KVR :: Sonic Reality / eSoundz.com » Sampletank 3? [View Original Topic]
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1-2-Many - Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:32 pm

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http://www.ikmultimedia.com/3teaser.php

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djanthonyw - Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:39 pm

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That's old, it was for amplitube.

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lotus2035 - Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:45 pm

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When you click on the "click here to discover more" link it takes you to the T-Racks 3 Deluxe page... (Which I happen to be selling in the marketplace right now..)

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1-2-Many - Thu Apr 01, 2010 1:49 pm

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I know - I suck at April fools jokes.

I stumbled across it when searching for news on ST3...it fooled me (until the end) so I thought I'd pass it on

But seriously, I didn't see any threads here at KVR devoted to it so I thought one might be apt. Here's a somewhat old discussion on IK's facebook page - http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=82970240613&topic=17575#!

Can anyone suggest further reading?

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Peter - IK Multimedia - Thu Apr 01, 2010 2:05 pm

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That's our old page that will be taken down. Our current page is: http://www.facebook.com/pages/IK-Multimedia/337617160146

Sorry for any confusion. We've definitely taken down what we need to from that discussion.

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zedd - Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:33 am

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Thankfully.

When I saw "October 15th" I was horrified.
I hope we'll see SampleTank 3 long before that.

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:51 am

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Sampletank 3...that has taken too long already. Sampletank was the first sample-based VSTi I ever bought. This was back when Kontakt was still on version 1 and not all too impressive. Well, I sort of regret going the Sampletank route instead. So many other samplers have surpassed it now, because its been ignored for way too long. Hell, even cheap-ass Wusikstation now has surpassed it in several ways. IK is really going to have to add alot of things to ST3 to make it even worth considering in the face of its competitors. Unfortunately, I'm willing to bet the upgrade price for current users is going to be quite high as well.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:53 am

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I hope it is worth waiting for.
rsp

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:11 am

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SampleTank isn't a sampler. It's more a "rompler" and actually SampleTank 2.5 still has certain things like its built-in effects system and models that are unlike anything else on the market. It is a great workhorse and the amount of people that have it and use it on albums is massive! There's nothing wrong with it whatsoever. I can think of a bunch of things I'd like to see in a Sampletank 3 and some day there may be one... I wouldn't assume it is going to cost this or that. You don't know that! I can tell you that whatever it will be it won't be something that's negative or discouraging... there'd be no point in that! So try to think positive.

I will tell you one thing positive for ALL SampleTank users and future users. There's a special version of the current SampleTank coming VERY soon and also a little (lot of) something from Sonic Reality that'll take that rompler to the next level. Keep your eyes peeled next week and let's see what happens. There are some GREAT samplers out there - no doubt. But for a tight multitimbral rompler module with "virtual expansion boards"... it has its place! Meat and potatoes baby. I love all of my other advanced and feature-filled samplers and synths. But, even with all of those I still SampleTank is always used in any music product I am working on. It's a powerful workhorse for quick creative results.. and plus it really ties the room together.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:16 am

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Dave, when I say you are the premier PR person in music software I kid you not, when I read any post from you I feel that product MUST be owned by me. For me personally no product that I have bought from SR or IK (with the exception so far of Amplitube 3) has ever lived up to that expectation for me.... Sampletank is dated period!!!!
rsp

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Scotty - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:39 am

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I use it much like Squids says. If I am looking for small percussion sounds, an unusual upright grand or even some of the loop libraries that I picked up on GBs, I go to Sampletank or should I say, I went to Sampletank.

A major limitation of Sampletank is the slow and limited search function. I have converted a number of my Akai libraries into Sampletank format so my Sampletank folder is quite large. The slow search speed just kills the main advantage of having the library which for me is to find the inspiration and keep a session moving. If IK re-released the included library of sounds with descriptive tags and improved the search engine it would gain increased value for me. I would pay for this update. The number of users who paid for the update would give a great indication as to how much life is left in the Sampletank platform. My guess is there is plenty.

Recently, I upgraded my Line 6 Pod Farm Platinum to Platinum 2. Line 6 was added some midi automation to the package but the selling point for me was that they repackaged all the amps, stomps, preamps, into elements which could loaded into inserts without having to load the entire Pod Farm plug-in. Instantly I am using these elements on some sketches and rediscovering the value that was already there. Should line 6 improve their models further I will most likely upgrade again due to the value and use I am experiencing presently. Line 6 models are a generation or two behind Amplitube 3 but the access of the individual components made it a worthwhile upgrade for me despite recently buying Amplitube 3 .

I think that Sampletank could enjoy a similar renaissance if they realized the power in what was there and gave as better access to it. - Scotty



quote="Squids"]SampleTank isn't a sampler. It's more a "rompler" and actually SampleTank 2.5 still has certain things like its built-in effects system and models that are unlike anything else on the market. It is a great workhorse and the amount of people that have it and use it on albums is massive! There's nothing wrong with it whatsoever. I can think of a bunch of things I'd like to see in a Sampletank 3 and some day there may be one... I wouldn't assume it is going to cost this or that. You don't know that! I can tell you that whatever it will be it won't be something that's negative or discouraging... there'd be no point in that! So try to think positive.

I will tell you one thing positive for ALL SampleTank users and future users. There's a special version of the current SampleTank coming VERY soon and also a little (lot of) something from Sonic Reality that'll take that rompler to the next level. Keep your eyes peeled next week and let's see what happens. There are some GREAT samplers out there - no doubt. But for a tight multitimbral rompler module with "virtual expansion boards"... it has its place! Meat and potatoes baby. I love all of my other advanced and feature-filled samplers and synths. But, even with all of those I still SampleTank is always used in any music product I am working on. It's a powerful workhorse for quick creative results.. and plus it really ties the room together. [/quote]

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lotus2035 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:42 am

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Honestly I love the sound quality of SampleTank, Sonik Synth (which I use quite a lot) SampleTron and Miroslav but I never feel 100% comfortable using any of them too many times in one project.
I have had far too many cases of hung notes, entire soundbanks and patches disappearing on song load, blasts of noise, audiocard hanging that forces a reboot that doesn't happen with other software.

It would be easy to say well maybe these things are caused by my host but I've had the same problems with the SampleTank line in both Cubase 5 and Ableton Live 8 and on two totally different systems.

I still hang in there with them however because I think the quality of the sounds are top notch.
I'm hoping that SampleTank 3 will be a total rebuild not just a facelift.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 am

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Thanks. But I disagree with the last comment. Is a B3 "dated"? Is a Rhodes "dated"? If something emits a sound and it is musical and accomplishes certain things - especially in a particular style or method that other products do not then it isn't out-dated at all! Okay, graphically perhaps it could be spruced up a bit... the old T-RackS wasn't dated either because a good model of a analog gear is still useful (and the original tube gear itself is also not dated!). But when TR3 came along the wider scope of modules, the improved graphics and everything else were a warm welcome! It didn't make the previous TR any less useful... and actually in some cases I still use it! But it was updated with more and that is surely what will happen some day with SampleTank 3.

In the meantime though, that engine has its uses musically. I can tell you as a sound developer who has worked in nearly every platform and while SampleTank currently is not EASY to develop sounds for... once the sound is in SampleTank it is SO FAST to be able to mess with it and get something creative going. Whether it is the effects or just the layout of everything right there in front of you or perhaps the layering of the sounds and routing the whole layered sound through a series of effects... it just accomplishes something musically that is convenient, efficient and productive... the more sounds you have in it the more you can play with them like clay and mold what you need. THAT is why it is used on so many records.

Look, I come from the world of hardware workstations. We did samples for companies like Alesis and Roland, we did patch programming and samples for Yamaha Motif and all sorts of products like that. Those were all about presets too and despite the fact that some of them had DEEP engines to tweak the sound it was kind of hard to access all of the different menus and pages so most people didn't tweak the sounds that much. Even I didn't apart from when we were hired to do so or if I really needed but I don't like hunting through pages and pages either. One of my favorite hardware keyboards is the NORD STAGE because everything is right there in front of me and the creativity I pull out of those built-in effects (which are MUCH more limited than SampleTank's... although the Nord Leslie is better than SampleTank's... and AmpliTube 3's Leslie is better than Nord's... so yes if there is a SampleTank 3 someday - which I am not saying but come on we all know there will be - then let's just hope they have the AmpliTube 3 Leslie in there!!!!).

So, what I am saying is the musicality of the effects in ST2, the easy and speed at which you can access parameters and save back variations plus the overall organic sound of it all adds up to a timeless useful device! Even if I obviously love Kontakt for our Infinite Player and it has its strengths and "sound" to it... SampleTank has a very DIFFERENT flavor! Sure, this is still subjective and each of you will have your preferences. I am not saying you're going to like SampleTank the same way I do or thousands of others. But, if you're thinking that just because it has been a while since a major overhaul that it is dated... I'd think again... especially if you own it! Give ST some love and perspective. It has its place in the music set up and does that job quite well! The "glue". The "let me see if SampleTank can get that sound for me" and as long as you have Sonik Synth 2 in there and Miroslav Philharmonik, SampleTron, SampleMoog and the upcoming massive.... woops, I almost spilled the beans (I love doing that! It is my specialty to tease) then there's a good chance you can pull a rabbit out of the hat in a session! I've done it many times and for that reason alone SampleTank and the SR sounds we've done for it are a staple piece in my set up. I know it is the same for many others... whether those people are in this thread or not is another story! But they're out there making music with it today just as much as a year or two or three ago. It's a valid tool for music-making and IMO a mistake to dismiss.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:49 am

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I don't have too many problems like that. No more than with anything else. Always best to keep saving as you go and then that is not such a big issue.

That said, don't get me wrong. I am ALL FOR improvements and new versions. I am one of the biggest "pushers" of it both for my own desires and the ones I read from you guys. I try to consolidate what I see and then "lobby" for it. The more I can ask for and comes true the more we can talk about it here and hopefully people buy it from esoundz... and the circle of sampled life is complete! Yes, of course, we still want to sell it to you buy you can take what I say with a grain of salt knowing that - which most of you know to do by now. But, I am talking very practical here. Musician to musician. Each of us work differently and do different styles of music so it may not always apply... but some things are universally appealing such as speed of workflow. I find SampleTank offers that most of the time and that's important to me. It has come through too many times musically for me to think anything but praise for it...

I mean, I am an effect collector as well and even things like that "Lofi" effect ALONE are worth it for me. There are some gems in that thing. Also Stretch is just amazing if you dig into it. I find it to be better than many other tools on the market for that. Plus better or not it has its own unique thing about it and it is another tool to have on hand in case it does the trick! That's my 4 cents.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:55 am

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[/quote]

Yeah, you're working on a track and you think "Man, I need a messed up sounding upright on this" and you grab any piano and start putting it through the LOFI effect or maybe the Phonograph one and dial back the crackle of the record or filter it a bit and then put a slap back delay on it... all in seconds. This is what I mean. You just grab something and quickly process, layer, tweak a few synth parameters and you've got it!

It comes in handy. When I say a "workhorse", I mean that if you're writing - even if you might replace the instrument later with a live instrument or something fancy from a 100 gigabyte library on something else - for writing inspiration and quick production you have these sounds that are not so large they can't be loaded into ram and they work nicely on a laptop as well, they get results and sometimes that is what ends up on the record and sometimes it acted as a scratch pad mock up of what you were thinking (the amount of people that use Philharmnik first and then a real orchestra later for example and maybe mix Phil in a bit to lush it up)...

We all have our complaints about it. I do too... some, not many, and nothing that holds me back from being able to make good use of it. For new users perhaps if it was more affordable and they could pick and choose which sounds they wanted to focus on then that itself would be a different kind of improvement as well. The access price and options! But for veteran users... I just hope you don't miss out on its usability still today. It has been around for awhile. But it still has legs!

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:58 am

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Dave, I hear you re: B3 and Rhodes, however do you not think that since ST came out they are B3 emulations that are more flexible, more authentic sounding and same with Rhodes since? or what do you think the B3 and Rhodes ST versins have that no other versions on the market has?
If you compare the effects in ST to say those in omnisphere, zebra, alchemy etc. not to even mention the soundtoys and uad's etc that I use, you really do think they stand up? I don't at all.
when you compare the GUI to all mentioned above and so many others like dcam etc you really do think it does stand up?
I don't at all.....
In a sense it is like comparing the presets in AT2 vs AT3...AT3 sounds so much better, because technology has moved on and improved on such things...
rsp

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:14 am

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I am sure a fantasy ST3 will be so much better than the current ST2.5 as well. But it doesn't exist yet. Before AT3, AT2 was GREAT! It was just fine and still is. So I am not saying that things can't be improved. I have a long list! Actually, I think there's a Facebook page IK has (Peter would know) with people's wish list for an eventual ST3 (with no official announcement of the product though so we have to hold our horses a bit). But, what I am saying is that ST2.5 is not dated or obsolete. Ironically there's nothing ELSE on the market (besides a fantasy ST3) that I can think of that would do what I get out of ST2.5 (and that includes the sounds that were developed for it that have a particular character).

By the way, when I made the B3 and Rhodes comparison... I was not saying ST2.5 has a better organ or EP than other software. That's not what I meant. I meant that the B3 is old (an actual one) and the Rhodes is too (although they just made a new one!) and so is a Piano, so is a Pultec, so is a Neve, so are Blue Jeans... but they're not out-dated. If it works it works! If it does a certain something that has its appeal then it is still valid, useful, worth getting etc. Sure, if something came along that was much better at that same thing AND captured the same character that made it great then sure, perhaps then it would be obsolete.... even though still useful to someone else and maybe just at a lower price!

But I don't think it is. I think it is a viable product that has its place. Maybe it IS time that the price came down though. It has been out a while. But it's musical function is still great for a "rompler" (even if far surpassed if judged as a full-featured sampler - which it never was supposed to be anyway). There aren't enough romplers in software actually... if you compare to the hardware keyboard and module world. It's hard to do well. That's a lot of sounds to sample and a lot of effects - luckily IK MAKES effects so they can borrow from their own DSP. That's always a plus and of course it is part of my wish list for the future of that platform... so let's see! But for now there are 32 juicy effects in there and cool layering/processing tools on thousands of sounds to play with! I wouldn't dis that too much!

So, complaints aside, I think there's some good life in that one. Those that wanna bash will bash. I am only talking to the people here that are serious about their music and are grabbing hold of some of the concepts being discussed. Even those old videos I did are still watched by people today and I get comments about it (okay, some of them are from rude Youtubers who say "stop talking and play beeoch!" but what can you do? It was an instructional video, not performance!!!). Seriously, a lot of people watch those videos we did back then and get some good tips on ways to use it.

From SR's perspective we make sounds for whatever you use - or spread it around in multiple formats anyway. I am by no means tied just to SampleTank as a format. But it has its place is all I am saying. A musical tool that for many is a staple piece in their set up, myself included.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:20 am

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I guess we will agree to disagree and I still stand by my assessment on the previous page...years ago SS2 and ST 2 were fine, to me now it is dated...we will agree to disagree.

rsp

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:23 am

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Edit: Oh the "effects"... I missed that, sorry. I was thinking of the overall sound so read below with that in mind... but with regard to the built-in effects, I think certain ones do and some can be a lot better. The compressor, limiter, parametric EQ and lofi effects in particular I find to be among the best I've heard in a VI plug-in and at the very least they have a flavor to them that is unique if we don't compare them any other way... so that, the delay and phaser are all tops to me. I can imagine DIFFERENT flavors and I am sure there will be some day (as there are in TR3 and AT3).

Now for the broader comparison...

---------

By the same token can you sonically make the same thing in Omnisphere, Zebra (whatever that is) or Alchemy? First of all, not if you don't have the thousands of Sonic Reality sounds in it like you do in SampleTank. That alone has its own unique character... but you could eventually have those Sonic Reality sounds in Reason, Kontakt or maybe even Alchemy at some point which I'd love to do because I am a big fan of Ben's work. He's just brilliant and a really nice guy to boot. But each of those platforms - even WITH these same samples - is going to have different character in how it is processed and treated. A different "flavor".

It is not a competition on which VI can have the most bad-ass synthesis or bells and whistles. If it was then things like Alchemy and Absynth might "win". But, it is more down to what results you can get for your music. If Omnisphere does everything you need then great! Or, more likely, if it has a certain host of flavors you like and character to it, way of working etc. then that's a good thing to have, so would Zebra be or Giraffe or Bear or Lion! (just having fun - I am sure it is great). Luckily some of these (not all but some) are affordable enough to have a variety and as long as each of them does something useful then I don't see where the problem is. Also, as long as something else doesn't REPLACE what the other does... none of what you mentioned fully replaces what SampleTank can do. Maybe for an individual's needs it does and maybe that's the case for you. But not for me and thousands of other users who use other things (samples, effects, set up) that are not replaced by anything else except perhaps a fantasy ST3... while that's not here yet I think it is wise to appreciate what ST2.5 has to offer which is quite a lot even still!

Have I broken you down yet? Haha. Anyway, it's all good. All that matters in the end is what each person thinks and feels. If I sparked a new perspective great! If not then those who will appreciate it will continue to do so and those who want to look for other tools instead will do so... we all have our POV. No one is any more "right" than the next. Just different perspectives is all. I hope mine was at least some food for thought!

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:30 am

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I only brought up the effects cause you did,



But to me the effects are only one of the many weaknesses of it in 2010.
The filters, the engine, the gui, the search engine etc are all to me major weaknesses compared to other stuff in 2010.
rsp

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Scotty - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:31 am

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Squids, any comment on my previous post regarding search speed for sounds and tags. This is where the utility of Sampletank breaks down for me. Faster and more flexible searching with tags is what I would like to see. CAn we antcipate improvements there ? The rest of your comments regarding the quick sound sculpting with effects and layering are the reasons it still has a very valid place in my vst folder.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:34 am

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you haven't heard of U-he's Zebra? it is probably one of the most popular vst's here on kvr....

You do know I own the product right? so it isn't like breaking me down into buying it. I already did. I just use it probably once a year now...in a good year

rsp

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:34 am

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Well I disagree to agree to disagree to agree to disagree! (Just kidding) To each his own of course. But I can't help but think you're probably missing out if you blow it off like that. Luckily it only matters what you think. If you're happy that's the most important thing.

For me, I'm quite happy with my SampleTank! I am also excited about what is coming next week and I have a feeling a lot of other people will be too. I wouldn't want to rain on that parade though with some vague notion that the format is "out of date". If it was then we wouldn't have busted our asses to come up with what we have to offer this month for all current and new SampleTank users. And we're not stupid either. As I said, SampleTank has its place. It as useful today as it ever was... maybe even more-so with this upcoming announcement. But that's all I can say about that for now.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:37 am

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No, I don't use U-he Zebra but I'll check it out. I don't use OmniSphere either but I know Eric does great work. Alchemy is one of my faves. And yes I DO know you use SampleTank so I am not trying to SELL it to you. But maybe what I am saying will help you or someone else appreciate it more - even if they already have it. Plus I am defending the notion that it is out of date... I whole-heartedly disagree and it would be a shame if others reading this were to start thinking that... especially knowing what revamp vitalization is coming just around the corner.

But, I will check out the Zebra. Noting against it or other animals. I was even in a band called Giraffe! So no problem.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:39 am

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well hopefully the revamp vitalization will reinvigorate me to use it again
rsp

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:40 am

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p.s. you are so frigging hard to argue with.......you are always polite and professional, and passionate... Even if we disagree it is clear you believe what you believe.....
cheers for you being you.
rsp

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:47 am

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Just my opinion, but I'm hard-pressed to get excited by whatever is coming because...

Part of the problem with Sampletank seeming dated is that SR is one of the only developers making sounds for it. Other sample companies won't touch ST because of its limited features. Now, before I get accused of "bashing", SR does what it does really well. But you guys have a major focus on "vintage" sounds for Sampletank. Old moogs and trons, Ringo drums sounds and such. While that appeals to certain groups of people, there are plenty out there that could care less about the sounds of the Beatles, Hendrix, or other stuff from nearly half a century ago.

Again, you guys do what you do well and SR is indeed the 'go to' place for those kind of sounds, and everyone has different tastes so I'm not bashing.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:49 am

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Effects are an interesting thing. I have some KILLER hardware effects that one could argue have LONG SINCE been "out-dated". Ever open up a Fuzzface? A Univox Superfuzzz? Surely there have been improvements in technology since... but it just so happens they have a unique character to them that I like! Same thing with the effects in SampleTank. As I mentioned, I don't think you're going to find effects in ANYTHING else that have the SAME character as these gems:

SampleTank's - Compressor, Limiter and Parameteric EQ (models of analog gear a la T-Racks), the quirky "LoFi" effect (which other effects CALLED lofi tend to sound completely different such as Kontakt's which is more of a bitcrusher type effect), the phaser (what a powerful multistage phaser with an MXR-ish sound to it!) and some of the others as well.

I think the reverbs could be improved quite a bit and the chorus is so-so... but my favorite chorus is the CE-1 and I like the model IK did of that in AmpliTube (they modeled my own CE-1 actually which I sent over to Italy). So, naturally, I have been begging for awhile that the CE-1 model makes its way into a future SampleTank! That and many other great modeled effects. No doubt it would be GREAT and when that happens we can all celebrate. But for now ST2 still has what it has that nothing else does... and it is good n' useful. Not JUST effects as well but the whole layout, speed of work with everything in one place... a lot of benefits it offers.

Also the filters are really nice and analogy. They have their own sound to them as well... and then there is the biggest factor which is the character of the samples and those are going to be proprietary to whoever sampled them.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:51 am

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you know maybe that is part of me being unimpressed with many of the SR stuff.
cause as you put it:

Cause with the exception of old moogs I am exactly like that...never understood what was so big about Hendrix, and I did play in many guitar bands, with endless hendrix covers , maybe at the time he was way ahead of his time but in today's context I never got it, and whilst I think the Beatles were probably in the top five greatest pop composers, I never cared much for their sound..And I actually never even thought of it as nearly half a century ago which is what it is...
hmmmm, maybe I am not the target market.
rsp

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:58 am

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Sonic Reality's Motto is "Sample Everything". We don't ONLY do vintage drums! Maybe that's what you've been seeing a lot of lately. But we've been one of the providers of workstation sounds for YEARS for many of the major hardware manufacturers of keyboards, modules and expansion boards as well as for companies like IK, NI, Propellerheads, Cakewalk, Emagic (pre-Apple), Steinberg, Camel Audio and many others! We have every type of sound you can think of practically from world instruments to orchestral to electronic to acoustic to vintage to modern... for a sample company we're quite diverse!

But, again, if you're looking for a platform that has a wide range of different sound developers than that's something like Kontakt which is probably the most popular for that... and we're there too! That is more of an open ended sampler platform. SampleTank is more of a semi-open rompler... kind of like the Roland synths with expansion boards. No one ever complained there weren't enough libraries from different sound developers for it. But it had all the meat and potatoes you'd want to be able to call it a workhorse... and that's what I am calling SampleTank here. A Sample Workstation "rompler" as opposed to thinking of it as Apples to Apples with something like Kontakt or Halion or other "samplers".

So I don't think you're bashing, no worries. I understand the appeal and agree! I wouldn't expect people to ONLY use Sonic Reality samples. I don't myself and I have every one! But, if you DO like Sonic Reality samples (and IK's- we're not the only ones who sample for that format) and you also like the things you can do in SampleTank, the organic and analog character of it... well, then that should speak for itself! Also each person is able to get more out of it than others depending on their creativity too. I am able to get a LOT out of Sampletank in my musical projects but that may not be the same for someone else. A lot of factors involved.

However, from a sound developer's perspective, I find there are things I can do with the sounds in SampleTank that I cannot do in other formats and visa versa. I also find that the limitation of no streaming has its plus points! More sounds, more portability, laptop use... I can go on about it. But, probably need to talk about something else to make the day more interesting! I think I made my point though... let me see if there's anything else lingering in this discussion that I missed... I don't want to just repeat myself here. You all can make up your own minds!

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:02 am

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Bah, that's pigeon holing us. I just used some examples. Our orchestral, SFX or world or other sounds have nothing to do with vintage sounds of Hendrix. We're broader than that.

Anyway, you may not be the target market or you may be and you're missing what it can offer you. It all depends on the shades you've got in the glasses. Being open-minded has its plus points!

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:07 am

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Oh yes, you're quite right, you guys have some other stuff besides only vintage sounds. I was speaking in regards to just Sampletank, and much of what you guys release in that particular platform seems to be vintage oriented.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:08 am

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I think there will be improvements in this area too. Although SampleTank does do some cool things like reading the BPM from the name and automatically being able to LOOP SYNC. Love that one. I wish it would automatically find sounds in the search by name of any type of sound... like I said, I do have a long list of improvements I'd like to see. But, it hasn't stopped me from being able to use SampleTank on every session. I think it is a good idea to get to know your sound libraries as well. I've got my go to sounds and then I hunt a little bit... improved search functions are welcome as are many other things mentioned in this thread.

But, it is the sort of extreme thinking "it's either in or it's out" that I think is a mistake. It is not perfect and nothing is. It has its plus and minus points. For many people the plus outweighs the minus and even more there really isn't anything else on the market that works and sounds the same way... not until this phantom ST3 this thread (which was based on a misintepretation of an old teaser about TR3) is about.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:15 am

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Miroslav Philharmonik, which we did, isn't. Also, many of the Expansion Tank titles are not either. Also, many of the custom Group Buy products we've done over the years were not either... World Orchestra and Rare Instruments... granted I LOVE vintage sounds and so do MANY people! They don't have to be used just for my personal favorite styles of Classic Rock and Progressive. They can be used for Hip Hop, Electronic, Film Scoring, Pop, Country, Jazz and many more... and they are!

Anyway, if you want diversity beyond "Hendrix" then as I said... keep those eyes peeled! Current and new prospective SampleTank users that may NOT have known just how much we have developed over the years will be stunned at what is coming next. But I better be quiet now before I get into trouble... you guys always get me somehow to let the cat out of the bag early!!! Okay, I take full responsibility. I am not good with secrets I admit it. It's like a hot potato and I just want to let it out.... muzzle...mmffffffff.

Ironically, I am sitting here talking to you SampleTank bashers about it! Haha. Just kidding. Look, this is the SR forum which is the closest thing there is to a SampleTank forum (even though it still isn't). We've had a LOT of SampleTank users tread here. There are hundreds of thousands of users out there in the world. We want to make them and prospective users happy, inspired and off making lots of great music of ALL styles. We're on a mission and there's ain't nothin's gonna stop us!

So sit back and enjoy the ride. We're about to unleash the fury! Haha.

Okay, folks, that's about it on that subject for now. Have a great little Saturday! I might head over to Home Depot, maybe Bed Bath and Beyond.. I don't know. I don't know if I'll have enough time! Okay just one!!!!

- Frank the SampleTank.

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DarkStar - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:39 am

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.. Zappa?

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standalone - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:42 am

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...Sinatra?

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Peter - IK Multimedia - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:49 am

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...N Furter?

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standalone - Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:53 am

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...Ygoestohollywood?

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zedd - Sat Apr 03, 2010 12:59 pm

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Just because technology has moved on and improved doesn't always make it better. I still love AT1 and the special sounds that it could create for my guitar, and would like IK to emulate their own Amplitube 1 product so that I could use those cool sounds again.


Yeah, you're right. I'm gonna stop listening to the Beatles and listen to a modern boy band that uses that cool Auto-tune effect!. Vintage effects are outdated and passe.

But seriously... you ARE right that there are plenty of people out there who don't get it... and that is a real shame. The 1960s was a Renaissance period in modern music. It wasn't just the slow movement of summer to winter. It was a polar shift, and the height of creativity in recorded music history. That music is timeless, and I am sorry for anyone (and everyone) who thinks of it as something less worthy of appreciation because it is old.


I think you should include in your signature "I never cared much for the sound of the Beatles". Being clear about that will allow most readers to take all of your comments on the quality of virtual instruments and effects with a grain of salt.

I don't meant to be rude... I am just saying that that is a very telling statement about your musical sensibilities, and from it I can totally understand why you would fail to appreciate some of the strengths in SampleTank.

I use SampleTank in every project, and agree with all that Squids said above. Sometimes competitor products have preferable versions of certain instruments, but in most cases my SampleTank library gives me exactly what I need, and does it quickly and efficiently. I wouldn't want to be without it.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:34 pm

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yeah I can see why it is so important to let everyone know that the Beatles sound was not my kind of sound in my signature!!!!!! WHAT?!!! Why does that make a difference? why is that of fundamental importance?
For what it is worth I loved 60's motown sound, and burt bacharach sound..
rsp

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:49 pm

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The Beatles had some stuff I thought was good, particularly on the Sgt. Pepper's album. But that doesn't mean I have any desire to copy or repeat the same things myself. Why would you? I don't mean to be rude...but if that is the case, then that is a rather telling statement about your musical sensibilities. That comment you made to zvenx about whether or not he likes the sound of the Beatles vs. his opinions on virtual instruments/effects is quite silly, as one has little to do with the other.

The 60's were the height of recorded music? Ridiculous. That is merely subjective taste and opinion. Why would one feel the need to exhalt one decade of music over all others? I feel sorry for anyone (and everyone) who would limit their musical sensibilities in that manner.

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zedd - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:03 pm

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It's probably not a very good idea, I agree.

Sorry... I was probably being a little obnoxious in suggesting that and apologize if it was offensive. But it is a consistency which helps to underscore where you are coming from in terms of the kind of sounds that appeal to you. Many of the effects included in SampleTank have a very vintage quality to them which impressed me to no end when I started using the product 5 years ago. I can understand that if the '60s pop rock thing is not your style then a lot of the SampleTank instruments and effects might not stand out for you. But if you like '60s Motown, I think there is actually a lot that you could work with..

But I do understand that if you have found instrument in other libraries that have that magical quality that you are looking for (whatever that magic is to your ears) then probably a less detailed ST instrument won't hold much appeal for you.

But if you haven't found exactly what you want, it is wonderful to be able to audition a bunch of upright pianos, basses and organs, etc.. SampleTanks loads each instrument very quickly and you can listen to a whole bunch of similar instruments to find the one that works with your song. Where it may have less detail per instrument, there is a greater variety of cool sounding instrument variations which allow you to find the tone that really works. Other virtual instruments usually have fewer instrument options and take longer to load because they are so detailed.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:28 pm

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I think there's a bigger picture to the significance of The Beatles besides "I didn't care for their sound"... if you didn't there's a good chance that an artist you like did and wouldn't have their sound if it weren't for artists like The Beatles - but not only them. A lot of influential artists of that time have lead to the things others like today... and yes some of us are still blown away by The Beatles and artists of that decade too! But luckily none of that really has anything to do with SAMPLETANK!

The important thing to come away with here though is that the sounds we've done for SampleTank are far more diverse than just Hendrix and Beatles-oriented! They include The Stones, The Who, Pink Floyd and Genesis as well. Just kidding. They include just about everything really but not all of it has been commercially released BY IK... and that is about to change. Some of you have experienced a wider variety for SampleTank than others due to your involvement in past eSoundz group buys... it is amazing but this has been going on for years!!!! Some are new to it and some have been there on every single one! In any case, it is a good time to take a broad perspective of the many loop collections and many instruments from all over the world that we've brought to that platform and to highlight what really IS so darn useful about it! Why IS it still totally viable today and nothing has replaced it directly for what it did and still does? That's actually a topic I really enjoy discussing and it will be very relevant pretty soon with this new surprise coming... from SR and IK.

Sure, when/if (I love saying if...) SampleTank 3 comes out it is going to be the dog's meow. But that's pure fantasy right now. You want to talk reality? Sonic reality? Good, there's going to be a wide assortment of things very soon to do a heck of a lot more than just Beatles and Hendrix! But, hey, if you did want to do some Classic Rock then you've really got that covered too. No less, many styles of Hip Hop, Electronic, Pop, Country, Jazz, Film Scoring, World Music and anything else you can think of... even some classic Motown Soul! Sound-wise it has been there, just not as much in the forefront as it is about to be! From IK and in a very appetizing way let's just say... and we're proud to be a part of that legacy and the exciting thing that is coming next!

As for the engine, man I don't think there's anyone here - myself included - who would say it is perfect or without flaws... but then again I can say that about just about everything I have. I absolutely LOVE my various samplers but I can give you a long list of flaws they have and some of it just can't be addressed because it is not the nature of that beast... and visa versa you can say the same about SampleTank. But what IS the nature of this beast? The best words to describe are words like "Rompler" and "Workstation". It's hard to just describe in words but when you're working on a track it is just that Swiss Army Knife tool that gets you there. Zedd said it really well. There may even be other software that does a particular instrument "better" but for the sake of speed and creativity you may find yourself doing it in SampleTank first... and then sometimes you find that the sound you did in SampleTank has a certain charm to it that just does the trick and you don't NEED to replace it!

For example, B4 is a cool organ plug-in (sad to see it go in fact... not sure why that happened!!!!). It is more powerful than say a Sonic Reality organ sample in SampleTank in terms of what you can do with it. So you might be working on a track and have an organ part and do it in SampleTank first. Grit it up, whatever you're going to do with it. Then you're immediately working on other parts of the song and then at some point you think you're going to replace it with the B4 to do a "better" organ. But you find that actually that sound sat in the mix quite nicely and had a certain character to it that you can't put your finger on (maybe it was that we sampled a really AMAZING sounding B3 and Leslie 122?) and even though you can tweak more drawbars and fun things on the B4 it just doesn't have the same character so you choose the other (or in all fairness visa versa). Either way, you have OPTIONS and that is one of the things that is great about SampleTank. Under one roof it has a lot of sound and quick sculpting options in the music creation process... there are plenty of INCREDIBLE tools to tweak your heart out! But sometimes you just want some meat and potatoes to get things going ... and some of that ends up in the final mix! That's how a lot of us use it.

Look, we're bringing all of the best Sonic Reality sounds over to formats like Kontakt to be played from our Infinite Player. That has a great sound too. If you prefer Kontakt then get that. But, even with all of my favorite sounds in Kontakt myself I still pull up SampleTank! Why would I? The samples are the same so... what's up with that? Well, it is because of the way I work with it, the ease of use and speed at which I can manipulate a sound with certain musical results I like! I can do DIFFERENT things with Kontakt and if I want to run Kontakt through T-Racks 3 Deluxe I can get some even more amazing sounds often but... again, I might quickly do that in SampleTank first and maybe/maybe not replace that later with something else that is bigger and better. SampleTank or Reason is my scratch pad very often and they work great for that... multiple sounds can be loaded at once, huge variety, efficient on the CPU and Laptopable. (made up that word). I likes it!

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zedd - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:34 pm

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I was talking about the "sound" of the Beatles in terms of the tonal quality of the recorded instruments. If something sounds awesome and has magical quality to it, trying to match that standard and replicate those tonal sentiments is not a bad thing by any means.

It is true that not everybody appreciates those sounds, but a majority of musicians would probably agree that the sounds that the Beatles got on their recordings are the Holy Grail of recorded sound.


I think I shouldn't have made the statement, because I feel like it was a little obnoxious for me to do so, but I do see a connection between not recognizing the magic in the sound of the Beatles and being dismissive about the usefulness of SampleTank in terms of its sound quality and usefulness.


Definitely my taste and opinion. I exhalt that decade over all others because of the gigantic amount of good material that came out of it. It was a period where recording technology made huge strides, and were drug experimentation blew open creative doors. Good stuff has come out of all the other decades, but not with similar concentration.

But yeah, that's my take. I guess we don't need to feel sorry for each other. There is so much of the music I love that I will continue finding new things that appeal to my sentiments until my dying day. I don't see my focus or my preferences as a limitations by any means, and I'm sure you don't see yours that way.

Anyways... I apologize for being provocative in my comments. I was feeling testy, but I don't mean to be a guy who disrespects anyone elses musical tastes. That's what makes the world turn. And as we grow we learn to appreciate and value things differently, so our tastes change, and we love things we thought we hated.

And lastly... there are numerous things about SampleTank which I hope will be improved upon. I am aching for it actually. So to balance my comments I will say that I agree with the idea that IK needs to pull up its socks and add some essential improvements to ST3 like a better filing/naming system, streaming from disk, round robining for more detailed instruments, and improved effects (which they have developed many of since ST was first released).

I believe that many of those things are coming, and I'm really looking forward to it.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:34 pm

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no problems we are all passionate about this thing called music
rsp

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:41 pm

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No worries zedd. I understand, man.

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:42 pm

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Another great post! Jabs aside, which you gracefully apologized for, your perspective is fantastic and really helpful for people to see. When you're in the thick of it and you NEED to get some options and results fast I find I just can't say no to SampleTank! On many occassions I was so glad I had it. A staple piece for sure. No slam to some incredible other plug-ins out there too! Get them all! But don't be without SampleTank on a session... not me. No way. Especially if you're doing anything where people are paying by the hour! But even if you just want the speed of your creative flow to be at its best... as long as one invests the time to dig into SampleTank to see what they can pull out of it.

I always like to see users that do! It is inspiring to others... I think I need to do some more videos on it as well. Those always spark some ideas and there are so many more things one can do with it creatively than many people realize. A good time to give this red baby some TLC! Or it might get forgotten and unappreciated because it has been around for awhile. I've not seen anything else come along that I feel would do the same thing so... until that happens one might as well get the most out of this fella... and don't forget you CAN change the color from Red to whatever you want! (that is a legacy argument that happened because of KVR actually! From years and years ago when people complained about the redness of SampleTank 1! A good Squids/KVR lobby for something everyone wanted and got... among other things!).

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Squids - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:48 pm

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I will add that even though I probably have more in common with the style of music I like with Zedd's, I think the concept of what he is saying can apply to MANY styles of music. You don't have to appreciate The Beatles to appreciate SampleTank! It is an open slate. You can pull in vocal samples and do incredibly unique things for Hip Hop or Electronic music, you can manipulate loops with slices and midi or with Loop Sync, you can layer and process multisampled instruments of ALL kinds in there... it really is a powerhouse but it ALL depends on the user and their ability to get out of it what will serve their music. If you can't get that out of it then that says it all - but for YOU, not for the next guy! And the next and the next... one man's trash is another man's gold!

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vespers75 - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:48 pm

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Indeed, mine is now a really light green-grey color.

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zvenx - Sat Apr 03, 2010 2:54 pm

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I am blue baby, blue
rsp

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zedd - Sat Apr 03, 2010 3:11 pm

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Wow, I didn't even remember that you could change the colours to green or to blue.

The first thing I did when we got the colour-changing option was to increase the lumosity so that I have a light pastel orangey red.

Never touched the controls again after that... and I actually forgot that it isn't the default.

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zedd - Fri May 21, 2010 9:21 am

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Hey Peter (and/or anyone who can help),

One thing I would like to see in ST3 is faster saving of presets (which can currently take up to a whole minute the first time you do it in a project).

I would like to know if there is any way (currently) to have two different ST libraries? I would love to put my MANY Gigabytes of newly add ReTank and Loop/Construction Kit content into a separate ST folder which won't have to be analysed whenever I need to relist the main library.

Is there any way to do this? I have registered so many different versions of SampleTank (probably about 6 of them), but I don't think any of them can run separate from the others. They are all one and the same thing.

It would be very handy to have a "SampleTank Loops" GUI which could reference its own library.

Thanks in advance,

Zedd

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lotus2035 - Sat May 22, 2010 5:46 am

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Looking forward to SampleTank 3... I have all the present stuff except Moog and love the sounds in them all but find them unstable to work with. I load up too many instances in Cubase and my project will have problems for sure.
I'm hoping V3 will be solid.

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zedd - Sat May 22, 2010 5:59 am

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You mean too many instances of SampleTank GUI will cause Cubase to crash? I've noticed that happening in Digital Performer, as well. Several instances of SampleTank, along with an instance of PLAY and Kontakt can cause the DAW to run out of memory and crash. On a few occasions I have found that having more than 3 instances of ST in a project can cause trouble.

When we finally go 64-bit, these issues will hopefully be history.

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lotus2035 - Sat May 22, 2010 7:35 am

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Yes.
For me at least using SampleTank/Sonik synth or the others requires a lot of tip-toeing around and crossed fingers..lol.. Not a very professional/efficient way to work. But I keep going back to them and working around the problems because they sound great.

I'm hoping the 32-bit version of Sampletank 3 will resolve the issues I'm having (hung notes and the entire sound database disappearing from the GUI are the most common). However, I'm still a bit sceptical that a total rebuild will mean no problems because my experience with T-Racks 3 Deluxe has been an unstable one too, again when multiples instances are loaded up which is in stark contrast to the older T-Racks plug which I have always found to be rock solid..

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draft14 - Sat May 22, 2010 7:41 am

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I would like to see in ST3 x64 native

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zedd - Sat May 22, 2010 8:32 am

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That's too bad Lotus. Aside from my discovery that too many instances of ST might cause problems, I have found it to be pretty rock solid, and have a ST instance in every project (it is built right into my project template).

Admittedly I had some trouble with many of the Amplitube plugins before I installed Snow Leopard and the Amplitube updates, so I presume that there were some issues. They seem to work fine again now. And the T-Racks3 plugs seem solid on my system.

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lotus2035 - Sat May 22, 2010 8:52 am

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I've said this before but I always felt that the problems were somehow related to the serial authorisation process which is tied into one's hardware. I've had the serial reset and products revert to demo mode on me a few times.

Nevertheless, I haven't given up on SampleTank yet. We'll see what happens with 3.

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hydemusic - Sun May 23, 2010 8:22 am

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I had a similar issue with TRacks3 and Ampltube SVX. I was using Sonar so it seems it's an IK issue seeing it happens with Cubase. Funkybot emailed me this solution. It has worked for me and may work for you.

1. Open the plugin
2. Click VST -> Plugin Properties
3. If "Configure As Tempo Based Effect" is checked, uncheck the box

4. Repeat this for any IK plugins that are crashing.
5. Close and reopen Sonar or Cubase

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bobbybland - Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:21 pm

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I'd really like to see Sampletank 3 use program changes, and not to where you have to manually set up sounds per banks.This takes alot of time and alot of the fun outta the workflow for me,when using Sampletank. I think a midi learn program change would work best.. up/down.. like a real rompler,or workstation,this is what makes them nice,they are extremely fast at getting your idea's down..

The browser should also be updated, a much larger Gui, x64,faster loading patches,and especially multi's.. And finally support for .fxb's too.

I love the way ST sounds,with these workflow features,it'd be perfect..

Better brass's

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pheeleep - Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:33 pm

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It's way better to use 1 instance of ST2 and load the 16 slots with sounds, rather than loading 16 instances of ST2. The same applies to any rompler/sampler. I noticed that way less resources are used when you take advantage of this feature..

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bobbybland - Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:37 am

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Wasn't Sampletank also on some sort of hardware at some point.. I remember seeing a hardware unit in the music store in orlando, it had sampletank sounds in a little box, remember thinking that was cool.. but load times we're slow though,compared to the workstations next to it..

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strav101 - Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:47 am

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This group buy 5 x 1 thing.......I don't think IK would have agreed to it unless a new version is on the way....ST 3 will have to ship with tons of content to complete with Kontakt etc. (prob everyhing in the GB!).....so I can see an upgrade coming up, obviously cheaper for us than new users.

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soulata - Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:38 pm

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So, what's up with ST3?

I've grown to like it in the last few weeks, well, kinda...

k

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zedd - Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:51 pm

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It's been a year since I was convinced it was going to be released in 2010. I am surprised it has not materialized.

I think IK is spending a bit too much making iPhone and iPad applications.

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don1thedon - Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:16 am

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+1!

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olepro - Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:47 am

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If they could just make another gui i would be glad
It is soo outdated and small and......ugly

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Squids - Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:52 am

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It's being worked on. Sure, the volume of products that are made can slow down progress of a particular product. It is a business but anyway ST3 is part of that business and it's coming along nicely. I'm doing some of the sounds for it. Gonna be great! As for when... can't say yet.

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Xenobt - Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:08 am

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Can't or won't?

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

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bobbybland - Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:37 am

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Would've been nice of IK to have considered just building a larger gui for their customers in the meantime.Some really nice sounds from what I've heard,but the current gui,makes it hard to work with, and I'm a rompler king!!!!

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bobbybland - Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:42 am

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Can you say if the multi's will be able to be used as program changes,and if so will they transistion smoothly to the next patch? Every cpu I've tested changing multi's on has made a huge pop in audio..

Also what types of sounds are you creating for it? Any new nice current sounding stuff,like big brass ensembles? Hip Hop southern styles? Orchestral stuff? Modern synth's?

thanks

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Squids - Fri Dec 23, 2011 7:50 pm

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I'm doing some drums for it right now but IK is doing a bunch of the sounds internally like the previous SampleTank versions. But I will be doing new Sonic Reality libraries for it as well taking advantage of the new features. Not sure about the multis and program change though. I'll have to check on that. Anyway yes it's bigger.

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bobbybland - Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:59 pm

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thanks for the reply

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zedd - Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:41 pm

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I don't understand the emphasis on these minor applications when we need an upgrade to the much more important SampleTank. How could it be that ST3 has not yet been released?

My DAW, Digital Performer, is finally going 64-bit. I really really REALLY need IK Multimedia to release the feature-enhanced 64-bit version of SampleTank asap, preferably before March 2012.

I use SampleTank 2 in almost all of my projects, and it remains one of the last 32-bit applications that is going to drag my DAW along and undermine my 64-bit efficiency. If I can get ST3 in 64-bit my set up will be golden!

Come on IK. Please focus on the regular maintenance of these products that many of us have come to depend on. I'm sure ST3 is being worked on and that it's gonna be great... but can we please go a little faster?

Many thanks in advance!

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Squids - Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:54 pm

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Nicely said Zedd and I'm right there with you. In fact, when ST3 comes I am going to support it like crazy because it's very important that it is a huge success. Otherwise the focus could be more on the other new products that are doing great. It's a business so the demand does of course affect what a company does. I personally think that even SampleTank as it is today remains a staple piece workhorse rompler but knowing what ST3 will do and updaing things like 64 bit will really take it that much further so... the sooner the better as far as I'm concerned too. Just so you know I push all the time for this as much as I can from my position.

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kev2525 - Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:12 am

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Keep pushing! I for one would love an update!

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BERFAB - Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:40 am

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As would I.

I went 64 bit last year and while I'm able to use T-Racks and Amplitube natively, the entire 'powered by ST' line (that I love, btw) sits collecting dust waiting for either a 64 bit upgrade or version 3. (As does CSR. I LOVE this reverb, but even with new technology available - and I've bought some very high quality 64 bit reverbs to try to replace it - nothing really compares, IMHO.)

Dave, I know you're under NDA for ST3 development, but could you possibly address two things that I'm curious about:

First, as conceived, will ST-3 have backward compatibility with prior sounds and libraries? I assume most of the bread and butter stuff will be nicely updated anyway, but some of the drum loop collections (which I think have always been underrated) will be missed if not compatible.

Second, will the memory limits for instruments be lifted or eliminated (i.e. disk streaming, etc.) in the new version?

Obviously, if you can't say so, no worries. But do hurry them along. I love my iPhone, but it just isn't a replacement for my studio filled with toys.



Cheers
-B

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Xenobt - Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:02 pm

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Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but when I just mentioned ST3 to a support person at IK, that I have Jampoints expiring soon, "It's gonna be a while." was the response. Pre-orders, maybe?

I love ST's power and flexibility, and I too hope it will support all the cool stuff it already has. (and my 60 gb of IK/SR libs!)

But I had to actually erase a post about the new iRig mixer here a week or so ago, cuz I didn't want to sound like a crank when everyone else seemed so excited.

I know DJs need tools too, but NI AND IK devoting so much time and effort to such a small niche of the market seems crazy, big-picture wise. And the endless stream of ios stuff coming from IK is starting to REALLY bug me.

If you play live, the ios Amplitube and Sampletank are real godsends, I'm sure. But for my needs, in a real working studio, all this stuff is entirely unneeded and seems to be impeding the pro tools (no pun intended) getting released.

I know that eventually the tablets and phones will do some amazing things and that someone has to get there first, but as a serious user, it all seems like toys now. Fun, but no real use in a professional environment.

Let's hear it KVRers, is there anyone out there using any of it to do paying scoring work, for sound design or even just making beats? It might let devs know where their best efforts should be going.

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

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zedd - Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:30 pm

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Totally with you on this!

I own almost every software product that IK Multimedia has made, aside from their iToys, and what I really want right now is for all the products to be 64-bit so that they are not going to continue to present a bottleneck. The focus should have been on updating the main products a long time ago. IK is way, way behind, with both EastWest and Native Instruments being 64-bit for more than a year now.

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lotus2035 - Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:24 pm

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I'm pretty much set for sounds and have no interest in buying new libraries.
However, as an owner of Sampletank 2.5, Sonik Synth 2, Miroslav and Sampletron I would very much like to be able to use these libraries in a 64bit plugin. They sound great and I use them a lot.
I really hope that IK doesnt expect all previous library owners to buy the full version of Sampletank 3 just to be able to use these in a 64bit environment.
Maybe a system like Amplitube and it's custom shop would be an option, A free 64-bit SampleTank 3 player compatible with the old libraries as well as the new.
I hate the idea of having to drag the 32bit plugs with me for the next few years and having to buy SampleTank 3 just for 64bit compatibility would be disappointing. Like I said, I don't need any more sounds.

It could go either way, look at the original T-Racks plugin, It was dumped and replaced by T-Racks 3 Standard outright but on the other hand it seems like CSR will get a 64bit upgrade. I guess we will find out in 2019.

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moonwalker2 - Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:12 pm

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Any news on sampletank 3? I saw their facebook group where they show some of the new stuff they sample, which looks awesome. As far as i can tell, ST3 has been in the making for about 2-3 years now (did they start working on it 2010?)

I would gladly pay for an upgrade of a new sampletank, it's in my opinion the best sampler when you want great sounds fast. Don't have time waiting for kontakts loading times...

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zedd - Wed Feb 08, 2012 2:38 pm

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Could you please post a link? I couldn't find it. Thanks.

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moonwalker2 - Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:29 pm

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No problemo, here you go! http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150301378600147.536841.337617160146

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zedd - Wed Feb 08, 2012 10:56 pm

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Thanks for that! I appreciate it.

I can't wait to be able to play those new instruments.

I wonder if ST3 will ship with all of the original content as well?

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moonwalker2 - Thu Feb 09, 2012 2:57 am

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The thing i'm most curious about is when it will be released - they have been talking about ST3 now for a long time.
We are still excited, still want to spend our money on ST3, and WE WANT IT!

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Squids - Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:46 am

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Yes SampleTank 3 has been in development for awhile and it has gone through many evolutionary changes as well. Yes, it's true I can't talk about what I know of it from my perspective, at least not in detail or revealing any secrets. But, IK has shared that it's in development and I can assure you of a couple of things which is that it will be compatible with the current SampleTank sounds you have (most of which were done by us at Sonic Reality, at least in terms of the PBST virtual instruments and XT2 libraries).

As for when... that depends on when it's finished! Is it coming out tomorrow? No. Is it going to be a LONG time from now? Well, maybe not so long actually. Some time this year is a good guess. For what it's worth I'm definitely on the side of pushing for it to happen sooner than later. We're also going to support the format at Sonic Reality like we've done in the past. So everything is still moving toward that... but of course there are no guarantees of anything. You just never know how things can change depending on different factors. I CAN tell you that it will be really cool if it comes out the way I've been seeing it developed and I think it's so unique and useful that it's worth the wait... especially with the particular features I've been requesting for years. I'm confident that if it has those it will be right on the money.

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DrApostropheX - Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:17 am

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I'm in the same sad boat I have every powered by SampleTank product made (just about) and can't use any of them because the 32-bit VSTi causes conniptions running in 64-bit. I actually bought the full version of Kontakt and have been beefing up my Kontakt collection because of this. I assume I'll give a hard look to a 64-bit SampleTank 3, but at this point I'm really liking Kontakt.

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Xenobt - Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:49 am

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That is SUCH good news, Squids! I've come to rely on my SR/ST libraries for sounds that give a track that something special that I can't find anywhere else, especially classic vintage keys and one-of-a-kind instruments.

And DrApostropheX, if you love the sounds from your IK instruments, but prefer the Kontakt gui, the Infinite Player gives you access to most (but not all) of the content from them. And eSoundz often features CRAZY good deals that are usually posted here, so keep your eye out. I recently picked up IP libraries for $11 usd each!

I've double bought many of the Xpansion Tanks and most of Miroslav in IP format because I prefer the sound of the NI sound engine, but the low CPU footprint of Sampletank based stuff is hard to beat for us folks with older systems, so let's hope that's one of the things it KEEPS!

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

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lotus2035 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:07 am

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It does? Hmmmm...I would love to know exactly what works and what doesn't work. I'm not asking you specifically, just curious.

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Xenobt - Wed Feb 15, 2012 7:55 pm

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No worries, lotus2035, it's a little tricky to get initially, but very cool.

Many (indeed most) of the libraries for Sampletank and the IK VIs were produced by Sonic Reality/eSoundz, and SR made a licensing agreement with Native Instruments to use the Infinite Player as a "bridge" into Kontakt/Kontakt Player format.

You buy the Infinite Player "shell" (that comes with lots of cool stuff called the Infinite Foundation Set) that allows you to use the IP libraries with the Kontakt sound engine.

While a point by point comparison of each library is too lengthy to go into here, (the lately elusive torgo is the true master of what is and isn't in each set, and many of his posts as well as great IP tip from Darkstar are in the KVR Sonic Reality/eSoundz archives) most of the ST parent sample sets appear in the IP format as various Kapsules.

For example, the aforementioned Miroslav is split into each orchestral section in IP as Orchestral Strings Kapsule, Orchestral Brass Kapsule, etc. while not specifically mentioning their original source. But patches like "23 Violins" are a dead give-away.

Here's a great IP Kapsule starter set, that covers lots of the turf in their Xpansion Tank cousins, at a great price.

http://www.esoundz.com/details.php?ProductID=2764

Sorry to derail the thread! Anyone who wants more info check out the eSoundz site, and there's great tricks and tips from SR/eSoundz.com in the KVR forum Manufacturers Section.

One last VERY cool note. The Infinite Player counts as a third party Kontakt library, which entitles you to the Kontakt crossgrade price! NICE!!!

KVR/eSoundz: Xenobt

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Squids - Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:34 am

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That's good stuff and I am sure it's appreciated. Chances are it'll get lost in this thread though so maybe someone should make another thread about sounds in multiple formats. In there I'd be more at ease to talk about the similarities between Sonic Reality sounds such as Miroslav Refills, Sonic Refills, Infinite Player/Kontakt and others.

But yeah let's stay on topic here about SampleTank 3. I'm definitely one of the people pushing for this to happen as soon as possible. We are developing new sounds for it and I really think a combination of the legacy libraries that have a good broad offering of meat and potatoes, vintage sounds and rare world sounds (what we call "workstation sounds" which are also available in other formats but just sound different than they do in ST because of the many cool DSP effects SampleTank has) the NEW sounds we're doing you'll also want. You'll see why. In any case, there's a lot to look forward to. I just have my finger's crossed on a few things making it to the final is the only thing.

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budweiser - Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:41 am

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@squids

Don't forget making a BIG resizable gui, i'm bored with the old tiny one...

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vespers75 - Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:49 am

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I justed wanted to quote that from the post I made on page one, almost 2 years ago...

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budweiser - Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:01 am

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iphone apps seems to be a more lucrative market...

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paterpeter - Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:02 am

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I only hope it doesn't take forever, as in Duke Nukem Forever. We know where that ended

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Squids - Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:36 am

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Remember I'm not making it. But I do believe it is going to be larger.

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Squids - Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:40 am

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It goes back longer than that. Sometimes products go through different changes over time and some take longer than others. A ton of other factors involved too, some of which you can (and already do) imagine. IK doesn't only do virtual instruments but this everyone knows is an important one and I look forward to its release as much as you guys... even though I'm often using ProTools in the studio and that's not even 64 bit yet so I'm fine using good o'l SampleTank 2.5 and I use it on practically everything. Works like a charm!

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zvenx - Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:56 am

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Quite frankly I am dying to see how this won't be a dollar short and a day late.

rsp

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budweiser - Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:06 am

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Any improvement of that kind will be more than welcome Spend the word to the ik gui team : "don't be shy, guys." I don't wanna have glasses that soon...

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vespers75 - Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:34 am

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Oh, I know it does. I was just being nice...

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