KVR Audio

osiris · Post by **osiris** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:00 pm

Personally, I don't think it's in decline. I think it's a fair and open marketplace with healthy competition. Now, if only I had the same kind of deal from cable companies. Can you say mon-o-pol-y?

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:12 pm

osiris wrote:Blame Apple and the 99 cent app ......

Dang Apple....

I was expecting this thread to become another one of those.."it's the end of the music industry and we know it" types of thread...

Arglebargle · Post by **Arglebargle** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:39 pm

I think it's great that talented small developers have forced the big guys to lower their prices, that's what a healthy market is all about.

Michael Carnes · Post by **Michael Carnes** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:53 pm

valhallasound wrote:
Between Exponential Audio and Valhalla DSP, there are 2 total employees, with no overlap.

Sean Costello

There must be more. I see myself coming and going.

Lotuzia · Post by **Lotuzia** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:53 pm

This is called deflation.

And it has consequences.

One part of the problem is exponential piracy. Eventually the biggest part. And it has evolved too over years. Both in the ways it is spread, as like in its mental representation in young people heads ( This is "normal", and the ones who pay are just " stupid " )

Another part of the problem is crisis. Probably the biggest part ATM. As everyone knows, putting food in the plate is more important than plug ins. Or music fwiw. Emerging countries market might be a solution for car manufacturers, it is not in software : Just ask any company their % of Chinese customers. In these countries pirac_y is just as massive as the net culture is emerging. ( And I'll take this opportunity to salute my rare Chinese users who might read this

)

Then there are other specific problems, like market saturation.

Some of the biggest players decide to orientate their market towards hardware, like NI or Arturia. This is a sign. While some other -big- sf companies lay off employees. Most of the successfull HW companies dont invest on the sf market. Other signs.

So crisis might end. Or become worse. Pirac_y might decrease. Or not. Nowhere did I see a divine law that says " It has to be always there. We can't do anything about that ". We'll see.

Still, some people are inventing new things. So ... it's not dead.

LtZ

Harry_HH · Post by **Harry_HH** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:12 pm

osiris wrote:Personally, I don't think it's in decline. I think it's a fair and open marketplace with healthy competition. Now, if only I had the same kind of deal from cable companies. Can you say mon-o-pol-y?

Exately. Internet (and information exchange such as KVR)plays a big role here. Also, we have to understand that music software busines is not apart of other economis and right now Europe and partly Asia and USA are in recession. When the global economics one day is again booming, the plugin prices go up as well, for sure. H.

Mutant · Post by **Mutant** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:27 pm

It is not piracy that forces the big overpriced plugins to become cheaper.

It is good and great freeware that makes it not as absolutely necessary to buy these overpriced plugins anymore.

fedexnman · Post by **fedexnman** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:43 pm

I also think the Native Host Plug-ins that come with ( insert DAW name here ) are getting better too .

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:53 pm

Piracy? When have we last seen a working crack of a decent plugin?

The era of keygens has been over for a while and nothing is easier than making a crack not work.

I suppose this is why the big crack teams have given up. They all lost whatever reputation they had, so there's nothing in it anymore.

This also means that stuff that formerly wasn't protected well (i.e. most indie devs) is now available for money only. Thus, less budget for the big boys with their dongles...

liquidsound · Post by **liquidsound** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:05 pm

Piracy is not corruptible with lower prices. I see this daily with people try to snatch Android apps, going hours on sites, not to spend a dollar.
It's a disease. Lower price its not a vaccine.

There is an economic crisis everywhere and competition with offers like a Chinese menu. Same food in 10,000 variations according to today appetite and tomorrow another lunch slight different.

And holidays, where some developer can come down to earth without loosing face hiding their outrageous greed and over profits once or twice a year.

I support the fearless developer, the ones without paranoia, trusting us in general and working with us. I think those are the ones that are finally leveling the market price in these difficult economical times.

mellotronaut · Post by **mellotronaut** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:13 pm

Urs wrote:
This also means that stuff that formerly wasn't protected well (i.e. most indie devs) is now available for money only. Thus, less budget for the big boys with their dongles...

this is an interesting thesis. people bought the expensive dongled stuff and used the 'free' cracks from non dongled software. seems plausible.

johnnyvn · Post by **johnnyvn** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:20 pm

In the case of Lexicon, it could also be that their corporate culture, coming from hardware, started pricing the PCM products high so as not to cannibalize their hardware sales. But over time, as hardware sales (presumably) declined, and their software sales were low, they realized that they could have a better time of it by lowering their software pricing. Obviously, this is just a guess.

Michael C., I know you are the programmer that I mentioned (I just couldn't remember your name), and while your departure from Lexicon may have been traumatic and difficult in certain ways, now that you have Exponential (I didn't know that until I saw your post), you may be realizing that you might be able to have a more satisfying time in certain ways by not working with a major corp, as some of our favorite plugs come from companies that are just 1 person or certainly not more than 5 or so. And I love to support these peeps by paying for their great products!

@midnight · Post by **@midnight** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:22 pm

Piracy doesn't hurt the industry nearly as much as people say it does. Its more of an emotional thing, dev gets pissed when he sees his plugin can be nabbed for free. The thing is, that person wouldn't have bought the plugin anyways. They are just downloading it because its there. They would be doing something else or using freeware if it wasn't. In my experience, people that are serious about their hobby pay for their stuff, period.

And obviously, plugins are the future. Software is replacing boxes and chemicals in all facets of life. It is far, far cheaper and easier to produce, it never breaks, take up zero space, etc etc....

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:27 pm

@midnight wrote:In my experience, people that are serious about their hobby pay for their stuff, period.

It's something strangely satisfying about owning software.

Downloading pirated goods maybe easy and cost-effective, but feels empty in comparison with owning it.

johnnyvn · Post by **johnnyvn** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:39 pm

Urs, I hadn't noticed that you had posted on this thread, too. My spirits are uplifted to hear that you feel that piracy isn't playing a large role in this story. I think I own every single one of your products and love them all. And I support many of your sub-developers who release soundsets for your soft-synths...I just paid the guy who is releasing that new pad bank for Zebra later this month.

Interestingly, for me, I'm much more likely to buy something when the price is right (duh!). When synth soundsets are $50.00, I have to think long and hard about making the purchase. When they are $25.00, I'm still doing a little bit of thinking but my hand is much closer to the "BUY" button. When they're $15.00, I'm touching the keyboard to make the purchase, and when they're $5-10, I'm rushing to complete the purchase!

The reason I mentioned kracks is because of what one other poster above noted. Waves seemed to have their DRM on lock-down by using their (often-too-hard-even-for-their-customers) protection scheme, but 2-3 years ago, I started having engineers come into my commercial facility with kracks of the Mercury bundle. It seemed like all of a sudden, everyone had it. And this saddened me deeply, because being in the music industry for as long as I have, I've seen what piracy has done to it...sooooo many people left the industry.

And so this thread was theoretically asking that same question. I'm glad to know that U-He seems comfortable with the way things are going, as I love your products and will keep owning them legally as long as you keep putting them out!

Are we seeing the decline of the plug-in industry?