KVR Audio

ludvicek · Post by **ludvicek** » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:45 am

I bought vb3 half year ago because it was and IMHO still is the best vst hammond emulation. Since B3 actually is an additive synthesizer I don't believe samples are a way to go. But I'm quite sure he cannot send version 2 out in next few months because it's in mojo

evilantal · Post by **evilantal** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 10:54 am

Just got the news that VB3 is finally 64-bit!
Now I can remove the last jbridged plugin from my setup

No need for a new king anymore in my book. The true king's back...

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 12:19 pm

evilantal wrote:Just got the news that VB3 is finally 64-bit!
Now I can remove the last jbridged plugin from my setup

No need for a new king anymore in my book. The true king's back...

Just downloaded the 64-bit plugins. Works nicely in Live 9.1.2 64-bit here.
Indeed no need for another Hammond plugin here...

Ingo

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:13 pm

Was about time!

Happy days

idiotboy · Post by **idiotboy** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:38 pm

Where are you finding the 64-bit version? I only see the old version on the GSI site.

http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=showproduct&b=24

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:01 pm

idiotboy wrote:Where are you finding the 64-bit version? I only see the old version on the GSI site.

http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=showproduct&b=24

Hi,

it'S at the download section:
http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=downloads

It is possible you need to re-enter your user name and serial number to use the full version.

Ingo

Spitfire31 · Post by **Spitfire31** » Tue Apr 29, 2014 9:13 pm

And just a FYI for Mac users: the VB3 64 bit is Windows only, at this stage.

Guido is working on the Mac version, but no ETA yet.

/Joachim

Jace-BeOS · Post by **Jace-BeOS** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:31 pm

I cannot understand why there are so many emulations of organs and Rhodes pianos. It's much weirder to me than the analog modeling craze. Is it just a case of "a real B3 costs too much to own but everyone loves the sound"? I can't tell whatsoever the difference between real or emulated Hammond or Rhodes when I listen to music albums. I'm sure having a real version of both would be ideal for playing (well, the Rhodes at least), but it's just another sound to me. What makes these things so constantly repeatedly recreated by software (and hardware) makers? Every synth I own has a preset (more like forty) that mimic both.

Funkybot's Evil Twin · Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:13 pm

Jace-BeOS wrote:I cannot understand why there are so many emulations of organs and Rhodes pianos. It's much weirder to me than the analog modeling craze. Is it just a case of "a real B3 costs too much to own but everyone loves the sound"? I can't tell whatsoever the difference between real or emulated Hammond or Rhodes when I listen to music albums. I'm sure having a real version of both would be ideal for playing (well, the Rhodes at least), but it's just another sound to me. What makes these things so constantly repeatedly recreated by software (and hardware) makers? Every synth I own has a preset (more like forty) that mimic both.

The reason there are so many is that they're classic sounds that have been all over the history of pop/rock music since the 60's. It's quite easy to hear the difference between a B3 or a good emulation, and a hammond patch on a synth. The two aren't even close. Same for Rhodes and Wurlitzer sounds.

No_Use · Post by **No_Use** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:23 pm

Jace-BeOS wrote:Is it just a case of "a real B3 costs too much to own but everyone loves the sound"?

Add to that the following:

If you're gigging and had to choose between always moving around a real B3 and a real Leslie or a MIDI keyboard and a laptop instead which would you prefer ?

Bubbamusic · Post by **Bubbamusic** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:35 pm

I must be missing something, but what is wrong with N.I.'s Vintage Organs library for Kontakt? That was the replacement for B4. I don't use it much, but I can usually get what I want out of it. Has a great Green Onions patch. Just like Booker T.

Spitfire31 · Post by **Spitfire31** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:39 pm

Jace-BeOS wrote:I can't tell whatsoever the difference between real or emulated Hammond or Rhodes when I listen to music albums.

That might be because you apparently haven't played a real, physical Hammond with a real, physical Leslie?

If you had, you'd realise that capturing/creating the extremely complex interrelationship between an electromechanical tone generator, a tube amp and a spinning horn-and-baffle is no easy thing.

So many have tried. Some have come closer than others and there's arguably still room for improvement.

I'll agree that in a busy mix, the finer points might get lost. But if you're soloing, there're big differences between the various emulations.

/Joachim

Funkybot's Evil Twin · Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:51 pm

Bubbamusic wrote:I must be missing something, but what is wrong with N.I.'s Vintage Organs library for Kontakt? That was the replacement for B4. I don't use it much, but I can usually get what I want out of it. Has a great Green Onions patch. Just like Booker T.

I think there's a feeling that it's a well made sample library versus a true emulation. There's lots of finer points to the Hammond sound that may be difficult to pull of in a sample library. Tonewheel leakage, foldover, nailing the vibrato, the drive, the entire leslie speaker emulation.

That's why some people still prefer B4, or even better, GSi's VB3. My guess is that the raw tonewheel sound of Vintage Organs has both beat in that regard, but the others do a better job of emulating the other aspects of the B3.

I love VB3 but I think the drive/distortion sounds too crunchy, and the Leslie simulation could use some improvement. I bet Guido could do an even better job if he did it over, which it sounds like he's doing, so I look forward to his work. For my money, VB3+Amplitube 3's leslie are the way to go.

BERFAB · Post by **BERFAB** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:09 pm

Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote:
Jace-BeOS wrote:I cannot understand why there are so many emulations of organs and Rhodes pianos. It's much weirder to me than the analog modeling craze. Is it just a case of "a real B3 costs too much to own but everyone loves the sound"? I can't tell whatsoever the difference between real or emulated Hammond or Rhodes when I listen to music albums. I'm sure having a real version of both would be ideal for playing (well, the Rhodes at least), but it's just another sound to me. What makes these things so constantly repeatedly recreated by software (and hardware) makers? Every synth I own has a preset (more like forty) that mimic both.
The reason there are so many is that they're classic sounds that have been all over the history of pop/rock music since the 60's. It's quite easy to hear the difference between a B3 or a good emulation, and a hammond patch on a synth. The two aren't even close. Same for Rhodes and Wurlitzer sounds.

Couple of things:

1) I don't know how they did it, but Synthmaster 2 has a few very playable B-3 patches. I'm not a programmer, but as near as I can tell, the only failing is the Leslie simulation which, I think, is done using a gating trick and not an Leslie-type emulation. I could be wrong about this though. Regardless, it's one of the few convincing synth patches for B-3.

2) The original Mr. Ray was an amazing Rhodes/Wurli synth edit product that really nailed the sound, but without using samples. I've always found it interesting that one of the easiest sounds to replicate in synths is the vibes, which is essentially a modified bell wave. The Rhodes/Wurli sound is done with tines which is a very close cousin. But I will agree that, other than Mr. Ray, there is generally a world of difference between synth and sampled versions of these instruments.

3) IMHO, the reason for all the different products emulating the same instrument is, in a word, control. Some people like it easy (Mr. Ray only had a few truly editable parameters), and some like to really get in there and adjust EVERYTHING (the old NI B-4 actually had tonewheel sets that you could buy and install to simulate the AGE of the instrument's guts).

Cheers
-B

JCJR · Post by **JCJR** » Wed Apr 30, 2014 8:46 pm

Jace-BeOS wrote:I cannot understand why there are so many emulations of organs and Rhodes pianos.

Hammond and rhodes are fun to play, the feedback between pressing keys and hearing sound and then pressing more keys. Rinse and repeat.

My hammond and grand piano are in the living room, and the EM gear is downstairs in the office. It would be nice to have as good clones possible and affordable of the hammond and grand piano in the office, without actually moving the dang things down into the office.

Last fall I downloaded the VB3 and played with it some, then got distracted and haven't revisited since. First impression was not musical under my fingers, though am certain it would sound musical played by a better musician who better connects to the VB3. I need to go back and play with it some more. Maybe wasn't in a receptive mood.

Had a suzuki hammond x something or the other, that I'd run thru a roland KC-500 and motion sound rotary horn. Had to add a couple of capacitors to the motion sound preamp because it had too many highs. The suzuki wasn't as much fun to play as the real hammond, but was better than the VB3 unless some practice would make me better appreciate the VB3.

So anyway I was dragging dusty stuff out of the old studio, cleaning, testing, either installing in the office, putting back on the shelf, giving away, or discarding if broken. The suzuki was discovered to have some bad custom IC's which are apparently unavailable anymore so it went into the dumpster. I'd like some kind of convenient hammond in the office. Preferably with an incredibly accurate leslie emulation but if push comes to shove I can use the motion sound cabinet. The belt on the motion sound cab was discovered broken, need to order another, though everything else is functional.

Some of the hardware hammond emulators look promising, but don't want to throw large amounts of money at the problem, and I don't want to clutter the office with too many keyboards. The old studio had got too cluttered to be a fun place to work, and am trying to keep the office spartan enough to be ergonomic and convenient.

We need a new king of Hammond plugins!