Vielen Dank!Sampleconstruct wrote:
Cogito is brilliant, great stuff Bob!
iZotope Iris
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- KVRian
- 1030 posts since 14 May, 2008 from Tralfamadore
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- KVRer
- 21 posts since 15 Oct, 2010
here's a challenge, pick a sample and let's see who can make a more interesting 10 second thing out of it.
you use iris and i'll use a wave editor or a tracker
my argument, after chasing spectral morphing and additive resynthesis for almost 10 years, is that it's all shit
you have a pitch shifter, some band pass filters, an LFO, and on top of it all a bunch of awful resynthesis artifacts
i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
you use iris and i'll use a wave editor or a tracker
my argument, after chasing spectral morphing and additive resynthesis for almost 10 years, is that it's all shit
you have a pitch shifter, some band pass filters, an LFO, and on top of it all a bunch of awful resynthesis artifacts
i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
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- KVRAF
- 11050 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
Sooo, basically... since YOU can't make anything un-shit with it in ten years, it must not be a viable 'form' of musical expression for anyone?IDM Superstar wrote: [...] my argument, after chasing spectral morphing and additive resynthesis for almost 10 years, is that it's all shit [...] i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
Rather limited "argument".
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
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- KVRAF
- 4218 posts since 15 Sep, 2010
No idea if you're joking or not, but either way that's one hell of a funny postIDM Superstar wrote:
i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
Last edited by Neon Breath on Thu Nov 08, 2012 6:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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- KVRer
- 21 posts since 15 Oct, 2010
anything is a viable form of musical expression, im just posting about the one that's got a 50 page thread but sounds like it's an SOS using a walkie talkie produced by Real Media over at the glass factory saying there's been a shipping mishap and they're drowning in tennis ballsShabdahbriah wrote: Sooo, basically... since YOU can't make anything un-shit with it in ten years, it must not be a viable 'form' of musical expression for anyone?
Rather limited "argument".
i was super hyped about this stuff for years until i realized it all sounds the damn same, i thought i'd be spectral morphing a goose into the gravitational collapse of a neutron star by now, but no, it's still squeaky warbly pew pew
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- KVRAF
- 11050 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
I can't argue the "same/same" aspects for the most part, as I agree with you. That is certainly a part of the challenge, indeed.IDM Superstar wrote:anything is a viable form of musical expression, im just posting about the one that's got a 50 page thread but sounds like it's an SOS using a walkie talkie produced by Real Media over at the glass factory saying there's been a shipping mishap and they're drowning in tennis ballsShabdahbriah wrote: Sooo, basically... since YOU can't make anything un-shit with it in ten years, it must not be a viable 'form' of musical expression for anyone?
Rather limited "argument".
i was super hyped about this stuff for years until i realized it all sounds the damn same, i thought i'd be spectral morphing a goose into the gravitational collapse of a neutron star by now, but no, it's still squeaky warbly pew pew
I feel that way about a number of synths/emu's that have been done-to-death, and certainly a LOT of so/so spectral/granular tools, so I can relate to your "disappointment/disillusionment" there. I am always "looking" for and searching out 'unique' approaches to sound design, and clever alternatives to the norm, however.
That said: as I spend most of my time in audio "editors" (Sound Forge/WavLab, etc.), that is how I approach Iris, and many other things that are called "synths", whether spectral, granular, or additive... they are sound generation, and manipulation tools. Some good, some not so... some exceptional, some mediocre. That's the playing field.
I really enjoy the interface and work-flow of Iris, and it's very well thought-out/implemented for an initial release (IMO).
Definitely an 'interactive' step forward for spectral "design" and experimentation (IMO), that will (and has) appeal(ed) to many people "new" to this area of synthesis/editing, as well as a breath of fresh air to those of us who have spent many years with it.
It certainly is not the end-all-be-all by any means, but Iris has 'earned' its 'place' in my tool-box.
[2c]
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
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- KVRAF
- 1548 posts since 12 Jan, 2010 from Copenhagen
I don't know if that's the point with Iris, seems to me it's geared for performing a mix of 3 plus sub, with all the benefits of realtime tweeking. There's been tools out there that can do Spectral editing on a Sonogram for years,IDM Superstar wrote:here's a challenge, pick a sample and let's see who can make a more interesting 10 second thing out of it.
Spectral morphing? Who said anything about spectral morphing in Iris? I thought spectral morphing was a different technique from what we are doing here? Shoudn't you have posted over in the RayBlaster thread. That sounds like exactly the thing that you don't need or want... My understanding of spectral morphing is where you take the frequency curve generated from one soundsource and impose it on another. Somewhat like the vocoder effect.IDM Superstar wrote: you use iris and i'll use a wave editor or a tracker
my argument, after chasing spectral morphing and additive resynthesis for almost 10 years, is that it's all shit
I can see that if you've been working with spectral morphing and additive resynthesis (not an Iris functionality) with poor results after an enourmous amount of time and effort as being very dissapointing, were you working nine to five, and didn't get any coffee breaks?
I'd say just take a well deserved break, rest your ears, and go on a walkabout..
Personally I've also done lots of experimentation in the past that didn't lead to any golden windfall sonically speaking, but I also get lost when I go travelling and sometimes I find interesting things that are all my own.
Your setup here has absolutely nothing to do with Iris, Iris is about painting on a masked out Sonogram to reveal what the soundspectra is made up of. There's no resynthesis artifacts. There's perhaps harmonics that get revealed that don't play well together but that's your choice as the editor.. There's always the danger of placing loop points in unfavourble spot that cause clicks, or boosting harmonics that distort the output.Hard selections could also lead to artifacts, but they are not because of resynthesis.IDM Superstar wrote: you have a pitch shifter, some band pass filters, an LFO, and on top of it all a bunch of awful resynthesis artifacts
You can dare what you like, any tool carefully used can produce results that are acceptable, it's a time issue, and it's quality issue, garbage in garbage out. It's also just a tool, it's up to the user to know what he's doing as no matter how good the tool used in an uninformed way you can quickly run in to trouble.IDM Superstar wrote: i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
Last edited by TwoToneshuzz on Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
waves break, but somehow it all makes sense.
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- KVRian
- 959 posts since 27 Jun, 2011
IDM Superstar wrote:i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
IDM Superstar, you put the I in IDM, lol. It's almost like you've been listening to my stuff.IDM Superstar wrote:anything is a viable form of musical expression, im just posting about the one that's got a 50 page thread but sounds like it's an SOS using a walkie talkie produced by Real Media over at the glass factory saying there's been a shipping mishap and they're drowning in tennis balls
i was super hyped about this stuff for years until i realized it all sounds the damn same, i thought i'd be spectral morphing a goose into the gravitational collapse of a neutron star by now, but no, it's still squeaky warbly pew pew
Buck heck, I still like turning a pic of a slate into a drone or filtering a pad sound with a tree or a sunset. But from now on, I'll have to read your post every time before I start. Great stuff.
"an SOS using a walkie talkie produced by Real Media" Priceless.
- KVRAF
- 5805 posts since 8 May, 2008 from ssssskipping ......... I left you there
Hello Mr. Superstar, someone accepted your challenge:IDM Superstar wrote:here's a challenge, pick a sample and let's see who can make a more interesting 10 second thing out of it.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19765443
Someone who obviously isn't a Superstar, as you are.
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- KVRAF
- 4218 posts since 15 Sep, 2010
In fact, you've already lost your challenge, man. Richard David James uses spectral resynthesis in his work since quite a long time now. (with success buy the way)IDM Superstar wrote: i dare anyone to make something that doesn't sound like a 16kpbs ambient radio stream from 1998
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- KVRAF
- 1548 posts since 12 Jan, 2010 from Copenhagen
I thought I'd just mention to those of you who are missing some modulation options in Iris that you have very powerful tools in Numerology Pro. In most Hosts. and if you want you could try this:
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/lfotool-by-xfer-record
As an extra level to get your Iris patches activated. You could setup the Macro knobs within Iris and then use the Lfo tool to modulate them or use midi learn in Iris and modulate parameters directly with the Lfo tool.
I haven't used it as I've got my modulation options in Numerology. But I refer the LFO tools as it's highly recommended by a poweruser called Two Soldiers on the Maschine and Numerology Five12 forums.
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/lfotool-by-xfer-record
As an extra level to get your Iris patches activated. You could setup the Macro knobs within Iris and then use the Lfo tool to modulate them or use midi learn in Iris and modulate parameters directly with the Lfo tool.
I haven't used it as I've got my modulation options in Numerology. But I refer the LFO tools as it's highly recommended by a poweruser called Two Soldiers on the Maschine and Numerology Five12 forums.
Last edited by TwoToneshuzz on Fri Nov 09, 2012 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
waves break, but somehow it all makes sense.
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- KVRAF
- 11050 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
^^^ ftfy ^^^TwoToneshuzz wrote:http://www.kvraudio.com/product/lfotool-by-xfer-records
LFOTool is a 'secret weapon'... (shhhh)
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
- KVRAF
- 35294 posts since 14 Sep, 2002 from In teh net
Looks interesting but Cableguys Midi shaper is a bit cheaper but appears to have more midi features (though not the audio processing granted).Shabdahbriah wrote:^^^ ftfy ^^^TwoToneshuzz wrote:http://www.kvraudio.com/product/lfotool-by-xfer-records
LFOTool is a 'secret weapon'... (shhhh)
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- KVRAF
- 11050 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
Here's the details from Steve's page:aMUSEd wrote:Looks interesting but Cableguys Midi shaper is a bit cheaper but appears to have more midi features (though not the audio processing granted).Shabdahbriah wrote:^^^ ftfy ^^^TwoToneshuzz wrote:http://www.kvraudio.com/product/lfotool-by-xfer-records
LFOTool is a 'secret weapon'... (shhhh)
Vids:LFOTool is an FX utility plug-in for VST and AudioUnit hosts for both Macintosh OS X® and Windows®. It empowers music producers to create tremolo, auto-pan, trance-gate, side-chain compressor simulation, and dubstep-type wobble effects with minimal effort.
LFOTool will process incoming audio as well as generate a MIDI message stream for controlling other instruments.
This unique plug-in also allows users to sculpt custom LFO curves and shapes and comes equipped with dozens of presets to achieve desired results quickly.
Consistent with other products in Xfer Records' software lineup, LFOTool is coded entirely in C++ in order to minimize the CPU load during operation.
Features
- LFO with customizable point+tension-curve editor, 12 graphs in a preset (switchable via MIDI notes or automation)
- up to 4 graphs simultaneously (Cutoff/Reso/Pan/Pitch)
- graph preset shapes from a drop-down menu, able to save your own
- can optionally send MIDI CC out to control other softsynths, effects, or external hardware which responds to MIDI CC messages.
- BPM (with optional swing) or Hz LFO rate control
- sample-accurate sync
- dozens of presets included
- both Mac OSX and Windows versions included
- 64-bit VST and AudioUnit support
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xj3daxaA2mo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFOuDh3BgB4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94MRdk9zTHw
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
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- KVRAF
- 1548 posts since 12 Jan, 2010 from Copenhagen
Lfo tool combined with Iris as it is now basically blows the lid of the limitations of the program.
Consider having two instances of Iris load with six identical samples in each of the slots then modulating the heck of of each to get different spectral thinks happening with different pan curvers pitch bends, frequency savy compression effects and you probably will never get to the bottom of whats possible with just a few well chosen samples with braod spectral content.
I have Numerology that can pretty well do the same so right now I'm working with a bout twelve Lfo's modulating various parameters, like pan Lfo amount and speed. On one Instance of Iris.
But again all this modulation is more post production on an almost finished sound materiel. The core activity in Iris is getting/choosing/assembling good material to work with and the Sonogram painting..
Sonogram painting can actually also be used to create pseudo Lfo effects directly. You could also use the output from and Iris instance fed nto an envelope follower and patch that into a CV for making a amplitude control on another instances of Iris's output.
Consider having two instances of Iris load with six identical samples in each of the slots then modulating the heck of of each to get different spectral thinks happening with different pan curvers pitch bends, frequency savy compression effects and you probably will never get to the bottom of whats possible with just a few well chosen samples with braod spectral content.
I have Numerology that can pretty well do the same so right now I'm working with a bout twelve Lfo's modulating various parameters, like pan Lfo amount and speed. On one Instance of Iris.
But again all this modulation is more post production on an almost finished sound materiel. The core activity in Iris is getting/choosing/assembling good material to work with and the Sonogram painting..
Sonogram painting can actually also be used to create pseudo Lfo effects directly. You could also use the output from and Iris instance fed nto an envelope follower and patch that into a CV for making a amplitude control on another instances of Iris's output.
Last edited by TwoToneshuzz on Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
waves break, but somehow it all makes sense.