Just spent all evening with this sucker and it is EXTREMELY good! Fuck^n! Here goes more $ up my pocket. It's been a long time since a synth has made me experiment like this. Most inspiring! Never played a real CS80, so I cannot compare. But the sound of this VSTi is sooo...

...

url?

No URL. Got it through Arturia's beta program. Sign up with Arturia to get it...if they need more beta testers.

OK...my experiences.
I got the letter from Xavier about the beta today.I use the FTP link,and-the copying to my drive keep quitting after 800k or so.Four hours later,I'm finally able to get the setup,_install and BR files.I run the installer-it asks for a password.I put the password in that was in my email,and-nothing.
It's one I'm going to skip on,I think-not when they ask me to test and I'm jumping through all these hoops and I STILL can't install the thing.
They just lost a customer,I think...
ew

You're a beta tester and you still have to pay for it?
Edit:EW'S post came at the same time as mine.I rest my case.No way am I going to clog up my registry and hard drive with numerous beta versions of a synth,spend dozens of hours testing and bug reporting and still pay for the thing(if that is indeed the case).

Well, I can only say that my downloads went fine - no trouble at all. Install likewise. And I have not found a single issue on Beta 1 so far.

so where at arturia do i sign up - im very interested in this number

Besides,I've got a real CS60 -I can always layer that for the CS80 sound(the only real difference was the ability to layer).No MIDI,but WTF?
ew

spmadmin wrote:

No URL. Got it through Arturia's beta program. Sign up with Arturia to get it...if they need more beta testers.

Well...last time I remember their beta url got leaked and lots of people got their hands on it....not me of course...LOL!!

PatchArena wrote:

Well...last time I remember their beta url got leaked and lots of people got their hands on it....not me of course...LOL!!

Most likely the reason they have a password on it now.

Robert

...and apparently the thing (the beta) self destructs after a certain period of time?

Some sort of new copy protection scheme... no wait, Microsoft has had that for years.

Hi,

Teksonik wrote:

You're a beta tester and you still have to pay for it?

This is nothing new for most companies. You're getting something out of it to a certain extent by being a beta tester - access to the synth early. Anyway, I'm sure that they'll offer some sort of discount to the beta testers when the full release becomes available.

If you feel that it is not worth it to you then wait like the rest of us. Plain and simple. They're not being greedy or anything. It's not like they're twisting your arm to beta test it - you're freely signing up for it. Also, you're not an employee of theirs just for signing up.

Nando

Hi,

6 hours ago i just drop a small mail to info@arturia.com asking if i can betatest in about 3 sentences and got the link to the beta version back from them without any questions. So if someone also wants to test this baby, i guess just drop them a email

Best Regards.

The beta is set to self-destruct after a couple weeks anyway, so if you think you're getting special treatment, you're not! I beta tested the Moog too, and they offered a discount, which is more than they should do as far as I'm concerned... They did the work, not me! Why should playing around with their synth entitle me to any special deal... You'll be the same people complaining about the presets later...

I just gave the tip that some other people migth be able to betatest it. Did i mention i want a special deal or whatever? Or did i complain? I just try to help and test it and make it a stable product so i can buy a stable version too later if i decide to buy it.

Best Regards.

That was not directed at you, sir... just all the whiners who complain about the upgrades, presets, copy protection, features, lack of features, best sequencer, blah, blah, blah... How about, if you don't buy it, you can't comment... new rule!

The beta version of Arturia CS-80V is currently being tested by a bunch of very skilled musicians.

Sorry for those who wanted to join the beta test but this is now CLOSED.

You'll have to wait for the final release. For technical specifications and further news, you'll have to wait for the AES Convention where the availability of the synth will be officially announced.

Regards,

Xavier

xavier wrote:

The beta version of Arturia CS-80V is currently being tested by a bunch of very skilled musicians.

So you lot can fuck off.

Rabid wrote:

PatchArena wrote: Well...last time I remember their beta url got leaked and lots of people got their hands on it....not me of course...LOL!! Most likely the reason they have a password on it now. Robert

Exactly!!!
Once bitten, twice shy....

David (Arturia)

So...any proto-reviews from the beta testers yet? Or are they under NDA? Any word on the sound, GUI, etc?

xavier wrote:

The beta version of Arturia CS-80V is currently being tested by a bunch of very skilled musicians. Sorry for those who wanted to join the beta test but this is now CLOSED. You'll have to wait for the final release. For technical specifications and further news, you'll have to wait for the AES Convention where the availability of the synth will be officially announced. Regards, Xavier

Hi Xavier, does this apply to people who got an email form you but replyed late ? I noticed the email yesterday and replied to it. Is there a cut off time?

lbn wrote:

So...any proto-reviews from the beta testers yet? Or are they under NDA? Any word on the sound, GUI, etc?

2 words, DA BOMB!!!!

Greets.

Here you can hear the Arturia CS80V in action: http://www.worton.com/mp3/cs80ish.mp3

xarc.mastering wrote:

Here you can hear the Arturia CS80V in action: http://www.worton.com/mp3/cs80ish.mp3

wow.. very nice!

xarc.mastering wrote:

Here you can hear the Arturia CS80V in action: http://www.worton.com/mp3/cs80ish.mp3

Whoa! There're some very Vangelis-like ("Vangelic?") pads in there. Very nice. I guess I should start saving up now. This one could make an even bigger impact than MMV with the simpler patch construction.

xarc.mastering wrote:

Here you can hear the Arturia CS80V in action: http://www.worton.com/mp3/cs80ish.mp3

Wow, verrry impressive sounds ! It's really a time travel.

To add on my "NFR hunt list"

BTW there is not only CS80 on this track, is there ? It seems to me that there also is a very nice delay at work Am I wrong ?

Red_Force wrote:

xarc.mastering wrote: Here you can hear the Arturia CS80V in action: http://www.worton.com/mp3/cs80ish.mp3 Wow, verrry impressive sounds ! It's really a time travel. To add on my "NFR hunt list" BTW there is not only CS80 on this track, is there ? It seems to me that there also is a very nice delay at work Am I wrong ?

The CS80V has Delay and Chorus built in

Hum. Should have guessed. The drum is from the CS80 as well ?

Red_Force wrote:

Hum. Should have guessed. The drum is from the CS80 as well ?

Sorry i just saw i didnt mention that the track is NOT from me. I just took it out from the Arturia CS80V Betatester community so that you guys can explore it a bit already.

Greets.

How *UNinteresting*. It's fantastic indeed, you can sound like Jean Michel Jarre or vangelis did in the 80s.

I wish this bloody trend of emulating vintage synths will end up so that we can expect more interesting synths where the CPU power is not dedicated to emulate the randomness and uncertainty of the anlalog circuits or their so-called warmth, but maybe used to generate interesting new sounds. No wonder the electronic music scene is now so broadly uniform and for most of its actors, quite non innovative. It's sad to see so many skillful people stuck in replicating these vintage shits whilst they coudl bring brand new things to the scene.

Can a good instrument get obsolet ? Do you think we should prohibit cellos ?

If not you shall admit that there is a point about doing those emulations, as few of today musicians could have access to a CS80 now. And to do it as close as possible to the original, because doing it like we would do it today would be pointless - it would be better to directly create a 2004 synth as you have pointed it.

I regret to tell that if you find that today's music isn't creative enough, you should blame the musician as theire are way much sounds available with plugins that the one finally getting burned on the CDs...

But actually, if you think today's music isn't creative enough, I'd suggest you to try another record shop !

I don't think you're taking things far enough, loomchild. I think that music itself is passe. I feel sorry for all the poor, pathetic fools who are still making music. Music is an idea that's so old, it's ancient. Time to let it die.

What's the relationship between Cello and a Cs80 softwsare please?. Maybe comparing a string dedicated synth would be relevant, in that case it's not.
And indeed, cellos are still crafted nowadays, so i really don't see the point.

Quote:

you should blame the musician as theire are way much sounds available with plugins that the one finally getting burned on the CDs...

that's the ones i directly blame. If there wasn't a demand you guys wouldn't probably work on these replications.

Quote:

But actually, if you think today's music isn't creative enough, I'd suggest you to try another record shop !

I got no time to argue on this point. If you 're happy with the vast majority of the production and find it either innovative or interesting in terms of sounds...when even the most so called innovative music is now broadly stuck in using all the same sound generation purposes........what to say.

Btw, Graoumf tracker Owned.

pough wrote:

I don't think you're taking things far enough, loomchild. I think that music itself is passe. I feel sorry for all the poor, pathetic fools who are still making music. Music is an idea that's so old, it's ancient. Time to let it die.

Interesting.....or funny?......pathetic?

loomchild wrote:

What's the relationship between Cello and a Cs80 softwsare please?. Maybe comparing a string dedicated synth would be relevant, in that case it's not. And indeed, cellos are still crafted nowadays, so i really don't see the point.

Relationship: both instruments. Both old instruments.
Irrelevent: type of sound they make.

But you DO bring up a good point. These "vintage" instruments being emulated are NOT being made. So an emulation is doubly a good thing. Can you buy a new one? No. Do the old ones cost way too much? Yes. Are they reliable instruments? No. Sounds like a job for an emulation!

loomchild wrote:

pough wrote: I don't think you're taking things far enough, loomchild. I think that music itself is passe. I feel sorry for all the poor, pathetic fools who are still making music. Music is an idea that's so old, it's ancient. Time to let it die. Interesting.....or funny?......pathetic?

EDIT: stricken. Contentious.

You seem to believe that innovation is the only thing. I come from the guitar world. What you're saying sounds bizarre to me. Not that it's incorrect, I just have found that "innovation" tends to result in inferior music. Not always, but often. Innovative products almost never sound as good as tried, tested and true ones. The cello world would likely back me up on this. Innovative music is sometimes interesting, but rarely listenable.

Admittedly, we wouldn't have much more than a stick and a log to make music with without innovation, but a lot of the good things have already been found and are readily available. Why throw them out? Cherish the old instruments. Work with them because they sound good. AND innovate.

Removed due to the previous edit.

Quote:

You seem to believe that innovation is the only thing. I come from the guitar world. What you're saying sounds bizarre to me. Not that it's incorrect, I just have found that "innovation" tends to result in inferior music. Not always, but often. Innovative products almost never sound as good as tried, tested and true ones. The cello world would likely back me up on this. Innovative music is sometimes interesting, but rarely listenable. Admittedly, we wouldn't have much more than a stick and a log to make music with without innovation, but a lot of the good things have already been found and are readily available. Why throw them out? Cherish the old instruments. Work with them because they sound good. AND innovate.

Obviously , you didn't seem to understand what I meant, and this is surely due to the fact that I didn't express myself well.

First, Innovation is no the key to anything. However, if you refer to old instruments, if people have kept on replicating harpischord or piano forte , there wouldn't be contemporary pianos at all. Same goes for cellos and ancient violas

Secondly, i admit innovation doesn't come from the instrument itself. the most innovative peices of music I have heard lately were based upon the use of classical instruments. I never meant to throw any of them appart. Although, replicating always the same sort of stuff is a never ending circle that simply ends by making the things stay where they are.

What i have first tried to state was that i was wondering how useful would be ANOTHER vintage analog replication. And I came to the conclusion that it was not. And I still believe that it is part of a trend which doesn't brign any good to music. No wi'd be delighted to debate that with you guys and even to change my mind on this subject. But please , no damn attacks or passionate answers.

cheers

Okay, I see your point now. Keep in mind, though, that considering this is a thread that mainly involves people who ARE interested in emulations of vintage synths and who see this as a Good Thing, your first post is the one that many would point to as a "passionate attack."

Nice then, but i can't post such things anywhere else than were the question is raised.

By all means, raise your point here, where it's relevent. "But please , no damn attacks or passionate answers."

ahaha :p

I had some trouble downloading it but - since I got it - it's a nice thingie gui-wise ---- not sure about the sound yet..... though the built in delay chorus and vibrato are sweeeeeet

looks very good and I haven't had any crashes or bugs yet....

and btw the rumble about the gui (leaving "lüfterschlitze" [don't know this word in english anymore for it's too late] is totaly "unbegründet" [samething here] you can un-lüfterschlitz it and "zum vorschein" [yup... you get it] comes a new panel - if you know what I mean..... and there's also a button to switch to keyboard and 'imortant' controls only)

loomchild,

I understand your argument but I think you're missing part of the larger picture here in a few aspects.

Not another analog: Why not? It's not as if all analog synths even sounded remotely alike. An ARP didn't sound like a Moog didn't sound like an Oberheim didn't sound like an SC, etc. Most of the old synths sounded vastly different. This doesn't even take into account the lack of availability of these synths these days and maintaining them if you can get them. A wide sonic pallette is an important thing for an electronic musician, so the more the better. Besides, there are still many, many musicians that still use analog gear to make contemporary music.

Lack of innovation: It's not as if every synth manufacturer is dedicated to simply recreating analog classics. There are plenty of innovative softsynths out there. As a matter of fact I'd go so far as to say that the only innovative stuff is being done is in software these days. When was the last time one of the big hardware manufacturers brought out something that blew everyone away? I think Absynth is a good example of what softsynths can do. Also check out the VirSyn stuff. Not to mention stuff like Rhino, Albino, z3ta, etc. There's plenty of innovation going on in softsynths. It's just that we can also bring back the classics at the same time.

What he means is that the Fans that took alot space in the GUI are now just on the left and right upper corners. If you open the CS80V these Fans rotate, but you with a single mouseclick on them you can stop them and save some more CPU if you dont need a 100% emulation

"I wish this bloody trend of emulating vintage synths will end up so that we can expect more interesting synths where the CPU power is not dedicated to emulate the randomness and uncertainty of the anlalog circuits or their so-called warmth, but maybe used to generate interesting new sounds. No wonder the electronic music scene is now so broadly uniform and for most of its actors, quite non innovative. It's sad to see so many skillful people stuck in replicating these vintage shits whilst they coudl bring brand new things to the scene."

Mnnn....I see you're complaining about limitations in a genre of music
you find stagnant. The latest whiz bang watchamacallit isn't going
to help you, (or anyone else), make up for a lack of talent. If the
music is stagnant it's the fault of the musicians not the machines.
Just because someone traded in their harpsichord for a piano
does'nt mean their music improved.

Myself, I'd rather play music than program
machines.....maybe that's why electronic music is so broadly
uniform....because so much of it is not made by musicians
but computer geeks......all that being said to each his own
if you'd rather crunch numbers than play notes, power to you.
As a former CS80 owner and current beta tester I have nothing
but high praise for all those developers that breathe new life
into old dinosaurs. I'll probably never own another CS80,
or B3 and I don't think I'll ever own a Mellotron even if I
could afford a new one,(yes they are so well loved by some that
new ones are actually being produced). But none of this pertains
to my actual point.....It's ALL good....old, new, borrowed, blue
there's never been a better time for gear hard or soft....So if
the music sucks, don't blame it on the gear sonny, you've got
way more toys to play with than we ever dreamed of back in
the day.

As to CS80V....Love It!! Dead on accurate GUI and sounds
just as ornery as the original,(with the exception of overheated
components and drifting ocillators!). No crashes, but the more
complex patches are kicking the caca out my old PIII 500Mhz.
Time I got off my duff and upgraded!

Cheers.......CL

Ok , once again It seems haven't been understood well.

Quote:

A wide sonic pallette is an important thing for an electronic musician, so the more the better. Besides, there are still many, many musicians that still use analog gear to make contemporary music.

I never denied that. But i 'm not sure about the 'the more the better' part. IF a moog sounds different that an arp odissey you can still tell that it sounds first like an analog synth. I remember that there used to be a certain rivalery between the Arp Odissey and the Micro moog owners. However skillful programmers have succeeded back then in getting pretty similar results out of both, so well that at times it was pretty confusing.

What I wanted to state was that it wasn't maybe necessary to have ANOTHER analog replication now there are already a moog modular , a Prophet and an Odissey emulations available because minus some small unique specifications, they are all based upon the same synthesis technique and finally sound quite the same. Of course they have different filters, different circuits. But you can get pretty similar sounds out of all of them. Do the test yourself.

Quote:

Lack of innovation: It's not as if every synth manufacturer is dedicated to simply recreating analog classics. There are plenty of innovative softsynths out there. As a matter of fact I'd go so far as to say that the only innovative stuff is being done in software these days. When was the last time one of the big hardware manufacturers brought out something that blew everyone away? I think Absynth is a good example of what softsynths can do. Also check out the VirSyn stuff. Not to mention stuff like Rhino, Albino, z3ta, etc. There's plenty of innovation going on in softsynths. It's just that we can also bring back the classics at the same time.

I never meant such, again. And that's why I would like more synth devs to focus on more innovative synthesis stuff like some attempts are made today, that I originally reacted.

I've been recently blown away by the Hartman Neuron, that's a truly interesting resynthesis technique.

Absynth, virysnth etc.. are quite nice example of innovative softwynths. But there are so few. Count the qunatity of so-called VA or analog 2-3 osc synths around, including Albino for me.

In a word, bringing the classics is not a bad idea, it's simply useless according to what's already available and finally not so interesting for soundesign. I'm far more interested by projects like the FM7 that offers a classic FM architecture - a quite fair emulation - combined with some techniques from the analog world and a truly interesting eveloppe system.

So yes, i don't care about a perfect replication of a CS80, but would be far mroe interested in a synth that would propose some elements of this syn, its filters for instance, it's s oscillators etc.... That's what I think that the VST technology can bring us.

"I'm far more interested by projects like the FM7 that offers a classic FM architecture - a quite fair emulation - combined with some techniques from the analog world and a truly interesting eveloppe system"

Fair enough, I'll have to agree with you there. FM7 is a wonderfull
update to the DX7 concept. I'm not a purist by any means. It would
be just ducky if Oddity, M-tron, Moog Mod, etc started with those
concepts and built on them. I believe G-Media is about to do just
that with the upcoming release of MetaTron. I fully embrace the
new and innovative...however, I nonetheless welcome spot-on
emulations which look behave and sound EXACTLY like the
hardware I spent so many years tweaking. I don't have to
figure out how to make these instruments sound just like
the hardware I know and love. I love to experiment with the new
but I also love being able to revisit my past.

Cheers.......CL

"We're not retro, we have tradition" Chris Robinson - The Black Crowes

Quote:

Mnnn....I see you're complaining about limitations in a genre of music you find stagnant. The latest whiz bang watchamacallit isn't going to help you, (or anyone else), make up for a lack of talent. If the music is stagnant it's the fault of the musicians not the machines. Just because someone traded in their harpsichord for a piano does'nt mean their music improved.

I was talking about sound design, not skills of the musicians. Of course a brand new synth technique won't make up for the lack of talent. But at the same time an abondance of old timer synths won't either.

Those who traded their harpischord for a piano didn't probably improve their music, but they introduced nuances in keyboard playing and opened a new way for a new sound palette.

Quote:

maybe that's why electronic music is so broadly uniform....because so much of it is not made by musicians but computer geeks......all that being said to each his own if you'd rather crunch numbers than play notes, power to you.

.....And these computer geeks are the ones that code the replications you seem fond of.

Quote:

So if the music sucks, don't blame it on the gear sonny, you've got way more toys to play with than we ever dreamed of back in the day.

We have far more convenient otys. toys that can save the synth state with a song and recall as many patches you wish, that you can trigger by midi and automate, cool. But still a lot of people are moved by a 303 emulation(just give a look at the thread titled this way), synths companies invest to reissue their old analog look synths, trying to bring the consummer the genuine analog taste.

So yes, there are more toys. But not so many really innovative ones and this trend to replicate, emulate the good old times sound is simply blocking that imho

OK,I finally got it installed.
Soundwise-it's pretty dang close.The ring modulator decay doesn't work right,but that's the only problem I've seen.
Interesting!
ew

Loomchild, i think you forget one important point: MARKETING!
Seen from the marketing aspect making a Synthesizer that everyone wants but never got their hands on, either cause its not built anymore or it is so expensive or complex that no normal "homemusician" can afford it, is a VERY good selling point. Compared to making something new that could not find the attention of the users just BECAUSE its something new and something that they are not familiar with is a much higher risk for a commercial company then making a synth "everyone wants".
Not to insult Arturia in any way, their emulations are both great, accurate and nearly perfect, but i think what i mentioned plays a GREAT fact! And i am pretty sure there are alot of companies that say "Never change a running system", know what i mean?

Best Regards.

Yes I do, I 'm aware of course of the marketing factor, I know that this factor plays also with the fact that there a true demand for analog style machines.

Doesn't change that I don't think it's a good thing:)

regards,

Just wanted to show you that.

Regarding the "Cloning or New" discussion i dont feel like joining it. I think there are pretty much synths of both worlds out and always something someone might need. So i would never complain about a new "Clone" as well as i wouldn´t about a "New" Synth that i maybe dont like. Noone forces you to use them. You hear only music you like and do you blame others for that they dont fit your musical taste? The same applies, at least for me, for Synth, Effects or whatever.

Greets.

I see room for both...

I definitely want to see new innovative things, but I also get very excited about some of the emulations.

In the case of the CS80, it's something that I always wanted to have but would not get because of cost, physical size, etc. And because I wouldn't spend that much money just to have those certain tone colors. I would not buy it for $3000 or whatever it would cost if I could find one, but presumedly for what the plug in will cost it will be great to have as an addition to my sound pallette.

Ditto Moog modular. Wouldn't buy the real thing for technical considerations - hell, I want a MOTM.

Loom have you played with Plex? I know it isn't the same thing, but your mention of Neuron made me think of Plex. Neuron... Pentium in a pretty box!

I can definitely see the argument whereby one can say that everything sounds the same after a while, and to a point it does. But I do think there are differences and it's simply nice to be afforded the choice. Just because it's there no one is forcing you to buy it. I think it also depends on why you are buying it too. Are you buying it because you are 'buying into' some marketing thing or because everyone else is buying it, or are you buying it because it fits your needs - that kind of thing.

Well, I'm bummed... got stuck at work really late last night and couldn't download the beta from there because of firewalls, by the time I got home, the download site was dead. Was really really looking forward to getting home and downloading it and spending the weekend playing with it. Grrrrrr!!!!

...and this is for work, I hope you're happy, lol!!!

loomchild wrote:

So yes, there are more toys. But not so many really innovative ones and this trend to replicate, emulate the good old times sound is simply blocking that imho

I don't understand this. Why do you believe that companies like Arturia are blocking the development of new synth techniques? It's not as if there is a finite quantity of synth developers and vital resources are being diverted to emulating classic synths.

Another thing to keep in mind is that it is the mathematicians and engineers who are actually innovating in the field of synthesis. Musicians have almost nothing to do with this. Bob Moog is an electronics engineer, not a keyboard player. Developing new synth techniques is akin to stumbling upon a new algorithm in math - some would say one and the same. It's not something that happens every day let alone every year. The truly cutting-edge stuff in synthesis is being done in universities and academic areas.

How long has it been since something groundbreaking has come along? 10 years? 15 years? Most of the synths that have come out in the last decade or so have been rehashes of earlier technologies. And what do we consider to be groundbreaking? Additive synthesis, subtractive synthesis, sampling (including sample playback), waveshaping, vector synthesis, physical modeling, FM synthesis. I'm sure there are others but the general idea seems to be groundbreaking ideas are few and far between.

You know that there are manufacuters that are still building piano's? It's unbelievable, they are stuck in the past. They should stop building piano's and make something groundbreaking... I have no clue what, but it has to be real innovative, cause the piano-concept is old and passe

loomchild wrote:

I never denied that. But i 'm not sure about the 'the more the better' part. IF a moog sounds different that an arp odissey you can still tell that it sounds first like an analog synth. I remember that there used to be a certain rivalery between the Arp Odissey and the Micro moog owners. However skillful programmers have succeeded back then in getting pretty similar results out of both, so well that at times it was pretty confusing. What I wanted to state was that it wasn't maybe necessary to have ANOTHER analog replication now there are already a moog modular , a Prophet and an Odissey emulations available because minus some small unique specifications, they are all based upon the same synthesis technique and finally sound quite the same. Of course they have different filters, different circuits. But you can get pretty similar sounds out of all of them. Do the test yourself.

I really don't want to touch this one since it's likely to open a can of worms, but... Yes, analog synths can produce similar sounds but they are not the same sounds. That is quite an important distinction and one that any musician would argue. That's like saying that all electric guitars produce a similar sound. Or that all grand pianos produce a similar sound. Does this mean that a Fender Strat is the same thing as a Gibson? Does this mean a Steinway is the same thing as a Yamaha? Absolutely not! Similarly, a Moog Modular does not sound the same as a Yamaha CS-80. A Minimoog does not sound the same as an ARP Odyssey. These synths are based upon the same principle (as are all electric guitars and grand pianos) but they are implemented in very different ways. This is the inherent nature of analog. So, yes, more is better. Otherwise, everyone would be playing the same electric guitars or the same grand pianos.

And these sounds are still in demand. That is why these synthesizers are being meticulously emulated. If the hardware manufacturers thought they could make money off of reissuing them they would. But this is not intrinsic to the synth world. You see this phenomenon with every class of instrument. There are particular models of instruments that are considered classic and helped define or popularize those instruments.

Initializing Behaviours wrote:

You know that there are manufacuters that are still building piano's? It's unbelievable, they are stuck in the past. They should stop building piano's and make something groundbreaking... I have no clue what, but it has to be real innovative, cause the piano-concept is old and passe

Please read my previous posts

Quote:

Developing new synth techniques is akin to stumbling upon a new algorithm in math - some would say one and the same. It's not something that happens every day let alone every year. The truly cutting-edge stuff in synthesis is being done in universities and academic areas.

Please read my previous posts

Quote:

How long has it been since something groundbreaking has come along? 10 years? 15 years? Most of the synths that have come out in the last decade or so have been rehashes of earlier technologies. And what do we consider to be groundbreaking? Additive synthesis, subtractive synthesis, sampling (including sample playback), waveshaping, vector synthesis, physical modeling, FM synthesis. I'm sure there are others but the general idea seems to be groundbreaking ideas are few and far between.

Please read my previous posts



Ok, I'll leave this debate since it's quite useless to post anything if it's not read and forces me to having to explain the same thing over and over.

[/i]

lbn wrote:

I really don't want to touch this one since it's likely to open a can of worms, but... Yes, analog synths can produce similar sounds but they are not the same sounds. That is quite an important distinction and one that any musician would argue. That's like saying that all electric guitars produce a similar sound. Or that all grand pianos produce a similar sound. Does this mean that a Fender Strat is the same thing as a Gibson? Does this mean a Steinway is the same thing as a Yamaha? Absolutely not! Similarly, a Moog Modular does not sound the same as a Yamaha CS-80. A Minimoog does not sound the same as an ARP Odyssey. These synths are based upon the same principle (as are all electric guitars and grand pianos) but they are implemented in very different ways. This is the inherent nature of analog. So, yes, more is better. Otherwise, everyone would be playing the same electric guitars or the same grand pianos. And these sounds are still in demand. That is why these synthesizers are being meticulously emulated. If the hardware manufacturers thought they could make money off of reissuing them they would. But this is not intrinsic to the synth world. You see this phenomenon with every class of instrument. There are particular models of instruments that are considered classic and helped define or popularize those instruments.

I have never denied that specificities existed. Now if you want to call that these are specificities that can' t prevent to produce similar sound but not the same sound, that's cool.

Once again, this wasn't what I was talking about. You're trying to make me tell that I'm refusing everykind of reference to the past instruments blablabla. Well, what to tell again... be happy with your 303, sh101, ms 20, prophet, Moog replications.

there is no need to reply to this post, i'm not watching the topic anymore. If someone has anything interesting to tell me, please PM.

If it's to jerk off about how great it is to have a cs80 replication, cyaz.

loomchild wrote:

Ok, I'll leave this debate since it's quite useless to post anything if it's not read and forces me to having to explain the same thing over and over.

This is probably a wise decision. Since you seem to think that a Minimoog sounds the same as an ARP Odyssey or a Moog Modular sounds the same as a Yamaha CS-80, this makes you not quite qualified to comment on this particular topic.

Anyone got any mp3 demos of this yet?

sorry your going

It is a shame that people frequently misunderstand each other - but your attitude is very unhelpful
- Ultimately you come here make a contenscious remark in a place where any idiot could work out it would get a response

then you agree with all the responses - beofre storming off saying we have nothing to say - YOU HAVE NOTHING TO SAY

"No wonder the electronic music scene is now so broadly uniform and for most of its actors, quite non innovative."

You feel that software guys should be designing something new - what is wrong with saving something great - the cs80 can do things that a moog or a 303 or zeta or a sampler or a hartmann nueron cant do - that is why it is worth doing -

You think that ll these things can be amde to sound the same- why bother doing something that sounds broadly similair - tkaing this to its extremes - if close enough is good enough then no-one would have made the innovations you like - why make an electric guitar when an acoustic is close enough - why bother making a synth after the moog - it will sound much the same- if you cant hear the differences between then im lost - nut ultimately my issue with your posts is

If you dont wanna buy it why annoy those who might ?

Alright, so... when is the AES convention then? I'm curious as to when and how much this thing will cost.

[struggling to get back on topic]

I had a CS80 a few years ago, unfortunately it went out of tune so much [i think the fans weren't spinning fast enough heheh] that I had to sell it... Does turning the fans off also act as a sort of 'oscillator drift'?

Also: How large is the gui, in pixels. Screen real estate is getting pretty costly over here.

¿[phÿlûm]_siñt£r

phylum sinter wrote:

Also: How large is the gui, in pixels. Screen real estate is getting pretty costly over here.

click image for the answer

Hi Dr. Wackler,

this screenshot is outdated, the Beta1 looks like this: http://xarcmastering.port5.com/cs80v.jpg

Best Regards.

Hi everyone, saw this thread and thought i'd chime in...I'm beta testing the CS80. I've been a sound designer for over 18 years, and have worked with all sorts of various synths including some vary rare ones (including the Axcel Resynthesiser). In the VSTi world I have a varity of synths including the Oddity, and Moog Modular, but I now see and most importantly hear after programing sounds on this wonder that I must add this to the collection. It's sound as you would expect from Arturia is nothing less than stellar! It's features are unique to itself, thus giving one a pallet to paint sound with unlike the others mentioned. The GUI is absoluyely stunning and fun! The FX section also are simply a blast. I have to admit, that I feel as though I'm actually playing the real CS80....I use a Kurzweil 2500 as my main Midi Keyboard controler, so I have the advantage of having 2 ribbon controlers to work with, which by the way are an absolute kick....you can program the CS80 ribbon to any of the modulation destinations( which there are a ton) including multiple destinations! Also, speaking of modulation capabillities, this thing has a ton, it's really a marvel come to life! I can't really say enough good things about this...but rest assured that this is about to make a hugh splash in the VSTi world. One last way of explainnig this is, it's probably the most FUN analog VSTi out there to actually play, because as I said before, I really feel as though I'm playing the thing in real life, crafting the sound as I play. Great Stuff!!!!

Oh ! big progress over the modular : at least you can read values !!

But eyestrain and pain : tiny fonts, I have to stare ....
Ring modulator : I see some black and white and too short faders in this level
Push buttons of the arpegiattor kind : on or off ?
There are also some forms of buttons in the bottom ...
Could you replace 4 high by one ? less text ...
When the faders are down they hide some text, shades ? okay, well ...
I hope the diagram has functions up to its GUI space ...
Oh thanks for the keyboard, I've one ...

Good sounding tho, so do something about your GUIs or I'll have to pass again ... because my eyes see barely identifiable things and try constantly to analyse !

I have a bad feeling that you may make more good synths that I'll be not able to use ( that's why I'am rather moody ! )

xarc.mastering wrote:

Hi Dr. Wackler, this screenshot is outdated, the Beta1 looks like this: http://xarcmastering.port5.com/cs80v.jpg Best Regards.

Thanks. I've updated the link to the screenshot on your site.

Could you also tell or show what is behind the cover where on the original there were the "presets" mini-sliders?

Under that cover is the modulation source/dest controls.

Great, exactly what I was hoping for!

loomchild wrote:
Ok, I'll leave this debate since it's quite useless to post anything if it's not read and forces me to having to explain the same thing over and over.

This is probably a wise decision. Since you seem to think that a Minimoog sounds the same as an ARP Odyssey or a Moog Modular sounds the same as a Yamaha CS-80, this makes you not quite qualified to comment on this particular topic.

Kids these days....I tell ya'!!

Yeah the GUI is a real bitchkitty, very hard to see. The CPU bite
on my poor 'ol PIII 500Mhz is pretty steep....but it IS a joy to play
and does sound quite like my old CS80!!

Cheers.....CL

You're not kidding Capn... would you say that say a Jupiter 8 and an OB8 sound the same? Geez!

Even if you did have an ARP Odyssey and a Minimoog side by side and dialed up fairly similar patches and played the same exact solo the SAME EXACT way, they would still sound totally different because of the way they scan the keyboards. Triggering vs. cv gates or something like that if I remember correctly. (and of course, the filters, etc.)

Well, I can give him that I understand the point he was trying to make.

But I still WILL buy the CS80v.

Could one of you kind beta testers confirm or deny that the oscillators' waveforms continuously cycle and don't retrigger on new notes. MMV annoyingly retriggers and i think that any synth claiming to be in any way analogue should not retrigger the waveforms Sorry, bit of a personal mission statement.

Mr Arkadin wrote:

MMV annoyingly retriggers and i think that any synth claiming to be in any way analogue should not retrigger the waveforms Sorry, bit of a personal mission statement.

Ok, I was playing with MMV only for a few days and its long ago since the evaluation period exceeded. But I did play quite intensively with it and did not at all realize that it retriggers the waveforms. On the contrary I was amazed by its powerfull sound, its warmth, its 'livelyness'.
OTOH usually I do realize if a synth does not use free running waveforms.
Are you sure MMV does retrigger? Anybody else who can confirm that?

Yep, the MMV does retrigger I'm afraid, it was in SOS a while ago.
Still sounds awsome, though!

Mr Arkadin wrote:

Could one of you kind beta testers confirm or deny that the oscillators' waveforms continuously cycle and don't retrigger on new notes.

Yeah, the CS80V oscillators *do* retrigger. I really doubt trhat this is an original feature of the CS80

Quote:

Yeah, the CS80V oscillators *do* retrigger.

Bugger.

They should fix that.

i need a cs-80 password for the setup. Can someone send it to weezer182@hotmail.com. I am a tester.

weezer182 wrote:

i need a cs-80 password for the setup. Can someone send it to weezer182@hotmail.com. I am a tester.

The password's in the email Xavier sent out when the beta was first released and again on Friday
ew

I'm sure that Xavier would be more than happy to resend to you if you lost it. Since you are a tester, just send him an email.

bodo wrote:

Yep, the MMV does retrigger I'm afraid, it was in SOS a while ago. Still sounds awsome, though!

And I always assumed that mainly the retriggered wavforms are responsible for Absynth`s cold/sterile basic sound. Now MMV proves that assumption wrong.

Well, since everyone else is doing it, I'll thrown in my two cents: I'm beta-testing as well, and the CS80 does sound great!. Congratulations on another winner, Arturia. The only downside (for me) is the size of the controllers - I'm going to need glasses* if this keeps up! People, remember, some of us are over 40!!

* yes, yes, I know I have glasses on - but they're my shades!

mistertoast wrote:

They should fix that.

About oscillator retrigg:
If you want no retrigg oscillator, then you assume than oscillator will run every time. If you have 16 voices of polyphony, 9 oscillators, then you have 16*9 oscillators continuously running.

I am thinking of how I could manage this feature asked from a lot of you and the CPU increasing it will bring. Why not in monophonic mode for the MMV. But it is impossible for a polyphonic synthesizer as CS-80V. Maybe in some days where CPU power could be free.

Anyway, there is something which is done and which gives you living sound.
So we can't say that there is retriggering oscillators, but we can't say the contrary.

Xavier

xavier wrote:

About oscillator retrigg: If you want no retrigg oscillator, then you assume than oscillator will run every time. If you have 16 voices of polyphony, 9 oscillators, then you have 16*9 oscillators continuously running. I am thinking of how I could manage this feature asked from a lot of you and the CPU increasing it will bring.

Just a technical question: Why does arbitrary start phases should cause CPU load? Isn't it just a random function that runs every time a note starts?

Thanks,

kybernaut

xavier wrote:

mistertoast wrote: They should fix that. About oscillator retrigg: If you want no retrigg oscillator, then you assume than oscillator will run every time. If you have 16 voices of polyphony, 9 oscillators, then you have 16*9 oscillators continuously running. I am thinking of how I could manage this feature asked from a lot of you and the CPU increasing it will bring.

Come on, it's not that difficult There are lots of options.

1. Keep the oscillators running in inactive mode (just update the phase, don't compute everything).
2. You can compute the time of voice being inactive and update the phase on voice reallocation (just don't destroy the old value when the voice went inactive).
3. You can keep the old phase for 'stolen' voices and set a random one when a voice is just allocated without stealing, which would give basically a similar (but maybe differently sounding depending on the random generator) effect.
4. Something else

Actually would be nice to apply the same 'freerunning' (that is non-initializing) effect to envelopes and probably internal state of the filters as well.

It would be even greater if you would have an option to set oscillator/envelope to freerunning or retriggering mode. For oscillators if in retriggering mode would be nice to be avle to specify a phase to which it should retrigger.

Best regards,
Dr Sync

P.S. Could you *please* do the same fix for MMV?

After the filters, for me the thing you have to have for a true analogue sound is cycling VCO waveforms - if MMV and CS-80 are claiming to be authentic then this really should be addressed. i'm not saying they sound bad or lack depth, but it's not authentic. For me the more a sound drifts in and out of phase not only defines analogue synthesis but sounds great!

Maybe this would be a viable thing... although I have no idea of the technical ramifications of what is possible and what kind of work it might entail...

Have both with the option of setting it as a global preference. It could default to what it is now, but with the option to go to running in realtime if cpu usage isn't a consideration.

If not now than maybe later as an update.

Definitely for the Moog especially in mono mode.

Is that the difference people are maybe hearing (myself included) between vsti's and virtual analogs (e.g. Virus, Q, Nova, Nord, etc.)... that those synths are running in realtime all the time?

Ned Bouhalassa wrote:

yes, yes, I know I have glasses on - but they're my shades!

They're also not actually over your eyes, Mr Magoo.

Hello all,
Hopefully I'm not too late to the party. Last night I made about 50 patches, and today I slapped together this song to kind of demo some of the sounds. It consists of 5 instances of the CS80V, and one acoustic drum kit in DR008. No external effects, no mixing, no compression, just the raw synth. So, I apologize in advance for the mix quality.

It should be accessible directly via this link:

http://www.soundclick.com/util/DownloadSong.cfm?ID=584567

If that doesn't work, then go here:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/3/chrislaurencemusic.htm

to download the song Ancient Techno.

Thanks for listening!

Dr Sync wrote:

xavier wrote: I am thinking of how I could manage this feature asked from a lot of you and the CPU increasing it will bring. Come on, it's not that difficult There are lots of options. ........

I get your silence as one of the following:

1. Thank you very much, that really could work
2. Shut up, noone is asking YOU!
3. What the $^% this guy is talking about?



Best regards,
Dr Sync

Quote:

1. Thank you very much, that really could work 2. Shut up, noone is asking YOU! 3. What the $^% this guy is talking about?

Or maybe he's just too busy to come here all days.

Dr Sync wrote:

I get your silence as one of the following: 1. Thank you very much, that really could work 2. Shut up, noone is asking YOU! 3. What the $^% this guy is talking about?

There's one part in Xavier's message that everyone left out when quoting:

xavier wrote:

Anyway, there is something which is done and which gives you living sound. So we can't say that there is retriggering oscillators, but we can't say the contrary.

I understood this like: "There is a 'workaround' implemented in MMV or CS80V already, which compensates for the lack of free running wavforms - however, we can not tell you our secret formula". But maybe that's just my personal translation of his 'french english'...

Hello Dr sync, zdar and dr.wackler,

you are right all you three.
I am very busy, as it is the end of the CS-80V project.
I can't discuss here why the simple calculation of the oscillators phase doesn't fit with my algorithm.
But I will use Dr Sync ideas to save CPU when I make no-retrigg oscillators for the MMV (in mono only, i am afraid)

Sorry for my "frensh english", at High scool, I prefered to play clarinet instead of learning

thank you for your interest in our product.

Xavier