KVR :: Hardware (Instruments and Effects) » UAD Apollo - if they get the drivers right, this is the interface to end all [View Original Topic]
There are 60 posts in this topic.

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:32 am

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I really have no doubt the sound quality will be nothing short of stunning, and considering cost of entry is not much higher than UAD cards themselves, with low latency uad monitoring, two dedicated HP amps, high quality pre's etc.. if they get that CRUCIAL aspect right, drivers, i think this is going really to be the best interface in the world. No joke,


with a price to match of course LOL.

But if i sell my duet 2 and my motu ultralite and a few bits and pieces i may be able to get one. I am actually EXCITED about an interface, and that's never happened to me before.

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Nig - Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:42 am

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Don't think I've heard of this, any link with details about it?

If its you're considering selling your Duet for oneit must be a serious beast.

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biomechanoid - Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:43 am

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http://www.uaudio.com/apollo

it does look very interesting.

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:49 am

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Hi it just made KVR news.

I am sorry i posted this in the wrong forum instead of computer hardware, which i think was the correct one??

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Shy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:59 am

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I never look at that forum, so it's good that you made the mistake . It seems nice, but I'd take an RME UFX over it without hesitation. The sound quality is flawless, the stability, driver features that no one else has and mixer software are essential, and I've been very satisfied with their reliability for a very long time. Maybe the preamps are nicer, but I have much better external preamps so I'd never use the interface's preamps anyway. Ah and those UAD plugins, uninteresting to me. I think it would sell well, though.

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:13 am

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I am sorry but i think UA have somewhat of a bit more experience in pre amp department and i expect these to be far better than the rme ones. I believe this WILL have the quality of dedicated boxes.

Uad plugins i have never bought into, but they are certainly not crap, particularly the tape and latest verbs.

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:16 am

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Actually this IS probably the right forum, as they are indeed hardware effects technically.

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Shy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:18 am

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I don't believe that kind of preamps can be anything special. Maybe they're a little better than RME's Micstasy, but definitely not nearly as good as the dedicated boxes.

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bishop666 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:30 am

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a faster dongle

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:49 am

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You have been a bit negative lately Shy.. but! i do notice you do have praise for alot of products, and not always the expensive ones.

For example i can't get V room to sound good on absolutely *anything* yet it's in your list of top verbs.

YET, i 100% agree with you on the LX480 being amazing.

But uad plugins no good? i mean do you really think even the struder is useless? and i know you are negative on most saturation emus but surely this one is the best? Everything i can find info on suggest the realism is quite phenomenal.

People will be able to "track" to tape with this interface. Isn't that a bit special?

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VitaminD - Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:44 pm

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http://www.sweetwater.com/store/search.php?s=Apollo

2 grand for the DUO hmm

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bishop666 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:50 pm

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And you have to buy a thunderbold upgrade card additionaly!

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:03 pm

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You either need a Thunderbolt card (which I've not yet seen in the wild) or a Thunderbolt equipped Mac.

EDIT

Oh I see, they're selling the card separately too. Not bad, I guess. It's also FW800 still.

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Shy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:05 pm

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Can't you read that it's a "Thunderbolt-ready" FireWire interface?

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:07 pm

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Relax, jackass, I missed it, hence the edit. Why are you so rude?

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:09 pm

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Here, let me help you respond like a normal human being:



There you go, glad I could help.

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Shy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:09 pm

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Shut the f**k up, moron. I wasn't just talking to you, and your edit was late.

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:10 pm

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Witty. And your edit was late too.

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Shy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:11 pm

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Unlike you, I wasn't trying to be witty, "jackass".

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:12 pm

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No, you were just being a rude dick. I get it.

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:15 pm

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Anyway, getting back to the topic it does look pretty cool, but unless you really want their plugins, I don't really see the appeal over an RME either.

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analoguesamples909 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:15 pm

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Im not sure really - because its a plugin (not real tape) that you can use and mix with anyway - along with a bunch of other non UAD ones...and the processing is post A/D...

I think having a low latency mix environment with some useful features like reverb for vocalists whilst tracking is cool...but Im unconvinced about this tracking with plugins idea...

Its certainly potentially useful if you know you will end up using a specific chain when mixing...but not a game changer IMO.

It looks like a very nice interface tho - and the price is better than I thought. A lot will ride on its drivers. UA seem pretty good on this. Its possible that the Mic Pres and conversion could be best of class who knows.

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polaris20 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:19 pm

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It's kind of a shame they didn't make the UFX USB3.0, but then again 2.0 and Firewire probably still do well with the traffic, and I doubt that USB3.0 would have any significant effect on latency, or lack there of.

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AndrewSimon - Thu Jan 19, 2012 1:30 pm

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Looks awesome....
I will buy one as soon as the economy will boom again....

Hopefully I will still be alive by then.

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ZenPunkHippy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:21 pm

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Nice! Just a little disappointed KVR doesn't have a proper versus thread yet

Peace,
Andy.

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hibidy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 4:52 pm

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lolz

@soundcard: Honestly exciting news from namm for a change

I have no need for one but I'm excited to see how it pans out LOVE the idea of what they are selling........very worried about host compatibility though

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trimph1 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:07 pm

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That does have my attention as well. Although, like you, I am concerned about compatibility issues

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DiScO197 - Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:21 pm

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I'm in a position of change right now and just sold a load of stuff, but I have been looking at the Thunderbolt PCIe expansion options but this has changed my perception somewhat!

I was looking to buy the Satellite DUO, and use the Thunderbolt expansion to house my UAD Solo, Mmm.

I'm surprised they did not include TB as standard. They're pretty pricey and I can only imagine the optional TB card to be big money.

I've already got an RME FF800, what to do!

It does look nice though

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fromOhio - Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:52 pm

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$499 for the Thunderbolt card. Me likey!

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hibidy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:59 pm

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Edit, I get it now.

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v1o - Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:15 pm

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This is just another audio interface with on board DSP. There is nothing new here. And nothing that TC Electronic and RME haven't been doing for years. You can effects at the tracking stage on all RME gear.

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hibidy - Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:48 pm

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EDIT

3000 usd (with the thunderbolt card) is too rich for my blood. 1999 for the duo WITH the TB card would really be pushing it. Oh well, I'll just have to settle for my lowly i7 860 with a gazillion plugs (I already own)

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TheoM - Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:41 pm

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it's new because the dsp tuns about 10x more variety of fx than ANY other comparable product, besides of course tdm pro tools (or whatever it's called these days)

now that i have realised effects are after ad, not *quite* as exciting,

but...

it looks like a nice interface and i'll be following it nonetheless.

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siriusbliss - Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:55 am

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Looks like they're mimicking the Sonic core Xite (which has already been out almost 3 years).

Looks like they laid down a quad card, added Thunderbolt I/O and some A/D.

I'll know more when I get to NAMM in a few hours to check it out.

Greg

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orpheus_ - Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:15 am

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I just bought a Satellite Quad and have been really surprised at the quality of the plugins/emulations. Especially the Studer tape, Lexicon and EMT reverbs, and the Roland RE-201 tape echo.

I own several very good tape and reverb plugins but none of them have left me with my mouth open like this. I'm now considering selling my beloved Lexicon MPX-1 (similar to PCM80) and Roland DEP-5.

The extra bandwidth from the Thunderbolt would be nice, too... Running 24 ins + a UAD-2 Quad over firewire is pretty full on.

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penguinfromdeep - Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:21 am

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I wonder what the converter quality will be like ... I recently bought Duet2 from Apogee and it was a _really_ clear difference from my previous soundcard that was Presonus Firebox. I listened them side to side. Firebox was like there was a veil in the sound. No matter what some of the people here say, but some of the converters are really better than other ones (even between two modern soundcards, some people say that all the modern converters are awesome and good enough)

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sqigls - Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:28 am

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as a UAD user and someone who doesn't really go for the whole "MAC Vs PC" shenanigans... (as if a Mac isn't a personal computer anyway)... This whole MAC elitism thing is very offputting for me. They aren't going to release Windows drivers for the Satellite, and the Apollo won't be Windows compatiable for many months... I mean, RME can write awesome stable drivers that don't fcuck out on the Windows OS, so what's the go here? One fruit to rule them all!? They just release some broad and lame excuse not to work on Windows drivers. Oh, Firewire is too unstable on Windows... well, my Fireface 400 will tell you otherwise.

Fucck you Universal Audio


* Soapbox not included

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egbert - Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:28 am

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There's not just the converters of course. The analog stages that follow the DAC and drive your output cables/headphone outputs are important - plenty of room for the introduction of unpleasant artifacts - as are clock signals.

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TheoM - Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:04 am

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sonic core nor creamware ever bothered with mac osx. or maybe there was ONE release I can;t remember, for power pc.

At least UAD will fully support both platforms, with only a minor windows delay.


And i was a pulsar user for many years and was as much of a gear junkie as i am now, and had many of the still touted effects, and alot of them are simply not on UAD quality.

That said, the scope platform still interests me and always has, if there was a mac version.

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pheeleep - Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:51 am

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A few years ago (before 64-bit) I bought a really nice Audio Interface (Echo Mona) with some quality Mic pre's. When 64-bit PC's were released, Echo provided new 64-bit drivers for their older products, up until the Echo Mona. I lucked out. Anyone that had an older model than the Mona was out of luck as far as getting 64-bit drivers. This made me realize how closely I got to owning a great unit with great mic pre's that I may have had to start using as a door stopper, since I moved on from XP to Windows 7 64-bit...

It got me thinking, and since that day I have decided that I will not be buying any expensive Audio Interfaces again in the future. Rather, when I can afford it, I will buy an expensive microphone preamp (that doesn't use drivers, so I can keep using it for many many years to come). I will get a cheaper audio interface to use it with so that when the Audio Interface becomes obsolete, and no new drivers are provided for it, I can replace it with a new Audio Interface and continue to use my fancy microphone preamp along with it.

I'd be very wary spending a lot of money on an audio interface that may not have a driver that can operate it in the future. You find yourself stuck with great mic pre's you can't even use unless you stick with a system that supports the driver. Just something to think about..

What happens when a new operating system is released? Windows 256-bit? Will this unit run on that system? probably not. That's why it's better, in my opinion, to just buy a nice microphone pre amp that is not tied to drivers and then buy a modest Audio Interface to use the Pre-amp with...

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siriusbliss - Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:51 pm

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With the success Soniccore had with the Xite, and the open-Scope announcement, there could be a Mac version (or even a Linux version) in it's future - since it would just be up to some developer building for the DSP environment.

But anyways, the Apollo looks good, but from what I know of Thunderbolt - the PCIe card / firewire/Thunderbolt adapter card is too expensive - but it gains them entry - just like the new MOTU interface (also being touted as the 'first' to incorporate Thunderbolt).

I couldn't get ANY of the UAD guys to tell me which A/D convertors they are using.

I'm sorry, but the whole thing looked a bit hodge-podge. (And I like UAD's plugins).
Nevertheless, if it works as intended, then UA will have some success with it.

Greg

p.s. I'd love to see UA join the open-Scope development team. Now THAT would be an interface!

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CT - Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:35 pm

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Soniccore has been saying they'll release a mac version "soon" since 2007-08.
I think at some point in 2010 they removed the statement that the mac version is upcoming. Not sure if its up anymore on their website. I have been very interested in the xite-1 since the nord modular got discontinued.

The UAD Apollo indeed looks very nice. I am in the market for a new interface, but have decided to wait a few months to see how it all shapes up, with what I expect to be at least a few more thunderbolt interface releases in the coming months.

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kmonkey - Sun Jan 22, 2012 11:40 pm

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I wonder why everyone think it is awesome real time effect box? Sure it's 2ms and that is super fast (note that this is being possible on scope cards for about 10 years) but keep in mind that UAD still does not have any kind of chainer shell. Which mean more effects you add per channel, more delay you have (unlike Scope system which sport awesome chainer - you can stack up to 8 different effects with the SAME near zero delay).

So basically on apollo if you put one eq, one compressor after it, you won't be able to track at 2ms, you'll get 4ms. Then add another one etc.etc.
That's far from being real time. Add to that that some of UAD plugins does sport different latency times. Add to that that they are still not clear is that 2ms only on 96khz (i think it is) or on 44khz. If it is only at 96khz then this does mean that quad card is actually a duo card and duo card is actually a single uad card. Because when working at 96 khz quad card can not run so many plugins. Uad duo even less.


Note that i am not trying to piss on product or that i am Scope fanboy. It just seems weird to me that they promote product as something groundbreaking (surely with thunderbolt part) while similar and better systems regarding "realtime" DSP processing exist for years now.

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sqigls - Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:06 am

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I'm not sure about this "chainer shell" concept, but as far as I'm aware UAD plugs run at a standard 256 samples right across the board...?

I can't believe I've never heard of Scope... just checking it out now...

All this stuff was a bit more viable when computers were weak and plugins were average sounding. Now with all this circuit modelling, and 6 core beasts...

So, I'm in the process of finding native versions for my UAD plugs. It's a bit difficult with many of the plugs, but I'm a bit over this crap. Needing ANOTHER device just to run a bit of software. If I can find a native VOG, a convincing 88RS equiv, moog filter, the RE-201, EP-34 and the EMT 140...

...damn, UAD got me by the balls

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Mr Arkadin - Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:15 am

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Amazing isn't it - I've been at 3ms for the last 11 years, only having to go higher when VSTis crap out my CPU with clicks. Oh, and the 3ms is because of ASIO - without the DAW (Cubase) it's almost real-time.

Oh and sqigls, it's not just about DSP vs CPU these days, it's about quality, workflow, integration. If you have lots of hardware Scope is great for integrating that into a computer set-up.

The routing for me is one of the main things (as well as the sound and quality of the synths, effects, etc.). I'm a visual/old-fashioned kind of guy and if I want to plug a synth into a dirt box into a flanger into a Leslie then back into the synth I can do all that as if I had the boxes, with (virtual) cables from one to the next.

Or I can just build my own synths and effects with the Modular IV synth.

It's a studio in a box, so having a box and a computer really isn't much of a hardship for the quality and quantity of stuff you get.

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sqigls - Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:09 am

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That's the only reason I still use UAD. I just wish I could buy them native. My expresscard only runs so many plugs, and the satellite doesn't run on Windows OS... (or Linix for that matter)... plus my firewire port is fecked now, so I need to use an expresscard to get firewire for my soundcard, but that leaves me without many of my FX... BIG GODD DAYN BALLS.

Seriously, Mr Jonathan Little Sir, can you please VOG me in native, pweeese?

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billybk1 - Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:17 am

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FYI, you can "stack" up to 4 UAD-2 plug-ins on each insert/bus with sub-2ms latency (that is the total latency) via the Apollo mixer. Using the Apollo as your front end you can quickly monitor, audition and print audio in realtime, with no discernible delay. You do not need a "chainer shell" when using the Apollo as a realtime FX box. Audio is going straight into and then out of the Apollo to your DAW of choice, just like when using an external FX box.


Cheers,

Billy Buck

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TheoM - Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:34 pm

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i don't understand some of the hate here.

it is just an audio interface, which will probably have great converters and pres, and also doubles as a full uad card.

I think it's a good thing

thunderbolt addon cheekily priced though, that's for sure.

I mean, on music forums worldwide the uad is consistently praised for the QUALITY of it's effects, and now you can print or monitor with them in near realtime, and have a fully fledged interface on top.


To me that should be praise.

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hibidy - Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:48 pm

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You've been on kvr longer than me, you should understand that it's nothing out of the ordinary

If by knocking the price that means "hate" then guilty. 3000g (including the TB card) is a ton of cash and there is no guarantee it's going to be stable. Don't get me wrong, the idea is brilliant.

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ZenPunkHippy - Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:11 pm

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This is definitely the right move from UAD, since the DSP only cards have been providing less and less value as time marches on. What annoys me a bit is the I/O spec ... 18/14 with ADAT making up the bulk of the inputs is (IMO) a total cop-out.

Will be interesting to see how these converters (and drivers) compare to RME / Lynx / Apogee.

Peace,
Andy.

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hibidy - Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:14 pm

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I heard those converters us WH tech.

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ZenPunkHippy - Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:24 pm

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You've lost me ... what does "WH tech" mean? Which company is that ... ?

Peace,
Andy.

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hibidy - Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:25 pm

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I'll tell you what I am hatin' on......when I go to "kvr" to check updates and get gang-attacked by those ads

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skarnka - Mon May 07, 2012 11:12 pm

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There is a good review of the Apollo Duo here:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/external-audio-interface/universal-audio/apollo-duo/editorial/reviews/one-small-step-for-men.html

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mkdr - Mon May 07, 2012 11:49 pm

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Well there goes total recall...



Yes you have a set amount of latency the plugs run at. But that amount is per plugin. So in the case of 256 samples if you have 8 plugins the latency will be 8*256 = 2048.
Now if you'd have a chainer you could have them all run in the same "process" and have 8 plugs with a latency of 256 samples TOTAL. Does that make sense?

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hibidy - Tue May 08, 2012 11:50 am

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Uninterested. I'm not adding a bunch of latency after working so hard to be so low.

This is going to be another trainwreck. Things are going to be incompatible, and fiddly and buggy. The rent is too high.

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egbert - Tue May 08, 2012 9:04 pm

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Anyone care to comment on the above?

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hibidy - Tue May 08, 2012 9:23 pm

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yeah, sure........I will

"I got paid to do this so I'll look for anything I can to red herring you away from any possible discrepancies"

How'd I do?

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egbert - Tue May 08, 2012 9:27 pm

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Give that man a cigar!

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illiustrope - Sun Jun 17, 2012 4:41 am

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+1

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There are 60 posts in this topic.