This has been mentioned several times in relation to the Waldorf Edition bundle that is being sold cheaply by Musician's Friend and AudioMidi, among others, but I still haven't seen the proof. Many people claim that the PPG Wave VST can make many interesting sounds. But the demo song on the Steinberg site sure doesn't float my boat.

I suppose I could locate the demo (if there is one), and try to load up some of the better presets that are available here and elsewhere, and try it. But my time is very short, and I often don't even get to turn on my music computer these days. So, does anyone have an MP3 of some killer PPG Wave VST sounds lying around that they'd be willing to post a link to??

I am tempted to try the Waldorf bundle because of the price, but I fear that I would simply never use the Wave, and would be paying for Attack, mostly. Anyone want to prove me wrong??

Thanks a lot,

Green

Green Red Brownell wrote:

But the demo song on the Steinberg site sure doesn't float my boat.

Most demos suck, no matter what the synth. Try the demo if you can, or look for some tracks here, im sure there are some (Scot Solida?)

I got the bundle, and i think its a great synth, and there are a lot of banks for it too.

You and I are in the same boat. I never did like PPG whatsoever. It either floats your boat, or it doesn't. There is a demo out there though.

Devon

You can check out this track I did a while back:
Counter-Productive

If I recall correctly, everything is PPG Wave except the various leads (ReFX Claw) and the drums.

My take on the PPG is that you can get some incredible tones - but its quite difficult to program, especially if you don't know the general content of the wavetables. Luckily there are quite a few presets out there.

The PPG never did anything for me either... and we all know that I'm the definitive word on such things!

I like the ppg. It's not got an "in your face" sound to it like z3ta, rhino or any of the other modern synths. Still, it has it's place. I was working with it the other day, and was really kind of pleasantly surprised at the sounds I was getting from it. It would be worth your while to track down a demo to try it out

Thanks so much to Floyd for going to the trouble to post something I could listen to. Nice tune, Floyd!

As for the sound of the Wave, what I am hearing is a lot of chime-y, bell-like tones, plus the bass, of course. So far, that seems to be the *only* sort of thing I hear from the Wave, and that's what worries me. It seems to be good for "background textures", and that's about it. Sadly, I'm still in the "is that all there is?" boat.

Oh well.... if I find some time to try the demo, I guess I will. If anyone else has a tune that features the PPG doing something *different*, please send along the link.

Thanks again to Floyd. I'm not dissing your song in any way.... I'm just seriously wondering about the value of the Wave, when there is so much else out there...

Glad you liked it GRB

Yeah, I don't really see the PPG as a 'do everything' type synth. It doesn't do lush pads without alot of fx, and I haven't been able to coax a really acceptable lead out of it. Still, at the low prices its going for - along with Waldorf Attack - its worth looking into for the sheer uniqueness of the sounds. I haven't really heard anything like it, honestly.

Green Red Brownell wrote:

As for the sound of the Wave, what I am hearing is a lot of chime-y, bell-like tones, plus the bass, of course. So far, that seems to be the *only* sort of thing I hear from the Wave, and that's what worries me. It seems to be good for "background textures", and that's about it. Sadly, I'm still in the "is that all there is?" boat.

Wizoosounds has Wave samples for Halion, Giga and EXS24 formats. You might want to take a listen to hear different sounds that the Wave can do:

http://www.wizoosounds.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/wizoosounds.woa/53/wo/Kq 223j6jCFc82VCaBWt1ThHfrB2/2.0.33.13.0.1.1

Also look in the Analog and Digital section for Wave.

I'm like you-I can take it or leave it when it comes to Wave. Most of the crystal clear bell like sounds can be done by FM synths just as well, or close enuff!

PGP sound great in a mix..

but you have to program the damn thing to get what you want.. I took some effort to learn the fucker and now I love it

the sound can be awesome.. and it can be shait

but I love that plug

Thanks, db. For me, it's boiling down to whether the reduced price on the bundle is worth it for Attack and D-Pole.

We'll see...

I got the bundle. I played around with the PPG and realized it wasn't restricted to producing only 80s sounding patches. The wavetable sweep feature is kind of fun. Anyway, I decided it was worth $40 and Attack was worth $40, so the $80 on the bundle was OK. The Attack is kind of cool but it takes some time before you can use it very quickly and efficiently to create patches. But I'm glad I got it.

UNFORTUNATELY, I have found that the PPG does not work with FL Studio correctly. No crashes or anything, it just misses notes periodically. Somehow not all the MIDI information makes it to the plugin. Apparently, I'm not the only one who has had this problem. It seems to be well known, actually. Oh well. Every other plugin works with FL with no problem.

I like the PPG enough to try to find some workaround - does anyone have any suggestions? One option: I can record the PPG in FL, export the MIDI to some app (free?) in which the PPG works properly, render, and import the audio back to FL. I wonder if there is a less painful approach.

well you could buy energyxt, and use it to host ppg wave inside of fl studio. that might fix your problem.

Quote:

UNFORTUNATELY, I have found that the PPG does not work with FL Studio correctly

there was an update to v1.2 -
is that what yours is?
I don't use FL that often, but I don't recall having troubles with the ppg in it.

Yeah, version 1.2.1. I think this must be the last version.

As far as getting EnergyXT, well that might work...but I don't want to spend any more money on my bargain synth to get it to work!

Any other FL users out there experience the same problem? I have heard from a few others who have seen the same behavior.

Kriminal wrote:

Green Red Brownell wrote: But the demo song on the Steinberg site sure doesn't float my boat. Most demos suck, no matter what the synth. Try the demo if you can, or look for some tracks here, im sure there are some (Scot Solida?) I got the bundle, and i think its a great synth, and there are a lot of banks for it too.

yeah scots patches make this shine i feel,most of the factory stuff was a bit shitty but with some of the banks available for the price in the bundle youd be an idiot not to

Í also was short before buying it for that special discount. Tried ppg again and realized that it is too one-sided for my taste. It does some interesting sounds...but they are all quite similar.

Who says it is worthwhile? There are so many better VSTi's out there, man, if you start buying every VSTi that's better than PPG, you'd finish up with full hard disk...

He blinded me with science

As for the FL Studio problems: It's strange - it only happens some of the time. I haven't quite figured out the circumstances that cause it. I am working on a song right now without any note drop-outs, as far as I can tell. So I'm glad to be using it. I'll keep using it, and if I get drop-outs, I'll figure out how to fix them - I think moving notes very slightly might help avoid this. Yes, a big pain, but something that can be done after a song is nearly complete. And at worst I can render the PPG tracks in a different sequencer (perhaps tobybear's simple VST host?).

By the way, A patch by Scot Solida was the inspiration for this tune I'm working on. Unfortunately the demo version will not allow you to load patches (that's dumb), so you can't really see what kind of patches are possible unless you make your own. But I like this synth - it's different from all the others I have. (All my others are freebies, by the way!)

Here's why the PPG Wave is a steal:
1. very low CPU useage
2. eight voice polyphonic
3. completely misunderstood

I've seen people making it out to sound like a one trick pony or that it's a rough and tumble synth or that it's a metaphysical experience, ect.

This is a very programable synth. The demo was very dated sounding and meant to attract people who remember the PPG Wave from it's hey day.

You can and will get a big amount of sound quality if you put time in learning to program the synth. If you want to hear some demos of songs with a lot of PPG Wave 2.v let me know and I'll put some older stuff of mine up.

I defy people to say it's not highly capable, especially as it is one of the finest digalog synths released as a VSTi and the closest you'll get to a microWave sound. The PPG is a bit rougher around the edge but the uWave has several years of newer technology doing many of the same things - with a cut down feature set.

Email me if you want to hear the Wave in action. I may not follow up on this thread.

I didn't like it at first because the factory sounds were -for me - relatively lifeless and uninspiring. I tried some of the 3rd party banks from and -boom- Viagra-like it sprung to life out of its previous moribund coma...now I love it.

Did anybody like -any- of the music that was made in the early '80s ?

Wait...

What was the question again ?


cerberus

I bought the PPG for $50 and it was worth every penny. Great for any digital sound, especialy Drum&Bass and Industrial sounds. It's a very versital but not very intuitive sound sculptor. Definately in a class of it's own!

So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!!
mp3 please!

double post (again)

x_bruce wrote:

2. eight voice polyphonic

Its actually 64 voice poly... Not only that but its multitimbral - 2 stereo outs. Agreed on the low cpu thing though, its maybe even lower than synth1.

Mindless, I posted an mp3 on the first page of the thread if you haven't already checked it out.

A zimple way to show the usefulness of the ppg wave 2.5.

Hold down the alt key on your computer while simultaneously hitting the akku button on the plug-in.

now audtion the random sound you've just generated.

here's a quick little thing I did in FL Studio featuring some patches from Scot Solidaypegged

nice little groove gary ...
the bass really kicks ...

thanks normal!
one thing I've discovered (or remembered) is that it seems to always load up with the default bank loaded.
so now, even if I load Scots' bank back up, I'm not sure which patches I used..There's probably a way to do this..must break out the manual, I geuss.

check to see if you have the 'enable program editing' option checked in the Fruity wrapper ...

that may solve the problem ...

normal wrote:

check to see if you have the 'enable program editing' option checked in the Fruity wrapper ... that may solve the problem ...

thank you! that indeed did solve the problem!

Mindless wrote:

So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!! mp3 please!

Van Halen: Jump (1984)
and many many more.

cerberus

cerberus wrote:

Mindless wrote: So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!! mp3 please! Van Halen: Jump (1984) and many many more. cerberus

I don't really think 'Jump' was a ppg.
oberheim obx

..but it was all over Thomas Dolbys' 'golden age of wireless' (along with a fairlight)

bluedad wrote:

cerberus wrote: Mindless wrote: So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!! mp3 please! Van Halen: Jump (1984) and many many more. cerberus I don't really think 'Jump' was a ppg.

I think this was an OBX, or another Oberheim...

PPG has been used in several Art of Noise, Propaganda, Franky goes to Hollywood, Thomas Dolby and Nik Kershaw tracks...

Well, I had a PPG and it was a fine machine, but this VSTi sounds a bit too harsh to me. That's why I said what I've said, that it's not worth buying, but considering all your posts here... hmmm I still think it's not as good as it could be, but it is good as many other VSTi's and if you gave it enough time to learn its high and lows. yep.

oh ye, and "Jump" was an Oberheim Matrix-12 [me think], could be OBx though... bad old hardware days, never looked back [almost... ]. Cheers.

I have a short demotrack of the PPG 2.V on my hp:
Electromagnetic Sauna

DocT, those are some nice ppg presets on your site.
I especially like the second set.
thanks!

bluedad wrote:

cerberus wrote: Mindless wrote: So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!! mp3 please! Van Halen: Jump (1984) and many many more. cerberus I don't really think 'Jump' was a ppg. oberheim obx

Maybe there was an oberheim also...The riff I am referring to was apparently all ppg.

www.parsek.at/cerberus/examples/ppg_Wave2.3_demo_cassette.mp3

"Example number seven speaks for itself"

Buy this great VSTi while you can !


cerberus

In case you didn't see my new thread: the PPG works with the new beta version of the plugin wrapper in FL Studio. The beta wrapper is available at the FL Studio forum.

Quote:

"Example number seven speaks for itself"

That does not sound like the sound in "Jump" to me. It sounded basicly like any ol' synth brass imo. Even preset 32 on my JD-800 sounded more like "Jump"

GRB, sorry for the delay. Lots of parts being swapped on the computer, more fun tomorrow as it gets a new case, dvd rw and other updates.

btw, I consult for my nephew who designs computers for music use. Some of the above changes are in a sense beta testing components for use in other people's systems. To date no sasualties due to programs going crazy, wacky drivers, etc.

If you think you might be interested in a Microsoft or Linux platform (this is still imo underdeveloped but I'll work with anyone serious.)

The tracks I'll be putting up are 2 - 5 channels of PPG Wave with various other fun synths like Pentagon/z3ta+, VirSyn TERA/CUBE, CronoX, Rainbow and a few others dating between 2002 through 2003. All tracks done in Orion. Should be up this week.

Very cool!! Thanks very much, x-bruce...

Green Red Brownell wrote:

Very cool!! Thanks very much, x-bruce...

It depends what you need it for. PPG is an electric piano. It has a great sound and although Lounge Lizard is more current in terms of sound quality and flexibility, it still holds it's own. Quite usable. Don't forget, also you can take sounds from any source and morph them, creating something other than the original.

stefancrs wrote:

Quote: "Example number seven speaks for itself" That does not sound like the sound in "Jump" to me. It sounded basicly like any ol' synth brass imo. Even preset 32 on my JD-800 sounded more like "Jump"

The sustain and release don't sound right. I do seem to recall that EVH mentioned using OBX's or similar in interviews at the time.

cerberus wrote:

bluedad wrote: cerberus wrote: Mindless wrote: So, HOW DOES IT SOUND!!!! mp3 please! Van Halen: Jump (1984) and many many more. cerberus I don't really think 'Jump' was a ppg. oberheim obx Maybe there was an oberheim also...The riff I am referring to was apparently all ppg. www.parsek.at/cerberus/examples/ppg_Wave2.3_demo_cassette.mp3 "Example number seven speaks for itself" Buy this great VSTi while you can ! cerberus

Go listen to the original Jump, it's kinda sorta close, but they obviously didn't use a PPG on it. I just did a back to back, and it's certainly off.

Devon

DevonB wrote:

Go listen to the original Jump, it's kinda sorta close, but they obviously didn't use a PPG on it. I just did a back to back, and it's certainly off. Devon

I don't have the time or desire to analysis it in detail. It's close with the PPG, but the didn't nail it! Kinda like a second rate bar band doing covers!

Who has a list of sites where I can get free or commercial sounds for the PPG Wave 2.V VSTi?

Thanks,
JB

oh the misinformation ..........

jump was an obx and the ppg was never an electric piano.

Haricots is right. He explains it in one of his interviews in either Guitar Player or Guitar World magazine. He used an early version of an Oberheim OBX, the one with the surface all black and grey, don't know how many voices. He routed the sound through one of his amps. He also used one of the default factory presets (can't remember the number anymore...) During concerts you would see him using an OBXa but that was not used for the recording...

The PPG VSTi is a great underestimated synth with very unique sounds but kind of odd to program, definitely not an electric piano!

Does anyone know what Michael Jackson used for the pad in beggining of Beat It? Sounds like a modified factory preset of the PPG. I'm getting very close...

PPG was all over Numan's Berserker, Fury and Strange Charm albums. I like it but it is an acquired taste. Used well it can very punchy, hard and powerful.

I seem to remember that Steve Winwood and Robert Palmer were very fond of their PPGs too.

Sorry for the long post....

Just got mine after 5 weeks (DHL are shit!!) and remembered I'd copy this off some website into a text file to print. Can't remember whch one though, hence the long post. I was waiting to see if it was in the manual and it isn't.

Those attempting to learn to program this might find it useful.


The Wavetable Descriptions

00. Harmonics 1-8 very strong, simulation of a resonant filter, wave number 00 is a sine wave.
01. Similar to wavetable 00, but with additional higher harmonics, dual VCF simulation
02. Similar to two previous wavetables, but also good for vibes, bells, tubular bells, and so on.
03. Sine-to-rectangular sweep, low-resonance VCF simulation, clarinette and flute sounds.
04. Waves 00-47 feature very high harmonics in progressively greater amplitudes. Waves 48-59 continue to add high harmonics but at a faster rate. Also useful for delay effects and church bells.
05. Very high harmonics are emphasized, effects similar to wavetable 15, but more mixture like.
06. Sine-to-ramp sweep, low-resonance-VCF effects, also good for woodwinds.
07. VCF sweep without resonance, also useful for woodwind sounds.
08. Highpass VCF simulation without resonance. Wave 00 has little or no fundamental. Wave 25 has fundamental at maximum amplitude. Useful for dark percussive strings, bass with click-like attack.
09. Formants are strong middle-range harmonics, useful for ring-modulation and vocal sounds.
10. Similar to wavetable 09.
11. Low formants. Wave 00 is dark, 32 is bright, 59 is dark.
12. High formants that sweep.
13. Very strong high-order harmonics, the fundamental is weak. Useful for bright percussive stringed keyboard instrument sounds like clavichord, harpsichord, and so on. When swept, you get an amplitude modulation effect. Wave 00 is maximum amplitude, 24 is minimum amplitude, 59 is maximum. Use great detuning, upper waves and dissonant low chords for noise effects.
14. Several organ registers. Sine, Hammond, Lowery, Church organs.
15. Harmonics 2 + 3 to sawtooth sweep. Useful for harmonium, accordion, harmonica sounds.
16. Wild amplitude modulation effects when swept. Several peaks and dips in amplitude.
17. Wave 00 features the fundamental and second harmonic. Wave 14 is the fundamental alone. Wave 40 has high harmonics. Wave 59 is the fundamental alone.
18. When swept produces high-low-high harmonic sweep effect.
19. Waves 00-32 are stationary waveforms with string upper harmonics and a few lower harmonics. Wave 59 has no fundamental.
20. Fast discrete changes of low and high harmonics for sample and hold effects. Wave 00 is a sine wave.
21. Sine wave to high frequency formants.
22. This wavetable is particularly suited for echoing effects. Waveforms vary from original attack plus one delay, to two coloured delays. Wave 00 is a sine wave.
23. Strong high harmonics.
24. Stationary organs. If swept produces ascending high harmonic sweeps.
25. Waves 59 to 49 go from bright to sine wave. 48 to 33 have a coloured delay. 33 to 18 are sine waves. 17 to 00 have a coloured delay echo.
26. Variations on sawtooth waves in strong, bright formants. Good for brass sounds.
27. Formant sweeps. When keyboard is used to control the waves, vocal and choir sounds can be produced.
28. Phasing sawtooth waves. Useful for ensemble string sounds.
29. Square to rectangular to narrow pulse waves. Sweeps produce pulse width modulation effects.
30. Used on older wave 2.2's to hold sampled waveforms loaded in via the Waveterm.
31. Held samples of piano and saxophone in pre-MIDI models (also in the VSTi version).

JAB3 wrote:

Who has a list of sites where I can get free or commercial sounds for the PPG Wave 2.V VSTi? Thanks, JB

I ask again. Thanks

I think there are patch banks right here at KvR, and at patcharena.com. Plus, look backwards in this thread for a post by DocT... he has a couple of banks on his site.

That's a start.... try using a search engine, and maybe you can post a few locations too.

Are there any up on the Waldorf FTP site? I haven't looked....

-- Green

Am I wrong or am I right - didn't one of the lads in Ultravox love his PPG? Or was that Trevor Horn who produced Frankie Goes To Holliwood? Anyway, it was big during that era so for synth pomp and 80's electro it should fit the bill.

There's a free bank of PPG patches on the Steinberg FTP site I think.

For an example of some modern PPG usage: The new To Rococo Rot album Hotel Morgan uses a couple of real PPGs on most of the tracks.

For some classic vintage usage:
The Frankie Goes To Hollywood tune Two Tribes uses the PPG for the storming bass line.

How many examples does one need. You either like the sound or you loath it. For other wavetable type synths, if you got Reaktor the try the Amphitryon ensemble. It's a blinder! Closet you are gonna get to the microwave in software.

enjoy

Harry

the PPG is all over "A Secret Wish" by Propaganda, one of my favorite 80's albums.

-jsd-