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Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

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wagtunes
KVRAF
 
7768 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Postby wagtunes; Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:52 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Synthetic Wav wrote:my problems with these tests is that you try to make both sound the same..a test where you try to show where they behave differelenty would more intresting and usefull to get better emulation, these test are fun but don't mean much . a freeware compressor could sound really close to a 3000 $$ one too if you really wanna match the sound insteed of demonstrating the difference.


I think the point is there is very LITTLE difference between the two and that there is no point in paying $3,000 for a synth when you can get the same sound out of a $200 synth.

And what difference would you show? Play 2 completely different patches? What does THAT prove?

Somebody please show me where I'm getting $3,000 worth of synth that I can't get from a $200 VST.

The demos I've just heard show me that you can't.
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Urs
u-he
 
20824 posts since 7 Aug, 2002, from Berlin

Postby Urs; Fri Aug 21, 2015 8:58 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Show me a well serviced OB-8 for $3000 on eBay or elsewhere... I want one badly!
Z1202
KVRian
 
740 posts since 11 Apr, 2002

Postby Z1202; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:00 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

analoguesamples909 wrote:
zerocrossing wrote:It would be pretty easy to find the places where software failed and do the same test and we'd all know the answer.


With Diva - what are these places it fails? Ive tested I think most extremes I can with an OB8 and Source....there are Unison examples here (which often fail in other softsynths) and full/very high resonance...
I didn't have the patience to listen to all the examples in the comparison, but what I would expect are basically the extreme setting of anything:
- very low and very high cutoff
- very high resonance across the entire cutoff range
- the same with different amounts of the filter input signal, from zero (selfoscillation) and very low to very high drive leveles
- very low and very high oscillator frequency
- try to exite the resonating filter with transients of a very low frequency (several Hz or even less) oscillator at various drive levels, use different waveforms
- very short filter/osc/pw envelope times, also with various amounts of filter drive
- all possible kinds of audio rate modulations, including noise as the modulation source, linear/exp and thruzero fm
- whatever else is possible :D
I don't know the architecture of the synths in question, so I don't know which of the above is possible, but you get the idea :D
Last edited by Z1202 on Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:04 am, edited 2 times in total.
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fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
 
9111 posts since 5 Jun, 2012, from Portugal

Postby fluffy_little_something; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:00 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Urs wrote:Show me a well serviced OB-8 for $3000 on eBay or elsewhere... I want one badly!


Which do you think is Diva? :D
Z1202
KVRian
 
740 posts since 11 Apr, 2002

Postby Z1202; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:03 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Urs wrote:Show me a well serviced OB-8 for $3000 on eBay or else...
:D :D :D
@Urs: I hope you don't mind me changing your message a little, just couldn't resist the pun :D
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Urs
u-he
 
20824 posts since 7 Aug, 2002, from Berlin

Postby Urs; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:13 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Z1202 wrote:
Urs wrote:Show me a well serviced OB-8 for $3000 on eBay or else...
:D :D :D
@Urs: I hope you don't mind me changing your message a little, just couldn't resist the pun :D

:lol: :lol: :lol:
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david.beholder
KVRian
 
1212 posts since 12 Sep, 2007

Postby david.beholder; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:21 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

FTW? I don't see neither link to original post on gearslutz nor words of enormous respect to the the swan808...
Image Murderous duck!
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analoguesamples909
KVRAF
 
1641 posts since 28 Dec, 2007

Postby analoguesamples909; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:29 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

david.beholder wrote:FTW? I don't see neither link to original post on gearslutz nor words of enormous respect to the the swan808...


no need I am SWAN808 :party:
Classic OB presets for u-he Diva -> http://swanaudio.co.uk/
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wagtunes
KVRAF
 
7768 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Postby wagtunes; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:30 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Z1202 wrote:
analoguesamples909 wrote:
zerocrossing wrote:It would be pretty easy to find the places where software failed and do the same test and we'd all know the answer.


With Diva - what are these places it fails? Ive tested I think most extremes I can with an OB8 and Source....there are Unison examples here (which often fail in other softsynths) and full/very high resonance...
I didn't have the patience to listen to all the examples in the comparison, but what I would expect are basically the extreme setting of anything:
- very low and very high cutoff
- very high resonance across the entire cutoff range
- the same with different amounts of the filter input signal, from zero (selfoscillation) and very low to very high drive leveles
- very low and very high oscillator frequency
- try to exite the resonating filter with transients of a very low frequency (several Hz or even less) oscillator at various drive levels, use different waveforms
- very short filter/osc/pw envelope times, also with various amounts of filter drive
- all possible kinds of audio rate modulations, including noise as the modulation source, linear/exp and thruzero fm
- whatever else is possible :D
I don't know the architecture of the synths in question, so I don't know which of the above is possible, but you get the idea :D


Okay can somebody please do what this person wants with the OB 8 and Diva so we can finally put this thing to rest.
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analoguesamples909
KVRAF
 
1641 posts since 28 Dec, 2007

Postby analoguesamples909; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:35 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

wagtunes wrote:
Okay can somebody please do what this person wants with the OB 8 and Diva so we can finally put this thing to rest.


sheesh I spent a year comparing and the guy didnt even listen to my examples...

I can tell you from a bit of experience that I have tried plenty of sounds many like the ones mentioned - and there is often a sense (as an analogue enthusiast) that one thinks 'oh Diva wont be able to do this one...'...but for all the ones I tried Diva does indeed got close. Exactly the same - maybe not...but there was a limit to how hard I could comparatively push it because I had simple architecture analogue synths...at the end of the day I like simple musical sounds anyway...

I recommend if someone has advanced ideas about what should be tested - go test them and post the results! :phones:
Last edited by analoguesamples909 on Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
Classic OB presets for u-he Diva -> http://swanaudio.co.uk/
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IncarnateX
KVRAF
 
2722 posts since 25 Jan, 2009, from Forgotten Realms

Postby IncarnateX; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:38 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

wagtunes wrote:Somebody please show me where I'm getting $3,000 worth of synth that I can't get from a $200 VST


Wow! So if I buy DIVA t can actually make me hallucinate to an extent where I see the OB8 in front of me and can feel and play it tactically?

Why do people keep thinking that it is the end product sound that matters for analog lovers, including themselves? It is an illusion. Preferences for analog synths can be explained by several factors apart from the sound of them. We do not need a new blind test to show that.

And It tells a lot when people in this thread start to talk about which sound they "prefer" or is more "warm", when the examples are so friggin bloody obvious similar. It seems hilarious....but it makes perfect sense from a psychological point of view. As a delusion it is harmless though, and there are no reasons to diss it as such. Delusions are okay if they make people happy and harm no one. :D
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wagtunes
KVRAF
 
7768 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Postby wagtunes; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:40 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

analoguesamples909 wrote:
wagtunes wrote:
Okay can somebody please do what this person wants with the OB 8 and Diva so we can finally put this thing to rest.


sheesh I spent a year comparing and the guy didnt even listen to my examples...

I can tell you from a bit of experience that I have tried plenty of sounds many like the ones mentioned - and there is often a sense (as an analogue enthusiast) that one thinks 'oh Diva wont be able to do this one...'...but for all the ones I tried Diva does indeed got close. Exactly the same - maybe not...

I recommend if someone has advanced ideas about what should be tested - go test them and post the results! :phones:


I believe you. Personally, I feel that hardware synths are vastly overrated compared to SOME soft synths. Mind you, a lot of soft synths, even to my poor ears, sound TERRIBLE. But Diva is NOT one of them. As much as I fought against getting it in the first place, I can honestly say that the sound is excellent and your test has me totally confused. I have no idea which is which.

But the hardware die hards will forever insist that there is this HUGE difference that justifies spending thousands of dollars on a sound that you can get for 200 bucks.

Whatever. I'm tired of the whole argument.
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wagtunes
KVRAF
 
7768 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Postby wagtunes; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:43 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

IncarnateX wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Somebody please show me where I'm getting $3,000 worth of synth that I can't get from a $200 VST


Wow! So if I buy DIVA t can actually make me hallucinate to an extent where I see the OB8 in front of me and can feel and play it tactically?

Why do people keep thinking that it is the end product sound that matters for analog lovers, including themselves? It is an illusion. Preferences for analog synths can be explained by several factors apart from the sound of them. We do not need a new blind test to show that.

And It tells a lot when people in this thread start to talk about which sound they "prefer" or is more "warm", when the examples are so friggin bloody obvious similar. It seems hilarious....but it makes perfect sense from a psychological point of view. As a delusion it is harmless though, and there are no reasons to diss it as such. Delusions are okay if they make people happy and harm no one. :D


Fine, if it's all a psychological thing and all about being able to physically turn dials and move sliders that makes one prefer one over the other, great. But if it's about sound and how Diva sounds like a wet rag and the OB 8 sounds like the Gods from Mt Olympus in comparison, sorry, I don't hear it.
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analoguesamples909
KVRAF
 
1641 posts since 28 Dec, 2007

Postby analoguesamples909; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:44 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

yes the sound is close (with some small differences IMO) but the experience of owning an analogue synth is great as a bespoke instrument with control surface and a little bit of character. However Diva is good at replicating the sounds - honestly its great to have both.

SOme people its worth the money because they love that small difference, or they make a lot of synth driven music...others they like more modern VA sound - and dont need very authentic analogue sound very often...its really horses for courses...its nice to have Diva available for $200...and its nice to have the hardware

Now buy my presets and have Diva sounding REALLY analogue 8) :P
Classic OB presets for u-he Diva -> http://swanaudio.co.uk/
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IncarnateX
KVRAF
 
2722 posts since 25 Jan, 2009, from Forgotten Realms

Postby IncarnateX; Fri Aug 21, 2015 9:45 am Re: Diva vs Analogue - a real world test

Z1202 wrote:I didn't have the patience to listen to all the examples in the comparison, but what I would expect are basically the extreme setting of anything:
- very low and very high cutoff
- very high resonance across the entire cutoff range
- the same with different amounts of the filter input signal, from zero (selfoscillation) and very low to very high drive leveles
- very low and very high oscillator frequency
- try to exite the resonating filter with transients of a very low frequency (several Hz or even less) oscillator at various drive levels, use different waveforms
- very short filter/osc/pw envelope times, also with various amounts of filter drive
- all possible kinds of audio rate modulations, including noise as the modulation source, linear/exp and thruzero fm
- whatever else is possible :D
I don't know the architecture of the synths in question, so I don't know which of the above is possible, but you get the idea :D


Eh....I think it is your own job to test your hypotheses. The burden of evidence is on you here, so can you please demonstrate by virtue of some examples?
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