Vortex VSTi - Multi Timbral Groove Machine Beta

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Thanks Andy!

OK ... a few more hours under my belt tonight delving into Vortex.

I had a couple of major crashes and a conflict with NMIndexStoreSrv.exe which is a data base routine from Ahead Nero Home. As I opened the presets drop down menu in Vortex, first Vortex froze with the menu down as well as Cubase freezing, then I got a program not responding message identifying the above file. This happened twice under the same circumstance ... and has never occurred before under any program situation in over a year on Win 7 x64. Anyway, I disabled start of that routine from msconfig, and after that everything went well, except all the presets were gone ... and still gone after a reboot of Cubase. Don't know what it all means, but thought you'd like to know.

Another issue I had was that a MultiSequence seemed to be playing on the 'Techie' preset, even though I did not have the 'red' light on in the master panel on/ lit. Is the MultiSequencer supposed to operate when that light is off?

A couple of other things noted.

1. I had to hit the 'P' button twice to paste a sequence.

2. With the 'A' button enabled, the changing of sequence pages was a erratic, sometimes it worked right away, sometimes it took two key presses and sometimes it didn't change the page at all.

3. Not sure on the 'Set All' button. I thought it copied the current sequence to all pages? But it just copied somethings to some pages on a freshly initialized ... not sure of the language for the collection of 12 sequences, but that's what I mean.

4. I also have a question about latency. It seemed that even though I wasn't using any of the internal synths ... and just triggering midi ... there was a definite lag. I turned my buffer way down and things seemed to improve. It made me think that even though I wasn't using internal audio ... the operation of Vortex was behaving as though I were. Am I just imagining things? If this is an issue, it's a shame you can't provide two versions, one as is and a second stripped of the audio for straight midi application.

5. Finally, I understand to a degree about the internal audio being a rompler, but in the mixer I only see patch numbers, not anything to identify the type of sound the patch number references. Again, am I missing something? Or is there a list some where for reference?

A couple feature request that I would find very useful.

1. Make the little note label at the top of the sequence page used for selecting between pages, the C, C#, etc., darker or a different color if it's an empty page with no data. It would be handy to know what pages were free without having to cycle through them to find out.

2. I imagine you can paste sequence pages between the presets, by loading one and then another, but I wish you could save presets for single pages instead of the whole collection of 12. I'd find this much more useful to be able to set up several different templates for drums, bass, piano, etc., which I could mix and match for creating a new set. Maybe a 'S' save button and 'L' load button by the C/P/D/Q buttons? I'm not saying to get rid of the global preset, just augmenting it with the elements of a single page. I think either TheSys or Consequence do something like this.

3. What about a little 3 or better 4 note chorder where you use the note in the sequence for the first note and then can dial up to 12 semitones above or below that for any of the next 3 notes in the chord ... all locked into the set scale for the sequence?

DF
Help! I've fallen up and can't get down!

Win7 x64 Dual Dualcore Xeon 3.0 Ghz 16 GB Ram. Cubase 6, RapidComposer, BIAB, Abelton 6, Acid Pro 6,Roland XV5080 & Super JD, E-Mu CS PX7, Korg Radias R and MI-EX R, ASR-X Turbo, UAD 2 Quads, stuff.

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I had a couple of major crashes and a conflict with NMIndexStoreSrv.exe which is a data base routine from Ahead Nero Home. As I opened the presets drop down menu in Vortex, first Vortex froze with the menu down as well as Cubase freezing, then I got a program not responding message identifying the above file. This happened twice under the same circumstance ... and has never occurred before under any program situation in over a year on Win 7 x64. Anyway, I disabled start of that routine from msconfig, and after that everything went well, except all the presets were gone ... and still gone after a reboot of Cubase. Don't know what it all means, but thought you'd like to know.
Well that's bizarre! I confess I have no idea how Vortex could conflict with anything outside of the host, we may have to do some debugging to identify where the problem originates.

The presets are gone, I reinitialized them all on the last beta just to have a clean slate for testing purposes, if you can stick to new projects for the time being that would be good, v1 is almost here and then saved projects will be the top priority :)
Another issue I had was that a MultiSequence seemed to be playing on the 'Techie' preset, even though I did not have the 'red' light on in the master panel.
This could be related to the initialized presets, let me know if it happens again.
1. I had to hit the 'P' button twice to paste a sequence.
2. With the 'A' button enabled, the changing of sequence pages was a erratic, sometimes it worked right away, sometimes it took two key presses and sometimes it didn't change the page at all.
Fixed in the next version, I've been optimizing the screen refresh and forgot to refresh the screen after this, so it was happening but the screen wasn't updating until a mouse move..

2. I haven't been able to reproduce, perhaps it was related to 1.

3. Not sure on the 'Set All' button. I thought it copied the current sequence to all pages? But it just copied somethings to some pages on a freshly initialized ... not sure of the language for the collection of 12 sequences, but that's what I mean.
Well it's in the wrong place really, I'm moving it out of the sequencer display. It sets all Lists and buttons to the current sequence values, not sequence data, it's a quick way to duplicate all the lists and Trigger Enables. It also sets channels from 1 to 12 for respective sequences. I can't see the value of duplicating the note data etc.. across all sequences, copy paste does that, I mean you would never want the same data on all 12 I don't think :)
1. Make the little note label at the top of the sequence page used for selecting between pages, the C, C#, etc., darker or a different color if it's an empty page with no data.
Good idea, Added in the next release :)
2. I imagine you can paste sequence pages between the presets, by loading one and then another, but I wish you could save presets for single pages instead of the whole collection of 12. I'd find this much more useful to be able to set up several different templates for drums, bass, piano, etc., which I could mix and match for creating a new set. Maybe a 'S' save button and 'L' load button by the C/P/D/Q buttons? I'm not saying to get rid of the global preset, just augmenting it with the elements of a single page. I think either TheSys or Consequence do something like this.
At the moment, the copy paste will copy the current selected sequence and paste to the selected sequence, ie; not all 12 it works with single sequences so you could copy the C data and then paste it to F for example.

I'm leaving the whole sequence import export for now, there is a request for midi import/export and it may be better suited to use that for exporting entire sets of sequences etc... Is that what you mean?
3. What about a little 3 or better 4 note chorder where you use the note in the sequence for the first note and then can dial up to 12 semitones above or below that for any of the next 3 notes in the chord ... all locked into the set scale for the sequence?
Well actually the existing method is much more flexible, by squashing the scale it leaves the original data unaffected and you can change the scale on the fly. I was thinking about adding a popup to the sequence display to hard change the sequence to a selected scale, but that won't be in v1.

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Astralp wrote:
Well it's in the wrong place really, I'm moving it out of the sequencer display. It sets all Lists and buttons to the current sequence values, not sequence data, it's a quick way to duplicate all the lists and Trigger Enables. It also sets channels from 1 to 12 for respective sequences. I can't see the value of duplicating the note data etc.. across all sequences, copy paste does that, I mean you would never want the same data on all 12 I don't think :)
Actually, yes ... as a starting point, template of a theme sort of idea. Imagine using the different sequences not multitimbrally, (or perhaps not entirely) but as looped sections of the same voice, i.e., same midi channel and other settings and so on. You complete your initial sequence and then in one go copy all the data and settings to the other pages and then make subtle variations for either performance triggering or composition generation midi recording. Nothing says you cannot instantiate more than one Vortex at a time, does it?


2. I imagine you can paste sequence pages between the presets, by loading one and then another, but I wish you could save presets for single pages instead of the whole collection of 12. I'd find this much more useful to be able to set up several different templates for drums, bass, piano, etc., which I could mix and match for creating a new set. Maybe a 'S' save button and 'L' load button by the C/P/D/Q buttons? I'm not saying to get rid of the global preset, just augmenting it with the elements of a single page. I think either TheSys or Consequence do something like this.
At the moment, the copy paste will copy the current selected sequence and paste to the selected sequence, ie; not all 12 it works with single sequences so you could copy the C data and then paste it to F for example.

I'm leaving the whole sequence import export for now, there is a request for midi import/export and it may be better suited to use that for exporting entire sets of sequences etc... Is that what you mean?
Not really. I'm talking about having a way to save ... let's call them 'sub-presets'? ... an individual sequence page, so that it can be loaded to any sequence page in the current 12 sequence page 'preset' ... which would only be copy/ paste functionally ... but could also be stored as a single sequence page with data, of course, to be loaded to a single sequence page in any other preset in the future. For examples, collections of drum fills or bass lines that could be useful for 'recycling' in many projects. Am I clear?
3. What about a little 3 or better 4 note chorder where you use the note in the sequence for the first note and then can dial up to 12 semitones above or below that for any of the next 3 notes in the chord ... all locked into the set scale for the sequence?
Well actually the existing method is much more flexible, by squashing the scale it leaves the original data unaffected and you can change the scale on the fly. I was thinking about adding a popup to the sequence display to hard change the sequence to a selected scale, but that won't be in v1.
I don't think I was clear. I agree the existing method is very flexible and I like it! I'm talking about a 'chorder' for polyphony, not restricting monophony to a specific scale. In other words, the note triggered in the sequence is processed to send a four note chord based upon the selected scale and what I describe above ... a way to create inversions.

I do want to add, I'm finding Vortex the most exciting tool I've come across in a long while! :love:

DF
Help! I've fallen up and can't get down!

Win7 x64 Dual Dualcore Xeon 3.0 Ghz 16 GB Ram. Cubase 6, RapidComposer, BIAB, Abelton 6, Acid Pro 6,Roland XV5080 & Super JD, E-Mu CS PX7, Korg Radias R and MI-EX R, ASR-X Turbo, UAD 2 Quads, stuff.

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Retrigger bug in Studio One, set up a four bar sequence with a drum pattern and when the pattern loops it plays a random sequence, like a fill then returns to normal on the next cycle. I added a synth sequence abd upon retriggering the drums on C were muted! I thing there are gremlins causing havoc in my PC. :hihi:

There seems to be some autopanning effect on the drums initially with the default preset. Also at normal levels the mixer vu is clipping. I brought the levels down but using another track for reference they are too quiet.

Re the names, the problem i can see is not knowing what the drum kits are. Sometimes i switch though the kits and a different sample such as a snare plays on the kick drum. Possibly a bug but a way to rename the channel yourself would be great for reference. Over 16 channels it would be difficult to keep track of things imho. :)

Btw what does the I button do? The overlay shows edit CC2 over that but hovering over the controls doesn't show what it does. Thanks.
Latest release and Socials: https://linktr.ee/ph.i.ltr3

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Retrigger bug in Studio One, set up a four bar sequence with a drum pattern and when the pattern loops it plays a random sequence, like a fill then returns to normal on the next cycle. I added a synth sequence abd upon retriggering the drums on C were muted! I thing there are gremlins causing havoc in my PC. :hihi:
I don't have studio one to test this, did you do any midi logging to see what midi is being sent?
There seems to be some autopanning effect on the drums initially with the default preset. Also at normal levels the mixer vu is clipping. I brought the levels down but using another track for reference they are too quiet.
That's Spread, you can set the amount on the synth page :)
Re the names, the problem i can see is not knowing what the drum kits are. Sometimes i switch though the kits and a different sample such as a snare plays on the kick drum. Possibly a bug but a way to rename the channel yourself would be great for reference. Over 16 channels it would be difficult to keep track of things imho. :)
The first 64 patterns have the same layout, all drum kits are made up of 24 samples, there is a 2 octave pattern to them. 1-64 have the same layout which has the GM layout for the first octave, and then the second octave has bass drum snare, cymbals and percussion. The set at the bottom of the range is pitched down an octave, and the set above is pitched an octave higher.

Drum kits above 64 use a different layout for the octave, using an assortment of different sounds including instruments etc... This is intentional as randomizing then creates completely different rhythms ala Black Magic.

I doubt I will name the kits beyond grouping, there is going to be a lot of them eventually.. If you want the standard kits stick below 64, if you want experimental/musical go above 64. There will be other grouping for percussion only etc...
Btw what does the I button do?
Switches the Info Overlay ON/OFF :)

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Actually, yes ... as a starting point, template of a theme sort of idea. Imagine using the different sequences not multitimbrally, (or perhaps not entirely) but as looped sections of the same voice, i.e., same midi channel and other settings and so on. You complete your initial sequence and then in one go copy all the data and settings to the other pages and then make subtle variations for either performance triggering or composition generation midi recording. Nothing says you cannot instantiate more than one Vortex at a time, does it?
Ok well this needs a different button, I think in most situations it would be a nuisance, but I see your point!

Should be fine using multiple versions, although be aware that midi is slow and so too much data can cause overflows, I do use buffering for CCs, but if there was a a few busy vortexes with CC ENV sequencers it may cause problems. Should be fine with the internal synths though.
Not really. I'm talking about having a way to save ... let's call them 'sub-presets'? ... an individual sequence page, so that it can be loaded to any sequence page in the current 12 sequence page 'preset' ... which would only be copy/ paste functionally ... but could also be stored as a single sequence page with data, of course, to be loaded to a single sequence page in any other preset in the future. For examples, collections of drum fills or bass lines that could be useful for 'recycling' in many projects. Am I clear
I see, I'll come up with an export/import then.
I don't think I was clear. I agree the existing method is very flexible and I like it! I'm talking about a 'chorder' for polyphony, not restricting monophony to a specific scale. In other words, the note triggered in the sequence is processed to send a four note chord based upon the selected scale and what I describe above ... a way to create inversions.
Ahh right like the Omnichorder in ARP, yes it's a good idea but I need to wait until I've decided how polyphony will be implemented, so it won't be for a while, it may actually be unnecesary by then.

I do want to add, I'm finding Vortex the most exciting tool I've come across in a long while! :love:
:) That's great news, thanks!

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Overlay On/Off. :dog: :lol:

The retrigger bug was caused by the note overlapping the looped sequence, it's fine as long as you keep the note to the grid otherwise S1 will play the overlapped note or mess up the retriggering. I'll get back to you about the sequencer bugs.

Thanks for the info about the kits. :)
Latest release and Socials: https://linktr.ee/ph.i.ltr3

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haha, well it's my fault really I need to get the manual updated, the only copy is in my head atm :)

Note overlapping, that is down to the sequencer, I know I've seen posts on the Reaper forum requesting that overlapping a loop be allowed, so i guess Reaper doesn't do it.

I'm trying to get a release out, I've done a fair bit today but I have a problem wit the Recorder which has me stumped... I need sleep.

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BETA 16 is up!

* CC12 Now changes currently viewed sequence
* Changed paint Note Mode so that the default is now paint all notes, and holding CTRL will only paint active notes
* Audio Input added, input Level is in the Master Section
* Copy/Paste display updates properly now
* Velocity Slider moved to the left.
* Sequence Active Marker - Now if a sequence is active (ie has steps enabled) a blue bar will display under it's selector.
* Lights added to show active incoming triggers on the sequence page
* Recorder Added - Press Record, it will begin recording on the next bar of the host clock and record for whatever amount of bars you have selected. Or can be used in manual mode to record for as long as you like.

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Vortex is getting better with each beta. :)


I hope the recorder section can be fixed. 16 bit doesn't work. Defaults to 24 bit and the output wavefile is just clicking noises.

I am looking forward t an updated manual. :)

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Andy ...

Please sleep, eat regularly and healthily, get some exercise and have a little fun.

This is all selfish of course.

I'm sure Vortex will be more of a marathon than a sprint ... and I want to see you cross the finish line.

Take care of yourself!

Como :)
Help! I've fallen up and can't get down!

Win7 x64 Dual Dualcore Xeon 3.0 Ghz 16 GB Ram. Cubase 6, RapidComposer, BIAB, Abelton 6, Acid Pro 6,Roland XV5080 & Super JD, E-Mu CS PX7, Korg Radias R and MI-EX R, ASR-X Turbo, UAD 2 Quads, stuff.

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Boy, can I lie!

I no sooner tell you to take care of yourself than I come up with something else I want you to do!

For those of us with XY controllers, could you assign X and Y controllers to the 'Shift' button? I guess it would have to work in conjunction with something like a Cntrl or Alt key, so when you released that key the pattern of notes would stay where you'd last moved them.

I was messing around using a little percussion sequence on top of a 4 to the floor beat, just shifting it up or down a step or two to the rhythm. Wow! Even though the changes were basically random and not preplanned for the changes, keeping the same groove with new drum hits sounded great. I can envision shifting it right or left against an alternating grid of mutes on the sequence to bring in preplanned perc hits by sliding into the unmuted steps consistently on the same beat in the sequence. This would be great for performance with and XY controller.

That also raises a couple of other questions for me: What are the rules when notes are added or moved to a new position in a sequence while it's playing? Are there settings to choose to let the note play immediately or only at the next bar ... or are all the sequences basically locked together all the time?

Como
Help! I've fallen up and can't get down!

Win7 x64 Dual Dualcore Xeon 3.0 Ghz 16 GB Ram. Cubase 6, RapidComposer, BIAB, Abelton 6, Acid Pro 6,Roland XV5080 & Super JD, E-Mu CS PX7, Korg Radias R and MI-EX R, ASR-X Turbo, UAD 2 Quads, stuff.

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Haha!

It's an interesting idea! But, I have reservations about it as it stands because shift happens on GUI side and so it isn't sample locked. It would be better for it to happen on the DSP side possibly by assigning a couple of CCs to shift so that it doesn't affect the GUI at all but achieves the same effect. Plus points of doing it this way would be that the patch won't be changed in terms of storage so you always have the same starting point when the project is reloaded, plus it would be recordable as midi events in your host so it could be played back.

Not sure if this will be in v1, I'm quite keen to get it finished and out now, but definitely a feature for 1.1 :)

In terms of rules, the sequence plays whatever is at that location when it hits the step. Notes have their own life, once they are triggered they play regardless of any changes.

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Como have you had any crashes or problems with the latest beta?

I have experienced a crash when using the Reso knob, which has me stumped at the moment, I'm looking into that one now.

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Oops, missed this one sorry Mark, really? I thought I'd sorted that, I'll have another look :)

hmmm yes manual....
MarkSA wrote:Vortex is getting better with each beta. :)


I hope the recorder section can be fixed. 16 bit doesn't work. Defaults to 24 bit and the output wavefile is just clicking noises.

I am looking forward t an updated manual. :)

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