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DUNE 2 is out now!!

Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Thu Aug 03, 2017 6:15 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

chk071 wrote:... and soft synths will be more demanding in 5 years too, so the gap between the performance of mobile devices, and desktop devices will remain the same. Frankly, we will never see something like Monark or Diva on a mobile device. Development for such platforms will always be a compromise to save processing power. And, who knows, maybe people will have enough of that gadget type of thing in 5 years anyway. They're already developing foldable displays now, who knows how a mobile phone will really look like in 5-10 years.


Those apps already exist and (personal opinion) some (Zeeon) will even sound better to me.
But synths like Animoog won´t ever come to desktops :D
Maybe not on smartphones due to the GUI but iPads are really powerful tools these days.
I think nearly all available synths would run on the latest one. IOS might have limitations but also less bloat and easy install, deinstall, plug n´play etc, no piracy, better optimized GUI, you don´t need to support 10 different OS versions and so on.
For sample libraries is not there but for synths it´s an awesome platform and the only usable multi-touch platform as well. I´m sure it has a bright future for music apps. I see more and more developers releasing apps or porting things over there.....resistance is futile :borg:
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fluffy_little_something
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9356 posts since 5 Jun, 2012, from Portugal

Postby fluffy_little_something; Fri Aug 04, 2017 6:20 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Richard_Synapse wrote:Yep, and it's conceivable that some day the smartphone processing power is simply enough to do whatever you want, when it comes to DSP applications. Suppose that in the future we have 10x better CPU performance on our desktops than we have today, and somewhat later smartphones catch up, it's possible that there's simply enough CPU, and that using more CPU no longer improves the audio quality in a noticeable fashion.

Richard


I doubt it, there are certain physical limitations to conventional processors and there is nothing yet to replace them anytime soon. Maybe 30 years from now...
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Richard_Synapse
KVRian
 
726 posts since 19 Dec, 2010

Postby Richard_Synapse; Sat Aug 05, 2017 12:44 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

fluffy_little_something wrote:I doubt it, there are certain physical limitations to conventional processors and there is nothing yet to replace them anytime soon. Maybe 30 years from now...


Sure there is limitations, but I don't believe in stagnation of CPU performance until it actually happens for a sustained period of time. There's a number of ways to gain performance even after hitting physical limitations, e.g. by optimizing the processors as such, by simply adding more cores, by introducing more clever technologies like SSE/AVX etc.

Richard
Synapse Audio Software - www.synapse-audio.com
Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:21 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Richard_Synapse wrote:
fluffy_little_something wrote:I doubt it, there are certain physical limitations to conventional processors and there is nothing yet to replace them anytime soon. Maybe 30 years from now...


Sure there is limitations, but I don't believe in stagnation of CPU performance until it actually happens for a sustained period of time. There's a number of ways to gain performance even after hitting physical limitations, e.g. by optimizing the processors as such, by simply adding more cores, by introducing more clever technologies like SSE/AVX etc.

Richard


Stagnation of cpu performance is just marketing anyway. Give the crowd just some snippets every year. You also can give it a name: Intel :D
They really need a lot more competition.
It even annoys me that the latest iPads are on par (or very close) to my macbook pro i7 quadcore. And it´s getting damn hot too and throttle down.
But everything what counts is what i hear and i want that without dropouts and crackle.
Sometimes a synth uses so much more cpu but it´s not really that better than older software.
It´s also really a matter if a tool is good optimized.
One of the latest super synths even don´t run on my mac because of GPU overloads.
Some developers already seems to use f.e. the metal engine from Apple and the GUI zooms and looks great and don´t use unnecessary resources like it would be a 3D game.
This is (for me) another plus for the younger mobile OS (but yes, especially Apple´s) since i have the feeling developers are "bothered" to use the latest updates and new features and of course it must be more easy to not have to think about a million different configurations of soft- and hardware. Of course i could be wrong here :wink:
(f.e. the new PPG Infinite is iOS only.....for now at least. Some other brands like Moog seems to prefer it since day one).
More important it looks like on single core those mobile cpu even exceed some of the better notebook cpu´s.
So a desktop plug-in really just shines for me if it makes proper use of multi-core support (like Dune 2).
chk071
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12925 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:26 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Cinebient wrote:Stagnation of cpu performance is just marketing anyway. Give the crowd just some snippets every year. You also can give it a name: Intel :D

Funnily, Intel were the only ones which really drove the processor market in the last... 20 years or so. ;) Where were AMD before Ryzen, and where will they be after it? Frankly, who says that the CPU market stagnated must have been sleeping all these years. Realistically, you need to buy a new PC every 3 or 4 years, to keep up with the development, especially when you play games. 15 years ago, i maybe need to buy a new PC every 6 or 7 years. It really develops in light speed these days. And that's surely not AMD's earnings, because they always lagged, and always will lag behind.
It's not "news" anymore, it's "infotainment".
Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:29 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

chk071 wrote:
Cinebient wrote:Stagnation of cpu performance is just marketing anyway. Give the crowd just some snippets every year. You also can give it a name: Intel :D

Funnily, Intel were the only ones which really drove the processor market in the last... 20 years or so. ;) Where were AMD before Ryzen, and where will they be after it? Frankly, who says that the CPU market stagnated must have been sleeping all these years. Realistically, you need to buy a new PC every 3 or 4 years, to keep up with the development, especially when you play games. 15 years ago, i maybe need to buy a new PC every 6 or 7 years. It really develops in light speed these days. And that's surely not AMD's earnings, because they always lagged, and always will lag behind.


We will see.....Intel is the Nokia of cpu´s :D
Notebooks are too slow compared to a tiny and small tablet.
I want an 6-8 core notebook cpu without the fans kicking in like it´s a helicopter :)
chk071
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12925 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:39 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

I'm sure there are, but, you'd have to shell out a couple of thousands, i guess. There are gaming laptops with pretty good performance, e.g.

Edit: Ok, not so sure about that "fan not going like a helicopter" thing. :D Guess nothing comes from nothing.
It's not "news" anymore, it's "infotainment".
Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:49 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

chk071 wrote:I'm sure there are, but, you'd have to shell out a couple of thousands, i guess. There are gaming laptops with pretty good performance, e.g.

Edit: Ok, not so sure about that "fan not going like a helicopter" thing. :D Guess nothing comes from nothing.


But this is where the latest ARM mobile chips like Apple´s A10X impress me a bit. They can do a shitload of things without much throttle and no need for fans. Then you get also some extra sensors for expressions you not find in other mobile devices like notebooks.
My notebook gets even warm while using you-tube. At least the fans just kick in if i render my audio....beside using Avenger...which let the fans kick in after a minute due to GUI issues.
Armagibbon
KVRist
 
409 posts since 20 Apr, 2017

Postby Armagibbon; Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:51 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

chk071 wrote:
Cinebient wrote:Stagnation of cpu performance is just marketing anyway. Give the crowd just some snippets every year. You also can give it a name: Intel :D

Funnily, Intel were the only ones which really drove the processor market in the last... 20 years or so. ;) Where were AMD before Ryzen, and where will they be after it? Frankly, who says that the CPU market stagnated must have been sleeping all these years. Realistically, you need to buy a new PC every 3 or 4 years, to keep up with the development, especially when you play games. 15 years ago, i maybe need to buy a new PC every 6 or 7 years. It really develops in light speed these days. And that's surely not AMD's earnings, because they always lagged, and always will lag behind.

Yea amd lagged a bit. But it sure aint because they hated innovating. Check out this vid...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osSMJRyxG0k

Intel bein assholes sorta got in the way of anything happening until now. Recent lawsuit settlement gave amd enough cash to push out something new and now intel's regrettin it ahahah. But really man I got 8yo intel hardware here and nothings changed. Intel still had their way? We'd still all be sittin on 4 cores for 1000 bucks.
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fmr
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5959 posts since 16 Mar, 2003, from Porto - Portugal

Postby fmr; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:23 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Cinebient wrote:
chk071 wrote:I'm sure there are, but, you'd have to shell out a couple of thousands, i guess. There are gaming laptops with pretty good performance, e.g.

Edit: Ok, not so sure about that "fan not going like a helicopter" thing. :D Guess nothing comes from nothing.


But this is where the latest ARM mobile chips like Apple´s A10X impress me a bit. They can do a shitload of things without much throttle and no need for fans. Then you get also some extra sensors for expressions you not find in other mobile devices like notebooks.
My notebook gets even warm while using you-tube. At least the fans just kick in if i render my audio....beside using Avenger...which let the fans kick in after a minute due to GUI issues.

Are you realistically comparing the performance of a latest generation Intel i7 CPU (which is no longer the top of the line, anyway) with an ARM processor? :lol:

Where are the specs, benchmarks, similar applications running, anything, to compare with? Are you forgetting that in you Macbook you can run several applications concurrently, dong several tasks, all at the same time (it's called multitasking)? Can you do that on your "wonderful" iPad?

Anyway, the top of the line Macbooks cost around $4000, which is outrageous. You can find a similarly speced Windows laptop for little more than $1000

I'd like to se an iPad competing with one of those gaming laptops chk071 mentioned :lol:
Last edited by fmr on Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)
Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:27 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

fmr wrote:
Cinebient wrote:
chk071 wrote:I'm sure there are, but, you'd have to shell out a couple of thousands, i guess. There are gaming laptops with pretty good performance, e.g.

Edit: Ok, not so sure about that "fan not going like a helicopter" thing. :D Guess nothing comes from nothing.


But this is where the latest ARM mobile chips like Apple´s A10X impress me a bit. They can do a shitload of things without much throttle and no need for fans. Then you get also some extra sensors for expressions you not find in other mobile devices like notebooks.
My notebook gets even warm while using you-tube. At least the fans just kick in if i render my audio....beside using Avenger...which let the fans kick in after a minute due to GUI issues.

Are you realistically comparing the performance of an Intel i7 CPU (which is no longer the top of the line, anyway) with an ARM processor? Where are the spects, benchmarks, similar applications, anything, to compare with? Are you forgetting that in you Macbook you can run several applications concurrently, dong several tasks, all at the same time (it's called multitasking). Can you do that on your "wonderful" iPad?

I'd like to se an iPad competing with one of those gaming laptops chk071 mentioned :lol:


Of course you can do that on iPads. Ever used one?
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fmr
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5959 posts since 16 Mar, 2003, from Porto - Portugal

Postby fmr; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:28 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Cinebient wrote: Of course you can do that on iPads. Ever used one?

No, but I was convinced that only one application could had the focus at a time (all the others would remains, so to say, dorment in the background. Isn't that the case?

Anyway, since there are now AU plug-ins (not many, but so) we could make a comparison with plug-in count, I guess. You even have Garage Band on both, so maybe you could perform a test with its own plug-ins and tell us how many you could open in each one.
Last edited by fmr on Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)
Cinebient
KVRAF
 
2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:29 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

fmr wrote:
Cinebient wrote:
chk071 wrote:I'm sure there are, but, you'd have to shell out a couple of thousands, i guess. There are gaming laptops with pretty good performance, e.g.

Edit: Ok, not so sure about that "fan not going like a helicopter" thing. :D Guess nothing comes from nothing.


But this is where the latest ARM mobile chips like Apple´s A10X impress me a bit. They can do a shitload of things without much throttle and no need for fans. Then you get also some extra sensors for expressions you not find in other mobile devices like notebooks.
My notebook gets even warm while using you-tube. At least the fans just kick in if i render my audio....beside using Avenger...which let the fans kick in after a minute due to GUI issues.

Are you realistically comparing the performance of a latest generation Intel i7 CPU (which is no longer the top of the line, anyway) with an ARM processor? :lol:

Where are the specs, benchmarks, similar applications running, anything, to compare with? Are you forgetting that in you Macbook you can run several applications concurrently, dong several tasks, all at the same time (it's called multitasking)? Can you do that on your "wonderful" iPad?

Anyway, the top of the line Macbooks cost around $4000, which is outrageous. You can find a similarly speced Windows laptop for little more than $1000

I'd like to se an iPad competing with one of those gaming laptops chk071 mentioned :lol:


I tryed that but i just don´t like windows and especially the trackpads and building quality is so damn bad on most of them that i prefer to pay more then (also i still get much more if i resell them later too).
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fmr
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5959 posts since 16 Mar, 2003, from Porto - Portugal

Postby fmr; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:31 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

Cinebient wrote: (also i still get much more if i resell them later too).
This is a myth!
Fernando (FMR)
Cinebient
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2368 posts since 16 Nov, 2014

Postby Cinebient; Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:33 am Re: DUNE 2 is out now!!

fmr wrote:
Cinebient wrote: Of course you can do that on iPads. Ever used one?

No, but I was convinced that only one application could had the focus at a time (all the others would remains, so to say, dorment in the background. Isn't that the case?


No. So before you say it´s all crap try to use it :wink:
It feels even more than real multi-touch since you could use several apps at the same time WITH multi-touch.
You can run as many apps as your device can handle.
I see more a limitation on my mac where i have to focus on one window at a time on the one screen i use.
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