KVR :: Samples, Sampling and Sample Libraries » The Giant: New Sampled Piano Library from Native Instruments [View Original Topic]
There are 59 posts in this topic.

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synchronizer - Mon May 21, 2012 11:13 am

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It looks like Native Instruments has released a new piano sample library called "The Giant", and it's an upright.

http://www.native-instruments.com/#/en/products/producer/powered-by-kontakt/the-giant/?utm_medium=email&content=1981&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=THE+GIANT+&page=4847

▪ Two Instruments: THE GIANT and THE GIANT Cinematic Effects
▪ 13 velocity zones for an extraordinary dynamic range
▪ 5 release samples for each key, with a length of up to 20 seconds
▪ Special resonance samples
▪ Halfpedal and Repedal
▪ Color control for easy variation of the timbre
▪ Real overtone samples
▪ Controllable piano noises like pedal, damper, string or hammer noises
▪ Compressor for pop piano sounds
▪ Global Preset system
▪ Based on the Galaxy Pianos engine
▪ 8GB sample content (4GB compressed)

What does everyone think of this? Is it an improvement over the older libraries such as Alicia's Keys?

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hibidy - Mon May 21, 2012 12:22 pm

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Well, I'm sure it will be a fine library for many but it does nothing for me.

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Aloysius - Mon May 21, 2012 12:27 pm

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Not sure if I 'like' or 'not like' it.

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synchronizer - Mon May 21, 2012 12:28 pm

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Well hopefully someone makes up his mind . People will buy it eventually.

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Keith99 - Mon May 21, 2012 12:32 pm

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Surprised there is a market for more pianos, Komplete comes with a few good ones anyway

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hibidy - Mon May 21, 2012 12:32 pm

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Does anyone else have the sneaking suspicion that NI takes the same piano and eq it a bit differently and market off as new?

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Akiha - Mon May 21, 2012 3:06 pm

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Totally.

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synchronizer - Mon May 21, 2012 3:07 pm

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I see that you all don't like it very much. ha It's not very realistic then?

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Windsurfer25x - Mon May 21, 2012 3:18 pm

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Well it's probably better than the ones that came in Komplete 7, Alicia's Key's is nice, I'm sure its a great sample library.

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core - Tue May 22, 2012 1:26 am

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Audio demos sound lovely to my ears. The cinematic sounds are really nice too.

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Funkybot's Evil Twin - Tue May 22, 2012 1:52 pm

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This just seems like such an esoteric instrument for NI to sample. I mean, how many people have ever heard of this 9 foot tall upright piano? Is there even a market for one? I would have preferred a nice set of warm Baldwin upright piano samples or something along those lines.

From the demos I've heard on the NI site I'm not overly impressed either. The piano sounds great in the jazz demos but just doesn't really do it for me elsewhere.

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hibidy - Tue May 22, 2012 2:34 pm

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My problem with NI is that those demos ALWAYS sound nice to me. Then you get the product and it's like "MEH". The pianos are especially that way to me. I love the vienna demo........HATE that piano

I'm referring to the addons btw, the actually products are generally good imho (fm8/etc)

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audiobot202 - Tue May 22, 2012 10:38 pm

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Just bought and installed it. Sounds just fine to me.

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darsho - Tue May 22, 2012 10:41 pm

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I only watched the video they posted on YT.
Sounded totally uninteresting to me.
I am not much of a Piano player, though.

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hibidy - Tue May 22, 2012 10:49 pm

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I use piano a good bit (certainly not every song) but it's just too hard to tell how much that would be used for 119 bucks.

Then again, I'm kinda lucky from time to time. I got the kawai piano back when that company was smart enough to use kontakt (I hate the idiotic idea that you need a f**king ILOK "2" for a sample library )

It's wonderful sounding........seems to always fit.

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Nanakai - Tue May 22, 2012 11:39 pm

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Yup. Pretty much.

I suppose it'll be nice to have if/when I get Komplete 9, but I'm sure as hell not buying it alone.

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synchronizer - Wed May 23, 2012 5:00 am

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Kawai piano...I didn't know that a sample library was made? Where can I find this product?

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Echoes in the Attic - Wed May 23, 2012 5:27 am

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I just think the NI pianos always sound very clean but sterile. The demos of this giant sound the same. I recently bought the braunschweig upright:
http://www.imperfectsamples.com/website/samples/braunschweig/braunschweiguprightpiano_pro.php

And it sounds much more full and interesting to me, for a character piano. For clean grand I'll use Truepianos or Pianoteq.

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hibidy - Wed May 23, 2012 1:02 pm

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http://acousticsamples.net/keys/kawai-ex-pro

Again though, it was a sample library for the full version of kontakt when I got it and now it REQUIRES ilok (though it might only be ilok one)

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Sampleconstruct - Wed May 23, 2012 1:05 pm

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+1000 - since 2 years for me it is the Braunschweig Upright if I can't have/don't need a real one...the 14 velocity layers and the slight imperfectness of the sound fits very well with the stuff I do.

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Echoes in the Attic - Thu May 24, 2012 6:46 am

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Oh yeah. I actually bought the basic version first. But I noticed that the last couple velocity layers really jumped and the sound changed quickly, but I loved the sound, so I went for the pro for the 14 layer. Definitely helps. And I really like the second Mike position too. It's the only piano I use apart from the modeled ones. Great for a more intimate sound.

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peppy197 - Thu May 24, 2012 11:02 am

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They (come/with/it/types)sound OK but their resonance is short
Larger libraries like that for the GIANT have naturally trailing notes, almost to virtual infinity...

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peppy197 - Thu May 24, 2012 11:05 am

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Yes. Its advertising the positive aspects, just like you would do in an interview for a job.... your not always so shining...but it sells.

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synchronizer - Thu May 24, 2012 11:35 am

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I actually have the Galaxy Vintage D sample library for Kontakt, which I find to be very good. I'd really like to try the Imperfect Samples Steinway though. It's too bad that there isn't a demo, because I could use something for solo pieces and more emotional songs in addition to the more clean Galaxy piano.

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Krakatau - Thu May 24, 2012 12:05 pm

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http://www.galaxypianos.com/the-giant.html

- good to underline perhaps that it is basically a Galaxy Instruments product rather than a NI one

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hibidy - Thu May 24, 2012 1:50 pm

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Every time I see this I think of peaches.

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Kaboom75 - Fri May 25, 2012 10:59 am

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I'm about to buy Giant I got a crazy fast internet connection. I've already got Alicia's Keys so can compare them in a bit if you like. I like silly idea stuff a 12foot 2 ton piano sounds like it would be fun to play.

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synchronizer - Fri May 25, 2012 11:00 am

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An in-depth comparison would be great! If you have other piano libraries too that would be helpful too.

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Gonga - Fri May 25, 2012 11:27 am

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I love Alicia's Keys. I'd be interested to hear your comparison.

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Kaboom75 - Fri May 25, 2012 11:48 am

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Updated after four hours of testing.

With the right preset choice it replaces Alicia's keys theirs more dynamic range than any other piano plugin I have used. It can sit into any type of music and sound evil or very nice and warm. I've tried it with classical movie type music/ piano and strings, heavy rock and pop. All the controls it comes with allow you to tweak it to fit any song.

I thaught I was going to end up leaving Alicia's keys in some of my mixes at first but now the pink GUI is gone and my music sounds better. With Alicia's keys I was always hitting the keys hard as I could to get the sound I wanted.

You don't need to hit the keys anywhere near as hard with Giant to get the same ballad type sound. If you hit them really hard you hear something that should be kept in a cage and it's nice and powerfull.

The reverbs included are proper convolution reverbs and they really sound great they sound like the same quality of altiverb 6. Theirs a built in compressor any of the controls can be turned off.

You get another version of it that has FX added and missing sample layers that puts it in Omnispheres mad shit teritory. My in ear headphones are making that rattling sound when you put the bass up way too much. Felt like I was using Trilian on acid.

Info of the real integrated piano it was sampled from http://www.klavins-pianos.com/index_en.htm

Listen to Giant http://www.galaxypianos.com/the-giant.html

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Gonga - Sat May 26, 2012 6:37 am

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Many thanks. Good review. Can't wait for it to be included in Komplete 9!

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Numanoid - Sat May 26, 2012 8:50 am

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Completely agree, how many piano sample libraries does the world need?

Doesn't make it magic that it's Alicia Keys' piano. What makes people buy her stuff is her playing, not the piano she's using

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deastman - Sat May 26, 2012 9:14 am

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I find it slightly annoying and deceptive the way NI licenses other companies products and then presents it as if they had built it themselves.

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standalone - Sat May 26, 2012 10:35 am

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I don't know, how many synths does the world need?

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Gonga - Sat May 26, 2012 12:28 pm

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"Doesn't make it magic" huh? What a revelation

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Kaboom75 - Sat May 26, 2012 12:29 pm

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Thanks Gonga :)

Says on NI website who made the piano samples and whos sample engine it is. NI also act as a publisher. I baught Alicia's Keys over a year ago because of the piano it was sampled from and because of who did the samples Thomas Skarbye. it's still a very good piano plugin I will still use it.

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ghettosynth - Sat May 26, 2012 1:42 pm

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That's probably exactly why they sampled it, ok, on edit, licensed the samples. It's expensive to do so and it is a niche product with esoteric appeal. It's relatively easier to compete with NI by sampling pianos that are a dime a dozen; and these days, that's almost a literal price.

Not everyone can afford, or gain access to, one of these.

http://www.klavins-pianos.com/details_370i_en.htm

It's interesting enough that people will buy the sample library just because the instrument itself is interesting.

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Gonga - Mon May 28, 2012 9:56 am

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A good thing to remember too, in the "old days" composers did a LOT of doubling of instruments. It's amazing the beautiful sounds you can achieve simply by having 2 or more different instruments (which you already own) play the same notes. And with modern tech, you can tweak them to get it just right. For example, take whatever piano you're using now, and add a smidgeon of Rhodes, or Wurli, or harpsi, or pan drum, or bed springs, etc.

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Numanoid - Mon May 28, 2012 2:30 pm

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Huh, what a revelation, who'd thought of that?

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Gonga - Mon May 28, 2012 7:07 pm

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I don't believe I've ever heard Alicia Keys music, but I've been playing serious piano for 52 years, and it's my favorite of many. The only thing Alicia Keys had to do with my purchase decision is that if she hadn't undertaken that project, the piano vst wouldn't exist.

Yes, there are quite a few people at kvr who sit around being condescending to others and hurling insults, but most of us here are serious musicians of one sort or another, who actually like to discuss the craft substantively, and it's a mistake to think you know our motivations, especially if you assume they are vacuous when they are not.

My comment was related directly and substantively to the craft: achieving a fuller piano sound is a part of what people have been talking about wanting to achieve. Your comment was an incorrect, condescending opinion of my and others comments.

I would suggest considering constructive comments relating more directly to the subject, as opposed to destructive and incorrect opinions regarding other members intentions, motivations, whatever other things you couldn't possibly understand.

And back on the subject ... this piano sounds amazing. I wouldn't spend so much for it, but wow, would I enjoy playing the actual instrument. Powerful! The dmo tracks at NI's site that are entirely giant demonstrate the huge versatility - it has a lot of effect potential somewhat like SonicCouture's Extended Piano (which I love).

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hibidy - Mon May 28, 2012 7:49 pm

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I think someone needs a hug!

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Numanoid - Tue May 29, 2012 1:20 am

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The reason why I added my comment in the first place is that I feel the Giant is a market ploy to sell another piano sample pack.

When the first sample packs came around it was enough that a Steinway had been sampled.

My opinion is that selling a piano sample under the name of Alicia Keys or the biggest upright piano is more or less a repackaging of the same old product.

I don't question the quality of the craft, they have probably done a great job.

Whenever I read an ad for a new Yamaha or Casio piano for instance, it is more or less always sold as being the most realistic piano sound ever. But haven't they said that about every new product for the last 20 years, and will they not say that about the next piano they bring out as well?

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standalone - Tue May 29, 2012 6:14 am

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If every piano is the same for you, you probably should not be giving your opinion in a thread about pianos.

The difference in sound between an upright piano and an exclusive (only three units were built) Yamaha C3 Neo Grand prepared for Alicia Keys' modern soul styles is huge. In fact, the same piano can sound and behave differently depending on how it has been prepared: read here.

And what's more, you seem to confuse this 'giant' upright piano with a normal upright like the Braunschweig, for example. This is an extra-large grand piano that only has the vertical placement of the soundboard in common with an upright piano.

Seriously, I suggest a retreat.

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Numanoid - Tue May 29, 2012 7:59 am

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I'm allowed to have an opinion, and I'm sticking to that.

In a discussion you need to accept that there will both be arguments for and against a subject

If you do not agree with somebody, and do not want to start a discussion, the best thing is often to ignore their posting

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hibidy - Tue May 29, 2012 1:46 pm

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Yeah, I'm confused standalone, what up? Were you on the beta team or something and we struck a nerve?

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quantum7 - Tue May 29, 2012 3:55 pm

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EVERY piano by N.I. has every released has absolutely STUNK in my opinion....except for Alicia's Keys, so I'm not expecting much from this new N.I. sampled piano offering.

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Funkybot's Evil Twin - Tue May 29, 2012 5:08 pm

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Alicia Keys was done by Scarbee. The Giant was done by the Galaxy piano guys.

You may want to raise your expectations a bit.

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quantum7 - Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:34 pm

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OK, there may be hope then.

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bailees7irish - Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:25 pm

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honestly, i think standalone makes a good point. the differences of the two pianos ARE huge...and just read what Kaboom75 said about The Giant.

or was he part of the beta team too?

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standalone - Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:42 am

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It's only that I feel very ashamed when I read someone in a music production forum suggesting that it doesn't matter one or another piano, all sound more or less the same. That's something that makes all members of such forum look like completely inculturated jerks.

Differences between pianos are a lot bigger than differences between electric guitars, no one here dares to say here that a Telecaster sounds the same as a Les Paul.



Do what you want with your opinions about pianos when you have at least one. Right now you've proved that you know nothing about the matter, what can I do about that? The only honest thing to do is to make you realize that you are wrong: differences between pianos are very important, not negligible as your lack of knowledge tells you.

If you can't tell an African elephant from an Asian elephant you should't give your opinions about elephants in a biologists' forum. If you can't tell a giant vertical concert piano from a upright piano you should't give your opinions about pianos in a musicians' forum. Not because you don't have the right to do so, only because it makes you look bad.

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Gonga - Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:31 am

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I, like most players, don't care about the marketing. I audition the instrument (when possible - this is why I say if there's no demo it's a major bummer) and decide based on feel and sound. Alicias Keys feels and sounds significantly better to me in very important ways than any other piano I have, and I have a LOT of them. I think most players would say pretty much the same thing about their choice...that it feels and sounds better to them, and they pay little attention to the marketing. On the other hand, the opinions of others who they have come to know, understand and respect, can be a major factor in a decision. I know it is with me.

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DaKlavins - Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:24 am

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Hi everybody,

Came across this thread while I was looking up some feedback on the Giant, and decided to join the discussion, as I felt you're sincere and creative folks, discussing in a more civilized manner than many other places in the virtual space...

First thing I'd like to say - IMO Uli Baronowsky and his team did an outstanding job on capturing the sound of the Model 370. I was thrilled listening to the demos on the Galaxy and NI sites, as I know from my own music productions with this piano how difficult it was to record a sound that's close to the real thing.

Second - the main idea with the size of this piano is to create a concert grand that has improved dynamics at all registers, purity and depth of tone in the bass register as well (no matter how hard you play), and a well balanced tonal quality all over the scale, in particular at the transition from bass (copper wound) strings to the middle register (plain steel), hence it's straight strung.

Last not least - I'd never expect virtually everyone to like the 'new' piano sound, of course there's very different listening traditions, styles of music, room acoustics to adhere to, etc., etc., - it's all about adding an option to the choice of musical instruments that offers new ways for musical expression and creativity.

So, I think the discussion shouldn't focus on "better", or "worse than the xy piano...", but rather on likes and dislikes, ideas how to utilize the vast options of the Giant (or other pianos), etc..

Enjoy the journey - exploring the infinite world of sounds and music!

Cheers..!

David

P.S.: Kaboom75, I just loved your statement: "If you hit them really hard you hear something that should be kept in a cage..."

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hibidy - Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:55 am

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The only way I can judge these since I'm not willing to simply buy every NI piano library is by the demos........which allot of people agree sound very same-ish. Anyways, cheers to those who like it!

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sorohanro - Sat Jun 09, 2012 3:20 pm

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Blind people might have opinions about paintings. Some might express things like "I like old paintings in oil, smells better than the new ones in acril", yet in an art forum their opinion might not really be useful.

Back to pianos, I have Komplete 8 and got several Kontakt versions of Acousticsamples pianos. New York and Upright sounds the best from NI stuff (to my ears) not a big fan of Vienna and Berlin.
From the demos, Alicia Keys wasn't really what I would use in my music, but I don't have it, I judge only based on the demo songs.
Demo songs of the Giant sounds interesting, big, really something I would like to use. On the other hand, when I hear a prepared piano by Soniccouture (the Xtended), Soundiron Emotional or Granny piano, then I would think twice before spending money on "the Giant".

Heck, truth to be said, I would like to have money to get all of those

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standalone - Sat Jun 09, 2012 11:38 pm

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You are talking about NI's libraries and I'm talking about pianos. I haven't mentioned NI one single time.

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synchronizer - Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:47 am

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I created this topic in order to inform people of the existence of The Giant, and was hoping that it would be home to very thoughtful discussions and reviews. Would everyone be able to stop complaining about the general quality of
Native Instruments-sponsored piano libraries? They're not even made BY NI, rather, they are made by other third party companies such as Scarbee or Galaxy Instruments. Of course not everyone is going to like everything.

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hibidy - Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:06 am

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n/m

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hibidy - Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:11 am

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n/m

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synchronizer - Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:13 am

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Yes, I agree that it's too bad that there isn't a trial version, but you can't claim that the pianos all sound the same because they're identical. It's more likely that Native Instruments WANTS the demos to sound the same.

It's too bad that Native Instruments doesn't have more trials on this website:

http://www.try-sound.com/

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There are 59 posts in this topic.