KVR :: Instruments » Jupiter 8 V 2.5 [View Original Topic]
There are 114 posts in this topic. Page: 1 2

---

risome - Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:40 pm

---

With some recent royalties and a special offer i just picked up the Jupiter 8v and i just want to say what a phat awesome synth this is .used a hardware version years ago and had forgotten just how good these babies sound.Warm lush deep and from now on a sonic staple in my production diet .thanks Arturia

---

afreshcupofjoe - Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:18 pm

---

Personally, I think the Jupiter modeled modules in DIVA shit all over J8V. The Jupiter was always my least favorite of the Arturia synths. I love Roland synths, but I just don't think Arturia did a very good emulation this time around. And since DIVA was released, hardly any of the Arturia stuff in my collection gets used anymore.

---

qube123 - Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:37 pm

---

The earlier versions of the J8V were a bit poo (IMO), however the new 64 bit version is lovely, not sure why it's different but it just sounds right now. In fact all of the new versions seem to have a polish that wasn't there before. Really enjoying the whole V collection again.

---

risome - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:06 am

---

Well thats your opinion afreshcupofjoe and i respect that bro but for me it sounds awesome , has a low cpu footprint and is eminently usable , as for the s word i hardly think so.
Cheers

---

afreshcupofjoe - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:08 am

---

That's interesting. I haven't tried it since it first came out, so maybe it has gotten better. I do remember that the Minimoog V improved remarkably in later versions, so it makes sense that the same would be true of J8V. Still, now that I have DIVA, I've pretty much jumped ship on Arturia altogether.

---

standalone - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:20 am

---

I have Arturia's Jupiter 8V 2.5 running alongside Diva in some songs and my opinion is that it's one of the few soft synths that can stand that test. Most of them simply sound too weak when Diva is present.

Version two of J8V got some important things fixed, begining with the overall loudness.

---

Sequent - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:35 am

---

I agree that the newest version just seems to sound better. I downloaded the 2.5 update and immediately noticed the difference. I was never pleased with the original version and found that it did not stand up to my memory of the real Jupiter... which memory was confirmed by comparing with some of my old DATs. But I'm pretty happy with the latest incarnation.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:08 am

---

Hm, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm fairly certain that a 64bit plugin sounds identical to its 32bit cousin. It doesn't affect the sound at all, or am I mistaken?

---

osiris - Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:29 am

---

I have Analog Factory, and the Jupiter patches don't do anything for me. However, the CS-80 and the Moogs and the Arp

---

EvilDragon - Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:45 am

---

Arturia's "Jupiter" has no relation to the sound of a real Jupiter 8. Diva's emulation is far, FAR better.

---

afreshcupofjoe - Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:13 am

---

It really shouldn't make a difference at all. I interpreted that as they overhauled the algorithm in the plugin when they did the 64bit update. I would think the 32bit version would have the same improvements, unless they didn't do an update to the 32bit version when they released the 64bit version. There is certainly no reason why the 64bit version should sound better simply due to the fact that it is 64bit.

Awesome username, BTW.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:31 am

---

Thanks, joe!
Well you know how companies advertize it when they make the slightest change (or improvement) to the sound engine? When Arturia took the v2 step with Jupiter8V they pronounced it loud and clear that their plugin is now louder.
As much as that volume increase was welcome, I'd think that if they had somehow overhauled anything in the sound engine, we would have heard of it. They mentioned their improved filters in the MinimoogV and the CS-80V, as a response to user requests, when they released the updates.
This time though, Jupiter8V is 64bit, and a Midi-something improvement. That's it.

I've written to them several times in the past about where I thought the sound engine needed some extra work to be authentic, but there can't have been to many critical voices, as they never invested any time and money in that. Once someone from their team told me, they don't have their own J8 to check whatever I claimed. That was a few years back, and by now I've forgotten what my complaints actually were.

It's still a nice and capable synth, really. But for complete authenticity, I might look somewhere else. And also, save a sound of your own and try to decipher the exact file for it on your hard drive. A silly system they have.

---

afreshcupofjoe - Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:00 am

---

I'm just going off what others here are saying. Like I said, I tried it back when it first came out and thought it was a pretty crappy emulation. Haven't touched it since.

---

risome - Thu Apr 26, 2012 3:10 am

---

I agree and i am happy with it so i will get on with using it in my productions.Cheers.

---

qube123 - Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:44 am

---

I was of this view, bought the v collection but didn't get on with it at all, tried the current versions and there's something different going on, even the Prophet V sounds amazing now at that was thinner than a thin thing.

It's very subtle though, can't tell you why it's better, didn't inspire before and never used it, however I am now working on a new LP that uses almost nothing else!

Would suggest having another look.

---

Kriminal - Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:05 am

---

diva doesnt emulate the jupiter8

---

1-2-Many - Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:10 am

---

Your right, it "Impersonates" it

---

braj - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:17 am

---

Does the Analog Factory require a dongle? That is the thing that keeps me from getting any of Arturia's synths, but I would consider Analog Factory if it didn't have that requirement. Also how CPU intensive is it?

---

qube123 - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:34 am

---

Uses either a USB dongle or a software equivalent that locks it to a particular machine.

Not CPU intensive at all in my experience.

---

braj - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:41 am

---

Oh not the dreaded iLok! ok then, not for me.

---

Echoes in the Attic - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:32 pm

---

I think Arturia is syncrosoft. So you use the software e-licenser if y ou don't want a dongle. To me it seems basically the same as challenge/response...

---

AstralExistence - Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:59 pm

---

ive cringed at the name arturia ever since i heard these guys were switching code between different emulations. dunno if this is still true today but just to think, they did that, makes me loose all respect for the company. i mean, that just completely defeats the purpose of an emulation

---

afreshcupofjoe - Thu Apr 26, 2012 9:54 pm

---

Detailed models of the Jupiter 8 filter, envelopes, and oscillators aren't enough for you?



There is always going to be plenty of code that could be duplicated between two virtual synthesizers. It would be silly for a company not to re-use their own code when making a new plugin with similar functions. I can guarantee that all of the big plugin companies do this. There are only a few general approaches to coding these things and beyond that the basic building blocks of an oscillator, filter or envelope are the same regardless of whether you are modelling a Moog, Korg, Yamaha etc.

---

Kriminal - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:03 pm

---

there's no documention that suggests diva is modelling a J8 in any way

---

Bronto Scorpio - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:23 pm

---

The dual VCO is an emulation of the Jupiter 6/8 VCO, the Pre HPF is an emulation of the Jupiter 8 HPF, the Cascade Filter (in clean mode) is an emulation of the Jupiter 8 filter and the analogue envs are models of the Jupiter/Juno envelopes iirc.

Cheers
Dennis

---

risome - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:37 pm

---

You can choose a soft eliscenser or a hardware ware one The hardware one makes using the vst in another studios machine easy

---

EvilDragon - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:37 pm

---

Fail.

---

risome - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:38 pm

---

I didnt think it did either
I think they are both awesome vst synths IMHO

---

braj - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:40 pm

---

I recall reading an interview of Urs where he mentions Diva being pertly modelled off "those synthesiszers with Greekgod names" and that even the name Diva hearkened to this fact as it means something like goddess. I think I read it in Wusik's magazine, ill have to look for it.

---

digitalboytn - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:43 pm

---

Yes - But it has to say "Jupiter 8" before some people believe it

I personally don't care if Diva emulates a rabbit...

She sounds bloody good and that's enough for me...

My favourite VA of all time...

She's greedy with the CPU but she's worth it....

Diva is the right name....A legend for sure

---

braj - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:47 pm

---

I don't think it is ever specified by Urs because there could be complications with Rolan, Moog, Morgan's if they said it directly. Otherwise it is pretty darn clear what inspired Diva

---

afreshcupofjoe - Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:49 pm

---

Urs has stated explicitly that it is. This has been discussed to death so many times in DIVA threads that honestly, if you don't know at this point then you just haven't been paying much attention. That's okay, I don't care if you don't really follow all of the banter around here, but the fact that you would so adamantly argue a point which you know so little about is kind of silly. Why not just say "I don't think there is any documentation"? Why all out proclaim that you know something to be a fact when it's something that you clearly don't know anything about? What's your deal? Are you always like this?



It was definitely specified by Urs at some point, and the information was rather exact (down to trouble they had with replicating certain parts of the MS20 rev1 filter where they couldn't take measurements inside the IC, making it a slightly less accurate model than the other components). There is tons and tons of information out there; all kinds of gorey technical details. I just don't feel like digging through the hundreds of pages of DIVA posts to find it.

---

EvilDragon - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:00 pm

---

I dunno why some people write Urs' name with all caps. URS is a company. Urs is of u-he fame.

---

digitalboytn - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:05 pm

---

Yes - but URS is a standout in the world of soft synth developers...

He's just plain Urs when he goes back home at night

---

aMUSEd - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:26 pm

---

Yes, incomprehensible really why they chose such an un user friendly and closed system. XILS have the same annoying preset system (a legacy I guess of when Xavier worked for them) but seem more open to changing it recently.

---

braj - Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:35 pm

---

I'm not saying Urs didn't SAY it at some points, just it isn't in the documentation nor the marketing materials. BTW I like how my phone changes Korg to Morgan's

---

osiris - Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:09 am

---

How did Urs name get mixed up in an Arturia thread FFS? Urs is a synth geek, plain and simple. I know this because he's shared some of his old manuals with me. It was his desire to emulate the Juno filter more precisely that I think Diva was born from.
Back to Jupiter. Yes, you have to have a dongle, but if you already have one(I had an eLicenser) you can put your license on there. I just moved mine to the one that came with Nexus and, besides the time it takes AF to load, I haven't had a peep out of it. But there are 3000 presets, so this is forgivable.

---

braj - Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:16 am

---

I've been thinking of getting the Analog Experience the Factory KB bundle for a while now, but keep holding off because a. maybe not the best controller (but I love the wood panels haha) and maybe not the greatest plugin, and plus I was concerned about the dongle thing. At least now the dongle may not be an issue. What do you think of that package, this is the one I was considering:

http://www.zzounds.com/item--ARAAEFACT

From what I can tell, it is a decent controller if not the best, and the plugin makes it seem like a good bargail. Just I have NI's Retro Machines which I'm not crazy about, I was concerned it would be similar to that in some ways. How much of the real Arturia synths do you get with the simplified package? Does it just use samples of them or is it using their synthisis? And how light on the CPU are they compared to Diva for example?

---

risome - Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:16 am

---

Just to close off ,funny how this thread started as praise for a great product and somehow got changed into a DIVA versus JP8 V thread, just saying............ cheers

---

osiris - Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:26 am

---

@braj - Cpu is consistent with, say Massive on the voice intense patches (20 percent on my tiny dual core Athlon) I don't think it's samples, I think AF is more like NI Kore, and it loads 'mini' versions of the synths. Downside to this, you don't get a lot of tweaking options. You get Octave, Filter, envelopes, and then the small knobs have parameters attached to them with stuff like OSC 1/2 Mix. You can't program your own patches. I will say I do use it and quite often. The Moog, Arp and CS-80 stuff really stands out and sounds extremely good. 3000 presets of various analog classics for that money to me was a no-brainer.

---

braj - Fri Apr 27, 2012 1:29 am

---

Coo. And since I mentioned Retro Machines, it made me go play with it, it actually has nice sound just not much tweaking options (good and bad thing really) but the arp is pretty nice, and I just realized I can send it to other plugins

Anyhow, I may get the Analog Factory now. Does it have an arp, and what is it like? I am crazy for arps and if there are a lot of interesting patterns included that would be a big plus.

---

Gamma-UT - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:03 am

---

In AF, any arps are baked into the original instrument presets - you don't have real control over the patterns. You can select ones with arps or sequences from the menu at the top.

---

braj - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:13 am

---

Ug, that's no fun.

---

afreshcupofjoe - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:22 am

---

They are the only two commercial VA synths on the market which attempt to accurately model the Jupiter 8. I don't see why comparisons with DIVA wouldn't be expected in a thread heaping praise on JP8V when DIVA arguably does a better job of modelling the same oscillators, filters and envelopes. How could it not?

I don't really see how this observation is somehow "funny" or insightful. It seems quite natural and obvious.

---

braj - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:32 am

---

How is the step sequencer in the Jupiter 8 V? Can it output midi?

---

deathwish - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:33 am

---

Is DIVA superior to Arturia JP8V?

---

EvilDragon - Fri Apr 27, 2012 2:40 am

---

Oh god yes.

---

risome - Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:50 am

---

Whatever and insightful is not a word i used

---

Arrested Developer - Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:22 am

---

Arturia JP 8 V -> GUI comes very close to the JP8
Diva -> Sound comes close to the JP8

---

zerocrossing - Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:38 am

---

That's my feeling as well, though I haven't tried versions past v2. I did like their new S.E.M emulation though, but with a new ATC-x in my studio there's not much call for it, though I suppose it would be nice for polyphony. I'd buy the S.E.M. if it were under $100. I guess that's my issue with all the Arturia stuff. They want way too much for them when software like Diva are better and more flexible.

---

braj - Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:45 am

---

---

Echoes in the Attic - Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:49 am

---

Ya it's crazy different pricing models. DIVA gives you 4 or 5 pretty much complete emulation under one product, which is half the price of one of Arturias synths. Just crazy.

One thing I thought was funny. If you watch the product video for the Arturia jupiter-8v, there is a scene where Nori Ubukatu (not sure if I got that name right), is playing the jupiter-8v first and then it switches to the real jupiter-8, I guess to show how similar they are. But the funny thing is, the sound gets so obviously less muddy and nicer when it changes to the real thing, so it had the reverse effect. With DIVA you can actually get it exactly the same for most jupiter sounds, whereas the 8v will get close for many sounds, but not most.

That being said, I've always liked the Arturia sound, but not for a true analog sound, but more for it's own unique sound. They are just about the creamiest softies I've used, although can be a little muddy. I used to have the Jupiter-8v, but I found that I could get most of the types of sounds I liked in it using Poly-Ana instead. And then once DIVA came along, I really had no need for it.

---

1-2-Many - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:18 am

---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlyVdJmbWKY

---

Ingonator - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:39 am

---

Exactly my thoughts.

I had a real Jupiter 8 back in 2004. Had the Arturia Jupiter 8V but sold it last year becaiuse the sound was not really close to the real thing.
I am very happy about the Jupiter 8 emulation in Diva which is modeled on Urs' own Jupiter 8 which on the pictures of Urs' new office/studio could be seen near to his computers : http://www.u-he.com/cms/90-the-new-studio

The Arturia synths i currently got are the Prophet V (could import original Prophet 5 and VS Sysex files) and the new Oberheim SEM V. IMO the Oberheim sound wise seems to be the best of the Arturia synths so far.


Ingo

---

MickGael - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:40 am

---

Jupiter-8V2 sells for $199 USD. Diva sells for $179 USD.

---

Kriminal - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:00 am

---

really? funny how jp4 and jp6 and moog and ms10/20 are mentioned dont you think?



well, im on the U-HE beta team, and i can honestly say i have not seen the J8 mentioned ONCE at the beta forum...the J4/J6, yes, lots and lots, but not the J8.

So you see, i dont follow all the 'banter' here, no, but i do have a rough idea of whats been going on, but if you can show me the documentation that says otherwise....

---

Ingonator - Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:34 pm

---

Hi,

i am VERY sure that it's from both Urs' Jupiter 8 and Jupiter 6. First here you could see pictures of the Jupiter 8 and the Jupiter 6 in Urs's new studio:
http://www.u-he.com/cms/90-the-new-studio

Second it was mentioned several times during the first public beta and third in the first versions the Jupiter was even mentioned in parts of the GUI (e.g. Jp6 and Jp8 in the "Shape" selection (now it is "analog1" and "analog2").

The filters in Diva should be like this:
- ladder: Minimoog (the one from Hans Zimmer which Urs borrowed)
- Cascade Clean: Urs' Jupiter 8 (which he mentioned sounds a bit different to other Jupiter 8's)
- Cascade Rough: Juno-60
- Multimode: Jupiter 6
- BITE (rev 1 and 2): MS-20 (two Revisions)

It looks like in the final version all references to the original synths were deleted in the GUI and the manual to prevent copyright problems.

a few quotes:












All of those are from this thread:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=302792&postdays=0&postorder=asc



Ingo

---

Kriminal - Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:46 pm

---

None of those quotes are urs saying diva emulates a jp8, and the original labels were DEFINITELY jp4 & jp6.

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:27 pm

---

This all makes me want to go to Diva and create a new J8'esque patch called 'Splitting Hairs.'

---

afreshcupofjoe - Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:58 pm

---

It's amazing that some people like Kriminal won't give up even when they are proven wrong. It's like they have some sort of compulsion which causes them to continually delude themselves. Incredible.

---

risome - Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:05 pm

---

I got my JP8V for $129 with a discount voucher

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:07 pm

---

I'm interested in how the 'extra' non-Jupiter features are, and CPU use. If these are really good and I can find the synth for a nice price used, I wouldn't care so much if it is a perfect emulation of Jupiter 8. How is it CPU-wise? (I think I asked that already).

---

risome - Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:11 pm

---

Very reasonable on Cpu 10/12% down to 5% on my iMac 2.8gHz dual core,

---

Echoes in the Attic - Sun Apr 29, 2012 5:26 pm

---

Wow. Just wow.

If you're still in denial, open up DIVA and go to the "Templates" section in the presets, which are factory templates of the synths which those modules were modeled after.

---

Echoes in the Attic - Sun Apr 29, 2012 8:59 pm

---

Ah, my bad. I was thinking of the advertised Arturia price of 250, and I got DIVA for 129 when it first came. Didn't think about the increased DIVA price and cheaper Arturia sales. But the point still stands.

---

Kriminal - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:02 pm

---

its also 'amazing' YOU still havent shown me the documentation...

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:23 pm

---

That Diva ships with an initiation patch for "Jupe 8" seems like documentation in its own right to me and it seems pretty obvious how Urs sidestepped mentioning Roland directly by calling them "that Japanese company that makes synthesis named after Greek gods" indicates strongly that he is avoiding saying it directly, I assume to avoid legal challenges. I really don't know how much more documentation you would need to connect the dots.

---

Ingonator - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:45 pm

---

Exactly. I remember i had to rename some of my Jupiter 8 factory sounds for Diva as a guide line was not to use words like e.g. "Jupiter 8" but i was allowed to use just "Jupiter" or "JP-8" instead.

I still wonder where Kriminal found a reference to the Jupiter 4 as i hear this for the first time (and i followed the Diva thread before the first public beta started). I have also not seen a JP-4 in any of the pictures of Urs' studio but there are a Jupiter 8, Jupiter 6 and Juno-60.


Ingo

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:48 pm

---

Does Arturia license the images and names for the synths they emulate? I would guess so, and it could even be Jupiter 8 isn't mentioned in the documentation to avoid conflicts with Arturia as much as Roland.

---

Kriminal - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:02 pm

---

Black coffee for me please

havent seen factory presets so csnt comment, never use them so they get deleted.

---

Ingonator - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:14 pm

---

There are currently 1350+ of them (maybe some are duplicates so it could be there are "only" around 1200+ really different ones) and so far i have not managed to check them all due to the sheer amount. Most of them were "collected" during the public beta (see "THIRD PARTY" folder) and those from Howard Scarr are just excellent as always. Michael Kastrup and Xenos contributed some excellent stuff too.

The sheer amount of factory sounds and the fact that i already contributed a bunch of'my own ones were leading to the decision that i first program sounds for other synths before i return doing more sounds for Diva but i will do that for sure, especially as the CPU use is improved now.

BTW two of the init patches (in "TEMPLATES" folder) are called "INIT Jupe-6.h2p" and "INIT Jupe-8.h2p".


Ingo

---

Kriminal - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:25 pm

---

You make presets do you?

like i said, i havent heard a single patch by anyone else, all factory sounds get deleted after install.

Anyway, work to do, busy busy. enjoy your day.

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:48 pm

---

"Fernando's Hardware Factory' in the Third Party bank is a good starting place for tweaking your own Roland sounds, created from the original factory soundbanks of various Juno and Jupiter synths.

Anyhow, this thread is supposed to be about Arturia's version besides not being as good as Diva in Jupiter emulation (so it seems) I doubt it is a bad synth, especially if you can get a deal on it.

---

braj - Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:57 pm

---

Why would you delete the factory presets? There are a lot of excellent ones and yeah I can see if you are a sound designed that you want to focus on your own, but doesn't the work of others interest you at all? I find great joy in going through the ones you sound designers create, especially some of the names that get chosen BTW Ingo has one called 'Horny Jupiter that made me smile.

---

Kriminal - Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:10 am

---

Ive spoken to an expert, and its possible i made an error, so aplogies to all concerned
genuine mistake, human error.

---

Ingonator - Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:20 am

---

Finally.


Like mentioned above it's time speaking about the Arturia Jupiter synth again. As i sold that last year i guess my position about that one is clear but i got the Arturia Oberheim SEM which i like and also the Prophet V (which emulates 2 synths and got an interesting hybrid mode).


Ingo

---

Kriminal - Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:28 am

---

Its nothing to do with respect, i just prefer to make my own sounds
also, anyone can make a patch and call it 'juno' etc, the name doesnt really mean much
anyway its done now, i must work...

---

hakey - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:25 am

---

+1

---

Kriminal - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:31 am

---

No, they dont interest me.

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:41 am

---

Ego is a tough one, we all have them but just like a musician that says he won't listen to the music of others, I personally don't find myself wanting to listen to theirs either. Humility is an undervalued commodity, but those who have it are the richest people I've ever known.

---

hakey - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:47 am

---

+1

---

Kriminal - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:47 am

---

I know what sounds i want and i know how to make them.
Its quicker than going thru a million presets
nothing to do with not liking others work or not wanting to listen to it
its about workflow.

---

zorniko - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:50 am

---

+1

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:51 am

---

You gotta be careful what you make this about. Many artists and musicians will tell you to ignore the work of others when making your own stuff. It's not a sign of ignorance, it's just essential to their creative workflow.
There's plenty of people who will listen to all the presets that a synth comes with, is that not enough?

I'm also deleting presets more and more, simply to give me a "blank slate" sort of feeling when dealing with a new plugin. It means complete freedom without being to influenced by all the presets you've just gone through. It's refreshing really.

---

hakey - Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:59 am

---

Good artists borrow, great artists steal.

- Picasso (but sometimes attributed to T.S. Eliot and others).

---

zorniko - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:04 am

---

---

fmr - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:20 am

---

I wonder how great artists like Bach (who learned everything by copying the music of the older masters), or Mahler (who earned his living by conductiong the works of others) managed to reach such high standards as they did.
I enjoy a lot listen to works from anybody, being them patches or music. And I think the more I know and listen to, the more I can manage to get on my own.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:20 am

---

a well chosen quote
Ah, but where you steal from, that remains up to you. You can steal your ideas from anywhere, doesn't even have to be from the same form of art. In a way, we all steal. I can say that at least 75% of all sounds I make contain stolen ideas. Ah, probably all of them do. I'm not always aware of it at the moment of creation, but it's still true. Have I ever come up with a chord progression that hadn't been used before? I doubt it. We're all thieves really.

"We're all thieves, and the worst kind are those who deny it. Also, this is a completely stolen and highly unoriginal thought that many before already had."

- The Unshushable Coktor

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:23 am

---

All the really great musicians I have met and appreciated were avid music consumers, playing cover versions even of other's tunes. I don't buy into the idea that you live in isolation even if you try, you are always building on your influences and the more you have, the more you have to work with, like a musical vocabulary. Imagine a person trying to write a novel when they only know a few words, painting a picture if they never saw many landscapes etc.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:28 am

---

But Braj, nobody said that. You collect ideas all your life, obviously. Just, when you sit down to do some actual work, some might find the idea of isolating themselves very rewarding. It's not for everyone, true. But why think less of someone simply because of his preferred workflow? No good, I say.

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:33 am

---

I am not thinking less of anyone, why do you think that is what I said?

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:36 am

---

No, true, that's not what you said. Don't want to put words in your mouth. But you said you're likely to ignore their work if they ignore yours. That's what I meant.

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:36 am

---

There is a difference in workflow when making my own music, and not being interested in hearing the music (or patches) of others. I bought Kriminal's Diva patches, but I think in the future I'll save my money and make my own, because I can. I bought them because the work of others interests me, and supporting other's efforts also interests me. But the mood of others also interests and affects what I will buy also

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:39 am

---

You mean when you don't like their attitude? I can relate to that. I have that with Mike Patton, don't dig his attitude, but I do like his music. Creates an annoying tension in me.

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:39 am

---

I must admit the mood of the 'show me the documentation' thing is also influencing how I perceive Kriminal's comments.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:41 am

---

Well he did apologize for his stubbornness though when proven wrong. Gotta give the man some credit.

---

zorniko - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:42 am

---

That's +2

Everybody +3

Everybody's right here

But everybody absolutely off topic

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:45 am

---

It wasn't exactly an admission, and he had to consult 'an expert' we all weren't good enough for him but that's my ego at work there as well. Like I said, we all have one.

---

The unshushable Coktor - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:46 am

---

A quick question to those who perceived an improvement in sound quality: Was that between v1 and the new v2.5, or between v2 and v2.5?

Maybe not super relevant, but it's back on topic.

---

braj - Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:48 am

---

+1

---

There are 114 posts in this topic.
Page: 1 2