hi,

in the "general purpose workhorse, under $100 category"; linplug cronox appears too good to be true. yet it rarely comes up in "best of" discussions. is it any good; can someone here vouch for it?

it appears to be basically a super-duper synth 1; same programming style, but with audibly cleaner output. i downloaded the demo, and from a quick test it appears to be highly capable. the demo does not appear to include presets (perhaps i installed it wrong?). i think it does sampling, looping, and resampling; but this aspect is not obvious to me.

so, is there anyone out there who owns cronox and can advise? thanks.

cronoX2 is a FANTASTIC machine but prolly a bit too esoteric to be your main lead synth i would say (depends what type of noise you make i guess)

perhaps if you like the linplug sound then the alpha (or even the freealpha) would be a better workhorse instrument for you

slainte rob

thanks exp4

actually, the free alpha's sound quality / ease of use is what lead me to cronox !!

in experimenting with the two, i think cronox does everything the alpha does, plus a whole lot more; correct me if i am wrong. cronox does not have all the waveforms of alpha, but makes up for that with AM, FM and resampling.

it also appears to be very easy on the CPU. there must be a downside; i just do not see it yet.

You're correct that CronoX will do everything FreeAlpha will do.and you hit the differences pretty squarely on the head.
CPU usage-that's debatable.I know both xp4 and I were talking about the CPU hits on our older machines(play some BIG chords using the Schrader mode on both oscillators,and see what I mean)when it first came out.It's a little more optimized,but I wish there was a global voice reduction switch instead of per patch.
What I mostly use CronoX for nowdays is to make waves to import into Reaktor and Absynth .
ew

I own CronoX but I haven't used it in 2 years or more simply because its filter just doesn't cut it fo rme. Its resonance is thin and weedy. I woul dsuggest Hydra as a far better alternative, you just need to spend some time with it to realise its potential, particularly as a 3 Operator FM synth. Its genius!

For some strange reason, LinPlug use their own, non-standard preset system. You need to load them from the instrument's GUI, not from your host's toolbar or whatever.

I like both CronoX and FreeAlpha, though I would also suggest daAlfa2K as a good sub-100 workhorse synth.

-David

I own a copy of cronox and I don't see why it couldn't be used as such.perhaps too much attention is paid to it's more unique qualities.you can get the more standard sounds out of it with less strain on the cpu.
i actually prefer linplugs method of patch importing too + the fact that it automatically saves a copy of whatever wav file I might load into it when i save a preset.

pummel wrote:

thanks exp4 actually, the free alpha's sound quality / ease of use is what lead me to cronox !! in experimenting with the two, i think cronox does everything the alpha does, plus a whole lot more; correct me if i am wrong. cronox does not have all the waveforms of alpha, but makes up for that with AM, FM and resampling. it also appears to be very easy on the CPU. there must be a downside; i just do not see it yet.

easy on the cpu? are we talking about a different synth? seriously, have you tried any of the actual presets? (don't know if you can with the demo)..cronox2 when i had an athlon 2600 was one of the worst cpu offenders for me..try playing 2 instances of 8 voices on a semi complex patch and watch your cpu go to its knees. but 2 throw my 2 c's about the preset system, i actually like it, on pc it was great, on mac unfortunately i can't get a song to reload the preset i saved. and as far as sound goes...well, i've go to admit, i have the factory presets, the electronisounds presets, the user presets, the kenfenpresets, and the latest volume 2 presets or whatever it's called, so because of this i have never really bothered doing any major tinkering with the machine itself, as i am still discovering the presets..but there are MANY i like, and find useful...especially the arksun ones

ok, what i meant by "easy on the cpu" --

my experiments to that point had been using it analog mode only; as if it were synth1. as such, it seems very efficient and clean sounding.

later, as recommended by this thread, i loaded a sample and put both osc in granular mode while playing a double fisted chord; and yes, i can get a significant CPU load. yet in a back-to-back comparison of similar multi-note EP sounds, rhino (another i am considering) was *twice* the CPU load of cronoX.

thanks bones, i will check out hydra; although i am really looking for more of a "budget" hybrid. BTW, *your* SE synths are nice.

Pummel,I don't know if the Crono demo will load patches but there's a bank of 21 presets using only the analog osc's at my site(just click the WWW next to my profile).Might help you decide if you want to purchase or not.I love CronoX.Great bargain.

pummel wrote:

...although i am really looking for more of a "budget" hybrid.

Again, let me suggest daAlfa2K by Dash Signature. In addition to having a nice warm sound, daAlfa also lets you import your own WAV files, though you can't do quite as much with them as you can with CronoX. Last I checked, daAlfa2K cost $40, and a package with the VSTi+640 ProSounds.net presets cost $70.

-David, who owns both daAlfa2K and CronoX and intends to use them a lot.

hey p4, thanks for the tip --

sorry i did not acknowledge sooner, but i noticed your first post and have been checking out daAlpha2k. in fact, i found a prevous post from a few months ago comparing daAlpha to cronox. in that thread, "VAZ plus" was also mentioned.

i am only able to buy one synth this year, due to budget constraints; so i need to pick a versatile one. it looks like the going rate is about $15-20 an osc. personally, i am more interested in the number of filters, not osc's; as thats where the cool sounds lie. pity none of the above has three filters; thats what i would really like to find.

dang; too many choices, not enough $$.

I have everything LinPlug makes except daOrgan and CronoX is my least used instrument in that group. As someone said, the filters are thin and the CPU use is very heavy. I don't consider it a workhorse at all. Right now Albino fits that position with multiple osc's and dual filters. My under $100 workhorse is still Pentagon I and Rhino is my under $100 synth that provides those special sounds.

Robert

Yup, I have to agree with Rabid. Pentagon I is a great workhorse. For a package deal, you can pick up Pentagon I and z3ta+ together for just over $200. That combination plus the good freebies like Synth 1 and Crystal is a monster core of synths to rely on.

ttoz wrote:

easy on the cpu? are we talking about a different synth? seriously, have you tried any of the actual presets? (don't know if you can with the demo)..cronox2 when i had an athlon 2600 was one of the worst cpu offenders for me..try playing 2 instances of 8 voices on a semi complex patch and watch your cpu go to its knees.

I ran your 2 x CronoX's on several different presets with 8 voices. (I too have most of them). Couldn't get my cpu to break into a sweat, let alone come to its knees. Highest was 45% CPU useage. This is on an Athlon 1600+ 1Gb ram and dma 133 hard drives.

Guess this is a case of YMMV. (Your mileage may vary).

Cheers

Druu wrote:

For a package deal, you can pick up Pentagon I and z3ta+ together for just over $200. That combination plus the good freebies like Synth 1 and Crystal is a monster core of synths to rely on.

Or for just under $200 you can get ORION Platinum with much better sounding built-in synths and hundreds of presets all delivered on CD in a shiny box, with a host to boot. These days its really hard for me to see "just over $200" being cheap for two downloadable softsynths.

Is it possible to use Orion synths in other hosts?

In V5 you will via ReWire slave

ok,

daalpha2k sounds great; and i would have to say it is the best under $50 commercial synth ive heard.

but it seems to repeat functionality i already have built into FLstudio. still, at only $40, its a smart buy just for the included high quality samples and for a more pleasant interface than 3xOSC.

having spent some more time with the cronox demo, and specifically pushing its filters and FM, i am having second thoughts.

what i am really looking for is a super clean sounding synth-1; but at a cronox (or less) price.

dougby1 wrote:

ttoz wrote: easy on the cpu? are we talking about a different synth? seriously, have you tried any of the actual presets? (don't know if you can with the demo)..cronox2 when i had an athlon 2600 was one of the worst cpu offenders for me..try playing 2 instances of 8 voices on a semi complex patch and watch your cpu go to its knees. I ran your 2 x CronoX's on several different presets with 8 voices. (I too have most of them). Couldn't get my cpu to break into a sweat, let alone come to its knees. Highest was 45% CPU useage. This is on an Athlon 1600+ 1Gb ram and dma 133 hard drives. Guess this is a case of YMMV. (Your mileage may vary). Cheers

or a case of "doug has a freak machine"..you're hte guy who had amazing cpu usage compared to others with rhino as well..honestly, i would NEVER get rid of that athlon 1600, it must be running at 4ghz

pummel wrote:

what i am really looking for is a super clean sounding synth-1; but at a cronox (or less) price.

Then [ discoDSP's Discovery ] is the synth for you. Without a doubt.

ttoz wrote:

or a case of "doug has a freak machine"..you're hte guy who had amazing cpu usage compared to others with rhino as well..honestly, i would NEVER get rid of that athlon 1600, it must be running at 4ghz

More like ttoz is accident prone when it comes to getting vstis working. Like Linplug RMIV.

dougby1 wrote:

ttoz wrote: or a case of "doug has a freak machine"..you're the guy who had amazing cpu usage compared to others with rhino as well..honestly, i would NEVER get rid of that athlon 1600, it must be running at 4ghz More like ttoz is accident prone when it comes to getting vstis working. Like Linplug RMIV.

ok, obviously my toungue in cheek humour didn't work for you

and i never had linplug problems with pc, only mac...oh, and watch how many people can't authorize their rm4 on mac, not just me

as far as cpu usage, well, i do find it a little hard to believe because:
I have asked you on a few occasions to waste 2 or 3 minutes of your valuable time doing a very simple ambience reverb test for me, and you just disappear and ignore the request (which i actually thought was quite rude, as i asked you very politely)...

secondly, you must be absolutely sure that you have 16 voices being played simultaneously...not just have 16 voices loaded and only be using 5 of them..i.e. play eight note extended chords on both instances of cronox, then tell me your cpu usage..it really does deped on the complexity of the patch too...go to user bank 1, and load "fabio misterio"..if you can honestly tell me that you can hit 16 simultaneous keys on that patch with only 45% cpu usage, then, i am not being sarcastic now, but you DO have a freak machine

Hello everybody

I like Cronox.
It needs to be explored before obtaining great sounds
Then, you will see that this synth can be your main synth

ttoz wrote:

play eight note extended chords on both instances of cronox, then tell me your cpu usage..

ttoz,

I don't want to get in between the two of you, since it seems like you guys are about to get bogged down in a deep and dirty flamewar (which is always fun to watch... ), but let me put in a word about my experience with the usage.

I have just loaded a single instance of Cronox2 and 'fabio mysterio' (once the regular and once the 'hold key' version) in Orion Platinum, and holding 8 keys simultaneously my CPU usage jumped to 76% in the first half-second, but then kept oscillating between 12% and 27%. I didn't try the 16-keys-at-once thingie, since I have no idea how to hold down 16 keys at once with only 10 fingers.

At any rate, my system is an Athlon 1700+ with Win2k, 768MB SDRAM, and an Audiophile 2496.

Dingo865 wrote:

I didn't try the 16-keys-at-once thingie, since I have no idea how to hold down 16 keys at once with only 10 fingers.

i find the elbow-to-wrist-full-bodyweight-lean-on-keyboard usually does the trick

slainte rob

...and as to Cronox 2: it's a fantastic synth, and fairly unique among commercial products. The original CronoX was my first commercial buy, and I would buy it over and over again; it gave me sound-sculpting abilities that none of the other synths offered (and definitely not at this price) at the time.

BUT, I do feel that it may not be the best suited for a 'flagship' or 'workhorse' type of role. The filter is very clear but thin and digital, which is just what I want for the part I use Cronox2 for, but not necessarily for a 'main' synth. I have Junglist (my second commercial purchase - used it once in the last 14 months) that has a nice sound, but I have been simply unable to get into it. To me (please note the strictly subjective and biased opinion), from preset management through GUI to the pacthes it ships with, everything in Junglist is boring. This is what kept me away from Hydra, which seems but a pumped-up version of Junglist.

Personally, I am absolutely convinced that you cannot get any better than Pentagon I for a workhorse synth role. Every time I load it, I fall in love with it over and over again.

Then again, BONES loves Hydra and thinks Pentagon is a needlessly complex piece of shit, and he has done a lot more music and built a lot more good synths than I have (which would be 0 in my case on both counts ), so take my opinion with a pinch of salt...

experimentfour wrote:

i find the elbow-to-wrist-full-bodyweight-lean-on-keyboard usually does the trick slainte rob

You bastard! I tried your approach - now I can spend the weekend collecting the pieces from the floor and rebuilding my keyboard with the stand... why did you not mention that I was supposed to put it first on a solid flat surface?!?!?!

heehee

slainte rob

Dingo865 wrote:

ttoz wrote: play eight note extended chords on both instances of cronox, then tell me your cpu usage.. ttoz, I have just loaded a single instance of Cronox2 and 'fabio mysterio' (once the regular and once the 'hold key' version) in Orion Platinum, and holding 8 keys simultaneously my CPU usage jumped to 76% in the first half-second, but then kept oscillating between 12% and 27%.

yes, that makes perfect sense..as the first half second is when the full polyphony of 8 is being processed, then, as the polyphony dies down, so does cpu usage...so there you go, if you were to hit 16 keys you would have cpu usage of over 150%, even for a split second, so it would be impossible, and your computer would probably lock up...and as your machine is faster than dougby's, it just again proves my theory THITTHA (you will have to work that one out yourselves)

Dingo865 wrote:

experimentfour wrote: i find the elbow-to-wrist-full-bodyweight-lean-on-keyboard usually does the trick slainte rob You bastard! I tried your approach - now I can spend the weekend collecting the pieces from the floor and rebuilding my keyboard with the stand... why did you not mention that I was supposed to put it first on a solid flat surface?!?!?!

actually, i have another point. a well optimized plugin on a macg4 should be reasonable competitive clock for clock with an athlon/pentium cpu...fabio misterio uses 90% of a single g4 1.42 ghz processor, which shows just how badly optimized linplug's mac instruments are..wheras with es2, i get about 500% better performance than that(altivec optimized)