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A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:22 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

aMUSEd wrote:OK great - working now. Thanks. It looks awesome in widescreen mode. Could you please make it save the path to presets too though, it keeps defaulting to the desktop which is the last place I would keep them.

I can get latency down to 7ms which isn't bad, maybe it would be useful to have a minimum phase mode for tracking?

OK I'll check out the presets thing.

Yeah I've thought about a minimum phase mode, I guess I could do it.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
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murnau
KVRAF
 
5284 posts since 13 Jan, 2005, from right behind you

Postby murnau; Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:35 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

my presets load/save under documents which is fine.

any chance to get a permanent info which band is actually focused? also an easy on/off for single bands?

thank you for the great work!
Whoever wants music instead of noise, joy instead of pleasure, soul instead of gold, creative work instead of business, passion instead of foolery, finds no home in this trivial world of ours.
A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:49 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

murnau wrote:my presets load/save under documents which is fine.

any chance to get a permanent info which band is actually focused? also an easy on/off for single bands?

thank you for the great work!

I'm not sure I understand what you're asking. You can see which band is focused because it's the one with the yellow circles around its yellow control, and on/off is double clicking, I'm not sure what else you'd want it to be.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
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murnau
KVRAF
 
5284 posts since 13 Jan, 2005, from right behind you

Postby murnau; Sun Jun 22, 2014 8:57 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

i mean not on/off regulary but muting a single band without losing the values when i bring it back.
the yellow circle is great but i must click on it and hold to see if it's band A,B,C or whatever. not a big issue of course.
Whoever wants music instead of noise, joy instead of pleasure, soul instead of gold, creative work instead of business, passion instead of foolery, finds no home in this trivial world of ours.
A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:49 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

I've updated SplineEQ again. Here's the list of fixes:

  • The preset opening and saving now remember the last location (Mac).
  • Fixed a bug in which the Gain, Frequency and Slope knobs wouldn't visually update correctly before a control point was clicked.
  • Fixed a bug in which some knobs would jump to another value than the one displayed on the first time they would be selected.
  • Improved fonts.
  • Added + signs in front of positive gains.
  • Changed the range and default value for the Delay parameter.

murnau wrote:i mean not on/off regulary but muting a single band without losing the values when i bring it back.
the yellow circle is great but i must click on it and hold to see if it's band A,B,C or whatever. not a big issue of course.

OK, the on/off thing makes sense and I could try to implement it, I just don't get why you care about the band letter thing though, I mean, it doesn't really mean much.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
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aMUSEd
KVRAF
 
27906 posts since 14 Sep, 2002, from In teh net

Postby aMUSEd; Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:56 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

Fantastic thanks
xtrax
KVRist
 
443 posts since 15 Aug, 2010

Postby xtrax; Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:43 pm Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

A_SN wrote:I've updated SplineEQ again. Here's the list of fixes:

  • The preset opening and saving now remember the last location (Mac).
  • Fixed a bug in which the Gain, Frequency and Slope knobs wouldn't visually update correctly before a control point was clicked.
  • Fixed a bug in which some knobs would jump to another value than the one displayed on the first time they would be selected.
  • Improved fonts.
  • Added + signs in front of positive gains.
  • Changed the range and default value for the Delay parameter.

murnau wrote:i mean not on/off regulary but muting a single band without losing the values when i bring it back.
the yellow circle is great but i must click on it and hold to see if it's band A,B,C or whatever. not a big issue of course.

OK, the on/off thing makes sense and I could try to implement it, I just don't get why you care about the band letter thing though, I mean, it doesn't really mean much.


Thank You
On-Off on the bands could be great.
Now it is much faster to navigate thru presets thanks.
On the smallest latency setting delay reported from the Spline EQ is 9ms, and I tried on some instruments in realtime (sounds great).
On this latency setting is still linear phase, or minimum phase?
I asking this because of pre-ringing problem with linear phase.
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aMUSEd
KVRAF
 
27906 posts since 14 Sep, 2002, from In teh net

Postby aMUSEd; Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:00 pm Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

At the moment it seems it's all linear phase but it would be cool if you could adjust some bands to minimum phase, particularly the lower frequency bands which are most prone to this 'pre ringing' effect - and I suspect that could also improve latency? DDMF LP10 allows you to set the phase response of any band to anything between LP and inverse MP which is cool but I do prefer the precision of the splines (coupled with the fantastic spectral display)
A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:04 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

It's all linear, always. Two things about pre-ringing. First of all there's the psychoacoustic phenomenon of pre-masking (aka backward masking) in which a quiet sound won't be heard even if it precedes a louder sound by a few ms. The limit ranges from 5 ms to 20 ms according to papers on the subject, and I seem to recall that lower frequencies have a longer pre-masking effect (not sure about that one) because your perceptual temporal resolution goes down with frequency (see this paper for instance http://kurser.iha.dk/eit/eaku/litt/Psychoacoustics.pdf ).

And then there's how you design your filter. At a resolution of 1.0 (in SplineEQ) the pre-peak part will be a maximum of 11.6 ms, so even a brickwall filter won't pre-ring more than 11.6 ms, which might be covered by psychoacoustic pre-masking, and if it's not then you can definitely lower the resolution to 0.43 which will give you 5 ms of pre-ringing tops, no way you can hear that. And for how you design it, if you have sharp changes then it's going to ring, if you keep it smooth it's not going to ring.

I'll try to offer some phase variety, the way I see it I should have a knob with on one end linear-phase and on the other end minimum phase, and in between you'd have a smooth rolloff between the two with the frequency at which that transition is centred moving along so basically it would swipe from one to the other, the benefit of having that would be so you could have linear-phase high frequencies and minimum-phase lows, does that sound good? I'm not sure about having it like LP10 and set the phase response for each band, mostly that in SplineEQ there's no such thing as a band, they're control points, there's just no traditional concept of bands (even though the interface calls them that) which usually kinda act like individual filters that are just summed up together.

Concerning the On-Off thing, I can do it, but there's one problem, you could turn a control point off, and then turn it back on, but if you ever select another point then your disabled point is gone. Also because they're not actual bands I'm not sure how much sense it would make to disable them. So, practically speaking I'm just not sure what good that would be. It makes sense in any other EQ that uses bands as individual filters that don't interact with the rest except by summation, but in SplineEQ I don't think it really works as well. By the way if your host offers you access to the plugins parameters in the form of a crapload of sliders you can already turn bands on and off with the first parameter of each band which is just an off/on thing.

Oh and as for the delay I can actually improve that a bit. When I first made SplineEQ I was too concerned that the convolution algorithm would take too much CPU for anyone's taste so I made a short list of FFT sizes that ran fast for their size, which means there are big gaps, as much as 25%, between two possible FFT sizes, which makes reducing the latency harder. With a more fine grained list of FFT sizes we could shave off a few extra milliseconds of latency (up to about 10 ms for about the normal resolution, more for high resolutions) to reduce the internal buffer size (though it could not be reduced to lower than your hosts audio buffer size).

Anyway, I totally agree that SplineEQ should have a minimum phase mode as it's a shame that an EQ with such a workflow and interface would be limited to linear phase. However because it uses convolution it still would have a bit of latency as unlike IIR filters or time convolution (which is prohibitively slow) which can work on individual samples the convolution algorithm has to gather a certain amount of samples (the "buffer" part of the latency) into a buffer which only then it can convolve.

By the way there's something about the way I calculate and report the latency that doesn't make sense to me. Right now it's half the size of the kernel + the size of my internal buffer, but what if the internal buffer was the same size as the host's buffer (provided a constant buffer size), then wouldn't the buffer just not count as part of the latency? I should test again if SplineEQ nulls properly.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
xtrax
KVRist
 
443 posts since 15 Aug, 2010

Postby xtrax; Tue Jul 15, 2014 1:32 pm Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

Thanks for detailed explanation.
Just to remind you about bug on OSX when I insert SplineEQ first time, size of the GUI is the smallest. When I remove it and second time insert it size of the GUI is OK. I tried this in Logic, WaveBurner and Peak all the same.
Previous version was OK.


Thanks
A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Tue Aug 12, 2014 2:21 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

xtrax wrote:Thanks for detailed explanation.
Just to remind you about bug on OSX when I insert SplineEQ first time, size of the GUI is the smallest. When I remove it and second time insert it size of the GUI is OK. I tried this in Logic, WaveBurner and Peak all the same.
Previous version was OK.


Thanks

Good news, I've identified the source of the bug! It happens because I try to read the preferences files just to find the resolution before I actually initialise the Mac preferences path, so the preferences don't get read that time and so the value that indicates which resolution it is remains at 0, which gives you that tiny interface.

I never noticed it before but the way it works also means that the very first time you run SplineEQ (if you never ran it before) the same thing happens, you get a 780 interface while the knob reads 1080. Fixing that too.

I'll release the fix in an hour or two.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
A_SN
KVRian
 
899 posts since 6 May, 2008, from Poland

Postby A_SN; Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:14 am Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

Alright, it's released, you can download the update.

I also changed something else, the FFT sizes thing, I think they're more fine-grained now.
Developer of Photosounder (a spectral editor/synth), SplineEQ and Spiral
xtrax
KVRist
 
443 posts since 15 Aug, 2010

Postby xtrax; Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:45 pm Re: SplineEQ v1.1; 64-bit AU?

Thanks for the update. I really like the improvements. Those lights are so easy to follow, and in the darkest area just boost until colors starts to appear. Very practical and original solution. I using it always for the mastering on max quality settings, and really shines like nothing else I have.

Even with the new price this EQ is low priced.


Thanks for this great sounding product.
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