Fragile Gods - "Vanishing Point" (remastered by Seismic & layzer)

[Frantz]

Thanks Himalaya for your detailed feedback. I had a similar experience. I first listened to layzer's remastered version on my earbuds on the train home from work and thought it sounded fantastic. Then I listened to it on my "good" speakers and noticed the prominence of the hi hats, the amount of compression, and the potential for fatigue.

layzer's version is sort of like a radio mix where everything is bright and exciting. Certain sounds, like the synth behind vocals during the verses, sound incredible but the hihats can be a little overwhelming. I think the ideal mastering for this track would be halfway between his and my version. Mine really does sound dull in comparison.

The whole process has been very educational. It really demonstrates the dramatic impact that mastering can have. I really need to learn more about it. This is only the second track I have put out and I still have a lot to learn.

layzer: Thanks again for the remaster and all of the helpful feedback on the prior version.

[Mariosprt]

I only heard it on (big close back) headphones but the hats are a bit too much on the remix. And because of this some of the nice sounds get thrown in the back.
It's got more presence for sure. I agree the perfection would be half-way.
Yes, mastering is indeed an art, kudos to layzer. And I too will have to study it one of these days.

[layzer]

first of all, thank you frantz for letting me experiment with what i consider some fantastic 80's synthpop in the here and now. i wouldn't try to improve it if i didnt think so highly of it

here is remaster #2 without the high end sizzle, less compression and reduced low end. i think my over compensation in the highs is a result of being an old timer + years of loud music! haah enjoy!

http://home.comcast.net/~layzer/kvr/VanishingPoint2.mp3

[Frantz]

first of all, thank you frantz for letting me experiment with what i consider some fantastic 80's synthpop in the here and now. i wouldn't try to improve it if i didnt think so highly of it

Thanks layzer. That's a huge compliment. I'm surprised but thrilled that anyone would want to do that. Had I known you were going to continue to experiment with this, I would have enabled download of the original .WAV file on SoundCloud. I have done so now just in case.

here is remaster #2 without the high end sizzle, less compression and reduced low end. i think my over compensation in the highs is a result of being an old timer + years of loud music! haah enjoy!

I think you may have nailed it on this one. It is just as you describe. The differences between this and the original mix are subtle but it does make certain sounds much more present. I would be interested to get Himalaya's expert opinion.

I will put your new master in post #1. Thanks very much.

[Frantz]

Never heard anything like this before
It's very strange and sorta, well... rather good.

I fear KVR has probably corrupted me completely now

Thanks folderol. We are slowly but surely bringing you over to the darkside.

Don't worry it won't hurt ... much.

[2NDMOUSE]

Very like cybotrons' " night drive " , "no UFOs" , but also reminds me of nitzer ebb or front 242.
I'll be honest and say im not a fan of the vocal but I do like the rest. Good job on the mix too as it has a lot of warmth in it. Good sound off that drawmer !

[lwpss]

I'm not an expert in music like this, but this song is well produced and mixed. Nice work.

[Frantz]

Very like cybotrons' " night drive " , "no UFOs" , but also reminds me of nitzer ebb or front 242.

Well spotted. I love all of those especially The Ebb.

I'll be honest and say im not a fan of the vocal but I do like the rest.

Yes, the vox definitely limits the appeal. At some point, I may try to collaborate with a real singer which would allow me to write more melodic material. For now, I'd like to see if I can do an album worth of songs for my not so golden throat.

[Frantz]

I'm not an expert in music like this, but this song is well produced and mixed. Nice work.

Many thanks lwpss.

[himalaya]

first of all, thank you frantz for letting me experiment with what i consider some fantastic 80's synthpop in the here and now. i wouldn't try to improve it if i didnt think so highly of it

here is remaster #2 without the high end sizzle, less compression and reduced low end. i think my over compensation in the highs is a result of being an old timer + years of loud music! haah enjoy!

http://home.comcast.net/~layzer/kvr/VanishingPoint2.mp3

This is much better, although I'm listening on my cans late night so my judgment may be off, but there is an immediate difference for the better. When flipping between the two remix tracks in my host it's very clear. Good job.

One thing I've noticed that whatever stereo process you've used it has affected the vocal, in that the original is placed firmly in the middle and the effects add the stereo widening, whereas in your post-treatment the vocal no longer has the centre point. I don't know which I prefer!

[Moe Shinola]

The tracks sounds amazing, especially the remix. My hats off to all involved.

[Frantz]

The tracks sounds amazing, especially the remix. My hats off to all involved.

Thanks very much Moe. Yes, layzer did a great job on the remaster.

[Frantz]

One thing I've noticed that whatever stereo process you've used it has affected the vocal, in that the original is placed firmly in the middle and the effects add the stereo widening, whereas in your post-treatment the vocal no longer has the centre point. I don't know which I prefer!

Thanks for checking it out Himalaya. Yes, the stereo widening effect stereo-ized the mono vocals. I do like it. I need to play around with that effect on my next track.

My wife prefers the layzer's remaster. I just compared layzer v2.0 to mine on multiple speakers and headphones. layzer's has a more bright, energetic, modern sound. Mine is more vintage sounding which is what I originally intended. I'll just make both available on SoundCloud and people can listen to either version.

http://soundcloud.com/fragilegods/vanis ... t2/s-jFwTr

[seismic1]

First up, I like what you did with the track in the three weeks since the original went up. It's got a nice feel with those vocal changes. It's given the track a slightly darker edge.

I just tried a quick master of this with a tweaked version of my normal mastering chain in T-Racks. I de-emphasised the highs in the Linear Phase EQ, cut the output from the Opto-Compressor, and cut the Input of the Brickwall Limiter by 1dB. I noticed that the level of the original wav was peaking at 0dB so I couldn't do much with mastering compression without overdriving things. I can send it to you if you like. I remastered at 44.1K/16bit

Oh, that pad at the beginning was a good idea.

Good work (both of you)

[Frantz]

First up, I like what you did with the track in the three weeks since the original went up. It's got a nice feel with those vocal changes. It's given the track a slightly darker edge.

Thanks, I tried my best. Now I have an effect chain that I can use as a starting point for vocals on the next song.

I can send it to you if you like. I remastered at 44.1K/16bit

Wow, this is becoming a real team effort. I would love to hear what you did with it. I am sure I will learn from it. Perhaps you could PM me a private SoundCloud link with a downloadable file. Thanks very much!