Beginners advice on moving away from VST's

[maudioradium]

Hi,

I'm looking for some advice regarding instruments. I have come from using software synths, such as fm7 and so on. The trouble I'm having is that I don't like many of the negative side effects of using soft synth's due to crashing, over-cpu usage, having to learn new interfaces for different soft synths and so on. I'm not posting here to argue my case about this, I just don't want to use synths run from my CPU on my PC.

So I was thinking about potentially buying a keyboard which, from my experience, provide a very reliable experience. However, I did wonder if there was any alternatives - for instance I've heard of: sound cards with on board synths, sound boards, external sound modules and so on.

To finish off with, I have a very small (only 32 mini key - midi keyboard) and now find this too small, so I was thinking about upgrading. This then led me into the idea of buying a bigger keyboard which also has polyphonic capabilities so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's. However, I'm wondering if there's any other options?

I'd be interested to hear what routes other musicians here use, and also shed their view on my particular situation. Thanks.


Regards,

Tom.

[Tricky-Loops]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

[thecontrolcentre]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

Since MIDI was invented pretty much. How else would you sequence a hardware synth (for example)?

@OP sounds like you want a workststion. KORG Triton, or similar ...

[maudioradium]

Thanks thecontrolcentre. What's your opinion on using external sound modules for my purpouse like the ones mentioned here?
http://tweakheadz.com/midi-synth-modules/

Thanks.

[Tricky-Loops]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

Since MIDI was invented pretty much. How else would you sequence a hardware synth (for example)?

@OP sounds like you want a workststion. KORG Triton, or similar ...

I have never routed MIDI from my sequencer to the keyboard but always from the keyboard to the sequencer...

[thecontrolcentre]

I use hardware and software together. Nord Modular, Arturia Microbrute, ATC Tone Chameleon and a fee others with Live 9. Works great for me ... and can free up CPU for Fx.

[thecontrolcentre]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

Since MIDI was invented pretty much. How else would you sequence a hardware synth (for example)?

@OP sounds like you want a workststion. KORG Triton, or similar ...

I have never routed MIDI from my sequencer to the keyboard but always from the keyboard to the sequencer...

So ... you work in the box. Maybe this thread isnt for you ...

[aciddose]

I find I really only need to choose one good controller, then I'm left wishing I could rip out the junk keyboards I never use from all the perfectly great synthesizer modules which I could otherwise have mounted in a rack.

Unfortunately the sh-09 isn't 19" Although I could probably replace my junos and DX and so on.

Anyway the point is MIDI is a hardware communication protocol adapted to software, not the other way around.

My advice would be try to adjust how you work gradually, not all at once. What you will probably find out is that whatever hardware sequencer you buy is just another PC running another bunch of buggy software. Best not to have that come as a surprise.

[Tricky-Loops]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

Since MIDI was invented pretty much. How else would you sequence a hardware synth (for example)?

@OP sounds like you want a workststion. KORG Triton, or similar ...

I have never routed MIDI from my sequencer to the keyboard but always from the keyboard to the sequencer...

So ... you work in the box. Maybe this thread isnt for you ...

You still haven't explained how you send MIDI (from a DAW) to a (hardware) keyboard...

If you send MIDI to a hardware workstation or to a hardware sequencer, THAT's possible - but not to a keyboard!

[arkmabat]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

My old midiman keyboard has a midi in. But it just goes to the midi out.

[aciddose]

If you send MIDI to a hardware workstation or to a hardware sequencer, THAT's possible - but not to a keyboard!

What are you talking about? "TO" a keyboard?

What is that even supposed to mean?

Most synthesizers come with a keyboard attached, and we send MIDI out of the PC to the synthesizer+keyboard.

Some synthesizers don't have keyboards attached, which is my preference when the thing already weighs enough without one and the quality of the keyboard is questionable.

For example lets take any board, like a juno-106. MIDI comes from the board, but also goes in. The MIDI that goes in controls the synthesizer, the MIDI that comes out can optionally also control the synthesizer (local on) or just get sent and allow the input to control the synthesizer (local off).

For example loading up my own host (I think savihost and a few others can do this) I can play on my PC keyboard and send midi out to my alpha-juno, the audio then comes back into the PC from the aj keyboard (1 out).

Meanwhile I can play the keys on my alpha-juno (1 in) and that midi gets routed into my host, then sent out on another midi channel (4 out) to my ADX-1 synthesizer.

[planetearth]

Hi,

I'm looking for some advice regarding instruments. I have come from using software synths, such as fm7 and so on. The trouble I'm having is that I don't like many of the negative side effects of using soft synth's due to crashing, over-cpu usage, having to learn new interfaces for different soft synths and so on. I'm not posting here to argue my case about this, I just don't want to use synths run from my CPU on my PC.

So I was thinking about potentially buying a keyboard which, from my experience, provide a very reliable experience. However, I did wonder if there was any alternatives - for instance I've heard of: sound cards with on board synths, sound boards, external sound modules and so on.

To finish off with, I have a very small (only 32 mini key - midi keyboard) and now find this too small, so I was thinking about upgrading. This then led me into the idea of buying a bigger keyboard which also has polyphonic capabilities so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's. However, I'm wondering if there's any other options?''

I'd be interested to hear what routes other musicians here use, and also shed their view on my particular situation. Thanks.

Regards,

Tom.

If your softsynths keep crashing or using too many CPU cycles, you should make sure you have the latest versions and that your host OS and DAW are optimized and up to date. You should also look into the softsynth's methods for reducing CPU usage. Many of the Native Instrument plug-ins have different "quality" options for real-time playing and rendering of audio. The rendered file uses the best quality the plug-in can provide, while the real-time audio is an "economized" version of the audio.

If you move to a workstation like the Korg Kronos, you're going to spend at least $3500. You can buy a LOT of plug-ins for that kind of money. And ultimately, you won't get the kinds of sounds you want--certainly not the variety you can get in softsynths. Other than the Virus and a few "virtual analogue" synths, most of the hardware synths on the market are simply ROMplers. They play back samples, and involve very little "true" synthesis. There are almost no FM-based synths on the market today (in fact, I can't think of any), and most of the ROMplers are very expensive and have limited sound expansion capabilities and limited MIDI sequencing tools.

What do you mean "port all the MIDI notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard"? You mean you want to dump your sequences from your DAW into the workstation? That's not a good idea at all. Workstations aren't meant for extensive MIDI editing. You don't have the tools you need, nor the screen real estate to see everything clearly. And workstation sequencers are limited in RAM or number of tracks/songs, where a DAW is virtually limitless.

Hardware synths offer great options for live playing and a few other real-time sound generation things, but they also take up a LOT of space, and they're only worth a fraction of what they cost new when you try to sell them. And good luck getting one fixed. But if something goes wrong with your VST, you can simply re-install it.

I'd suggest you take a look at your host operating system, DAW and softsynths to make sure they're up to date and running as efficiently as possible. The VSTis available today are so flexible and powerful that it's difficult to justify spending thousands of dollars on a workstation. One workstation.

Of course, all that said, I'd LOVE a Korg Kronos.

Steve

[thecontrolcentre]

...so that I can just port all the midi notes from my PC sequencer into the keyboard and have no issues with the VST's...

Since when do keyboards have a MIDI IN?

Since MIDI was invented pretty much. How else would you sequence a hardware synth (for example)?

@OP sounds like you want a workststion. KORG Triton, or similar ...

I have never routed MIDI from my sequencer to the keyboard but always from the keyboard to the sequencer...

So ... you work in the box. Maybe this thread isnt for you ...

You still haven't explained how you send MIDI (from a DAW) to a (hardware) keyboard...

If you send MIDI to a hardware workstation or to a hardware sequencer, THAT's possible - but not to a keyboard!

Pedantic semantics ... the OP is a beginner asking for advice.

[aciddose]

Keyboard is the usual name for a synthesizer+keyboard anyway. If that is the misunderstanding, that's tricky's issue not the OP. The OP had it right.

Not technically right, which I can appreciate, sure. Normally I'd be the one arguing that everyone is a moron for calling a synthesizer a keyboard just because it has a keyboard attached to it. Still though, it doesn't really cause that much confusion, does it?

He obviously meant a synthesizer+keyboard.

[Tricky-Loops]

For example loading up my own host (I think savihost and a few others can do this) I can play on my PC keyboard and send midi out to my alpha-juno, the audio then comes back into the PC from the aj keyboard (1 out).

I've never done this. If it's possible, then I stand half-corrected...

Anyway, the intention of the OP was to send MIDI from a DAW to a keyboard, not from a simple host like SaviHost!