KVR Audio

electro · Post by **electro** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:03 pm

Seems to be missing audible note release keyclick. Sounds good otherwise.

Stokely · Post by **Stokely** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:29 pm

I'd be interested if someone familiar with Logic's Vintage Organ could compare them. It's not that I'm unhappy with VO, but I am curious if the grass is truly greener out there and I just don't know it

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:41 pm

After some days of testing Blue3 i just decided i do not need another organ emulation at the moment and will stay with GSI VB-3 and a few other options (e.g. B-3 V included in V-Collection 5 and NI Vintage Organs in NI Komplete 10) at least in the near future. I am more or less used to the sound of VB-3 for quite a long time now (independent of which one might be closer to a real B-3 or other hardware Hammonds !!!) and as mentioned earlier Blue3 could not fully replicate that sound for me while Blue3 sounds very nice on it's own and has lots of tweaking options.

If i had to choose one of them a decision between Blue3 and VB-3 for me would not be about "better " or "worse", they just sound different IMO so both could be worth using them.

SMH · Post by **SMH** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:47 pm

electro wrote:Seems to be missing audible note release keyclick. Sounds good otherwise.

There's definitely key-click at note-off. Compare it with Key Click turned down and up. (Also, disable Chorus/Vibrato and put the Cabinet in Direct mode so you can hear the pure organ clearly, and pull out all the stops so you'll get a full 9 clicks.)

I think what you're noticing though is there's no velocity sensitivity on the release click like there is on the attack. (Perhaps he's modeled it, but good luck finding a controller keyboard that actually sends release velocity.) If you turn the Contact Timing (in the Options) to Minimum that should minimize the difference in note on and off click spread.

Maybe an option to give some minimum/maximum/random click spread time on key release would help even them out. (A MIDI processor effect might be able to do this too, in real time even. But only if he's modeled it to obey the release velocity. Maybe I can edit some MIDI to test that. Let me try...)

SMH · Post by **SMH** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:57 pm

Ha! I forgot my old ESQ-1 sends release velocity, no MIDI editing necessary. Blue 3 isn't responding to it though.

So, no, it doesn't model Key Click speed by release velocity. REQUESTING PLEASE!

(As well as the ability to set min and max Off Click time values that it randomly picks a value from between. Most keyboard controllers don't send release velocity so this would be a way to simulate it within a given range specified by the user.)

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Mon Jul 10, 2017 7:47 pm

Back in the 80s, I had a Crumar T2 organ that I though had a gread key click. In fact, I thought the organ itself was amazing. Loved it almost as much as the B3 which there was no way I could afford or be able to lug around.

electro · Post by **electro** » Tue Jul 11, 2017 2:05 am

The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.

egbert · Post by **egbert** » Tue Jul 11, 2017 4:44 am

electro wrote:The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.

Exactement!

SMH · Post by **SMH** » Tue Jul 11, 2017 10:34 pm

egbert wrote:
electro wrote:The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.
Exactement!

That's something even real Hammonds don't have. (And already easy enough to accomplish by splitting the part between two instances of Blue 3 in your DAW.)

chris.r · Post by **chris.r** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:30 am

electro wrote:The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.

Never heard of such feature. Only splitting high and low rotary speaker signals. For me the only big thing missing would be switching between two states of drawbars for live purposes.

wagtunes wrote:Back in the 80s, I had a Crumar T2 organ that I though had a gread key click. In fact, I thought the organ itself was amazing. Loved it almost as much as the B3 which there was no way I could afford or be able to lug around.

Ha! GSi bought Crumar. They make Mojo now

chris.r · Post by **chris.r** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:36 am

Stokely wrote:I'd be interested if someone familiar with Logic's Vintage Organ could compare them. It's not that I'm unhappy with VO, but I am curious if the grass is truly greener out there and I just don't know it

I'd be interested in doing a shootout. Unfortunately I don't have access to few major players like B-5 or Mojo. Has Logic's Vintage Organ a demo version that runs on Windows?

SMH · Post by **SMH** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:37 am

chris.r wrote:
electro wrote:For me the only big thing missing would be switching between two states of drawbars for live purposes.

+1

Switching between the live drawbar position and a stored drawbar preset setting(s) for each manual would be nice. Maybe even offer to use MIDI note-ons for the octave below the lowest note the organ plays for the presets, just like a real one does on the reverse-color keys. (Should also be map-able to a CC#, at least for one preset. That would do for what I need, but keyboard control would be a nice option to have for those with controllers with > 61 keys.)

There's probably also ways around this using the preset system, haven't gotten that far with it yet, I'll let you know if I find a quick technique.

nordickvr · Post by **nordickvr** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:05 am

chris.r wrote:...Has Logic's Vintage Organ a demo version that runs on Windows?

Native Logic's instrument.
So no, no Windows version.

egbert · Post by **egbert** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:59 am

chris.r wrote:
electro wrote:The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.
Never heard of such feature. Only splitting high and low rotary speaker signals.

Line outs and line outs with low pass for the bass line are common mods to Hammonds. Trek make a bunch of hardware modules for mods to Hammonds including the above line out unit, a reverb tank and FX loops.

SMH · Post by **SMH** » Wed Jul 12, 2017 5:14 am

egbert wrote:
chris.r wrote:
electro wrote:The only big thing missing is separated outputs for processing the upper and lower manuals through 3rd party FX.
Never heard of such feature. Only splitting high and low rotary speaker signals.
Line outs and line outs with low pass for the bass line are common mods to Hammonds. Trek make a bunch of hardware modules for mods to Hammonds including the above line out unit, a reverb tank and FX loops.

Not separate line outs for each manual. At least I've never heard of it and don't see how it could be easily done. The two manuals rely on the Hammond's AO-28 pre-amp to be mixed and have Vibrato/Chorus and Percussion applied. Usually any line out mod is done after this pre-amp, not before (where the signals are severely high-impedance and wouldn't work for most line level inputs other than maybe guitar amps, which have high-impedance inputs, not line-level).

Most line-out kits are also for the Hammond models with built-in speakers. And therefore only output what the speaker would have output (i.e. both manuals already mixed together).

See? No dual line outs and all for organ models with built-in speakers.
http://www.tonewheelgeneral.com/build_p ... ccessories

Same, nothing with dual line-outs. (And the effect loop option is *after* the manuals are mixed together.)

http://trekii.com/products/pre-amplifiers.html

Again, it's a complete no-brainer to set this up in your DAW. Just run two instances of the plugin. It's the last thing GG should be worrying about at this point (if ever).

Vintage tonewheel organ: GG Audio-Blue3 has been updated to 1.3