Hi Group,

this is to let you know, that my NADS "not another drumsynth" is now available as a demoversion.


(screenshot doesn´t reflect final version)

I´m still working on the full one, which will have much more preset kits...

NADS Features overview in short:

- nice GUI elements by O. Larkin
- Windows VST Instrument
- drumsynthesier, all sounds generated
- 32 kits included
- 7 drums at once
- 4 filter types for each drum
- combfilter effect, distortion
- stereo noisegenerator
- variable waveforms
- 6 stereooutputs
- 6 limiters for each output
- fully automatable
- MIDI controllers supported
- single-drum version with 100+ sounds also included

Download the Demo here:
http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

Please give it a try and let me know what ya all think about it

By the way: Customers that bought Agonyx will get this one for 25% off!

Thanks for listening!
-sonic out

sounds good, but all the preset kits are identical

[edit] - my mistake, they aren't identical. This sounds quite cool actually, how much will you be charging for it?

thanks!

i thought on 10-15 US$ ... i think this is a fair price

Here are two new Demos...

http://www.prodyon.de/files/nads_demo5.mp3
http://www.prodyon.de/files/nads_demo6.mp3

demo6 is made out of one drumloop and a very basic melody, so that you can hear how well NADS fits into existing mixes

some more replies?

sonicfire wrote:

thanks! i thought on 10-15 US$ ... i think this is a fair price

Hey sonicfire,

This drumsytnh looks good. Regarding the price of 10-15 dollars, i think that is probably a fair price if the product sounds good.

I think it fair to say that some KVR members may be reluctant to buy synthedit commerial products because certain synthedit devs in the past have let them down with bad support.

I won't mention names but a certain trance synth/s were released, and although they sounded great, people bought them only to realise that support may not be very forthcoming. I did.

I guess what i'm saying is that people will buy this (i would, i love agonyx) if they can be re-assured that you intend to take it seriously and offer good support, updates when needed/wanted etc.

It looks like you have the potential to develop great plugins, as long as you can back it up with good support.

Cheers

Quincy

reply.

Not another PC drumsynth... NAPDS!

dunno how enthusiastic i can be about the marketing prospects for anyhting that begins "not another.."

if you are planning on doing some vst for money, my suggestion (take w/ grain of salt is perhaps wait on the $ until you have something unique (i don't know how unique this is.. as said, too many my own to d/l, jsut like aesthetic) and let people get to know you as a developer first :p

oc i know fuckall about it really

how about adding some color to the gui

thanks for replies, guys! that was fast fast!

quincy: thanks, well i try to do my best to support people when they have probs/questions and stuff. it´s not always easy but i try

sickle666:

DHR53: *lol* why not? or NABSDSFPC (not another boring synthedit drum synth for pc)

xoxos: yes, true but in short you call it just NADS, so that "not another..." doesn´t stand in front. okay, perhaps this isn´t that unique, but ok sounding anyway (IMHO)

hitman8081: well, this time i wanted just a plain gray, next thing will possibly be more colourful!

I really like this drum synth. I like the way you've created the kits - choosing some excellent sounds that work well together. I think they work well for hard-house/trance but could be used in hiphop and chillout just as easily.

I don't know how you intend to develop NADS but I'd like to see more kits and more sounds per kit. Perhaps spread over 2 octaves instead of one. Maybe a couple of hat and snare like sounds per kit would give motre options. Please don't change the sounds that are already included because the strength of NAD's is it's quirky sounds. I'd just like to see more of that quirkyness.

Perhaps you could include some simple FX like delay and reverb. I'd also like to see a compressor or brickwall limiter per instrument so that we can control the levels more easily. These ideas may not be possible but I'm just throwing them out for discussion.

I like the name 'NADS' as well. And the cool little animation reminds me of the animation in Reaktors LIMElite. When it's ready you've got a customer.

I dunno how strict Oli is on his stuff being used in commercial products. But if you haven't already you should checkup so it's ok to use his Greyskin even when selling the plugin.

Apart from that though it looks like a fun lil thing

/Majken

majken: thanks , yes, i´ve asked him

munchkin: thanks! well, atm i´m still in the usual SE cpu-usage probs. adding even more drums would be no problem but then also cpu load raises. i will see if i can crunch it down further.
about that two octave spread: wouldn´t it be better to use black keys? i thought of that. so you would have 12 drums instead of 7... hell yeah, i will do that. some extra snares and hihats are a good idea
but dont flame me if it consumes even more cpu then
concerning fx, this time no reverb. it just uses too much horsepower. but delay, yes would be possible.
i thought of making some small extra-fx plugs that you can use more flexible instead of putting them into NADS...

I meant... how about a Mac version of something for a change! ...HAMDS

The cpu load seems minimal on my system. I'm getting between 7-13% cpu. Some kits don't use more than 8%. Using a 4/4 pattern with kick, snare and hihat at 140bpm.

I'm testing NADS in Sonar 3 and Ableton Live 4 with a Athlon 2400XP PC and EMU 0404 s/c.

Look forward to a delay being incorporated in the future. If possible, a limiter on each sound would be cool. I know I can adjust the levels but the punch of the sound is then lost. I'm always hoping for compressors/limiters in drum synths. I also think that a gate would be very useful to get that cut up rhythmn that works really well in some dance music.
Perhaps these fx could be switched off in order to conserve cpu if they aren't needed. I've never programmed anything in synthedit so I don't know how realistic any of these ideas are.

NADS is a lovely little instrument and reminds me of Waldorfs Attack. But I think you've created more interesting and contemporary sounds. I never really liked Attacks GUI though. 10 out of 10 for both your products so far.

@munchkin: thanks for that!
well atm i´m trying to raise drumsounds to 12 or something and after this i will add some basic fx, like the delay. not sure about that compressor/limiter thing, i never got into how such an effect works.
have to learn that, i think

this poll is fun, i´m sure if i would say NADS will be free the votes would be way more positive

yepp

Not to poop on you or anything, but with free competition like Odo's Rythms v2 only a thread or two away from yours, you are probably absolutely correct.

sonicfire wrote:

this poll is fun, i´m sure if i would say NADS will be free the votes would be way more positive

Perhaps you should change the poll to 'yes' and 'maybe'. Don't let the 'no's' put you off. You'll still get customers and those who don't want to buy it may not need this type of instrument anyway. I don't think the price you're thinking of charging is too high. But maybe that's because I'll make good use of NADS in my music.

if there would be a way to change the poll, i would do

sickle666 wrote:

Not to poop on you or anything, but with free competition like Odo's Rythms v2 only a thread or two away from yours, you are probably absolutely correct.

It's true that Odo releases some amazing synths for free. His Unknown synth is exceptional IMO. He's releasing Rhythms 2 tomorrow so we'll have to wait and see...

What I like about NADS are the kits. There are many drum synths out there but there aren't that many with kits as interesting and different as NADS. I think the kit/preset programming is what makes a synth stand out and IMO this is what makes NADS worth buying.

The NADS kits sound like they are made for modern dance music rather than the same tired old 909 and 808 kits. The other important thing is that the sounds in each kit work well together. I think that's an achievement considering they are quite unusual.

munchkin wrote:

What I like about NADS are the kits. There are many drum synths out there but there aren't that many with kits as interesting and different as NADS. I think the kit/preset programming is what makes a synth stand out and IMO this is what makes NADS worth buying. The NADS kits sound like they are made for modern dance music rather than the same tired old 909 and 808 kits. The other important thing is that the sounds in each kit work well together. I think that's an achievement considering they are quite unusual.

hmm..

odo wrote:

i`m working on 2 skins for Rythms 2 one hard yello and a metal skin like the old one the yello is almost ready i think 2 days or so i want to change the text in the output part of the synth need to make a the sine/triangle buttons and some more things after that i need to make 64 kits Odo.

Thanks!! That´s the most timeconsuming part for me - trying to make decent kits

btw, i agree odo´s works are really great

sickle666 wrote:

munchkin wrote: What I like about NADS are the kits. There are many drum synths out there but there aren't that many with kits as interesting and different as NADS. I think the kit/preset programming is what makes a synth stand out and IMO this is what makes NADS worth buying. The NADS kits sound like they are made for modern dance music rather than the same tired old 909 and 808 kits. The other important thing is that the sounds in each kit work well together. I think that's an achievement considering they are quite unusual. hmm.. odo wrote: i`m working on 2 skins for Rythms 2 one hard yello and a metal skin like the old one the yello is almost ready i think 2 days or so i want to change the text in the output part of the synth need to make a the sine/triangle buttons and some more things after that i need to make 64 kits Odo.

64 kits! Bound to be some good sounds then. I'll still buy NADS tho...

Hey sonicfire,

I haven't had a chance to try yet, but I'd recommend that you get Oli Larkin's permission to use his graphics before you sell this. Also wouldn't hurt to credit him somewhere in the readme file or about screen.

Cheers,
Steve

@shamann: of course, no worries, i´ve asked him.

by the way: just click on the NADS logo!

EDIT: or did you meant that with the "about" screen?

I just tried Odo's rhythm. It sounds good but IMO the kits aren't as inventive as those in NADS. I know Odo hasn't finished it yet but I still prefer NADS for the type of music I do. I think NADS has a more contemporary sound and will work better with modern club music.

i think each one has its own strength. imho odo´s goal is to aim solid acoustic like kits, where my goal was to create some unusal drumsounds / experimental

i think i will call it yaps - yet another purchase for spoonboiler...

well, you know how i feel about it already. love the sounds it makes, and how quick it is to go from idea to sound. the new things you are thinking about are solid, and i look forward to hearing the results.

cherio
s:b

I've just tried Odo's new Rhythms and your NADS and I must say that Odo's synth is quite nice, has a good kick drum and many kits, but your is

TOTALLY F*CKIN AWESOME!!!

A Huge Yepp!

Where do I send those 10 bucks?


Note that I'm hardly ever that impulsive?

@spoonboiler: no worries, it will be cheap
i hope i get all that stuff i have in my head implemented soon!

@paulie phonick: thanks!! if you really want make a donation via paypal on my site then i will sent you the demo-robotvoice-free one

I wanna be clear that I am not making any comparisons of your work to Odo or anyone else.

Were Odo to suddenly ask for financial renumeration for his synths, I would be the first to purchase each & every one of them, & as a supporter of up & coming developers in general (YOU included, if you remember), it can't be stressed that enthusiasm in a new instrument's release can overtake it's actual status as bieng ready for such, ie, a commercial release..

I am clearly a Devil's voice in the midst of praise, but issues regarding other works would be nice to see addresed such as your synth's preset loading issues..

Unless I am unaware of an upgrade, I recieved info on teh FX version, but not the actual synth's preset loading getting a fix.

Pushing development of a new instrument in leu of finishing a previous one *could* possibly be seen as putting the dollar before the product.

This is what the much loathed Superwave has done.

You are new, have new ideas, & many are caught up in supporting your emergence, but be careful you don't get too far ahead of yourself. The benefit of developing free instruments is that you are by nature more or less immune to an un-satisfied user; they can take your work or leave it. Odo clearly has gone beyond the point where financial renumeration is no longer an un-realistic consideration, but he humbly kicks out one great instrument after another.

So does E-Phonic

So does Ugo

So does Algo Music

So does Krakli


Clearly a rant, but did you glean anything from 5% of it?

@sickle666: the reason why it will took so long to fix agonyx is:

1# i´m afraid i have to fix every single patch, because due to the new SE beta, most of the settings aren´t remembered at all.

2# i had to wait for this new beta mentioned in 1#. now its out - after NADS i will see what i can do ... sad but true, i cant make any promises.

sonicfire:

If only PayPal was available where I live... Guess I'll have to wait for the full release and make a VISA payment via ShareIt.

Any chance for an Agonyx+NADS bundle? Together for only 17,99 EUR instead of 22


sickle666:

I wouldn't mind seeing those synths release free either, but it doesn't seem likely to happen, so I guess I'll just have to grab them - even if they cost 10 bucks each and have some minor inconveniences (which are far from being as bad as in ZynAddSubFX, for example, which I would also pay for if necessary). Paying 10 bucks for a synth is nearly like getting it for free, especially if it sounds as original as Agonyx and NADS. Moreover, I don't think for that amount of money, people will require a 24/7 help line - bugfixes, updates, new patches will be enough (for me at least).

Paulie Phonick wrote:

sonicfire: If only PayPal was available where I live... Guess I'll have to wait for the full release and make a VISA payment via ShareIt. Any chance for an Agonyx+NADS bundle? Together for only 17,99 EUR instead of 22

well, i was thinking on something like that, but first i want a fixed agonyx. (if i ever get it completly fixed )

sonicfire wrote:

well, i was thinking on something like that, but first i want a fixed agonyx. (if i ever get it completly fixed )

That's precisely what I meant.

This is a prime example of placing the horse before the bit.

By your own admission, you have been recieving income from a flawed/incompletely developed product.

Yet you are here annoucing a new instrument & what it's gonna cost & accepting payments.

I'm hoping I needn't rely upon my usual colorful dialogue to make my point any clearer?


Sorry, man..maybe I should have messed about with your synth a bit more before supporting it financially..At least then you would be minus one now serious antagonist & un-happy customer.

Guess I did us both a dis-service..

Good luck & later,

I didn't see any problems with presets in NADS so what's the problem with fixing Agonyx? Can't you just reuse the same solution?

sickle666 wrote:

By your own admission, you have been recieving income from a flawed/incompletely developed product.

sorry, but i dont think that agonyx is/was incomplete. it only lacks patch-selecting inside the plugin. you knowed that! i only asked for little 5 bucks (=nothing).

i told you and others here why i couldn´t fix it. it was a bug in SE, not my fault - i noticed this bug while developing agonyx, but still wanted to give it away because i think it´s a nice little synth , even if you cant browse patches inside ATM

and, as i said, i will try to fix it ASAP.

Paulie Phonick wrote:

I didn't see any problems with presets in NADS so what's the problem with fixing Agonyx? Can't you just reuse the same solution?

the people want to browse patches inside agonyx, not loading patches one-by-one per hand. i agree that it´s much easier this way, but due to a fault in SE i couldn´t release it with internal patch browsing. that´s why i decided to deliver it with all patches as fxp-files outside the plugin...

once again ... two little mp3-demos, just browsing through some of the internal kits:
http://www.project-hurricane.de/nads_demo7.mp3
http://www.project-hurricane.de/nads_in_the_mix.mp3

Here are the MIDI Controller-Numbers:

Channel 1-7 = Drum 1-7

41 = Osc/Noise Mix
46 = Noise Decay
47 = Noise Attack
52 = Pitch
53 = Decay
54 = PMod
55 = Speed
56 = Mod Rate
57 = Mod Amount
58 = Filter Cut
59 = Filter Q
60 = Comb Amount
61 = Comb Feed
62 = Dist Amount

Please give it a try, and let me know how/if it works, thanks!

I just tried it. There seems to be a problem.

When I hit a sound with my percussion pad the sound will not stop.

This may-or-may-not be a problem with the fact that the drum machine sends out midi notes at 0 (zero) duration. You only catch the note-on events and miss the note-off.

Sonicfire,

I think you make some great stuff, but i have to agree with sickle here.

I think he agrees with me that you have to show that you can offer good support for ypur products before charging any kind of money for them. I am happy with agonyx at the $5 i paid for it But i suspect that i too would not buy NADS until you have fixed agonyx. You say that it is complete except patch banks, but i'm afraid that about 99.9% of all synths support this. It is really an essential.

I think you have the makings of a great plugin developer, but i think you are maybe rushing a bit to sell your stuff.

Just a suggestion - but perhaps release NADS as beta for say 2 months, then once you are sure all bugs are fixed, issues solved etc you can charge for it.

I just want you to understand that i am not criticising your work at all. It is unfortunate that some other SE developers have let people down in the past.

Just to make myself totally clear - I think your synths are worth money, and i have paid(agonyx) and will pay(NADS) if you show that you can offer good support. Its worth remembering that an existing customer(like me) looked after well is probably worth more than a new one who is unsure of what support he will get.

Keep up the good work on the synths my friend

@Sepheritoh: this is really strange, because NADS doesn´t output any midi data. which host do you use?

No, no, the drum pads output the midi data (a Yamaha DD55) and send it to NADS (inside Sonar).

@quincy: thanks for the flowers, yes he´s right - its an essential problem, but that dosn´t mean agonyx is incomplete. i think it works as i should, and that you cant select patches inside it isn´t really a bug. its an "unwanted behaviour" or something.

now fixing this is (almost) impossible. the huge cpu-load also doesn´t motify me to fix it. it was my first project - i´m sorry for all that problems...

perhaps i shouldn´t request money for it, but i just didnt wanted to give away almost 5 months of (almost 24/7) work for free

i respect all developers who make freeware software, most of them are cool and their products rock - but thats definately not the way for me. i think asking for some bucks to support the work someone had/has is more than natural... well, just my opinion...

Sepheritoh wrote:

No, no, the drum pads output the midi data (a Yamaha DD55) and send it to NADS (inside Sonar).

ahhhhh now i now what you mean, sorry.
the D55 outputs midi notes with zero velocity?! i still dont understand this. do you mean the decay?

Nooo.

Zero duration.

I.e. the note length being none (zip), or it sends the note-on and note-off events simultaniusly at the identical timecode.

This is a common problem with samplers too, don't worry. VSampler also can not read data send this way.

I know nothing about programming synths, but it might be that you are using the note on event to start the attack and the note off event to start the decay. Because the decay trigger, i.e note-off comes too quick and is already gone by the time the attack has done it's attacking, the decay never starts and what I get is one-long-distorted-sound.

@sepheritoh: nope, NADS uses note on for both of them. note off should just cut everything. this is weird, because i never heard of such a problem ...

how does this sound ? could you post / send a mp3 or something?

One thing i hate about posting - if your post is late on a page (14/15th post)then sometimes pople don't see it

Sonicfire did you get my post? I think i'm making a serious point, despite the fact i'm slightly drunk

quincy: yes i answered here

sonicfire wrote:

@quincy: thanks for the flowers, yes he´s right - its an essential problem, but that dosn´t mean agonyx is incomplete. i think it works as i should, and that you cant select patches inside it isn´t really a bug. its an "unwanted behaviour" or something. now fixing this is (almost) impossible. the huge cpu-load also doesn´t motify me to fix it. it was my first project - i´m sorry for all that problems... perhaps i shouldn´t request money for it, but i just didnt wanted to give away almost 5 months of (almost 24/7) work for free i respect all developers who make freeware software, most of them are cool and their products rock - but thats definately not the way for me. i think asking for some bucks to support the work someone had/has is more than natural... well, just my opinion...

sonicfire wrote:

quincy: yes i answered here sonicfire wrote: @quincy: thanks for the flowers, yes he´s right - its an essential problem, but that dosn´t mean agonyx is incomplete. i think it works as i should, and that you cant select patches inside it isn´t really a bug. its an "unwanted behaviour" or something. now fixing this is (almost) impossible. the huge cpu-load also doesn´t motify me to fix it. it was my first project - i´m sorry for all that problems... perhaps i shouldn´t request money for it, but i just didnt wanted to give away almost 5 months of (almost 24/7) work for free i respect all developers who make freeware software, most of them are cool and their products rock - but thats definately not the way for me. i think asking for some bucks to support the work someone had/has is more than natural... well, just my opinion...

Hehe, sorry mate missed that one

Unfortunately what you say just backs up my worries here.

you say:

"the huge cpu-load also doesn´t motify me to fix it. it was my first project - i´m sorry for all that problems..."

And it sounds to me like you are happy to have charged me money (admittedly very little) and then abandoned the project for a new one.

So sadly i have to ask - will you work on NADS for a few months and then abandon it to start something else? I would hope not, because then you would have paying customers who feel abandoned too.

I really don't like having to ask these questions, but after S****WAVE i think i have to. I hope you don't take it personally.

i dont take it personally i fully understand you... but imagine re-designing 160+ patches! thats almost IMPOSSIBLE - how often do i have to say that? i even dont know which dozens of settings i made to each single patch ...
(+ the patches that skore and xeno/neurotoxin made for me) - i will see what i can do

oops, i forgot - NO , i dont throw NADS away and start something else after some months or so - thats not my intention. but i dont know why people just cant live with agonyx, seen as a 5 (ok, now 10) bucks synth that works well so far , but only needs to be feed with sounds by hand?

sickle - i return the five bucks to you, okay...?

sonicfire wrote:

i dont take it personally i fully understand you... but imagine re-designing 160+ patches! thats almost IMPOSSIBLE - how often do i have to say that? i even dont know which dozens of settings i made to each single patch ... (+ the patches that skore and xeno/neurotoxin made for me) - i will see what i can do

To be honest i understand that, its not an easy task.

May i suggest that you make 64 or 128 new patches, and release the fixed synth and those? Once people have the patch loading/saving fixed, they will be quick to sumbit new patch banks i think. People can even keep the old version for tracks using old patches etc.

What you reckon? I would design a few patches for you if you want. Not that i'm an expert mind you

I know you are trying mate, just been burnt before thats all. NADS is looking great by the way

sonicfire wrote:

oops, i forgot - NO , i dont throw NADS away and start something else after some months or so - thats not my intention. but i dont know why people just cant live with agonyx, seen as a 5 (ok, now 10) bucks synth that works well so far , but only needs to be feed with sounds by hand?

I'm gonna make this crystal clear:

YOUR SYNTH IS THE ONLY VSTi I HAVE EVEN SEEN THAT REQUIRED HAND LOADING OF INDIVIDUAL PRESETS.

It's not YOUR position to determine if that is an inconvieniance to the user or not, it's OURS..& we have been trying to tell you politely for WEEKS that it's in-appropriate to accept money for a malfunctioning product.

But at least it's unique.

I can't think of ANY other synth that has this problem..

You can always use that uniqueness as a selling point, I guess..

jeez..what a fucking waste of time..if I wanna feed something by hand, I'll buy a fucking Billy-Goat & hand it a soup can, M'kay?!

well, yes - would be a solution!
yes! i always love to see patches that others made with/for my own creations!
i will post as soon as agonyx has been updated...

sonicfire wrote:

where my goal was to create some unusal drumsounds / experimental

well try Odo's KickMeToo, it's very good for that too

sickle666 wrote:

sonicfire wrote: oops, i forgot - NO , i dont throw NADS away and start something else after some months or so - thats not my intention. but i dont know why people just cant live with agonyx, seen as a 5 (ok, now 10) bucks synth that works well so far , but only needs to be feed with sounds by hand? I'm gonna make this crystal clear: YOUR SYNTH IS THE ONLY VSTi I HAVE EVEN SEEN THAT REQUIRED HAND LOADING OF INDIVIDUAL PRESETS. It's not YOUR position to determine if that is an inconvieniance to the user or not, it's OURS..& we have been trying to tell you politely for WEEKS that it's in-appropriate to accept money for a malfunctioning product. But at least it's unique. I can't think of ANY other synth that has this problem.. You can always use that uniqueness as a selling point, I guess.. jeez..what a fucking waste of time..if I wanna feed something by hand, I'll buy a fucking Billy-Goat & hand it a soup can, M'kay?!

Easy tiger

I think he's got the point. It looks like it'll get sorted soon, and it'll be cool. But the point had to be made.

sickle, i´ve explained that bug in SE that caused this prob often enough.

if you think agonyx is malfunctioning, just go and make your own synth. but please stop ruining my threads. thanks

sorry nothing more to say

sonicfire wrote:

sickle, i´ve explained that bug in SE that caused this prob often enough. if you think agonyx is malfunctioning, just go and make your own synth. but please stop ruining my threads. thanks sorry nothing more to say

There ya have it folks..

Got a problem with a "commercial" product?

Get fucked & make your own.

Always a pleasure watching someone commit career suicide..

Bye now,

sonicfire wrote:

sickle, i´ve explained that bug in SE that caused this prob often enough. if you think agonyx is malfunctioning, just go and make your own synth. but please stop ruining my threads. thanks sorry nothing more to say

Sonicfire try not to take it too personally. Imagine if you released your music to the public, you would expect to get some criticisms then too. I think sickle words are a bit harsh, but try not to be offended.

The best thing you can do is take is as contructive criticism and learn from it. Once you have fixed agony you will have a great product for the price, and happy customers too

This will help you for in the future as people will trust you and buy your new products too. I will i think, NADS demos sounded cool and $15 for a qulatiy drum synth sounds good to me, i been looking for one recently!

jeeez... one of the guys that doesn´t understand me, even if i explain him the problem over and over again ... when did i say agonyx is a commercial one?? is it in stores? i just charged him > 5 < bucks for it...

sonicfire wrote:

jeeez... one of the guys that doesn´t understand me, even if i explain him the problem over and over again ... when did i say agonyx is a commercial one?? is it in stores? i just charged him > 5 < bucks for it...

Unfortunately that does make it commercial. And goes with it some responsibility.

However i want to make it clear i'm not going mental like sickle! I think you're being a bit harsh sickle mate, give the guy a chance.

He may well do the right thing and then all that ranting would have been unecessary.

quincy wrote:

Sonicfire try not to take it too personally. Imagine if you released your music to the public, you would expect to get some criticisms then too. I think sickle words are a bit harsh, but try not to be offended. The best thing you can do is take is as contructive criticism and learn from it. Once you have fixed agony you will have a great product for the price, and happy customers too This will help you for in the future as people will trust you and buy your new products too. I will i think, NADS demos sounded cool and $15 for a qulatiy drum synth sounds good to me, i been looking for one recently!

he just sounds like he had paid hundreds of dollars for that one... it was 5 (cant say that often enough ) and when he ordered it , it was CLEAR that to you have import patches by hand, and that it is because of SE!! thats why i dont understand this sudden frustration...

of course, i learn from it. i have to - what else can i do

sonicfire wrote:

jeeez... one of the guys that doesn´t understand me, even if i explain him the problem over and over again ... when did i say agonyx is a commercial one?? is it in stores? i just charged him > 5 < bucks for it...

Anything involving a transaction of funds is considered 'commerce'. Simple.

If you would quit blaming Jeff for your own incompetence & talk to some other SE guys as was suggested, or better yet, simply use the host's preset loading functions like damn near everyone else, you wouldn't have this preset loading issue that you do, then maybe you wouldn't be the recipient of this level of hostility.

Don't make the mistake of thinking I'm dense, I just have an infinite amount of aggrivation & impatience for ppl who pass the buck as you clearly have. Literally..

And it's not the money.

At all.

It's about bieng PROFESSIONAL if you expect a SINGLE dollar from ANYONE.

In it's current form, your synth is donationware AT BEST.

But don't bother listening to me, go ahead & insult someone who has made a payment in good faith to you as I have & see the inevitable results of your arrogance & immaturity...

You'll learn these simple rules on your own or perish as a developer.

You may not see it, but I'm trying to do you a BIG favor..

I can't see why the Agonyx preset issue is relevent to NADS? The presets load fine in NADS.

I agree that it's a pain to load presets into Agonyx but this is not the case with NADS. I think it would be more appropriate to discuss the Agonyx presets issue in an Agonyx entitled thread - not the NADS thread.

In my experience many devs release evolving products. I've bought synths that have had a lot more problems than the difficulty of loading presets. I'm sure Agonyx will be fixed in the future. An Agonyx demo has existed right from the start so I would suggest trying the demo to see if it's suitable before buying it.

sickle: that BIG out of order favor?

Quote:

(...)If you would quit blaming Jeff for your own incompetence & talk to some other SE guys as was suggested(...)

i can only say it again - just try developing a synth for yourself and then we talk again...

munchkin wrote:

I can't see why the Agonyx preset issue is relevent to NADS? The presets load fine in NADS. I agree that it's a pain to load presets into Agonyx but this is not the case with NADS. I think it would be more appropriate to discuss the Agonyx presets issue in an Agonyx entitled thread - not the NADS thread. In my experience many devs release evolving products. I've bought synths that have had a lot more problems than the difficulty of loading presets. I'm sure Agonyx will be fixed in the future. An Agonyx demo has existed right from the start so I would suggest trying the demo to see if it's suitable before buying it.

exactly...

sonicfire wrote:

sickle: that BIG out of order favor?

You're right..'out of order' was a bit harsh..

Last I checked that toilet seems to work fine now.

Do me a favor & strike my email from your updates database.

...

I'm happy too see what sonicfire can do in the near future regarding agonyx fixes and NADS.

Lets just not have another S****Wave situation thats all. Many people, myself included, would likely never buy from those guys again.

Juts rememebr sonicfire, you can lose many customers quicker than you ever gain them. I don't think this is the situation here, but if you about S****Wave then you know what i'm talking about.

Agonyx - still a great synth, but not strictly "complete" yet. Very close though.

Sickle - calm down mate, he's doing his best. A little slack for a newbie developer needed i think.

well i will see... for me, agonyx IS complete except that patch-thing.

i think in future i will only respond to *serious* emails - either talking here...

sorry, i´m a bit f***** off

sonicfire wrote:

well i will see... for me, agonyx IS complete except that patch-thing. i think in future i will only respond to *serious* emails - either talking here... sorry, i´m a bit f***** off

I understand you must be pissed off, never nice to get criticised.

But sadly the patch issue is a "serious" one, even if we may have shit ways of trying to say it! Ultimately, you may not be able to re-create every patch etc, but thats not the end of the world.

Once you have bank loading/saving you will have a complete product. As sickle said(a bit bluntly) pretty much every single VST supports this, and so it does need sorting.

It may be a little work but it'll pay off, you will have a better synth and more faith from blokes like me

will fix that agonyx prob soon, but now lets not forget that thread is about NADS! not about agonyx

Hey sonic.

the kits sound great so far. Good work.

sorry 'bout the agonyx mess. I don't understand it myself, i seem to be able to load patches... but then I tend to make my own anyway.

I think the last SE update says that it is sorted though.

Anyway, remember: you can't please all the people all the time. You can try, and that's a good idea, but when it comes to an upset customer, for whatever reason, you just have to learn not to take it personally. Just say, "I hear you, and I hope to have that fixed very soon. You'll be the first to know."
Always worked for me in the past, at least in the day job context. People are getting to know your stuff, and if it is useful to them they will get it.

s:b

i try to dont take it personally but its really difficult because i´m sure this guy even dont know how hard it is to get a synth up and running ...

but i will keep that in mind

sonicfire wrote:

i try to dont take it personally but its really difficult because i´m sure this guy even dont know how hard it is to get a synth up and running ... but i will keep that in mind

If it helps at all sonicfire, i am a synthedit newbie who has just started, so i understnad it takes work

I have been trying to make my simple step-sequencer work for nearly 2 weeks now, and still not sorted

Somebody, PLEASE make a demo with scratching effects, NADS, and the obvious title!



And as for the rants... The improved patch-loading is a "feature request" not a "bug". Bugs are when an existing product does not work as the developer intended. SonicFire clearly intended the patch loading to work as it does. Having said this, it's a very reasonable feature request. Personally, I wouldn't worry about patches at all for a $5 product.

Haven't tried the drum synth (have no need for one myself) but the name seems a little problematic to me...

Surely Australia isn't the only place in the world where "nads" is slang for genitals? (abbreviation of gonads, if you are wondering). Of course, that didn't stop a hair removal company here naming their product "Nads", but she claims she named it after her daughter Nadia (who must be really thrilled that her own mother uses her as a model for hair removal ).

And life's rich tapestry weaves on...

-s

@smp: perhaps i should again re-think the name

@jzero: exactly

@quincy: yes, SE first looks easy - but the more you try to make - the more complex it is! good luck with your sequencer thing!

okay, so, i´m now doing the following to NADS:

adding a simple delay, a type of compression/limiter and a "pressure"-effect.

these fx can be applied to output channels (1-6) so you can easily route different drums to one fx or the same comp.

the pressure-effect can be triggered by one of the drums, it works similar to a compressor, it will lower the volume of all other drums by a selectable amount when a specific drum is triggered

sonicfire wrote:

@sepheritoh: nope, NADS uses note on for both of them. note off should just cut everything. this is weird, because i never heard of such a problem ... how does this sound ? could you post / send a mp3 or something?

http://www.dog-on-blues.co.za/various/naddemo.mp3

@sepheritoh: ahhh i see the problem. (i mean i hear it ) - yes, its due to the sustain in NADS. i will implement a mode switch for that or something, so that it will work.

thanks

sonicfire wrote:

okay, so, i´m now doing the following to NADS: adding a simple delay, a type of compression/limiter and a "pressure"-effect. these fx can be applied to output channels (1-6) so you can easily route different drums to one fx or the same comp. the pressure-effect can be triggered by one of the drums, it works similar to a compressor, it will lower the volume of all other drums by a selectable amount when a specific drum is triggered

Excellent news! It gets better and better. Will it be possible to switch off these FX when not needed to conserve cpu?

I like the name NADS - it's a drumsynth with a lot of balls...

@munchkin: thanks!
yes, you can of course deactivate them

@Sepheritoh: damn, the way to fix it i tried wasn´t best. sound stops but drums still appear triggered.
have to think of an other way.
is there a way in your drumpad to choose the length of the outputted note? or is it always note on with immediately note off?

munchkin wrote:

I like the name NADS - it's a drumsynth with a lot of balls...

As in "Go nads go"



or whatever

sonicfire wrote:

@munchkin: thanks! yes, you can of course deactivate them @Sepheritoh: damn, the way to fix it i tried wasn´t best. sound stops but drums still appear triggered. have to think of an other way. is there a way in your drumpad to choose the length of the outputted note? or is it always note on with immediately note off?

After I recorded the notes I can use the Musiclab "fixlength" Mfx plug-in to get round it.

PS I have to do the same trick with VSampler. It is just a problem auditioning the sounds and while recording. Thanks for trying. Why don;t you try to contact Pieter-Jan from ephonic (Drumatic) for ideas how he got round it?

i will ask him, if i dont came up with my own solution

and i think i got it - will compile and post it then

Nice!

Glad I could help.

i´ve added a little "hold on/off" button in the osc window, by default it´s off so that your drumpad should work now. turning it on is more useful when playing NADS by midikeyboard then...

get here:
http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

please let me know if it works.
thanks for mention that note on/off thing!!

sonicfire wrote:

i´m sure this guy even dont know how hard it is to get a synth up and running

I have no idea how to do brain surgery either, but do you suggest everyone learn how to do it themselves?

Some of us wanna USE synths, they don't wanna make thier own instruments..I appreciate it's not easy; that's why I support devs instead of using warez like 90% of the assholes out there, but blowing me off & telling me to make my own synths is rediculous.

NICE. It works.

Congrats.

HI

Stop winging - you do graphics don't you?

I'll get my Amiga out and code a bleep in Basic you do a little graphic moving around a cavernous arena -we'll bring it together and call it one bouncy ping pig only.

Pretty please on the mother f.....g ping please.

- no longer a gentleman

Flipper.

original flipper wrote:

HI Stop winging - you do graphics don't you? I'll get my Amiga out and code a bleep in Basic you do a little graphic moving around a cavernous arena -we'll bring it together and call it one bouncy ping pig only. Pretty please on the mother f.....g ping please. - no longer a gentleman Flipper.

Sounds good..Whatcha think we can market it for? $10..$20?

Sell it for $1,000. I bet you will get somebody to buy it.

Call it "One Bouncing Nad"

i can forget about having a stereo comp/limiter on each output (6 in total). cpu-usage goes about 25-40 % on my 2200 athlon.

so i will add one comp than can be routed to one out you want...

Sonicfire, my little input:

Often i find that synths suffer from having built-in FX, certainly regarding more...erm...essential aspects of production like compression.

This would seem a step too far to me. If the user wished to compress/limit their drums, let them use a dedicated plugin.

This is not always the case,as funnily enough i like the built-in FX on agonyx, but thats becasue they help to make sounds quicker. In that context i think its diffrent.

But with compression, people would rather use a more specialiesd tool. I may be wrong however, just my opinion

Besides, you said yourself that the CPU overhead is a killer!

nice to hear you like the fx

actually i also think so, becuase there are enough nice low-cpu compressors (even freeware) out there, for example blockfish.

but i think one limiter that can be used on one of the outputs would be a good idea anyway.

hi folks, i just added a output section with 6 limiters for each output. please give it a try!

download here:
http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

thanks!!

hmm.....no one?

sonicfire wrote:

hmm.....no one?

I've just tried the update. Fantastic! The FX really give the kicks, bass and crash sounds some wallop. I think it allows for greater variations in drum sounds. Thnx for including the limiter and make-up.

Now, you're going to kill me for asking this but here goes...

I would love to be able to assign each sound to a different limiter/make-up/NAD FX and then route to either a stereo out or to the individual outs. Does this make sense?

Perhaps you could add a stereo out that all the individual outs could be bussed to if necessary. The reason I ask for this option is that then I could use the NAD FX on individual sounds without having to set up individual tracks for each NAD output in Sonar. I suppose a stereo out would mean adding a pan option for each sound so that pan could be adjusted.

thanks, munchkin

i´m not totally sure about what you mean with that.
you mean routing the limiter thing itself to one or more channels? so that its not fixed to one output?

btw: i will include panning for each drum and/or outputs in next release, thanks for that

Would it be possible to use a different FX on each sound instead of each output? That way, it will be possible to output all sounds through the primary out with different FX levels.

yes but this would cause even more cpu load
thats why i decided to go this way...

sonicfire wrote:

yes but this would cause even more cpu load thats why i decided to go this way...

Ok...no problem.

panning for each drum has been included now
check out here:
http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

hmmm...i think i will now fill nads up with 128 kits and release it... have to really fix agonyx now.
after this i can improve nads further and make a free new version/update or so...

This sounds really funny. I like it it has bite

BMX

hehe thanks for that

any more replies? should i still make some more drums at once before releasing?
or two version? one with seven drums and 2-4 outputs for 10 bucks, and one with more presets, 6 outs, and 12 drums for 20-25 ?

I am creating a little demo song with it. Its a very inspirational plugin. Hehe the reminding registering voice really fits into this tune.

cool
let me hear when finished please

sonicfire wrote:

any more replies? should i still make some more drums at once before releasing? or two version? one with seven drums and 2-4 outputs for 10 bucks, and one with more presets, 6 outs, and 12 drums for 20-25 ?

Don't rush for the cash so quickly man!

Release whatever you have done for $10 or $15, then see how things go with sales and feedback and stuff.

Then you can consider raising the price when you have done another cool new product! I like the sound of this synth, its quirky.

i know, sorry

yau = yet another update:

- small internal bugfixes
- added a lofi effect for each output
- added free output routing

so each drum can send its output to 1-6 and these out´s can itself be outputted to 1 from 6 "physical outputs".
(very bad english)

http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

sonicfire wrote:

any more replies? should i still make some more drums at once before releasing? or two version? one with seven drums and 2-4 outputs for 10 bucks, and one with more presets, 6 outs, and 12 drums for 20-25 ?

I'd definitely go for the 12 drums and 6 outputs with more presets. But please don't change the ones already included because they are so good.

I think you've done a lot to incorporate our suggestions so I think NADS is worth $20-25.

thanks, munchkin.
no worries i wont change the default presets!

i´m only afraid concerning cpu usage, its even now sometimes very high - if i add even 5 more drums, again with filter,dist and stuff..
but i think i have a nice idea how to get around this. so every user (old pc, new pc) can make max. usage of NADS

There seems to be a change in the sound coming out of output E. I takes ages to decay now for some reason. I can adjust it with the decay control but I didn't need to before. Also E is not sounding on some presets. I'm using NADS in Sonar 3. It was fine in previous releases.

Ok... tell ya what.

If you finish this up and release it like, now, I will give you twenty clams for it. But comon, buddy, save some for the update!

This does have a really great sound, and although I am starting to thin out the ol' VST library, I would like to get this one.

So what'ya say? by the weekend?

s:b

@munchkin: i will check that. does this endless decay also only happen with certain presets? if yes, which ones?

@spoonboiler: by the weekend? yes, i´ll do my best

does anyone else experiencing these problems in sonar3 ?

munchkin, i found something, please test again
http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip

thanks

sonicfire wrote:

munchkin, i found something, please test again http://www.prodyon.de/files/prodyon_nads_demo.zip thanks

Presets:
Welcome To NADS - Note E
Nutz In The Skies - Note E
etc. etc.

Every sound on note 'E' has such a loooonnng decay. Is this meant to be? I don't remember this in the first release. It's the only one with such a long delay. Every other note/sound seems fine.