I'm listening to an interview with BT (Brian Transeau for those of you who don't know who he is) that he did on KCRW promoting his new "Emotional Technology" album and he was talking about technology and different things. Anyway he mentioned that there were a bunch of great programs out there by people programming shareware apps and he said...

"...programs like Plastic...(a bit further) my friends will ask about my plugins...and I'm like 'that's a $9 program, dude, you need to get on the internet'"

I just thought you guys would like to know that, yes, a Big boy DOES use your Plugins to make his stuff. I think thats a killer plug for YOU guys!

Kudos, reFX!

/drez

It might be if I had even the slightest idea who Brian Transeau was.

BONES wrote:

It might be if I had even the slightest idea who Brian Transeau was.

Click his name above in my post for a link to his website.

BONES doesn't want to know who BT is

I don't think its his cup of tea really

a

that great to hear be half of reFX BUT who really cares about a some jerk that does not like midi...

a wrote:

BONES doesn't want to know who BT is I don't think its his cup of tea really a

Then he DEFINITELY should NOT click the link to his website and learn about him. That would be unspeakable!

I clicked the fucking link. It just told me that he was some nobody with a job in the music industry who likes to see his picture on his website. BFD.

I don't mind BT, he's a bit commercial (pretty boy).

"Dreaming" is cool though.

BONES wrote:

I clicked the fucking link. It just told me that he was some nobody with a job in the music industry who likes to see his picture on his website. BFD.

That's 'bout what I figured you'd see.

I guess your not into Paul Van Dyk, Oakenfold, Digweed, Sasha, etc. Fine. Don't quite know what a "somebody" in the music industry is for you, but it doesn't really matter in the context of this thread, so...

for those of you that DO know something about him and/or like his music, I think it says alot that he endorses Shareware plugins openly. It seems that alot of times the bigger the artist gets, the more closed they are about sharing their toolsets, but BT will tell anybody what he uses.

warbug wrote:

that great to hear be half of reFX BUT who really cares about a some jerk that does not like midi...

What's bad about not liking midi? If he chooses to edit everything "by hand" and make 6000+ audio edits in a single tune, then that's a choice he (or you or I) can make. I didn't think there was a rule that says "thou shalt use midi and like it". Most Piano players don't have much need for it and that's probably OK, right? Midi is just a tool like any VST, Host, or pre-amp. Nobody has to use the same tools.

My wife doesn't care for Midi and never uses it, does that make her a jerk too?

I bet BT has been to kvr before. Its pretty much certain actually. What name would he post under tho?

one of his songs maybe?

if he doesnt like midi - how does he actually USE all those shareware vsti ???


slainte rob

Who is BT? It's like saying who is Fred Durst? BT is one of THE foremost dance music producers of the last decade.

yea really!

where ya been under a friggan rock..
even if ya dont like the style.

Who is Fred Durst?

yeah, like him or not, he's NASTY

Kajiki wrote:

Who is Fred Durst?

He's cheeze ball!!! AKA "Cheezy Bastard".

Kajiki wrote:

Who is Fred Durst?

Some rock nob who famous apparently.

experimentfour wrote:

if he doesnt like midi - how does he actually USE all those shareware vsti ???

He uses midi all the time, but when programming beats for example, he render them as audio and line everything up by hand (llike quantizing). Something about the midi-timing he think is sloppy.

/megl

munchkin wrote:

Who is BT? It's like saying who is Fred Durst? BT is one of THE foremost dance music producers of the last decade.

doesnt fred durst wear a red hat?

think there a far more important producers in the dance world in recent years tho than bt
hes only really had an impact in the clubs,yes i know the most important place and before anyone says it yes a few minor breaks into mainstream
look at people like william orbit,mirwais,that bloke who looks like ali g damn cant remeber his bloody name but theres loads

BT - isnt he supposed to be the grand daddy of trance, in which case someone should go back in time and strangle him at birth. This is the prolo music of the new century.

A lot of the big boys appear to do most of their work in Pro Tools and Beat Detective.

People who think BT is all about Trance really should try listening to some of his music. ESCM and MISL are great me thinks, two really diverse albums, although some of his new stuff is quite commercial sounding that I'm not so sure about.

Either way, this guy puts serious effort into making music the way he does. If you understand why he hates midi and the lengths he goes to to time correct his audio, you can't help but say wow

Hmm, well, I don't see how the sample-accurate timing of PlastiCZ or any other plugin instrument can be described as 'sloppy' but I'd rather listen to "Memories in a Sea of Forgetfulness", "Remember", "Dreaming" or "Pop" than anything by Skinny Puppy, Front 242, or Cabaret Voltaire

Well, sample accurate timing is only as good as your MIDI jitter...

CreepJoint wrote:

BT - isnt he supposed to be the grand daddy of trance, in which case someone should go back in time and strangle him at birth. This is the prolo music of the new century.

What a shitty thing to say, music is about taste, not yours, not mine, but everyones, shame on you!

/ea

griels wrote:

Hmm, well, I don't see how the sample-accurate timing of PlastiCZ or any other plugin instrument can be described as 'sloppy' but I'd rather listen to "Memories in a Sea of Forgetfulness", "Remember", "Dreaming" or "Pop" than anything by Skinny Puppy, Front 242, or Cabaret Voltaire

Even though it's getting on a bit now, I still have a softspot for the guitars and vocal at the end of "FireWater"

"Running Down the Way Up" is quite beautiful too

Phaedo wrote:

Well, sample accurate timing is only as good as your MIDI jitter...

Which can be corrected after it gets into Logic - as x4 said, it's got to get into PlastiCZ somehow

I can see how editing Audio would offer more control however. Also I think BT is speaking in broad terms, not being a pedant like me or some others here

If people like BT's trance I think you'll be very disappointed by his newest CD, coming out today, but probably only in the US . Every track has vocals, most of them in the usual verse and chorus sense. For a preview visit www.briantranseau.com
Expect pop and .....rock

Armadillo wrote:

If people like BT's trance I think you'll be very disappointed by his newest CD, coming out next week I believe. Every track has vocals, most of them in the usual verse and chorus sense. For a preview visit www.briantranseau.com Expect pop and .....rock

some of my favorite stuff is his vocal stuff. I won't be disappointed at all.

Yeah I bought his album yesterday (in the UK). It's not as good as the previous one as he seems to be covering off too many styles (although that could be seen as a good thing). Mostly it's breaks, pop and some guitar based tunes, with a couple of 'progressive' tunes in there for good measure. I prefer his breaks stuff and the few tracks in this style on this new album are really good. He's clearly very talented, and very wealthy (the bastard's got Kyma!)

just my two pence.....

ea wrote:

CreepJoint wrote: BT - isnt he supposed to be the grand daddy of trance, in which case someone should go back in time and strangle him at birth. This is the prolo music of the new century. What a shitty thing to say, music is about taste, not yours, not mine, but everyones, shame on you! /ea

poo to you sir

i just got my bill from bt

ah that would explain his wealth then.

griels wrote:

Phaedo wrote: Well, sample accurate timing is only as good as your MIDI jitter... Which can be corrected after it gets into Logic - as x4 said, it's got to get into PlastiCZ somehow

Yeah, but I imagine what he does is: get a performance down, render to audio, then fiddle. That way his process is the same for a VST and an electric guitar.

CypherOne wrote:

Yeah I bought his album yesterday (in the UK). It's not as good as the previous one as he seems to be covering off too many styles (although that could be seen as a good thing). Mostly it's breaks, pop and some guitar based tunes, with a couple of 'progressive' tunes in there for good measure. I prefer his breaks stuff and the few tracks in this style on this new album are really good. He's clearly very talented, and very wealthy (the bastard's got Kyma!) just my two pence.....

Which album was it that you bought?

As far as I know, Emotional Technology is not out yet?

what, he plays the fiddle too?

so this bt bloke
i take it he does irish folk if hes usin a fiddle?
i like the pogues

Quote:

Which album was it that you bought? As far as I know, Emotional Technology is not out yet?

'tis, I bought it yesterday

vurt wrote:

so this bt bloke i take it he does irish folk if hes usin a fiddle? i like the pogues

Actually 'Memories in a Sea of Forgetfulness' has an Irish folk flavour (crossed with jazzy arabic-flavoured drum'n'bass) and certainly features Ueillean pipes, and possibly fiddles

Hmm, what was I saying about pedantry?

CypherOne wrote:

Quote: Which album was it that you bought? As far as I know, Emotional Technology is not out yet? 'tis, I bought it yesterday

Hmm...you must have bought an import. I don't think there is even a set date for a UK release yet. Lucky bugger

He also mentions that he uses reFx Beast in the Remix interview.

Firewater is the song that hooked me on that type of electronic music. Too much stuff on the market is just mindless patterns strung together with no sense of song construction or knowledge of music theory. My only real complaint with BT's music is that the early stuff is not mixed very well. I do enjoy the variety of stuff from "Voyage of Sasha" to "Love, Piece and Greese".

Keyboard mag had an interview a year ago in which he explained how and why he edits his loops in audio. The main reason is to match up the swing or feel from his large collection of self recorded loops. Whether he creats the loops with Reason or hires a drummer for a recording session. Once he is ready to put together a song he can pull in loops and not worry about layering patterns with different feel and timing. Think about it. If you use a percussion loop, drum loop, and bass loop with three different "feels" you end up with a mess unless you do something to line them up.

Robert

griels wrote:

vurt wrote: so this bt bloke i take it he does irish folk if hes usin a fiddle? i like the pogues Actually 'Memories in a Sea of Forgetfulness' has an Irish folk flavour (crossed with jazzy arabic-flavoured drum'n'bass) and certainly features Ueillean pipes, and possibly fiddles Hmm, what was I saying about pedantry?

pedantry-gently simmer for several or minutes over a medium to low heat until not too soft not too tough and some of the water has evaporated into the ether,as tomorrow will when tomorrow is but a memory as yesterday


i love word association time

my psychiatrist seems to dislike that particular exercise

thing is are we being serious or am i joking

Quote:

Hmm, what was I saying about pedantry?

Isn't pedantry something to with feet?

anyone want some fudge

i made it meself

CreepJoint wrote:

ea wrote: CreepJoint wrote: BT - isnt he supposed to be the grand daddy of trance, in which case someone should go back in time and strangle him at birth. This is the prolo music of the new century. What a shitty thing to say, music is about taste, not yours, not mine, but everyones, shame on you! /ea poo to you sir

Poo taken, thank you madame.

/ea

Rabid wrote:

He also mentions that he uses reFx Beast in the Remix interview.

Wow - I'm reading that Remix interview right now, and he explains how 2 guys in his studio spent 6 WEEKS time correcting one of the songs!

Damn...

/megl

Did you notice that he also mentions Big Tick Rhino? Both Beast and Rhino are listed along with some VERY NICE equipment. Though he did list Beast with the "old" synths like the Arp 2600.

Robert

Yeah - it's really cool that he's using Rhino!

He also menions the Malmström synth from Reason, which I've become quite fond of too

/megl

I wake up this morning, and this thread is 3 pages long!

For those of you that appreciate the topic, thanks!

I love his new album! I like the new direction and dfferent styles. Also, check out the Movement in Still Life Pioneer Avextrx CD set. Incredible stuff!

I didn't know he used Rhino and Beast. That's really encouraging.

Heck, he even uses REASON! (notice my sig)

Notice the "Links" section on his website. See if you meet some familiar links there.

deep wrote:

"Running Down the Way Up" is quite beautiful too

I bought his last album solely after hearing that song. It's not really my regular style, but the album is quite well done and all that. The breakbeat stuff was the most interesting IMO. I thought the production on "Pop" was tight as well.

I have to admit, although it shouldn't matter, he needs a new wardrobe. The white suit on his newest album?

I saw an interview with him a while ago. apparently he is a total gear geek and has written articles in professional engineering mags (pro tools stuff).

He has a MAJOR problem with midi, thinks it's the work of the devil and has conducted very elaborate experiments to prove the timing is appalling.

He also said if he was starting now, he would use acid. Looks like he's changed his tools.

sealed wrote:

... He also said if he was starting now, he would use acid. Looks like he's changed his tools.

I don't think he has changed. He still uses the same sound sources, some of which rely on MIDI. He just does not record song direct from MIDI. Like many other professionals he uses MIDI software and hardware to create loops, and then edits those loops. He is definately not the only professional that does not give in to poor MIDI timing and slop. I think Garbage did their entire second CD putting arrangements together in audio rather than MIDI.

Robert

sealed wrote:

I saw an interview with him a while ago. apparently he is a total gear geek and has written articles in professional engineering mags (pro tools stuff).

His CD "ESCM" is produced/played/arranged AND mastered by himself.
AND he plays guitar, drums and sings as well. I wonder if he can play the digeridoo.

Does anyone really give a shit who uses what?


Does it affect how you listen to music? Seriously?

I don't care myself.

i dont CARE either - but its still interesting to know

no ???

slainte rob

I smoke golden virginia tobacco and use happy shopper bog roll from Keiths if anyone wants to know.

Sod that, I want to know which type of Rizla Macy Grey uses.

donkey tugger wrote:

I smoke golden virginia tobacco and use happy shopper bog roll from Keiths if anyone wants to know.

doesnt Keith sell papers then donk? I think you'll find they hold the baccy in longer

After being into electronic music since around 94' I remember when guys like BT, Sasha, Armand Van heldon (that guy who looks like Ali G) were sort of cutting edge. These guys all sound very "polished" and "well produced" these days, not my cup of tea.

-Rick114

Kriminal wrote:

Does anyone really give a shit who uses what?

Well, considering that all day everyday, people are talking about VST plugins on this site, I'm gonna have to go with "quite a few people do". I always appreciate when you announce a tune and mention what you used.

If nobody cared, then what are we doing reviews and "what host/plugin-for-this-and-that" threads for?

Kriminal wrote:

Does it affect how you listen to music? Seriously?

Yes, it does. When I listen to BT, I am amazed at the amount of editing that has to go into making the stuff he does, so that affects me. It makes me want to push myself into not settling and to make something better.

Further, learning how or what a talented artist uses does affect how I "make" music.

I have to agree with Drez. So many people give the standard "I only use Protools and have 2 origional 303's in my studio" that it is nice when people list $30 sound sources as being just as valid musically.

I would also think it is very rewarding for independant developers to know that one of the hardest working and most sucessful creaters is using their software. It is also nice to me to know that professionals are using the same cheap (but good) instruments that I am able to purchase.

Robert

I'd disagree, they talk about the vst's not who uses them. totally different.

and just because the beatles use the same guitar as me, doesnt mean im gonna like em even more.

all wank material really...'oh et uses the same synth as me...'

I agree with drez too. Most of the people I have known have been too arrogant and 'artistic' to really get into the technicalities of music making (that included myself by the way).

It really does help to know what instruments people and how they use them use if you aspire to make music of a similar genre. Doing completely your own thing is unlikely to get most people very far.

The BT article really changed my view of the whole thing, especially as he has a hollywood face too. Meaning that his musical abilities and looks would probably have guaranteed him success without being a sound designer, engineer and producer as well.

P.S. I am sure with the audio recording tools at his disposal the vsti's won't sound like $30 on one of his tracks

Kriminal wrote:

I'd disagree, they talk about the vst's not who uses them. totally different.

No, tons of threads are about "I use this" and "I use that". There is no difference. When a kvr-user says in a thread "well, I use Fruity because..." this is the same thing. Its information for the reader that, many times, he may not know about.

Kriminal wrote:

and just because the beatles use the same guitar as me, doesnt mean im gonna like em even more.

Well, since guitars have very different tonal qualities and I liked a particular sound that the Beatles had, then it would probably be of interest to me.

Kriminal wrote:

all wank material really...'oh et uses the same synth as me...'

I don't care if he uses the same synth as me and I don't think anyone else in this entire thread has said that they use it as well. I don't think that was the point, at least it wasn't the point I was making when I started the thread. The point was that Big Guys use Small Guys stuff and its nice to hear about it if your a Small Guy.

If you built a guitar that the beatles used, I think you would be a bit stoked to hear about it.

Im sure the developers are pleased that a famous artist uses their VST's.
Instant boost to the bank balance as all the sheep go out and but Synth x cos Artist X uses it

I find it a bit sad that ppl are only interested in what someone else uses so they can copy them.

no offence ppl, im just not into this gear whore/lust crap.

P.S. i have never heard BT, that i know of, but i have heard of him, some sort of old trance producer?

Kriminal wrote:

Im sure the developers are pleased that a famous artist uses their VST's. Instant boost to the bank balance as all the sheep go out and but Synth x cos Artist X uses it

Obviously you have totally missed the point of the thread, Krim. It was a Kudos to Shareware Developers, not "go by the plugin BT uses" thread. Again, nobody has even mentioned "go by PlasticZ cuz BT uses it!".

Kriminal wrote:

I find it a bit sad that ppl are only interested in what someone else uses so they can copy them. no offence ppl, im just not into this gear whore/lust crap.

Well, there's no offence, its just that I don't understand what your statements are about. They have nothing to do with what has been mentioned on the thread. Nobody has talked about gear lust or copying anyone except you, unless I've just missed it and you can point it out?

Kriminal wrote:

P.S. i have never heard BT, that i know of, but i have heard of him, some sort of old trance producer?

Well, for those of you that are interested in hearing BT, you can hear his whole new album by clicking here. He released it for streaming a few days before the album went out.

Considering how many people who haven't really acomplished anything come down on VST as "crap! it ain't analogue" etc - when BT mentiones that he uses VST - it gives much needed boost of legitimacy to VST. For those who are easily influenced and are unsure of their own choice (beginners are always examples of that) - it's a very important thing to get approval from a respected figure.

I suppose the thread turned into a 'who is BT?' discussion because a lot of people here hadn't heard of him. Which is surprising considering BT has been at the forefront of electronic music for over 10 years and even scored Holywood movies.

I think there is a bias towards guitar based music at KVR which isn't a problem for me but there have been people at KVR bemoaning trance and hip hop as if a few guitars in the mix make music more valid. It always appears to be dance musicians having to justify the integrity of dance music and not the other way round. Electronic music seems to be more acceptable here if it's either electronica or hardcore. Dance doesn't appear to have the same kudos.

When I listen to the amazing music on Nukleuz 'Big Room Tunes' I really wonder if the people who do critisize trance and dance music have any idea of the ingenuity that goes into making it. It's seems to me that among musicians it is acceptable to be prejudiced against dance music because dance music is considered light weight and inconsequential. A bit like disco was considered to be inferior to rock.

I've never had any problem loving Sylvester and Thin Lizzy at the same time. If the music moves or grooves me then I don't care about the genre because I'm pleased the musician has been so creative.

munchkin wrote:

I think there is a bias towards guitar based music at KVR

ehhh?????? Have you listened to any of the competitions? I reckon its probably about 70;30 in favour of purely electronic stuff, and all us gitar people use vsti stuff too.

munchkin wrote:

I really wonder if the people who do critisize trance and dance music have any idea of the ingenuity that goes into making it.

Slagging of trance isn't the same as criticising dance music. I make dance music. So do my friends. So do my heroes. Trance on the other hand is music made by and for people who can't dance. No funk. No groove. No soul.

Respect

donkey tugger wrote:

munchkin wrote: I think there is a bias towards guitar based music at KVR ehhh?????? Have you listened to any of the competitions? I reckon its probably about 70;30 in favour of purely electronic stuff, and all us gitar people use vsti stuff too.

Yeah, but who wins all the prizes, eh Donk?

nuffink wrote:

Trance on the other hand is music made by and for people who can't dance. No funk. No groove. No soul.

Ya see what I mean?

Dance music has moved on since Black Box and SXpress ya know!

TristezaOrange wrote:

Yeah, but who wins all the prizes, eh Donk?

The ones who rig the voting

I think when trance came it it was more free-form, but eventually became a "formula" which was copied over and over. Other Trance producers went too far on a tangents (too much ecstacy around back then) coming up with Hard trance and the like, which to me is akin to heavy metal. That being said I still like to hear (and do hear frequently) trance influences in rock, hip hop, house. And adding some trance elements to a tune with a good groove sounds good. Has to be created from scratch though no presets or premade patterns. They've been done to death!!!

munchkin wrote:

Dance music has moved on since Black Box and SXpress ya know!

You'll have to much better than that if you want to patronise me cocker.

No, I think I did a pretty good job.

horse

munchkin wrote:

No, I think I did a pretty good job.

munchkin wrote:

Dance music has moved on since Black Box and SXpress ya know!

not if you go to the local Ritzy it hasnt

Trance is very robotic I agree and I know that some people find it souless. But I do find that some tunes really get the hairs on the back of my neck standing up. I suppose the idea of trance and hardhouse is to be hypnotic and uplifting. The breaks used in hardhouse are generally funky. Percussion that swings is used to funk up the beat.

Having said that I love disco house and the funky/garage stuff played at places like Queer Nation, Ministry Of Sound, Salvation and Fabric on certain nites. It's not all Trade, Trade, Trade for me.

TristezaOrange wrote:

donkey tugger wrote: munchkin wrote: I think there is a bias towards guitar based music at KVR ehhh?????? Have you listened to any of the competitions? I reckon its probably about 70;30 in favour of purely electronic stuff, and all us gitar people use vsti stuff too. Yeah, but who wins all the prizes, eh Donk?

Not me for sure! And its only cos you electronica softies are too scared to sing!

For you young whippersnappers at home, MIDI is actually an ancient hardware networking protocol. Well, not ancient per se, but considering it was launched in 1983, I think 20 years is a lifetime in the technology sector!

Using the MIDI *message* spec with softsynths is one thing. That's generally a sample-accurate affair. Using it with hardware synths, however, introduces timing slop, as the bandwidth is extremely slow compared to most wires today.

So that's why BT feels it necessary to time-correct performances. Personally, I think it's more than a bit anal, but he's free to waste however much time and money he wants to make it happen (he *does* have assistants to do this kind of shit-work).

Anyway, I'd rather listen to donkey tugger, and *he* doesn't time-correct his samples! DT kicks BT's ass!

- m

munchkin wrote:

Having said that I love disco house and the funky/garage stuff played at places like Queer Nation, Ministry Of Sound, Salvation and Fabric on certain nites. It's not all Trade, Trade, Trade for me.

Checkpoint Charlie
The After Dark Club
London Street
Reading

This Thursday

Lose your faith in trance. Rediscover your love of clubbing.

http://www.o-reading.co.uk/clubs/check_weather.html

I'd love it! But it's in Reading.

just an interesting side-note:

Markelford - good points, but do you realize that Ethernet is MUCH older then the 20 years you quote for MIDI? And the common fellow's Internet connection is only JUST getting to a level where it's using ethernet based broadband, yet even so we are only realizing a portion of the performance/speed that ethernet has to offer, with our Internet connections.

You are correct about MIDI - I just think that your estimation of the useful lifespan in the technology field is a little off target!

Markleford wrote:

So that's why BT feels it necessary to time-correct performances. Personally, I think it's more than a bit anal, but he's free to waste however much time and money he wants to make it happen (he *does* have assistants to do this kind of shit-work).

I saw an interview/feature video on him that came with Mac Addict (I think) magazine sometime in the last year or so where he admitted he had obsessive-compulsive disorder and basically could work for hours on one track, just working on one sound or section. I bet if he had less to do, he would do away with the assistants and just do it all himself.

He may be a cheeseball, but the guy has written some damn good songs that have, for better or worse, practically guided popular club culture for the last ten years. The breakbeats on ESCM were nu skool before nu skool existed, and his melodies have always been top-notch, if on the poppy side. The first time I heard the new track 'Somnambulist,' I thought to myself 'wtf is this crap?' Problem was, I was unable to get the damn song out of my head for weeks and ended up really liking the track (both the original & Burufunk mixes).

It is nice to know that the guy who has any gear he wants at his disposal will use some nice shareware just because it *sounds good*, validating our own reasons for using such gear as well.

Markleford wrote:

Anyway, I'd rather listen to donkey tugger, and *he* doesn't time-correct his samples!

He does have a way with those heart wrenching guitar tunes. One I particularly like but I can't remember the name. I thought I saved it but now I can't find it but I might have backed it up. It was about 4 months ago. I'll go thru my posts to find what it was as I posted about it at the time. (Am I vague or what? )

Laserguided wrote:

just an interesting side-note: Markelford - good points, but do you realize that Ethernet is MUCH older then the 20 years you quote for MIDI? And the common fellow's Internet connection is only JUST getting to a level where it's using ethernet based broadband, yet even so we are only realizing a portion of the performance/speed that ethernet has to offer, with our Internet connections. You are correct about MIDI - I just think that your estimation of the useful lifespan in the technology field is a little off target!

Yeah, but ethernet wasn't made overnight. It took Bob several years for it to come of age (remember arcnet? Under 2mbit shared...yuckola!). Also, Ethernet was built for communication between PC's to share files. Midi was not designed to do almost all of the applications that we force it to today. We use it why? Because there ain't nuthin else!

Ethernet is just one method for communication, there are many, many different ways (ATM, DSL, Cable, Wireless)...Midi would be more in comparison TCP/IP in that it is getting long-in-the-tooth and actually slowing down traffic because of how it handles various things (window size negotiation, error recovery, etc.).

MIDI is the Dialup of the Internet World. BT is ready for the Ethernet of MIDI.

munchkin wrote:

a ritualistic, repetitive drumbeat was played for 25-30 minutes straight of dancing, after which the musicians would change the beat, throw in off-beat hits, etc. The "trance" of the dancer was so deep that the off-beat hits and the change would hit them in a physical manner, often causing them to lose balance and control--"be outside of themselves"

NOW the thread has got proper interesting - this is the root of why music affects us ALL so much

slainte rob

Did I write that? I'm proper good I tell thee! I agree with myself totally as it is at the root of why music grooves us (if only I did write it. )

oops





i am SO sorry folks

the mere click of the WRONG button when you have mod powers and -

POOF !!!

everything goes to fuck

sorry again

slainte rob

Who wrote it? It's proper bo...

I was never a big BT fan (because I really don't like trance) until I read that Remix article. For one thing, the passion with which he talks about making music is incredible for a guy that's achieved so much. And the incredible details that he gets into...he's like a friggin musical scientist. And the way in which he openly shares his vast knowledge and technique is really endearing.

And how can you NOT admire a guy who's writing a 300+ page book on timestretching


Igor

Grace - 'Not Over Yet'. BT and Paul Oakenfold mixes (1993/5). A pair of stunnaz!

levit71 wrote:

I was never a big BT fan (because I really don't like trance) until I read that Remix article. For one thing, the passion with which he talks about making music is incredible for a guy that's achieved so much. And the incredible details that he gets into...he's like a friggin musical scientist. And the way in which he openly shares his vast knowledge and technique is really endearing.

He is the most complete musician I know... Not only a great writer, but a very talented singer, technician and producer. And very creative as well.
And one of my biggest influences... listening to his music makes me feel bad about not spending another bunch of hours in polishing and mixing for my songs

megl wrote:

experimentfour wrote: if he doesnt like midi - how does he actually USE all those shareware vsti ??? He uses midi all the time, but when programming beats for example, he render them as audio and line everything up by hand (llike quantizing). Something about the midi-timing he think is sloppy. /megl

Someone at Sonik mentioned that BT uses Logic. In Logic, the finest MIDI resolution is only 1/192. If you want to make a finer adjustment, the only thing you can do is rendering the MIDI track as audio and shifting the starting point of the rendered audio. I always thought this is ridiculous...why 1/192 not 1/1024?

K-Traxx - 'Hard Venture' & Club Wizards - 'Floor Burn'. I defy anyone not to dance to these two HardHouse or no...

"I think it's time to make the floor burn..."

And then there was Happy Hardcore. Remember that? Ravetastic! (You can tell I've got a Tony DeVit mix on as I write. )

Tony DeVit

Isn't this what dance music is supposed to be about? Having some fun I tell thee! Proper bo!

Rik wrote:

He is the most complete musician I know... Not only a great writer, but a very talented singer, technician and producer. And very creative as well. And one of my biggest influences... listening to his music makes me feel bad about not spending another bunch of hours in polishing and mixing for my songs

Get a grip mate. It's glam rock for pill monkeys, not art.

munchkin wrote:

Trance is very robotic I agree and I know that some people find it souless. But I do find that some tunes really get the hairs on the back of my neck standing up. ...

Yes. Pretty well said. It reminds me of early 1980's new age music. Robotic feel, synthetic sounds, using lack of emotion as an emotion. ...

Robert

nuffink wrote:

It's glam rock for pill monkeys, not art.

Exactly! Gulp! Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

I just read your previous post you metropolitan snob.

nuffink wrote:

Get a grip mate. It's glam rock for pill monkeys, not art.

I only want to listen to art. Is there a list around that tells me what is art and what is trash? I get confused listening to opinions or trying to just for myself. Maybe the government should set up some type of program to tell people what art is?

Robert

PS: Actually, the last time I listened to Art was on the Spectrasonics site. He submitted a demo while he was not busy working on Phatmattic.

experimentfour wrote:

oops i am SO sorry folks the mere click of the WRONG button when you have mod powers and - POOF !!! everything goes to fuck sorry again slainte rob

You don't know what you just did to my brain Rob!!!!!

I'll try to restate . . .

Let me try this again . . . In response to munchkin's talk of trance coming off soulless . . .

Although I must admit I'm not a huge trance fanatic, there are some aspects of rave culture and the repetitive four on the floor beat that are quite fascinating. I was an anthropology and music major in college (before switching to English ) and I did some research on Haitian Voodoo rituals, particularly around the music. I watched some amazing videos of voodoo dances, where a ritualistic, repetitive drumbeat was played for 25-30 minutes straight of dancing, after which the musicians would change the beat, throw in off-beat hits, etc. The "trance" of the dancer was so deep that the off-beat hits and the change would hit them in a physical manner, often causing them to lose balance and control--"be outside of themselves", the literal definition of ecstasy. I remember in the early days of underground raves getting the same feeling.

Laserguided wrote:

You are correct about MIDI - I just think that your estimation of the useful lifespan in the technology field is a little off target!

Oh, I'm not arguing that: I'm just giving some perspective to people who never done MIDI cabling and routing! Someone who has always used software doesn't understand what BT has against MIDI, as they think it's just the cable that gets their keyboard notes into Cubase.

Really, the only thing that has changed about MIDI is our expectations of it in comparison to other music and audio technologies. Some people have higher expectations than before, while others have none at all as it doesn't affect their software one bit!

- m

http://briantranseau.com/media.html


Any of you that bad-mouthed this guy should really feel like shit. His entire album on the net...for free.

Igor

yea its free cuz its rubbish and he already made enuff money remixing that backstreet boys song...


i was not real hip on BT's music so i went and listened.....and man does it suck its like progressive trance for super white ppl..its WAAAYY over produced.

Quote:

yea its free cuz its rubbish and he already made enuff money remixing that backstreet boys song...

I'm not sure I understand your point. Every member of Metallica is a multi-millionaire yet that doesn't seem to stop that douchebag Lars from e-mailing a subpoena to some 15 year-old that downloads "Enter Sandman". Is BT obligated to give his music away because he's wealthy?

Quote:

its WAAAYY over produced

Oh brother



Igor

levit71 wrote:

http://briantranseau.com/media.html Any of you that bad-mouthed this guy should really feel like shit. His entire album on the net...for free. Igor

After listening to his songs, the fact that he has two assistants just for quantizing his music makes tremendous sense.

I bet he can't dance.

dont get me started on metallica......they are rubbish in a different way.


and you did not quote my strongest point...

its like progressive trance for super white ppl.

or epic broadway musical trance pop house. might be a better description.

Quote:

its like progressive trance for super white ppl. or epic broadway musical trance pop house. might be a better description

Hey, it's not for everyone
But that still doesn't change the fact that what he did was very commendable. Like him or not, BT is a bonafide star, which nowadays earns you the right to be a pretensious, greedy dickhead...instead, he releases his entire album to the online community. I really had not interest in his album, but he's earned my 15 bucks.

ps
I just listened to some of your tunes, warburg...good stuff, even if a bit underproduced

warbug wrote:

yea its free cuz its rubbish and he already made enuff money remixing that backstreet boys song... i was not real hip on BT's music so i went and listened.....and man does it suck its like progressive trance for super white ppl..its WAAAYY over produced.

Sorry, but "Smartbomb", "The Revolution", "Ride", "Madskillz", "Movement in Still Life", "Hip Hop Phenomenon", "Knowledge of Self", and "Superfabulous" have zero to do with trance. If you've listened to the new Album on line, then you would have heard that "Knowledge of Self", "Superfabulous", and "Circles" are not trance songs. Did you listen to the entire album?

The reason it sounds "WAAAYY over produced" is because it is actually produced "very well". Most of the stuff that's out there today is "badly" produced. BT's stuff sounds crisp becuase he's a fantastic engineer and it sounds clean because he wants you to hear all of the work he's put into it...not cover it up with a bunch of mush and shoddy sound choices and lazy engineering.

I guess if "super white people" only like trance, then "super black people" shouldn't listen to it? That's a pretty general and innaccuarte remark, IMO . Why? Because I listened to BT today with 3 "black" people...and they actually LIKED it. "They" thought "Hip Hop Phenomenon" was "PHAT(!)".

If you don't know about someone's work, then how can you make a sweeping judgement on it based on flipping through a couple of tunes? If you don't like it, fine, but ignorance is no way to be credible about something. To me, that's like installing Reaktor, playing with 3 presets and saying "this synth sucks because all it does is Pads".

yea but i dont make my stuff for coke head yuppies.

Kajiki wrote:

levit71 wrote: http://briantranseau.com/media.html Any of you that bad-mouthed this guy should really feel like shit. His entire album on the net...for free. Igor After listening to his songs, the fact that he has two assistants just for quantizing his music makes tremendous sense. I bet he can't dance.

Can you elaborate?

That was a joke. I'm referring to the previous comment about quantized music = soulless music.

Kajiki wrote:

That was a joke. I'm referring to the previous comment about quantized music = soulless music.

heh, I'm a bit slow on the pickup. Yes, its funny how we get "groove templates" so that we can make things sound "real" when we quantize .

munchkin wrote:

Who is BT? It's like saying who is Fred Durst? BT is one of THE foremost dance music producers of the last decade.

You know, I doubt that I would know who Fred Durst is if someone hadn't died at the Big Day Out and he hadn't been called as a witness at the inquest and it wasn't all over the telly.

BONES wrote:

munchkin wrote: Who is BT? It's like saying who is Fred Durst? BT is one of THE foremost dance music producers of the last decade. You know, I doubt that I would know who Fred Durst is if someone hadn't died at the Big Day Out and he hadn't been called as a witness at the inquest and it wasn't all over the telly.

I just saw Limp Bizkit Sunday for the Summer Sanitarium Tour and he was actually pretty funny...I'm not a big Durst Fan, but he has a pretty funny stage presence.

i use some cool stuff too.

kryos wrote:

i use some cool stuff too.

That's what BT said!

donkey tugger wrote:

I smoke golden virginia tobacco and use happy shopper bog roll from Keiths if anyone wants to know.

i smoke golden virginia too in red rizlas

macy gray uses rolled up newspaper which is why she sounds like marge simpson having an orgasm

I reckon BT's cool, if a little anal.

Well, more than a little actually.

Forever,




Kim.

talking of anal the finest midi avaliable in logic is not the 192 ppn but is actually 960 ppqn (1/3840 Note)

But im sorry BT is overproduced - I get no sense of any of the noises being played at the same time - ie no sense of liveness

And while hes clearly an able musician , mainly the joanna, the tracks dont evoke much in me - im off to listen to Mccoy Tyner - BT is a little richard clayderman in comparison

still what ever floats yer boat

and finally this stuff is a million miles from those repetitive beats that drives primities wild - if you want that kind of effect move to chicago (circa 1988) or get on the mr mills tip or something but BT, or any other trance, is no where near monotonous enough - in fact if you really want trance track down anything by the master musicians of joojooka (thats not the right spelling) -

joojooka is a village in morrocco where once a year all the males of the village (about 40 of em) get loaded on drugs and play drum music for a week (true) - its like battacuda meats wellard techno

Righteous

ericj23, do you know how to tweak note's timing in Logic's matrix editor on the 1/3840 level?

you turn off snap to or quantise (cant remeber which)- you can then move the notes freely around the page- with a finer that 192 resolution-

I don't use quantization so it must be "snap." Forgive my ignorance, but how do I turn off snap?

in the matrix window their is a box that allows you to select the grid spacing on the window - on eof those options is off (3840) - you can then move midi notes around freely - mind you the step sequencer wont work so youll have to play them in

Ok...my matrix goes down only to 1/192. There's no off (3840) option. Maybe I need to set something in the option? Thank you. I'll investigate this further.

drez wrote:

Because I listened to BT today with 3 "black" people...and they actually LIKED it. "They" thought "Hip Hop Phenomenon" was "PHAT(!)".

That's easy. The song oozes Phat (tm). The only problem I have with it is the song structure (but I have that with more BT songs - my problem anyway).

The way I see it, BT is sort of like Mondriaan with sound... And I like that sound (just like I like e.g. Hybrid's sound).

And yes, I can dance...

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