KVR :: Music Cafe » [ runagate ] trad genre melt dub rock w.i.p. [View Original Topic]
There are 32 posts in this topic.

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runagate - Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:31 am

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runagate - Unquenchable Hereinafter

Unquenchable second link on box.net

a sprinkling of prince paul, rock and dub
a work in progress, please let me know what you think
considering it ask a sketch for people playing live

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bobsled - Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:01 am

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Attention to detail, lots of space in the mix, room for the individual instruments to express themselves, not so over the top.

Just some first impressions. Also, I really want to see/hear you perform live.

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rachmiel - Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:05 am

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reminds me of the shaggs.* the layers have that 'almost, but not quite fit together rhythmically' feel that the shaggs did so well. and there's a smart/dumb thing going on with the repetitions/gestures that's very shaggs-ian.

* - on the off chance you don't know the band:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shaggs

they should be required listening for every avant artiste.

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rachmiel - Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:07 am

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are you in pursuit of some musical goal? like inventing a new/hybrid style ... or finding your voice? or are you just doing what comes naturally (for a restless mind like yours) and going wherever that happens to take you?

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runagate - Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:54 am

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Room for the instruments to individually express themselves was definitely somthing I was going for, and typically quite bad at. I like the details that demand attention to change at any given moment as part of the composition especially being that I like an overabundant amount of events per slice of time in a song. So it's hard to make sparser things, because no one wants sparse in a bad way, and my sound design skills are such that I end up making another crazy field of psychedellic events before I realize I've lost the desired-sparseness which I was trying to sculpt initially. This time I did ok I think.



Option 3.

Aside from the piles of "demos" I make for plugs I like I basically never sit down thinking "I will make a type of song x.

Things swarm through my head all day, some are appropriate enough to current projects for me to go sit at the DAW and carve em out. You are very astute in feretting this out of me.

So in essence no, this time I'm not genre-inventing. And certinaly I've never tried to find my voice. I've know what that is since I was 17 I'm one of those lucky comes-naturally-with-no-struggle kinds. Sadly, that makes it so I never take embarassing and later disavowed minstrelsy or ska periods.
Though I've no idea what the integration of my various musical periods will be someday, now that I think on it. They've all been due to opportunity and resources, plus a dash of just changing through time. But mostly opportunity and resources. For instance, horns are loud so I don't horn anymore except through plug-ins due to opportunity and resources.

Poor musicians, look how we destroy our lives in pursuit of our passion.
I imagine that being the en-patroned court yodeler of a Sogdianian potentate looks like a good era in the history of musicians on days like this.

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pattonfreak1 - Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:07 pm

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Oh but you are...

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polyslax - Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:00 am

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Can't listen to runny right now, but I do want to say I love the shaggs! Some of the most fun and wacky outsider music in existence.

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padro1957 - Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:25 pm

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Sorry for what might be a dumb question but are these ideas for actions you want other performers to re-create and add too or 'tapes' to perform on top of?

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runagate - Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:53 pm

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Just sort of a sketch of a framework to hang realtime performance on, not necessarily using these sounds (certainly that lovely automated GRevDelay on guitar, though). Real instruments, virtual, whatever.

I've already abandoned this song idea as unfeasible.

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justin3am - Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:02 pm

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I'm really feeling the Shaggs reference. This should turn into a "My Pal Foot Foot" remix. Speaking of which, some of my friends from Highschool became aquainted with an Austin, Texas band called Foot Foot. Thay were alright...

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=54688731

The more times I see the word "Foot" written out, the weirder it looks.

Great work as always, get down with your folky self!

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padro1957 - Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:29 pm

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I am asking for 2 different reasons; 1. if this is to be a direction/score for other people to perform virtual real etc... then I wish you the best of luck in finding people that can do this (and I mean this without sarcasm ) as this is close to the dream group I would want to put together myself (if I was a few decades younger:) 2. if on the other hand this is a sound that you have a burning need hear completed you may just need to do it without cornern for any other involvement or you could possibly spend an extended period of time waiting for the right combination of personalities to come along that might come close to achieving what your head has already (secretly) finished...

Sorry for the babble , I mean only to encourage you as i have been on both sides of this idea (and not particularly succesful at either one)... but you, from what I have listened to here have a great potiential ahead of you that hasn't fully exploded yet.

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runagate - Sun Dec 02, 2007 4:55 pm

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My old guitarist lives in Austin now. That's where my and S.A.P.'s band "Huffer's Choice" will form someday.

As to Shaggs - I kept wanting to address that, as I immediately read about them and thought it interesting, especially as it makes me think of Beefheart, but I couldn't find any audio so I didn't know what to say.

Foot Foot. They sound like crazy people




I didn't realize you're new to KVR: welcome

I doubt that my bandmates would have any problem playing this...

As to a burning need to have it be heard... hmm. Listening again I do re-like much of it, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist usually (less than most here, really, but still somewhat) so it's odd that I'd even post a w.i.p.


How about this - I'll give you the audio tracks rendered individually or the midi or the FL project files if you (unlikely) use FLStudio and you can play with it

And don't apologize about "babble" - by no means are these comments anything but welcome and besides you'll make me self-conscious about my last 6000 or so posts here.

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padro1957 - Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:06 pm

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i am not that new just dont talk that much and happen to think cause I have been pursuing related ideas since the late 1970's that I want to encourage you even though I have no clue how long you have making music-noise... and you are very good at it.


I am not responding to just this particular post but to the last few weeks worth that i have been paying attention to... I have had many ideas over the years but one I especially wished had come to fruition was the creation of a quartet (circa 1984/85) that consisted of a few friends (from the Sun City Girls) playing drums (all organized on a single pole) and bass (2 strings at least 7 ft long from a grand piano) with odd sampled-circuit bent noise and vocals care of a former 6'10" basketball player friend... sort of a psycho speed metal drum and bass noise rock... we all talked about it but never got it done... I forget the tracks name but (elk something) made me think of this nonsense again.



I am really not qualified but thank you for the offer. i hope I am not coming off like a jerk, but hay i have been drinking today... I have been involved in 'experimental' music since 1978 and see/hear related intrests in the sonic explorations you have now... and after hearing a bunch of your 'sketches' would really like to hear what you might do as a final product.

[/quote]

I can't help that... I really just mean to encourage you

ps. just as a frame of refernce this is a site I sent to you some time ago and have tried recently to make the tongue and cheek aspect of it more obvious...
www.psychicheadcharge.com

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runagate - Sun Dec 02, 2007 6:39 pm

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Oh yeah! I listen to that all the time.
Sorry, I'm horrendous with names!
Believe me, no offense taken whatsoever and I'm glad to talk.

I hovered the cursor over your name and got back 21 posts so I thought new, but I was a lurker for over a year without posting, too; but then Herodotus's gamelan sucked me in and here I am.

Ah, unfulfilled projects! Until I got me this PC music, almost everything I'd been involved with was unrecorded, unfinished or some combination thereof, despite my continuous ranting: "won't you slackers want to hear this in 10 years!?!" lmao

Especially being a sax player, always recorded barely audibly or not at all due to feedback problems when playing with loud instruments like e-guitar and rock drums.

Thanks, by the way - your encouragement worked and I showed the song to my bandmate and he's totally into it.

I wish I could hear that band. I'm 6'6" so I can relate to the basketball player dude. Sounds wonderful!

I'm hard to encourage, though, as I'm weirdly unmoved from my normal level of obsession usually. I'm awfully process-oriented, but make grandiose plans that almost come to fruition then get sidetracked by things beyond my control. If I'd been born rich I'd be more than happy to sit in a studio 18 hours a day plotting the overthrowal of reality via audio.

But, again, if it means anything to you you've succeeded - this song is now in more hands than just mine, like I originally intended. They'll ground my more experimental instincts.

Guitar will be real, drums will be real. Keys will probably play bass. Touchscreen and VR glove - we're plotting that out now.

The amazing thing is, though, that when one is grounded in instrument-playing as quite a few of us are around here it's just mind-blowing that you can use PCs to plot out structures that you simply can't show to a musical co-conspirator whose instrument you can't play adequately. My basslines, which I always wrote on bass, turned out to be too weird technique-wise for even great bass players; they didn't want to use the eccentricities of my playing. I sure as hell can't play much of drums or guitar I've written, and less so play funky drumming in 11/8 lol. I love this cross-breeding of techniques, it's really paying off like I'd always hoped. Getting it stage-worthy is an interesting challenge, but not like learning synthesis, producing, engineering and all the other crap that's prerequisite.

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padro1957 - Sun Dec 02, 2007 7:13 pm

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For what its worth heres a link to the closest we ever got to that... keep in mind this is 20 years ago and based on a 'needle thrown on a jazz lp' sample
http://oliphantarts.com/RUN/07%20-%20Music%20From%20The%20Great%20Southwest.mp3



you still haven't let me in as to how long you have been doing this... I had the same mind set at one time only to find that I was much more productive when I had to fight to get to get both the equipment and time...

.

good...

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Voidoid Surrealist - Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:50 pm

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Really hearing your inner Laswell in this one, and despite being such a different sort of music, rachmiel's Shaggs comment was spot on. I sure hope you'll be recording the live version of this stuff and sharing with us.




Not to detract from CJ's track in any way, but that's the most awesome thing I've heard posted in the Café in a long time.

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runagate - Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:18 am

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How long which? Trying to get this live thing going - 2 months or so.
Spent the summer working to buy gear to make that a realistic proposition.

How long making annoying psychedellic computer songs? I dunno, 3 years on and off. Life's chaos prevents me some 1/2 years, then I dive back in like a mad dog.

Making music in a dilletantish way? Mostly in my head or on paper for 15 years, occasionally with instruments and/or other people when possible.



No kidding, that's crazy! [VS, I sure as hell think that track is cooler than mine! }
I gotta show that to my old guitar player - he used to be in a weirdo rock band called Earth Pigs all of whom would really appreciate that.

Damn, padro, lack of resources. All the lost years of never made recordings, eh?

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jancivil - Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:35 pm

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izzat like brobdignagian, at all?


I want sparse, even empty in the worst way

"'what I want is nothing at all' is a true zen saying"

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stanlea - Mon Dec 03, 2007 1:50 pm

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Runagate : cool track, I'm sure a drummer would have fun playing that, certainly with more fills. Jojo Mayer maybe.

padro : crazy track - sometimes I feel so alone when I realize that I haven't got any friend who can listen to that kind of stuff.

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jancivil - Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:05 pm

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king crimson, post-Levin

begs for actual instruments

i love the main riff: deh DAO, deh downt diDAO

oncet upon er time I was the perfect lead guitarist for this kinda action

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runagate - Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:30 pm

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What in hell was I saying about Sogdiania?
Musta been a lot of caffeine that day!

A tea cup is used for it's emptiness, but a Siddhārtha wouldn't necessarily pour all the tea out.

Thanks stanlea. Weird, didn't think anyone would react one way or another to this. I suppose with my style it's not obvious whether something's incomplete or not. Even I've not noticed when my CD skipped before, right away, and I've got them all memorized obviously.

Thanks, stanlea. You're a Music Cafe trooper. Hmm. I can't imagine how that idiom will come across in Francaise. padro's song is bad (in the good way).

@jancivil: I like your compressed clean guitar a lot. Funky. Tough.

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sloworm - Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:31 pm

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when i first heard this, i had a visual of a ball room in the fifties with people wearing purple and dark colored suits, breakdancing. But this is kinda rock&glitch so I am baffled why i had that visual. whenever i listen to your tunage i get disturbing visuals. but they are very eye opening at the same time, so therefore you get a 10/10. I love it. The bassline is what I like the best, i think it is great!

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padro1957 - Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:23 pm

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Hey you folks.... thanks for the kind words , I feel like I have accidentally practised bad forum etiquette which I will not do again.

runagate: I was really trying to get an idea how long you have been making racket because I admire what your doing and have had both good and (far more) bad results trying to work within a group context. I look back and have realized if I would have pursued solo and group actions simultaneously (and with equal energy) I probably would have accomplished alot more... thats all I really wanted to toss out to you, some old guy experimental 'musician' thoughts to (i think) a much younger generation

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runagate - Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:31 pm

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No bad etiquette for my threads!
I am the least touchy of anyone about my own music, and am extraordinarily glad that you came to talk, and especially posting that song link.

I'm in my early 30's, btw

I'm old enough that I generally refuse to post details of my non-online life (ha! me, the embracer of all things plug-in) but too many friends around here have picked up on them without knowing that factoid anyways

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padro1957 - Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:14 pm

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cool... till the next doohickymabob I am going to go post some old shit proper style

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herodotus - Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:27 am

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This song will take the twin cities by storm.

C'mon, lets get going. We positively owe it to our wretched local music scene to spread the noise.

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runagate - Tue Dec 04, 2007 6:37 am

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Sorry I missed this. I'm trying to let this thread die, as padro has made a Music Cafe thread

We're working on it I swear. My life is 13% less chaotic as of today. I'll be in touch. Sorry

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jancivil - Tue Dec 04, 2007 10:14 am

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no. do it; the lick I mentioned, horn and some blaring brassy synth

anyway, that's an essential sort of lick, you well may wanna lose the rest, but that lick stays

trust me

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synthgeek - Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:32 pm

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Great stuff Runny! I see you've posted quite a bit lately, will try to make it back to comment on more, but if I don't, rest assured I'm listening anyway...

Anyhow, back to this one- perhaps my new favorite of yours. Excellent work!

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corman rapeblio - Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:51 pm

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Yeah this is surely one of the most traditionally 'enjoyable' Runagate tracks I've heard. I think it benefits from you allowing certain distinct parts to repeat for a bit before you cut their head off, great drums too.

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runagate - Tue Dec 04, 2007 7:04 pm

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That's nice to know. I've been saying that all summer. No one ever need worry about commenting on my songs, though. I'll plug along doing my ting regardless, and feel bad about my missing out on the net so much this summer - but I did grab a TON of tracks from lots of people - including people who've no idea who I am lol - and just never made it back to comment.


@corman: hopefully we here in St. Paul will balance our odd and trad qualities just right. I'm so pleased you seem to be around here nowadays. So much to learn, so many great examples of computer musicians. Really. It's weird how much is out there, but how much of what I like even a little makes its way here is crazy.

I just posted this in the quiet hour but I'll state it here, too.
I just got out of the hospital. I'm real tired, don't wanna post right now, but I'm ok

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pattonfreak1 - Tue Dec 04, 2007 7:35 pm

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Quote of the day

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There are 32 posts in this topic.