[ Shane Sanders ] -- Silver Roses

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REVISED!!! :D Same filename as before.

This is so much improved that it's practically a new piece. I'm trying hard to get some of these Asian influenced tunes produced and off my hard drive. Probably best to call this one a world trip hop tune. Can't think of a better genre description at the moment.

The snare is probably loud for some tastes, but I'm liking it right now. Please let me know what you think of the mix in general. Is the kick drum too intense or does anything seem out of balance tonally?

http://www.Futurehaus.com/dubfantasy/Silver_Roses.mp3

-Shane
Last edited by Shane Sanders on Thu Aug 19, 2004 5:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Wow! This was a great piece. (I guess it still is :D )
Color me impressed.

a couple of comments:

I liked the drums/percussion as is.
But the lead whitle- thingy sounds very front and center in a dry, flat kinda-way in the beggining, as if it is too dry? When the bow thing complements it, it fits in the mix better. Maybe a little delay on it would help eliminate the GM sound

I really like the way the organ works in this piece/

What did you use for the bass? I like it.

Look at me trying to give suggestions to someone who has already bested me with his offering. Thanks for sharing this. A keeper for me.
..what goes around comes around..

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Very active, evolving piece. I usually hate(ok, hate is a strong word..) this kind of music, but this is really well done. I think the bass line needs more beef to it, but nice rack, very alive.

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Let me say that whenever I see a Shane Sanders new song post in the cafe, it's an automatic download for me.

Once again, superb stuff. I loved this. I also loved "Nico was a strange girl" for the Aug Comp.

Nothing for me to critique, the mix is perfect for me, the drums are not too loud; love the snare too. I would call this a hybrid celtic-asian piece though.

Good work!
Last edited by koorby on Wed Aug 18, 2004 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Quite a spanky piece of work. I'm really shit at comments tonight, but I thought at least I'd let you know that I had a listen.

Greg

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Okay so since noone said it, I'll do

Even after getting used to the snare I just feel its too active too sharp, I'd have prefered a much duller or woolier snare.

Where this song excells however is in build and composition. Beautiful production too. The kick is perfect btw

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I think it's a bit too synthesiser-shop-demo for me but the mix is spot on again and well executed
My other host is Bruce Forsyth

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i like this shane,and the fact you went for a direct d/l this time 8)

whats the eeeeeeeeooooooooo noise at the start,kinda like a theremin but not quite?

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Sorry to sound a little harsh, but for me this isn't one of your better pieces in it's current state, Shane. The mix is good, but I'm feeling too much confusion of harmony here. At 0:26 you've got the pads playing chilled minor chords and the bass playing a jolly major scale. There's no rule against this, but to me it sounds goofy. In the section that starts at 0:47 the bass has a strange bum note that's out of key. There are some very nice sonic choices in there.
I always feel the same when you use realistic/sampled basses and sequence them in that staccato manner. Every note is the same in velocity and expression, which sounds blatantly computerised. I think its that quality that leads Spaceman to use the synth demo analogy. I think that that type of bassline needs slides/portamento in key places and accents on certain notes. Then passing notes that are out of key can sound intentional.
Every day takes figuring out all over again how to f#ckin’ live.

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Thinking about it, a groove template might add more expression to the bass.
Every day takes figuring out all over again how to f#ckin’ live.

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vurt wrote:i like this shane,and the fact you went for a direct d/l this time 8)

whats the eeeeeeeeooooooooo noise at the start,kinda like a theremin but not quite?
That sound is Sytrus, using the Space Singers patch. I find that patch inspires tons of melodies from me. I just sit there and noodle around as the lovely vibrato just pulls me in.

Thanks to all for the comments. I'll give the piece a few days to leave my head and then revisit some of the comments and make improvements. Fresh ears will help me.

I'm not sure about any bass notes being out of key, however, or that it's robotic in regards to dynamics - timing articulation yes, plenty of work to do there, but since the bass is playing such a prominent role as both melody and change support, I don't know what could be done differently. Uprights are just punchy and don't sustain the way an electric bass sound would, so it invites a more noty approach. There are velocity changes all over the place in the bass sequence, and to my ears the line has all kinds of syncopation that would come from a real upright player (maybe I need a better sample set). I think I just hear tonality in a more synthetic scale kind of way, with less worry about harmonic movement and more emphasis on modal joys. I'll spend more time going through some of my sounds and see if I can find something that suits me as much as the upright. Maybe a sine bass or something? And, of course, there are always other scalar choices, so I might serve the piece better if I experiment more. I do appreciate the feedback as it pushes me toward improving my craftiness. Harmony is not my strongest point, obviously!
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Out of interest, do you hear the minor pad/major bass combination, i.e. does it stand out to you? It's jumping out at me, not because I have any academic training (I don't). I mean, it jumped out before I identified what it was.

I guess it's predominantly the similarity of attack on all the bass notes that gives the synthetic feel. Perhaps a modelled bass (slayer2 maybe) might allow for more expression.
Every day takes figuring out all over again how to f#ckin’ live.

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Great stuff Shane! Sytrus is inspiring isn't it? This track has a beautiful harmonic balance and the bass line is just perfect.


Good luck with this one.

Gordon

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I've taken everyone's analysis and applied myself towards a better piece.

Yep, Luke, it did suck. What do you think now that I've reeled in the tonality and structured the progression in a friendlier way?

My only beef with it tonight is that the first half has a bit too much going on with the kick drum - best to save that for the latter part. So I'll need to revisit again this week and trim out some "wordy" pick-up kicks here and there. I tend to overdo things.

Same file and path as before:

http://www.Futurehaus.com/dubfantasy/Silver_Roses.mp3
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ack! I missed the first mix, so I was listening to this reading all the comments and trying sooo hard to hear what was going on with the bass then I get to the bottom of the thread and it all becomes clear. I'm a bit slow these days...

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