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fisherKing
KVRAF
 
1626 posts since 6 Aug, 2009

Postby fisherKing; Wed May 16, 2018 6:53 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

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Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
 
6074 posts since 12 May, 2008

Postby Echoes in the Attic; Wed May 16, 2018 11:31 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

Well the recently released session strings pro 2 does make that xml list seem more legit. I just hope massive x is t a reaktor instrument. They seem to be going that way for all their new synths. I'm not sure if they would actually release another non-reaktor synth.
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noiseboyuk
KVRAF
 
2333 posts since 25 Jan, 2007

Postby noiseboyuk; Wed May 16, 2018 12:10 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

Yes, I thought the same Echoes.

I think the only instruments from the Ultimate list we haven't seen or heard about now are:

Middle East
Kontakt 6
Massive X + Library

And these two effects:

Freak
Dirt

Oh, and just possibly TRK-01 but I suspect that isn't a product at all and some kind of internal management thing.
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LeVzi
KVRAF
 
1868 posts since 7 Jul, 2008, from Cardiff, Wales, UK

Postby LeVzi; Wed May 16, 2018 10:07 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

wagtunes wrote:What's this Massive X that everybody's talking about?


This plugin
Forward ever, Backward never
LeVzi
KVRAF
 
1868 posts since 7 Jul, 2008, from Cardiff, Wales, UK

Postby LeVzi; Wed May 16, 2018 10:08 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

noiseboyuk wrote:
LeVzi wrote:Would have to be some huge update for me to go to Kontakt 6 tbh, cannot see it.


Most people who use 3rd party libs will update sooner or later, since they all get released and updated to be compatible only with the latest version. You could just have Player 6 if they're all Kontakt Player libs though.

Sounds like we're not imminent with Kontakt 6 however if we're it's not in beta yet. That either means that although this list looks and feels genuine to me, actual release might still be quite a way off, or they'll do what they did in K10 (as I recall), and release with a voucher to upgrade once the latest version of Kontakt is finally ready to go.

I'd guess that whatever Massive X is, is quite a different animal to the current version, since a) the original Massive is still present and correct in the list and b) there looks like a library which suggests sampled content too, so could be a wavetable / sample hybrid. Maybe this will be NI's very belated answer to Omni, who knows...


Yeah thats true tbh, for compatibility reasons, but i've never used it for libraries tbh, always just as a sampler. I'd like to see some of the effects revamped or expanded upon.
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11026 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Wed May 16, 2018 10:16 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

Echoes in the Attic wrote:Well the recently released session strings pro 2 does make that xml list seem more legit. I just hope massive x is t a reaktor instrument. They seem to be going that way for all their new synths. I'm not sure if they would actually release another non-reaktor synth.


Which, IMNSHO, is awesome. When they release Reaktor synths you have the ability to modify them to suit your needs. They also seem to update them more regularly and this further commits NI to Reaktor, which is also awesome.

I'm also really hoping that K6 brings serious newness in the way that Reaktor 6 did. I want NI to demonstrate that they are also committed to making Kontakt truly THE industry leader. As someone else mentioned, they need to update some of the effects and, IMNSHO, also the filters. I would like to see more power in the synth engine. Ultimately I would like to see it host Reaktor macros, but I doubt that will happen.

I guess I'm not in the mainstream but I really like that NI is focusing on Reaktor and Kontakt. They are tools to build instruments and by focusing there they are able to create new instruments quickly and we get better tools to do the same. I think that they are converging on their niche and they are probably unbeatable there as long as they keep innovating.

Also, Maschine and Traktor kick ass, now let's see some convergence there please!
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EvilDragon
KVRAF
 
16596 posts since 6 Jan, 2009, from Croatia

Postby EvilDragon; Wed May 16, 2018 10:19 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

Sadly Reaktor synths cannot be as CPU optimized as standalones (and no multicore support either), so that's the con of going about it that way.


Kontakt filters were upgraded already in version 5, there's many more of them and they do sound better (courtesy of Mike Daliot, who also coded Massive and did Monark). Don't expect circuit modelled filters in Kontakt, with huge voice counts that Kontakt can push out it just wouldn't be feasible. I don't expect any news regarding filters in Kontakt 6.
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11026 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Wed May 16, 2018 10:36 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

EvilDragon wrote:Sadly Reaktor synths cannot be as CPU optimized as standalones (and no multicore support either), so that's the con of going about it that way.


Don't care, that's not NI's strength it seems. I don't see them going back, but what do I know.

Kontakt filters were upgraded already in version 5, there's many more of them and they do sound better (courtesy of Mike Daliot, who also coded Massive and did Monark). Don't expect circuit modelled filters in Kontakt, with huge voice counts that Kontakt can push out it just wouldn't be feasible. I don't expect any news regarding filters in Kontakt 6.


Well, you would probably know better than I do, but, the filters in K5, while better than K4, are not really good enough. I don't really care about the "huge voice count" arguments because I think that for those kinds of libraries, better filters probably don't matter as much. People are still using Kontakt to create interesting sample based synthesizers and that's where I'd like to see improvement.

I think that there's a lot of room to improve the synth features in Kontakt, but what I would expect to see is a much improved U/I among other things.

While I don't think the Halion filters are amazing either, I do suspect that Halion is going to start pressuring the small dev side of the sample library market. NI needs to innovate if they don't want to lose market share there.
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EvilDragon
KVRAF
 
16596 posts since 6 Jan, 2009, from Croatia

Postby EvilDragon; Wed May 16, 2018 11:30 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

ghettosynth wrote:Well, you would probably know better than I do, but, the filters in K5, while better than K4, are not really good enough. I don't really care about the "huge voice count" arguments because I think that for those kinds of libraries, better filters probably don't matter as much. People are still using Kontakt to create interesting sample based synthesizers and that's where I'd like to see improvement.


I guess that's in the ear of the beholder. IMHO they are definitely MUCH improved and they do take some additional CPU compared to old ones. But as I said, don't expect any new filters in K6, these introduced in K5 are the result of NI responding to "Kontakt filters are not good" that everyone was saying. So it is highly unlikely we'll see any more changes in this area for the foreseeable time. New effects are much more likely.
ericj23
KVRAF
 
2411 posts since 25 Aug, 2002, from here

Postby ericj23; Wed May 16, 2018 11:47 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

ghettosynth wrote:
While I don't think the Halion filters are amazing either, I do suspect that Halion is going to start pressuring the small dev side of the sample library market. NI needs to innovate if they don't want to lose market share there.


I wonder if NI have cottoned on to what Steinberg have being doing with Halion? Essentially most recent Steinberg VST's have been part of Halion sectioned off to be a separate product. This allows for the same code base to be tailored to people's needs/willingness to pay.

So, speculating wildly, Massive X could be a player of wavetables/sample banks produced by Kontakt 6's new wavetable oscillators. It would allow for a preset player (massive x) that would sound great (hell the filters could be different in that), they can sell expansions for it and if you want to make your own you need Kontakt 6. That sounds like a million ways to make money and might head Halion off at the pass.
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
11026 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Wed May 16, 2018 11:57 pm Re: Any news on Massive 2?

ericj23 wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:
While I don't think the Halion filters are amazing either, I do suspect that Halion is going to start pressuring the small dev side of the sample library market. NI needs to innovate if they don't want to lose market share there.


I wonder if NI have cottoned on to what Steinberg have being doing with Halion? Essentially most recent Steinberg VST's have been part of Halion sectioned off to be a separate product. This allows for the same code base to be tailored to people's needs/willingness to pay.

So, speculating wildly, Massive X could be a player of wavetables/sample banks produced by Kontakt 6's new wavetable oscillators. It would allow for a preset player (massive x) that would sound great (hell the filters could be different in that), they can sell expansions for it and if you want to make your own you need Kontakt 6. That sounds like a million ways to make money and might head Halion off at the pass.


As speculation goes, that's pretty top notch! That fits their MO because they could sell their own sample banks and maschine packs It also explains why Massive X isn't a replacement for Massive and requires a library.
v1o
KVRian
 
1051 posts since 1 Oct, 2004

Postby v1o; Fri May 18, 2018 6:31 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

Kalamata Kid wrote:
drdriller wrote:Massive X is coming with next komplete update.

https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... 12.328679/


X = 1
or
X = 1.5
or
X = 2

Someone failed at Roman numerals when they were at school.
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Kalamata Kid
KVRAF
 
3113 posts since 26 Jul, 2001, from Tarpon Springs, Florida, USA

Postby Kalamata Kid; Fri May 18, 2018 9:10 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

v1o wrote:
Kalamata Kid wrote:
drdriller wrote:Massive X is coming with next komplete update.

https://www.native-instruments.com/foru ... 12.328679/


X = 1
or
X = 1.5
or
X = 2

Someone failed at Roman numerals when they were at school.



Someone failed at Algebra when they were at school! :lol:
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noiseboyuk
KVRAF
 
2333 posts since 25 Jan, 2007

Postby noiseboyuk; Fri May 18, 2018 9:14 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

v1o wrote:Someone failed at Roman numerals when they were at school.


Hey, what happened to Massive 2-9?
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Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
 
6074 posts since 12 May, 2008

Postby Echoes in the Attic; Sat May 19, 2018 4:23 am Re: Any news on Massive 2?

noiseboyuk wrote:
v1o wrote:Someone failed at Roman numerals when they were at school.


Hey, what happened to Massive 2-9?


Given that it is called Massive X I am guessing that it will not be exactly a successor to Massive in that it won’t be a VST. I am thinking more and more that it will either be a Reaktor ensemble or perhaps if the kontakt additions or big enough, maybe a kontakt instrument with wavetables like someone already guessed.

I do find it strange though that they release vst effects still but not vst instruments anymore.
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