TX16W crashes in Cubase?

[thomas0906]

Hi

My System:
Windows 7 (32bit)
Cubase Elements 8

I startet testing TX16W this Weekend.
I think it is the best Plugin to use my SF2 Soundfonts or own samples within Cubase.

But there is a bug:
I ve been loading a SF2 GM Soundfont of 63MB into TX16W.
I can define Groups and Play the samples from my MIDI Keyboard.

But at least, if I want to save the Projekt, TX16W opens a window itself and wants to save something unknown to me like "txbank / not-used" AND WILL NEVER RETURN.
I have to quit cubase with the Task Manager.

So I tried to save a bank within TX16W with the save bank button.
There are some samples, with the output "can not save xxxxxx" but it returns to the user and will not keep hanging on.

So TX16W is not usable for me, because I cannot save any Cubase Project with included TX16W Instrument.

Could you please help me to find this bug?
I would like to use this great Software TX16W!

Greets
Thomas (Germany)

[thomas0906]

P.S.

All the SAVE Options in Settings are OFF.

[elcallio]

That is strange, I've seen no issues with Cubase 8 - though to be fair I've only really run it in 64-bit mode, but there should be no functional difference.
Which version of Win7 are you running? If it is not updated to SP1, I'd strongly suggest doing so. Also, can you share the Sound font you loaded? Since you have trouble saving the project, that might not be sharable.
Are you sure that TX or Cubase has not opened up a dialog window somewhere (maybe hidden in background - check task manager/task switch)?
What changes did you do to the loaded SF2? Did you modify samples, i.e. is TX trying to save these?

[thomas0906]

Hi

I ve been testing a bit...

I am only loading and saving, no editing or changing.

The problem seems to be in the soundfont.
I can load it and use it, but I cannot save it in a bank or performance.
The txbank has been created with corrupt data and some waves could not be written.
So there must be an error reading and saving these special waves.

So I loaded it again and saved the first 10 programs as programs.
I created a new empty bank and imported the 10 programs in this bank.
Now all is fine. I can save the bank an Cubase works also well saving the project.
But its a lot of work to import all the 127 instruments one by one

Its 63MB so i need a file transfer server to share the .sf2 file to you.
any idea?

Greets Thomas

[elcallio]

Can't you put it on dropbox or similar?

[thomas0906]

I will try ONEDRIVE
You have a PM

[elcallio]

Thanks for the SF2. So, I'm pretty sure the "crash" was a dialog being hidden.
The problem with the file was that a sample in it had illegal file name characters, which where not auto-translated. This caused a save error when exporting the referencing program. Quick workaround is to simply rename the wave inside TX.
But I've made a fix and I'll put up a hotfix release asap.

[thomas0906]

Ah, ok.
If there is no limit in naming the samples in soundfonts, this could happen again using alien soundfonts

By the way, I did not understand where and when tx16wx will save the samples.
I have created some Folders: BANKS, PROGRAMS, PERFORMANCES, SAMPLES
If I save a bank in BANKS, the samples are stored in BANK/SAMPLES if i store a program in PROGRAMS the samples are stored in PROGRAMS/SAMPLES and so on. So all the samples from all the Banks, Performances or programs are spread over these subdirectories. But I want all the samples in my SAMPLES Folder.
What happens if two different samples from different Performances and programs have the same Name?
In the cubase Projects Folders I dont want anything from the tx16wx files. This would create a lot of redundant files.

Is that possible?

And 2 other questions:
I want to save my Banks and Samples manually.
Is the a way to Switch AUTOSAVE off?
It seem that in Cubase saving will be done sometimes while working.
Is there a way to Switch saving tx16w off, when savign the cubase Project?

Thanks a lot
Thomas

[elcallio]

Ah, ok.
If there is no limit in naming the samples in soundfonts, this could happen again using alien soundfonts

By the way, I did not understand where and when tx16wx will save the samples.
I have created some Folders: BANKS, PROGRAMS, PERFORMANCES, SAMPLES
If I save a bank in BANKS, the samples are stored in BANK/SAMPLES if i store a program in PROGRAMS the samples are stored in PROGRAMS/SAMPLES and so on. So all the samples from all the Banks, Performances or programs are spread over these subdirectories. But I want all the samples in my SAMPLES Folder.
 

Yours is a bit of a special case, since you are basically bulk converting SF2:s no? In general, TX16Wx will save store samples (if needed of if "copy content" is turned on) beside the saved programs. But note that unless copy content is on, and the samples in question not modified, saving a program just reference the original sample. So if you have a library at c:\samples and load c:\samples\bass\ninjabass.wav  into a program, then save it in c:\tx\programs\ninjabass.txprog, it will just reference the original file.

Likewise, by using the "places" path setup, you can have sample folders where TX will search for samples on load, to avoid absolute sample paths.

For your issue however, if you want to convert SF2:s to TX programs (note though: this is not required to operate), simple load the full SF2 into an empty TX instance, then export it as a bank into your PROGRAMS folder. You can safely ignore/delete the saved txbank and txperf files in this case, since they don't really contain anything useful. All the sound settings are in the programs.

Also look at settings, "sample folder naming". You can optionally make TX save samples into per-root item folders. (The name is misleading, as it will for the bank save it will name the folder based in the _bank_ stored. This is mayhap a bug, but I will not deal with it right now.)

What happens if two different samples from different Performances and programs have the same Name?
In the cubase Projects Folders I dont want anything from the tx16wx files. This would create a lot of redundant files.

Is that possible?

Turn of "save all waves in fxb". If you modify files in the sample editor or similar (normalize, trim whatever), you must either manuall save the sample to disk,or TX will have to save the modified data into either DAW project folder or project data (depending on capability & "save waves in project").

And 2 other questions:
I want to save my Banks and Samples manually.
Is the a way to Switch AUTOSAVE off?

What do you mean by "autosave"? Do you mean saving DAW state? No. That would be breaking the plug-in contract.

It seem that in Cubase saving will be done sometimes while working.
Is there a way to Switch saving tx16w off, when savign the cubase Project?

No. The plug-in cannot tell the difference between auto-save and manual save (of daw project). It is a limitation of the plug-in standard.

Thanks a lot
Thomas

[elcallio]

A 2.4.2c update that fixes the sample names issue with SF2 is up.

[thomas0906]

Hi

Using 2.4.2c produces the error in cubase again.
Cubase with TX16Wx is saving in an endless loop...
I only saved the cubase project within cubase.
One second later TX16Wx opens that window endless...
There is no other window in the background waiting for input or so.

The bank has been saved before without any problems.
The Soundfont is the same I sent for testing...

[elcallio]

I managed to reproduce _sort of_ the above behaviour, though the exact artifacts might vary.
It seems Cubase does some bad things with locks in its message loop, which in turn causes a deadlock when TX16Wx is showing its progress dialog. This is similar, but not the same as, a previous issue with FL12 (or was it 11?) which had issues with closing windows during VST callback processing.
Unfortunately it is not super much I can do to figure out exactly what is wrong (or whos fault it is - though my money is with Steinberg, since showing a window and pumping windows messages should be quite legal at any point in the UI thread (that is what a dialog does after all).
The best workaround I can offer right now might be to add an option to simply not show the progress dialog at all, which will of course severely limit the feedback during IO + make it impossible to abort a long operation. Still preferable to hanging processes though I guess.

[thomas0906]

Hi elcallio

An option to switch the message window off would help.

Another way could be to save nothing in tx16wx while cubase is saving its own project.
I dont know the trigger for tx16wx to save something while cubase is saving, but couldnt this be done by the user inside
of tx16wx before closing cubase?

greetings
thomas

[elcallio]

Sorry for the delay.
Not saving is (unfortunately?) not an option. A plug-in must store its state when requested by the host, otherwise you'd find an empty TX16Wx whenever you loaded a Cubase project, being forced to manually load all relevant data. Not to mention it would break the plug-in contract.

I've revived the beta section of tx16wx.com, there is now a 2.4.2d beta up. It adds a setting: "Show load / store progress window". When switched off, no progress dialog is shown when doing load/save.
It is however at best a hacky workaround, so I am not overly fond of this "solution" (though TX v3 will be different altogether). But please try it and see if it at least helps you.
Cheers
/C

[thomas0906]

Many thanks!

Cheers
Thomas