KVR :: Homegrown Sounds » Vortex VSTi - Multi Timbral Groove Machine Beta [View Original Topic]
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Astralp - Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:02 pm
Vortex - See this page for all info/audio demos/Videos
Andy
gwill - Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:35 pm
Beta link above redirects to hg homepage -- please fix!
Greg Williams
Astralp - Thu Jan 26, 2012 3:59 pm
oops! Sorry about that Greg, fixed now.
shanecgriffo - Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:20 pm
will download and test, thanks ,
looks very interesting and should be great i imagine- if arp is anything to go by!
Astralp - Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:30 pm
If you like the Step sequencer side of arp then this takes that and runs a marathon
musikmachine - Thu Jan 26, 2012 8:26 pm
musikmachine - Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:18 pm
Bugs:
Timing issue in FL, the loop resets itself randomly. Seems to be a graphic redraw problem as well. Also whenever i edit the velocity there is a zippering noise.
Also in FL i tried using a midi out to change the pitch on CH16 sending midi on port 1 but it didn't work. Sequence seemed to get stuck and just kept looping.
When doubling a pattern the step data and velocity values aren't copied, just the notes. I can only draw individual steps in the velocity lane as well, not sure what the control is for drawing lanes.
In cantabile keeps crashing but i think it's due to JBridge as i've tried several different plugins. Win 7 64bit.
Apart from that, looking good.
Janusz Grzybek - Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:17 am
Hi,
I tried today download Vortex, but unfortunately, your website currently doesn't work. I'll try later.
...PIPA
?
Janusz
gwill - Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:19 am
Just bought -- with abundant confidence in Andy's bug-fixing and plug-improvement talents, based on his diligence and prodigious abilities in the past, especially with ARP! Vortex could be 2012's monster plug, I think!!
Feature request -- on/off switching for the (to be added) built-in synth, so the synth doesn't add to CPU use when it is not being used.
Thanks!
Greg Williams
Janusz Grzybek - Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:34 am
PIPA passed me
... and I visited site at last.
I bought Vortex on spec, but I trust Andy and believe it will be great plug-in
.
Janusz
VariKusBrainZ - Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:31 am
Hi. Just purchased but no download link is available. Is that correct?
Nielzie - Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:41 am
gwill wrote:
Just bought -- with abundant confidence in Andy's bug-fixing and plug-improvement talents, based on his diligence and prodigious abilities in the past, especially with ARP!
+1
VariKusBrainZ - Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:12 am
VariKusBrainZ wrote:
Hi. Just purchased but no download link is available. Is that correct?
Still in beta, duh!
ezelkow1 - Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:01 am
gwill wrote:
Just bought -- with abundant confidence in Andy's bug-fixing and plug-improvement talents, based on his diligence and prodigious abilities in the past, especially with ARP! Vortex could be 2012's monster plug, I think!!
+1
Tell ya the truth I already have a few similar plugins, but after hooking up the padkontrol and defining the cc's, managed to waste an hour alone just with one of the presets, switching between the sequences and using the pads for the effects. They definitely make it fun to use and could easily see some cool stuff coming out of it just by messing around for a little while with even a basic sequence. So yea, had to buy this morning
Astralp - Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:13 am
Thanks everyone, glad that you are liking so far, definitely play with the triggers they are a lot of fun!
MM Thanks for the bug report nobody finds them like you
I'll work on the bugs tomorrow, today I'm focused on getting the synth engine ready, I have a single working version so far. The idea is to keep it as simple as possible, I'm determined to keep Vortex easy to use throughout. It will be like a rompler with banks of presets, I'm working on some presets now and it's sounding good. I'm hoping to get the synth engine into the next beta, sometime today or tomorrow.
Greg, I will do my best to minimize CPU when it is not used
Ok, back to it...
ezelkow1 - Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:50 pm
Any thought of adding swing?
Astralp - Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:58 pm
I tried Swing initially but it didn't sound good, the problem is that because all sequences are different tempos it makes it very difficult to implement, I'm not really sure how to go about it.. You can't really swing different tempos at the same time. Once I have everything working and implemented, I'll do some more experiments perhaps just locking it to a single tempo is the key.
There will be a release out in a few hours, I have the basics of the synth engine in there now.
I'm currently struggling with the timing issues, it has me puzzled, it is now rock solid in FL, but now has some issues in Reaper, can't seem to get it working in both at the same time... very strange problem..
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:05 am
BETA 2 Download
The synth engine is now in there, still lots to sort out but it's working. There are a few presets so far, you choose via the program change section on the mixer LSB changes banks, the idea is that bank 0 will have Bass/Lead type presets, 1 - will have more padlike sounds, 2 - Blips and Sequencing type sounds, and 3 FX. There's about 30 in each of the 0 and 1 banks, and a few in the FX.
It works by choosing sounds via the mixer, and you'll notice a new yellow button at the top of the mixer strips, when this is lit that channel is playing the internal synth, unlit will play external midi. Note that the mixer strip or program change does not need top be switched on to control the internal synths, as long as the yellow button is lit the strip will work for the synth.
Haven't done much on the synth page as yet, there is mono/poly mode, retrigger and fine tune so far, sorry no labels yet!
As for the bugs:
Channel 16 is fixed, timing in FL is fixed I hope, still an issue in Reaper but only when starting playback. If there is a note at the very beginning timing will be out. Solution is to start playback a bit earlier, if it is a looped section it plays correctly next time round which has me baffled..
I haven't noticed any graphic corruption, but have experienced some zippering, I think there must be a problem with my main sequencer display code, I'll look into that tomorrow.
Cantabile seems fine here..
I did leave the dragging across lanes for editing the velocity out intentionally, I thought it was bit too easy to edit the wrong step value in Arp.
Let me know how it goes! Next big job is to code something for samples/drum samples, and get some FX in there.
Andy
musikmachine wrote:
Bugs:
Timing issue in FL, the loop resets itself randomly. Seems to be a graphic redraw problem as well. Also whenever i edit the velocity there is a zippering noise.
Also in FL i tried using a midi out to change the pitch on CH16 sending midi on port 1 but it didn't work. Sequence seemed to get stuck and just kept looping.
When doubling a pattern the step data and velocity values aren't copied, just the notes. I can only draw individual steps in the velocity lane as well, not sure what the control is for drawing lanes.
In cantabile keeps crashing but i think it's due to JBridge as i've tried several different plugins. Win 7 64bit.
Apart from that, looking good.
Timing issue in FL, the loop resets itself randomly. Seems to be a graphic redraw problem as well. Also whenever i edit the velocity there is a zippering noise.
Also in FL i tried using a midi out to change the pitch on CH16 sending midi on port 1 but it didn't work. Sequence seemed to get stuck and just kept looping.
When doubling a pattern the step data and velocity values aren't copied, just the notes. I can only draw individual steps in the velocity lane as well, not sure what the control is for drawing lanes.
In cantabile keeps crashing but i think it's due to JBridge as i've tried several different plugins. Win 7 64bit.
Apart from that, looking good.
Janusz Grzybek - Sun Jan 29, 2012 2:45 am
Hi Andy,
I found your manual for Vortex contains chapters with descriptions of setup in selected DAWs. Currently, I use PreSonus Studio One 2 as my main DAV. MIDI configuration in Studio One is a bit tricky, so if you want I can write short PDF/WinWord document with description of Vortex setup (with screenshots and setup for multitimbral MIDI outputs). Next, you could edit and add it to your manual. What do you think about this?
Janusz
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:19 am
Janusz
That would be fantastic
Have you noticed any bugs in Studio One?
Janusz Grzybek - Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:00 am
Hi Andy,
Astralp wrote:
That would be fantastic
OK, I'll write it after weekend.
Astralp wrote:
Have you noticed any bugs in Studio One?
No, Vortex works well with Studio One (at the moment)... If I had found bugs, you would find my bug reports here
. However. I haven't too much free time for more advanced tests. I'd like check behavior of internal synth, CC messages, etc. tomorrow.
Best janusz
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:26 am
Oh that's good news then!
I'm going to add a screen of assignable CC knobs at some point soon which can be used for external or internal same as the 2 in the mixer. Just about everything in synth is controllable by CC with numbers starting at 70, I'll come up with a list of them soon. Avoid CCs below 70 for the time being, as there are a few set up for testing purposes.
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:28 am
Off the top of my head, 74 cutoff, 71 Resonance (needs limiting at the top end though), 72 Release. Note that they only respond to messages from the plugin itself via the knobs and CC sequencers, not incoming CC messages, as that would be chaos!
Janusz Grzybek - Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:44 am
Astralp wrote:
Off the top of my head, 74 cutoff, 71 Resonance (needs limiting at the top end though), 72 Release. Note that they only respond to messages from the plugin itself via the knobs and CC sequencers, not incoming CC messages, as that would be chaos!
Yes, this is logical. Internal "routing" for those CC is sufficient - after all, Vortex is not Zebra2 or Alchemy
... this is multitimbral step sequencer, and synth engine is implemented rather for sequence tests.
Astralp wrote:
I'm going to add a screen of assignable CC knobs at some point soon which can be used for external or internal same as the 2 in the mixer.
Good idea! So, I wait impatiently on next beta.
Janusz
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:55 am
It might take a bit of getting used to as the ccs will affect all presets on that channel, so when the preset is changed, all ccs will be re-transmitted, same way as with external gear, I'll have a an on/off for each strip so that it can be disabled easily. I'm also planning to have a single version of the synth designed for creating your own banks of sounds (although this might be after v1.0 is released) and eventually sample based sounds too. I will be developing the drum based sample side of it before v1 though, I think that is essential.
Janusz Grzybek - Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:10 pm
Astralp wrote:
I'm also planning to have a single version of the synth designed for creating your own banks of sounds (although this might be after v1.0 is released) and eventually sample based sounds too. I will be developing the drum based sample side of it before v1 though, I think that is essential.
Firstly, this synth was discussed in ARP 1.7 topic as basic synth engine similar to solution implemented in Sugar Bytes Thesys. But I see this idea grow up and now it transformed to real and serious synthesizer .
Janusz
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:17 pm
Haha, oh yes, I do have a tendency to explore the full potential of things, the Ammonite engine is a complex synthesizer and so ALL the temptations are there
Main thing is to keep things simple from the front end, so it's easy to use but the potential for presets is vast because of the concept of using MSB/LSB banks. The more I think about it the more I like it. I also want to have a go at getting the Terranova FX engine in there if it doesn't add too much CPU and do a similar thing with presets rather than full on GUI.
I'm just reworking the display, turns out that the glitches are caused by too much GUI activity and so it needs reducing drastically. I'd planned to overhaul this at some point anyway but I'd rather be doing it later than right now
ezelkow1 - Sun Jan 29, 2012 12:30 pm
Oh one more request, like the swing not sure how do-able it is but figured Id throw it out there, midi import
abstractcats - Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:36 pm
Geez! I missed this one! The controls look really fantastic, as does the gui over all. I give it a run this week. Thanks for public beta
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:39 pm
Hi Scott,
Well I've refrained from sending a mail out yet until the main bugs are squashed, so it's a bit low key at the moment
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:40 pm
ezelkow,
I'll add it to the list right next to midi export
abstractcats - Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:57 pm
Astralp wrote:
Hi Scott,
Well I've refrained from sending a mail out yet until the main bugs are squashed, so it's a bit low key at the moment
Well I've refrained from sending a mail out yet until the main bugs are squashed, so it's a bit low key at the moment
Sounds great. I just spent about 10 minutes letting Vortex have its way with Zebra, running through the presets in Vortex..
Nice work Andy! This will go on my "must buy" list for 2012 Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:59 pm
Great
It's a beast! yomanfree - Sun Jan 29, 2012 2:44 pm
Hello
I've just tried (and bought) Vortex a couple of hours this afternoon and I've been impressed. I've for sure not seen yet all the possibilities, and probably miss some things, but perheaps 2 or 3 simple improvements could be helpfull.
First I agree a midi export/import (or at least export) could be really nice. Is it possible too to:
- be able to export a config file, saving the configuration of Vortex, in order to be able to load it later?
- be able to add a word in front of each line of the sequencer in order to know, when we add a note, what kind of note it is ? (for exemple, I would like to add : Tom 1, snare etc.....).
Thanks for this excellent tool ....
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 2:54 pm
yomanfree wrote:
Hello
- be able to export a config file, saving the configuration of Vortex, in order to be able to load it later?
- be able to add a word in front of each line of the sequencer in order to know, when we add a note, what kind of note it is ? (for exemple, I would like to add : Tom 1, snare etc.....).
- be able to export a config file, saving the configuration of Vortex, in order to be able to load it later?
- be able to add a word in front of each line of the sequencer in order to know, when we add a note, what kind of note it is ? (for exemple, I would like to add : Tom 1, snare etc.....).
All settings are saved as a VST Preset so you can just save the *fxp if you need to and reload it later. All settings are saved in your project and restored when you reload it
The second one is tricky because Vortex can't know what it is you are targeting, plus all midi devices layout drums differently, so it can't be assumed that it is GM. I'll have a think about it, perhaps the best bet would be some form of user definable colour coding?
In regard to midi export don't forget you can record the midi output to a track seeing as it's midi
Glad you like it so far!
yomanfree - Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:56 pm
Ah yes that's an idea for the midi.
For the text in front of lines, just let the user to add it by himself and ... allow him to save the config
? Then just doing the work 1 time, the user will be able to load the accurate config file depending on the configuration (and instrument used)?
Astralp wrote:
yomanfree wrote:
Hello
- be able to export a config file, saving the configuration of Vortex, in order to be able to load it later?
- be able to add a word in front of each line of the sequencer in order to know, when we add a note, what kind of note it is ? (for exemple, I would like to add : Tom 1, snare etc.....).
- be able to export a config file, saving the configuration of Vortex, in order to be able to load it later?
- be able to add a word in front of each line of the sequencer in order to know, when we add a note, what kind of note it is ? (for exemple, I would like to add : Tom 1, snare etc.....).
All settings are saved as a VST Preset so you can just save the *fxp if you need to and reload it later. All settings are saved in your project and restored when you reload it
The second one is tricky because Vortex can't know what it is you are targeting, plus all midi devices layout drums differently, so it can't be assumed that it is GM. I'll have a think about it, perhaps the best bet would be some form of user definable colour coding?
In regard to midi export don't forget you can record the midi output to a track seeing as it's midi
Glad you like it so far!
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:59 pm
Ok, it's on my list, but be warned it's a long one..
yomanfree - Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:17 pm
No problem that's really nice to have
Just seeing another point (after that I promise, I will go to bed, night in France): I m not able to have in the same grid 2 notes at the same time (same column). I've missed something ?
Thanks
Astralp wrote:
Ok, it's on my list, but be warned it's a long one..
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:19 pm
Polyphonic Sequencing is coming in a later version, at the moment they are 12 x mono step sequencers.
yomanfree - Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:41 pm
Thanks for your fast answers. This point is really important from my opinion, more than any other. Using several mono step seq is by far more painfull than just one polyphonic.
To be honest, on my side, as long as I will not have this feature, I'm afraid I will not use it too much
(despite of the fact of your VST is quite well built).
Astralp wrote:
Polyphonic Sequencing is coming in a later version, at the moment they are 12 x mono step sequencers.
Astralp - Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:46 pm
It will happen once v1.0 is stabilized, right now I have to concentrate on getting it all robust, there is much work still to do especially on the sound side of things.
musikmachine - Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:54 am
Firstly, let me say awesome plugin! A great way to control multitimbral plugins.
However there are glitches present, either with me or the plugin; not sure which.
Still getting weird timing in FL but i like the randomness of it. Can have as a feature?
I'm trying to create a template with the Maschine controller but it's not triggering the triggers in Vortex. Also i'm setting the pads to channel 16 but they are changing the pattern and not repitching.
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:05 am
Glad you like it
Can you explain what's going on with the timing a bit more, it's rock solid for me in FL..
Not sure why the triggers wouldn't work either, just verified they are working here. High value must be greater than 63, and channel 16 can't be used for triggers as it's reserved for re-pitching. Re-pitching is working here so I'm a bit confused about that too.. Does your controller send out Note Off messages or Note On messages with zero velocity, I may not have accounted for that. Can't think of any other reason.
I was working on the graphics all day yesterday, just a bit more to do and I'll release a new version
Nielzie - Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:22 am
I agree that midi export would be really helpful (and appreciated!) as a feature. It would make it so much easier to use, then setting up everything manually for recording midi to a track through a host.
And besides, it would be a feature that could find its way into ARP (must have!) and perhaps even Black Magic too
musikmachine - Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:20 am
Pads are set to channel 16 but the buttons are set to 1. I think it's the maschine controller cause it's doing it with Arp as well, not sure why cause the pads set to 16 and Arp and Vortex are set to receive on channel 1. I still can't trigger the triggers but i'll try with my midi controller. I think i need another host for midi, always having these issues with FL but the port config can get a bit confusing sometimes.
Working better in Cantabile but there does seem to be a bug with the sequencer. I tried the trigger button i had assigned which caused the sequence playing to play like it was latched an octave higher, the sequence became stuck and panic didn't stop the sequence so i disabled the audio engine but it continued to play. I tried changing various settings in Vortex but they became ineffective, changing the tempo caused the tempo to speed up and it's currently playing about 300bpm. Gabba!
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:18 am
I can do a version with a midi debugger to see what is coming into Vortex midiwise. Yep I don't like the port idea in FL, it seems a bit convoluted, I'm sure there must be a reason why..
There is a bug, where a sequence gets stuck playing, I've experienced but not very often, I could blanket fix it but really I want to know the situation which leads to it so I can address it properly. So far I haven't been able to recreate it and it hasn't happened for a while. I have a feeling it is to do with the multi sequencer. If you can find any clues let me know
right back to graphics..
jensa - Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:34 am
Another no-brainer from Andy. Bought it without even testing it.
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:36 am
Thanks Jens
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:31 pm
Here is the next beta, just graphic changes in this one on the main sequencer display, it's much more efficient now, prettier and eventually skinnable
Beta 3
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:45 pm
Sorry, forgot to put the sequence lights back and add the debug code, please re-download if you just downloaded it...
MM - This version writes a log file to C:/debug.txt of all incoming midi data, if you can try the triggers and channel 16 and the send me the file I should be able to see what's going down.
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:09 pm
Oh, also forgot to say the new version isn't compatible with old projects, I had to significantly change the way velocity is stored and so it will be unpredictable in saved projects, hopefully from now on it will be backward compatible with previous versions. Sorry about that, but it had to be done.
musikmachine - Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:11 pm
Nice UI but the version i've just downloaded doesn't work in FL and when i try to rescan in Cantabile it crashes. I'm running Ableton in demo mode and it's working well but i still can't get the pitch to work, it just triggers another sequence, even when i set the midi in to channel 16. I assigned a button on my Roland A-300 pro to reverse and that changed the sequence, also tried clip automation to no effect. Also seems to be random but sometimes the sequencer lights don't work.
Uploaded the debug file anyway http://www.box.com/s/a9sbqsxby59fxchftnsz
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:25 pm
Really? I need to think for a bit, I'm wondering if it's 64 bit related issues..
I'll check out your log file, thanks
You mean the sequence lights at the bottom of sequencer, do the others at the top and on the mixer work ok? I might have to move the ones at the bottom anyhow as they cause the entire sequencer section to force a redraw, but I'm not sure where to put them yet, that is where they need to be, it's either that or move the step slider to it's own module.
Oh, I have to ask, did you delete the old version completely (I'm sure you did
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:46 pm
No GUI Test for TJ
Can you try this one, I've removed the GUI code to see if that is the cause of the crash in cantabile and not working in FL. Ta!
Looking at the log, there are no messages on channel 16, I'll set up a debug at the actual input. For the triggers it should be a momentary button type: OFF state zero, ON state 127. I can see a stream in the log incrementing as though it's a knob, but I guess that is when you tried with automation?
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:56 pm
Hmmm, well in FL regardless of what channel you sent on in is always channel 1, plus no CCs are received by the plugin, am I missing something? I only use FL for brief testing and so don't know how to use it beyond the very basics. Do you have to manually link controllers via the Fruity Wrapper? Seems convoluted if that's the case.. On top of that FL itself uses the CCs to control playback etc, so how is it possible to use them for a plugin? I give up with it, I even bult a plugin with just midi logging info and it always converts the incoming channel to 1... sigh...
It works as expected in Reaper and Cantabile.
Janusz Grzybek - Mon Jan 30, 2012 3:57 pm
Astralp wrote:
Janusz
That would be fantastic
Have you noticed any bugs in Studio One?
That would be fantastic
Have you noticed any bugs in Studio One?
Hi Andy,
Unfortunately, my two sons (1 & 5 year old) catch a flu, so currently I haven't time for more advanced tests. However, I wrote short document with screenshots about using Vortex in Studio One. I'd like send it to you, but I need your email address, because I can't upload to you attachments via contact form on your site. Could write me PM with your email address?
Best,
Janusz
Janusz Grzybek - Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:29 pm
Thanks Andy,
I sent it.
Janusz
musikmachine - Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:16 pm
Astralp wrote:
I can do a version with a midi debugger to see what is coming into Vortex midiwise. Yep I don't like the port idea in FL, it seems a bit convoluted, I'm sure there must be a reason why..
There is a bug, where a sequence gets stuck playing, I've experienced but not very often, I could blanket fix it but really I want to know the situation which leads to it so I can address it properly. So far I haven't been able to recreate it and it hasn't happened for a while. I have a feeling it is to do with the multi sequencer. If you can find any clues let me know
right back to graphics..
There is a bug, where a sequence gets stuck playing, I've experienced but not very often, I could blanket fix it but really I want to know the situation which leads to it so I can address it properly. So far I haven't been able to recreate it and it hasn't happened for a while. I have a feeling it is to do with the multi sequencer. If you can find any clues let me know
right back to graphics..
Initially i just overwrote beta 2 but then i removed it completely. Yeah the sequence lights. The sequence still plays but occasionally there are no lights. Btw should Vortex indicate when the triggers are being triggered?
I've had the stuck note and speed up bug in FL and Cantabile. I forgot to say i'm testing it on win 7 32 bit. It's an amd system though fwiw but i'm testing it on my laptop see if i'm having the same problems, seems better so far.
Iirc FL receives on all channels unless you select all the tracks and then it sends on 1-16 respectively.
It receives the pitch changes from the midi out plugin but external controllers just trigger the sequences. The timing seems to be caused by align tick length, disabled that and it's playing perfectly in sync now.
Yeah the increment is probably the clip automation i tried. With maschine i assigned a button and set it to trigger which is momentary, minimum velocity 0, maximum 127 on channel 1.
One FR, i know it was shown in the Nexus clip someone posted but a way to lengthen the step beyond one 16th would be great, or is that what the triggers effectively do? I suppose the timing would be different but sometimes i find the gate to be too short although i could assign a CC track to the synths sustain or release. Cheers.
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:33 pm
Thanks Janusz, might be a little while before I get around to adding it, it'll be on the next big manual update when all the new features are complete.
I can't think of any reason why an AMD chip would cause problems, there is SSE used in the synth engine but AMD chips can handle that.
Did you try the no GUI version above to see if it solved the scanning issue in Cantabile? That one has me worried, it could be an issue with the graphics stuff I've just added, so before I doing any more in other areas it would be good to know it isn't causing issues.
To lengthen the step choose the tie extend modes, using that you can increase the length by adding another tie step as long as the original note is tied and it doesn't hit another note first
Keep in mind if you can notice a sequence of events that leads to the stuck sequence, that would be greatly helpful
Good news on the align tick length solution, I just checked in my version and it's disabled so that explains that one, I wonder if it is disabled or enabled by default..
I'm just adding the FX engine and coding something for the routing, I figured I would try 4 selectable output pairs, and number one goes through the FX. That way it gives 3 possible busses for processing externally.
ezelkow1 - Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:27 pm
With beta3 is the synth portion supposed to work? I only briefly got to try 2 and I couldnt get it working in there, so tonight I figured id take a closer look. So I just enabled the yellow button next to each number, but not getting any audio out at all. Tried messing the lsb/msb and still nothing
Just wondering if I was missing something
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:30 pm
Yes it's working, probably the Master Volume at the top is switched to zero as I didn't go through the presets and update them all yet, try the preset called synth Test1
ezelkow1 - Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:32 pm
Astralp wrote:
Yes it's working, probably the Master Volume at the top is switched to zero as I didn't go through the presets and update them all yet, try the preset called synth Test1
Yup that did it
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:33 pm
smashing
MarkSA - Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:10 pm
Being playing around with the beta. Worth seeing what the finished version can do.
Now polyphonic instrumentation implemented, now that would be something.
Nice job on Arp 1.7 too.
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:15 pm
Thanks
In terms of polyphony I'm thinking of having more mono sequences that can play simultaneously instead of true polyphony, that way they could also be used to chain together to make longer sequences as well. I think this will be a better option an more versatile
Arp will get some more treatment once I have this one released, at the very least the triggers need to go in there!
Astralp - Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:18 pm
Don't think I explained that well, it will be polyphonic but with the ability to have longer sequences by chaining them instead.
Janusz Grzybek - Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:15 am
Astralp wrote:
Here is the next beta, just graphic changes in this one on the main sequencer display, it's much more efficient now, prettier and eventually skinnable
Indeed UI in beta 3 is much better.
Janusz
alexfalcao - Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:47 am
Hey Andy, Just found out about it now, definitely I will test drive later. It looks
Astralp - Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:50 am
Hi Alex, haven't announced it properly yet, still *lots* of work to do but it's getting there, almost have the FX engine completed now
musikmachine - Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:13 am
Astralp wrote:
Thanks Janusz, might be a little while before I get around to adding it, it'll be on the next big manual update when all the new features are complete.
I can't think of any reason why an AMD chip would cause problems, there is SSE used in the synth engine but AMD chips can handle that.
Did you try the no GUI version above to see if it solved the scanning issue in Cantabile? That one has me worried, it could be an issue with the graphics stuff I've just added, so before I doing any more in other areas it would be good to know it isn't causing issues.
To lengthen the step choose the tie extend modes, using that you can increase the length by adding another tie step as long as the original note is tied and it doesn't hit another note first
Keep in mind if you can notice a sequence of events that leads to the stuck sequence, that would be greatly helpful
Good news on the align tick length solution, I just checked in my version and it's disabled so that explains that one, I wonder if it is disabled or enabled by default..
I'm just adding the FX engine and coding something for the routing, I figured I would try 4 selectable output pairs, and number one goes through the FX. That way it gives 3 possible busses for processing externally.
I can't think of any reason why an AMD chip would cause problems, there is SSE used in the synth engine but AMD chips can handle that.
Did you try the no GUI version above to see if it solved the scanning issue in Cantabile? That one has me worried, it could be an issue with the graphics stuff I've just added, so before I doing any more in other areas it would be good to know it isn't causing issues.
To lengthen the step choose the tie extend modes, using that you can increase the length by adding another tie step as long as the original note is tied and it doesn't hit another note first
Keep in mind if you can notice a sequence of events that leads to the stuck sequence, that would be greatly helpful
Good news on the align tick length solution, I just checked in my version and it's disabled so that explains that one, I wonder if it is disabled or enabled by default..
I'm just adding the FX engine and coding something for the routing, I figured I would try 4 selectable output pairs, and number one goes through the FX. That way it gives 3 possible busses for processing externally.
I'll check it today, Cantabile can be buggy sometimes, or more prone to crash than other hosts. It's working fine on my laptop though that's why i thought maybe an amd issue.
I was using the tie mode but the none tied notes had a really short gate, guess i should rtfm before posting.
I'll see if i can recreate the stuck note, the second time was cause by me triggering the trigger i'd mapped which latched the sequence as mentioned before and i couldn't stop it, changing the various parameters in Vortex had bno effect but changing the tempo diviion caused it to speed up.
I'll test the non gui version and post back in a bit.
musikmachine - Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:27 am
Astralp wrote:
No GUI Test for TJ
Can you try this one, I've removed the GUI code to see if that is the cause of the crash in cantabile and not working in FL. Ta!
Looking at the log, there are no messages on channel 16, I'll set up a debug at the actual input. For the triggers it should be a momentary button type: OFF state zero, ON state 127. I can see a stream in the log incrementing as though it's a knob, but I guess that is when you tried with automation?
Can you try this one, I've removed the GUI code to see if that is the cause of the crash in cantabile and not working in FL. Ta!
Looking at the log, there are no messages on channel 16, I'll set up a debug at the actual input. For the triggers it should be a momentary button type: OFF state zero, ON state 127. I can see a stream in the log incrementing as though it's a knob, but I guess that is when you tried with automation?
I think all the messing around with midi ports in FL caused the ports to get messed up. It's working fine in Cantabile today. repitch is working as expected and the triggers are working!
Some of the trigger behaviour is weird though, triggering forward caused the sequence to gate and the sequencer lights stopped working again. Audio continued to play gated on various sequences and i recreated the stuck sequencer bug by hitting a pad on the maschine controller. Tried enabling and disabling the various controls and chanlle 16 hold caused the octave latch again.
Reloaded Vortex and was working well initially until i triggered the quantize tempo knob, caused the sequence the play an octave higher and remain stuck. Clicked on the keyboard to try and disable it and Cantabile crashed.
MarkSA - Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:33 pm
I've been playing around in cantabile too. Vortex has crashed it a number of times. Though cantabile is useful, badly needs work. Mainly for bank loading.
I haven't been able to get my head around what the synth section does or what the buttons do.
I may have an issue with deleting notes. It is either to slow or doesn't work sometimes. May be Cantabile? I will try this in a different host.
I have used Vortex with Z3TA+
Astralp - Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:42 pm
BETA 4 - Now includes TerraNova FX engine
OH, well good and bad! I'll have a go at fathoming out the stuck note phenomenon tomorrow although it hasn't happened to me for a while, I know for sure that switching on multi mode whilst notes are held (or vice versa) will cause problems because I haven't implemented a retrigger for it yet, may get around to that tomorrow. What was the pad on maschine doing, a trigger?
The FX are in now and seem to be working well, I'm amazed how good the CPU performance is considering there is 12 Ammonites in there, my system is handling it easily and it's an old core2.
I've also found some graphic bugs which were causing unnecessary redraws, so hopefully that is the end to all glitching issues, seems good here.
I've altered the GUI again, but it's still a work in progress, but I think it's going in the right direction, looking cleaner anyway.
The synth section now has a GUI and TerraNova has a first attempt.
The Routing is in place now, so from the synth section, you can select FX which is the main out, or choose from another 3 stereo outputs for post processing in the DAW. These are Raw Channels and bypass everything including the Master Volume. Let me know if there are any issues with it
Tomorrow i will do some more presets for the synths too.
Astralp - Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:49 pm
Mark,
I think the crash was caused by the undo system, I've disabled that part of it for the moment until I get a chance to go through it, the crash happened when double clicking on the sequence.
Beta 4 now has a GUI for the synth section, there is only Polyphonic/Mono, Fine Tune and Retrigger (for Mono Mode). The synth is pretending to be an external multi-timbral box, so you choose sounds like you would for any other midi device using the program change section in the mixer, MSB 0 and use LSB to select the various banks 0 = bass/leads, 1 = pads, 3 = blips, and 4 = FX. There aren't many presets yet, about 100 I think so you need to stick to the low numbers to get the available sounds. I'll try and get a bank completed tomorrow
Astralp - Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:51 pm
Oh and you can use CCs 74/71 for cutoff/Resonance, 72 is release time. I'll try and remember to list all the CCs tomorrow. You can use them via the CC Sequencers or via the assignable knobs on the mixer.
musikmachine - Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:13 pm
I forgot to add that the crash occured in a saved project in cantabile, repeatable with the non gui version. When i opened the gui it was just a black screen with the plugin shell so i tried rescanning to load the new version of Vortex and that's when the crash occured. The maschine pad was assigned to repitch but so is my keyboard.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:16 am
Oh sorry I did mention it, but I destroyed backward compatibility with beta 3, I had to change the way velocity was stored, should be alright from now on with saved patches
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:08 am
BETA 5
* Double & Quad fixed
* In Velocity & CC slider views, you can drag across to edit all values
* Switching between Multi-Sequence and normal mode no longer creates hanging sequences.
TJ - Hopefully this has fixed the hanging sequence issue
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:29 am
Fast work, haven't gotten to testing beta 4 yet!
I was wondering about the changes in Vortex, it seems to evolving into a full blown instrument.
Will the extra stuff affect stability and add much overall to the cpu load? Will there be an option to disable the synths etc or a midi only version? I only really want something to sequence mulitimbral synths but i'm not complaining, just curious about the direction Vortex is going. Cheers.
Nielzie - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:36 am
Astralp wrote:
Odd.. that link takes me to http://hgsounds.com/ but it should download the file. Even after clearing my browser cash
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:54 am
^Same here.
Janusz Grzybek - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:55 am
Nielzie wrote:
Astralp wrote:
Odd.. that link takes me to http://hgsounds.com/ but it should download the file. Even after clearing my browser cash
Confirmed. But when I replaced filename in link from Vortex-Beta6.zip to Vortex-Beta5.zip I can download beta 5. Maybe Andy haven't upload beta 6 file yet, or simple confused 5 with 6, because 5 didn't release here.
Janusz
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 7:59 am
Here's the CC assignments for the synths so far:
Note that these are only relevant from inside the plugin, they will not work from your external controller. You can use them via the internal CC Sequencers or assignable knobs.
70 - Filter Type
71 - Resonance
72 - Vol/Env/Pitch Release
73 - Vol Attack
74 - Vol Cutoff
75 - Vol Decay
76 - Sustain
77 - Filter Attack
78 - Filter Decay
79 - Filter Sustain
80 - Pitch Decay
81 - Noise Level
82 - Osc Mix - Multi Function depending on Synth Mode
83 - Osc Level - Multi Function depending on Synth Mode
84 - LFO Amount
85 - LFO Destination (0-Filter, 1-Pitch, 2 - Vol)
86 - Pitch ENV Level
87 - LFO Waveshape
88 - Analog Mode Enable
89 - Analog Mode
90 - LFO Tempo
91 - LFO Wave Shape
92 - LFO Enable
93 - Filter Envelope Level
94 - LFO Attack
95 - LFO Decay
96 - LFO Sustain
97 - Octave Enable - makes OSC 2 1 Octave Higher
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 8:08 am
Strange! Not sure why the link isn't working, I did get confused about 6 it is of course beta 5... doh.. Anyway I'm on it now.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 8:16 am
Right here we go again:
BETA 5
For some bizarre reason the directory has become inaccessible on the server, I've made a new one..
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 8:30 am
There is now an index page for the betas which will make life easier:
BETAS
Regarding CPU Usage, unless a synth is being used it will use no CPU, same for the FX, if there is no internal audio no CPU is used by TerraNova, or if it is switched off.
The good thing is that I've built it so that you can use mostly midi and just use a couple of internal synths if you want, only the synths being used consume CPU.
There is nothing more to add which will add any new CPU usage, all changes are now to the existing architecture on the internal audio front such as Sample support and presets
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 8:37 am
Performance-wise, I don't think the load time has increased significantly mainly because it is presets that add time, if it had 12 full blown Ammonites with controls for them all, the Amount of preset storage would be huge and add some serious load time, especially as VSTs load all presets into memory as well, and so if there are 128 presets each one with x parameters it can become a lot of parameters... I've started sticking with fewer presets in other products for this reason, load time can be reduced significantly by having 64 internal presets over 128.
Anyhow, the synth section uses no parameter storage at all, it shares the program/MSB/LSB change of the external midi, as both will never be required at the same time
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:49 am
Ok i thought you were adding samples for the drums and such. I can test it in maschine anyway with the synth which i just did and it crashed but it seems to be stable in a fresh project.
Bugs:
Can't drag the velocity sliders on sequence C, they jump up and down when i click on them so reloaded Vortex but this time clicking on the velocity slider caused a major crash in Maschine.
Loaded a fresh instance in cantabile, loaded the Synth Test1 preset, latched a sequence via the cantabile keyboard and as soon as i hit a pad on the maschine controller it caused a stuck note. Hit a few more pads which triggered more sequences, it's like multisequence is enabled but when i enable it all the sequences stop playing.
The lights on the sequences that were playing are stuck lit and remain stuck even when i change preset.
So is it only possible to control four ccs at any one time? Will there be a basic synth gui? It's possible to coax some interesting sounds out of the synth but it's truly a case of using one's ears.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:05 am
Ok, thanks for that, yes best to use fresh projects for testing for the time being.
sounds like some sequences are not being released, I'll have a look, lights will be related to that.
There will be drum instruments, but they'll only load if you use them, they will just be presets in the synth engine. Same with any sample based sounds.
There will be another page of programmable CC knobs as a sub page of the mixer.
I can't reproduce the Velocity Slider issue? Was it a fresh project when the crash occurred? Sounds like the old velocity settings might have been triggered, you need to in a fresh project if so
You should be able to use saved projects from now on (beta 5), but right now I'm only really interested in fresh project problems which keeps it simple. Once v1 is released backward compatibility will be the top priority.
As for editing sounds there will be a separate single synth for creating custom presets/banks. You should think of the synth inside Vortex as a rompler, I don't want to add the complexity of editing sounds beyond CCs for the reasons I mentioned above, the good thing with CCs is that they can also be used for external gear, which keeps equal weight between it being a Midi Sequencer and an internal one. In my mind whilst I'm developing, the synth engine is an external device.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:30 pm
Beta 6 is up, hopefully fixing some the pad triggering issue, and also channel 16 messages being ignored, it was actually the sequence of midi events that caused the problem when I'm determining what to do with the message, I hope this makes things much more stable
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:37 pm
Yeah rompler is the word i was trying to think of.
Yeah it was a fresh project each time, i usually start with an empty project and save when any bugs occur in a bid to be organized.
Just got an Access Violation message in FL whilst changing the preset via the FL wrapper button, dudn't crash but everything froze up and i had to force quit.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:41 pm
waqs it one of the copied default patches, maybe I didn't re-initialize them, although I thought I had. The change in velocity storage was a big change so any remnants from the old method can cause problems, I'll check it out now.
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:44 pm
It was with beta 5, i'll try the latest an post back.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:45 pm
Hang on, 2 mins, I've just seen some remnants to fix, the default and randoms can cause a crash, new version coming shortly
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:56 pm
Ok, just got a crash in FL when i tried to load an instance.
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 1:02 pm
Ok Beta 7 is up!
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:09 pm
Just tested in Cantabile on my laptop and seems more stable but the keyboard notes on Vortex appear to remain latched once i've triggered a sequence from the laptop keyboard which is what was happening before only now the sequence doesn't continue playing.
I tried it with Cypher but the sequence eventually became stuck again while editing the velocities and CC sequencers which also started to behave erratically, not sending the relevant value in the sequencer lane.
Also in FL i routed an instance into Diva demo which triggered the first few notes and then started playing a very short stuck note repeatedly for a few seconds removed the instance of Diva nd reloaded it but the same thing occured. The Vortex sequencer is jumping around randomly while nothing is playing but when i press play back it resets and the same thing happens again with Diva, plays the sequence then plays a short gated tick and then silence. Tried several different presets and changing sequence, same thing.
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:57 pm
Loaded an instance in Maschine on my desktop and loaded the synth preset, triggered sequence C but as soon as click on the plugin edit button Maschine freezes and locks up. Has done it twice now.
musikmachine - Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:12 pm
Something else i've found is when doubling the sequence the velocity steps aren't duplcated and the second part of sequence plays differently. Also sometimes when i d input a 2 bar long note the vortex sequencer ignores the sequence gate of 16 steps and plays for 32 steps. Think i had a similar issue with Arp.
Also, all the pan knobs appear to be inverted; pan left and the sound is coming out the right speaker. Now i've started to play with the synth and fx bit i'm starting to dig it.
But will the mouse be the only way to input sequences into Vortex?
Astralp - Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:51 pm
I'm having trouble duplicating any of these issues, double works with velocity, I fixed that yesterday. By 2 bar long do you mean 2 steps? I've tried it at 2 steps and 32 steps and it seems to work correctly.
Pan is fixed in the next version
Glad you like, it's becoming quite a music making machine, especially once the drums are sorted and the presets are done!
The trouble with entering notes via cc like in ARP is that until I figure out how I'm going to do the polyphonic sequencing, it's tricky. If I opted for polyphonic notes on the main display, how could you control more than one? But, I am more leaning towards the idea of having multiple sequences attached to each note, so polyphony is possible but also lots of other options like chaining sequences or splitting sequences between octaves etc... In the latter case I could use CCs as a controller for what is currently being edited. I'm also worried about assigning CCs yet as there are so many things they could be useful for, and there aren't that many, I've already used up most NRPNs for the mixer. For instance control over the coming CC knobs might be more useful, what do you think?