Vanguard2!

[mhog]

Vanguard has been replaced by other synths in my rack

IMHO Vanguard cannot be replaced. It's like Sylenth1, Firebird, Absynth, Dune etc. They can be called "harsh", "metallic" ,"plastic", "fake", "obsolete", whatever... but they have that particular "character", a peculiar classic sound that one cannot find in other synths. For example, regarding the trancegate, it is very difficult to obtain the same Vanguard's "smoothness" using other synths natively. The only way to do that is via Camelspace or similar. For gated pads and trancegate, Vanguard is still N.1 (for simplicity and results). If Refx will actually introduce a dongle and new (useless) features, I guess I'll remain with 32Lives+Vanguard1. If they will make it 64bit + gate/arp and GUI improvements, then... "wow"!

[Kriminal]

Free upgrades often require payment and rightfully so........

so not free then...

[VitaminD]

So many here expect the worst.. take a deep breath, everyone, please. Let's just wait until more information is given before jumping off of the deep end.

[Teksonik]

That's what I get for postin at 5am....of course I didn't mean to write free....

Free upgrades often require payment and rightfully so........

so not free then...

[Compyfox]

Not free if you have to buy a Dongle to use it.........

As you've pointed out in your own post, it's not known what way reFX will go. It is pure speculation - but even the speculation is highly critisized already.

Chances are that Vanguard will stay USB Key free - but the sideeffects are still the crack community. Chances are, that Vanguard might use the Elicenser system, but the USB key is not mandatory (unlike NEXUS). So it's basically still a "dongle"; but it's locked to your HDD (read: Soft Elicenser). No extra fees in this case. Chances could even be a C/R system like U-HE is using with all bells and whistles... we just don't know yet!

Then again - if you're using Cubase, VSL or something else that uses the Elicenser already - the argumentation is a bit invalid and moot IMO.

Free updates are not that uncommon. Free upgrades often require payment and rightfully so........

Technically, a v2 inclines an "upgrade", the backwards compatibility hints at more features, which would definitely count to that category. But if it's basically just maintenance stuff (porting to x64) with some GUI changes but nothing major - it's technically an "update".

Either way - the newsletter hinted at it that it will be free. So either way it's a win-win situation for longtime users IMO. Critism all good and fine - but this shouldn't be understimated.

An update that only brings 64 bit support and then requires a Dongle will deserve criticism.....but there's not even a release date yet so let's see what happens. If it's just a free update that brings 64 bit support and does not require a different copy protection than version one it will get my respect and gratitude. An upgrade that brings new features but requires a Dongle would be useless to me. Just my personal stance.

No, it does actually not deserve critism at all. At least IMO.

First and foremost, it is still the developers right to protect his intelectual property. If you don't like these measurements - then it's not the developers fault. It actually lies on your personal opinion and mabye bad experience with certain CP systems. You know KVR just as well as I do, and we both know how this debate usually ends. It is actually going that exact same route currently.

Furthermore, as I mentioned above, if you have an Elicenser USB key already - then there is also no need for critism. The USB key also goes for 20EUR street - which is 30EUR less than the iLok2's MSRP (street is currently 39EUR). Though since we can only assume what might happen, chances are that the CP system could turn out to be "Soft Elicenser". So again, it is a win-win situation. And 20 EUR as upgrade fee (in order to get an Elicenser) should be worth to anyone that wants to continue using Vanguard 2, and get free support on top of it.


If I wouldn't have had both the iLok and Elicenser, but there is one tool I use that I depend on even, it's worth to me to spend the money. Actually - I actually spent extra money just because of Slate Digital (switch from iLok1 to iLok2 with VCC). And since the iLok2 was only available through US borders at that time, it took me three weeks until I was able to use my tools again.

To me, it was worth it. To you, it's obviously not.


Then again - that's all down to personal opinion and definitely no need to drag this into an anti-dongle hatefest. Speak with your wallets, people. But technically, even that is a moot argument - since you get a free v2(!). No matter which route it's going.

[Teksonik]

It is pure speculation - but even the speculation is highly critisized already..

If criticism is premature then your praise is as well............Like I said let's wait and see what happens.

Chances are, that Vanguard might use the Elicenser system,

"Chances are" is speculation. If version 2 requires an E Licenser I probably won't install it on my new computer. I haven't installed Retrologue for that very reason. Just don't need or want them bad enough. I suppose if Vanguard 2 is a huge upgrade I would install an EL but again let's wait and see. However I doubt a huge update would be free.

no need to drag this into an anti-dongle hatefest.

And no need to drag it into a Pro Dongle Love Fest either..........

No, it does actually not deserve critism at all. At least IMO.

Yes it does...at least IMO.......and there we have it....stalemate.

Let's wait and see what happens. There is not even a release date yet.

[Teksonik]

Vanguard has been replaced by other synths in my rack

IMHO Vanguard cannot be replaced.

IMHO it was very easy to replace Vanguard......Dune, Sylenth, Alchemy, Zebra2, Predator, Albino, etc do the trick for me. "Smooth" is the last word I'd use to describe Vanguard. But having said that if version 2 uses my current reg code I'll probably install it just for nostalgia's sake.......and if it contains significant upgrades to the sound I'll probably use it again.

But let's just wait and see what happens..........

[manducator]

Chances could even be a C/R system like U-HE is using with all bells and whistles... we just don't know yet!

Does U-HE use C/R?

[Compyfox]

Chances could even be a C/R system like U-HE is using with all bells and whistles... we just don't know yet!

Does U-HE use C/R?

Sorry - serial. But it felt to me as if it was C/R.
Then again, I activated so many plugins recently, that I might mix things up...

Let's wait and see what happens. There is not even a release date yet.

Stalemate indeed - and as you're pointed you, you already have an Elicenser. So... even if this speculation (which I didn't start - I merely commented on it) might turn out to be true (USB key)... it's simple for you at least.

Only that you do not want to use USB key systems. Which is your thing still. But then again... we're walking in circles again.

[Touch The Universe]

So are there any new feature info released yet, when again is the release?

[mhog]

Vanguard has been replaced by other synths in my rack

IMHO Vanguard cannot be replaced.

IMHO it was very easy to replace Vanguard......Dune, Sylenth, Alchemy, Zebra2, Predator, Albino, etc do the trick for me. "Smooth" is the last word I'd use to describe Vanguard. But having said that if version 2 uses my current reg code I'll probably install it just for nostalgia's sake.......and if it contains significant upgrades to the sound I'll probably use it again.

But let's just wait and see what happens..........

IDK... among the synths you quoted, IMO no one can replace Vanguard. For "smooth" I am not referring to its sound (that is a question of tastes), I mean the results when you are looking for a nice trancegate or trance lead: in a few seconds you always get what you are looking for, and its filters help a lot. It is very easy to program and always inspiring. Sylenth1 or some Tone2 synths, or Predator, and of course Nexus2, have similar "smoothness", but (1) they are more expensive; (2) Vanguard is much simpler to program; (3) it sounds more "vintage" (or "classic" if you prefer). Alchemy and Zebra are on another level... they are not "trancegate" synths, they are much more complex. Yet, they (almost) never give you the typical "trance sound" you can get in seconds with Vanguard (or Sylenth1). Unless you plug camelspace in or you program them deeply.

[Teksonik]

you already have an Elicenser.

I doubt that ReFx will use Steinberg's E Licenser....and as I have already pointed out I have not installed Retrologue on my new system because of the E Licenser simply out of the desire to keep the system lean and clean as possible and the fact that Retrologue isn't needed enough to warrant it. Unless Vanguard 2 is a huge improvement I would not install an E Licenser for it either.............

[Teksonik]

IDK... among the synths you quoted, IMO no one can replace Vanguard.

IMO they can.........and already have.

It is very easy to program

I made several times the purchase price of Vanguard selling presets for it.......... Like I said back in it's day Vanguard was a cool synth but the competition has outpaced it over the years.........IMO

Alchemy and Zebra are on another level... they are not "trancegate" synths

They are in the right hands............

[Teksonik]

So are there any new feature info released yet, when again is the release?

No release date....no feature list that I know of.......could be months away or weeks or days.........

I can't be sure but I could swear that I saw that "Vanguard 2" announcement on their site quite some time ago......but again can't be sure.

[Touch The Universe]

I'm surprised it took so long for an update, just glad it won't end up as 'albino' with no new updates