Kirk Hunter Diamond Symphony Orchestra Support

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Sorry for spamming, but I'm experiencing a strange issue here now with noise being introduced after saving the instrument .nkis.

I was getting the missing samples message when loading up various TVEC-4 instruments. After re-saving some of these to get rid of the missing samples message, loud noise has been introduced to the playback. So far it's only happening for the TVEC-4 strings, only to the Smooth, AccentPP, AccentMF and AccentFF articulations, and it only happens after I save the instrument.

[edited to remove the link]

I would have thought that re-saving the instruments was corrupting the samples somehow, but when I change back to the original instrument .nki files they play fine with no noise (indicating no permanent changes to the samples themselves).

Has anybody come across this before? I'm not sure if it's a KH Diamond or Kontakt issue.
Last edited by CJ_83 on Wed Oct 05, 2016 8:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

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CJ_83:

"Problem playing the audio file..." error message in both Firefox and Chrome.

I've edited and saved all of the TVEC 4 strings and have found no problems after saving,
but it wasn't because of a missing samples error message.
I set the CC11 programming back to the standard way most all instruments use CC11,
and then just saved over top of the originals.

NOTE:
I didn't update to the newest version of Kontakt.
I hate the new look have seen posts about other problems but not the one you mention.
What version of Kontakt are you running?

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nousndthem wrote:CJ_83:

"Problem playing the audio file..." error message in both Firefox and Chrome.

I've edited and saved all of the TVEC 4 strings and have found no problems after saving,
but it wasn't because of a missing samples error message.
I set the CC11 programming back to the standard way most all instruments use CC11,
and then just saved over top of the originals.

NOTE:
I didn't update to the newest version of Kontakt.
I hate the new look have seen posts about other problems but not the one you mention.
What version of Kontakt are you running?
Thanks for the quick reply. I've edited the post to switch the link to soundcloud - hopefully that works now. I'm not sure exactly what version of Kontakt I'm running (not at that PC currently), but I remember updating it very recently, e.g in the last few months.

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CJ_83 wrote:Completely agree on all points. A reply would at least be nice. I was aware of the issue before I purchased so I don't feel too hard done by. I just assumed there would have been some sort of update to fix it, or at least some support.

Between this and the cumbersome download, I'd be very annoyed if I'd paid full price. At the discounted group buy price I can't complain, even if IntervalLive can't be used for the woodwinds.

I'd be hesitant to buy another KH product now though, which is a shame because I love so many aspects of this one.
I've been looking the Oboe over and I'm beginning to think that this isn't a programming error. Call me crazy, but I wonder if he purposely used the trumpet samples for the Oboe's IntervaLive patch because he didn't have suitable Oboe material for them. It's a very short sound and if you go in and adjust the trumpet levels down, it sounds a lot better. Some of them sound a bit too bright and would probably benefit from having a low pass filter applied to them. This could be done and saved that way without the need to mess with the script, but it's a s***load of work.

:dog:

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CJ_83 wrote:Sorry for spamming, but I'm experiencing a strange issue here now with noise being introduced after saving the instrument .nkis.

I was getting the missing samples message when loading up various TVEC-4 instruments. After re-saving some of these to get rid of the missing samples message, loud noise has been introduced to the playback. So far it's only happening for the TVEC-4 strings, only to the Smooth, AccentPP, AccentMF and AccentFF articulations, and it only happens after I save the instrument. An example is linked below:

https://soundcloud.com/cedarjones/kh-ko ... ue/s-w8H0D

I would have thought that re-saving the instruments was corrupting the samples somehow, but when I change back to the original instrument .nki files they play fine with no noise (indicating no permanent changes to the samples themselves).

Has anybody come across this before? I'm not sure if it's a KH Diamond or Kontakt issue.
Man, that's weird. An interesting experiment would be to go into the Group Editor and find one of the groups that "lights up" when you play some notes. Select that group, and select Group Solo. When you play notes, you will only hear that group. If the selected group is part of a round robin, or a different velocity level, you will have to play it a bit to hear that soloed group. I would be interesting to know if it still sounds noisy when it plays. If not, the noise is coming from another group.

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CJ_83:
Wow. That sounds like synthesizer white noise.

So, the error message about unfound samples?

"IF" you tell Kontakt to find the files and then instead of saving the instrument just play it to see if the noise is there,
is the noise there?

Also, what is the exact name and folder path to the instrument in the recording you posted?
Also the articulation.
Please give it to me like:
Path example:
S:\Diamond\_TVEC_4_Diamond_Instruments\00_T4_violin_instruments\a 1st Violins 18,9,4,1 Players All Articulations.nki

I'd like to check mine and make sure it's not the same as yours.

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nousndthem wrote:CJ_83:
Wow. That sounds like synthesizer white noise.

So, the error message about unfound samples?

"IF" you tell Kontakt to find the files and then instead of saving the instrument just play it to see if the noise is there,
is the noise there?

Also, what is the exact name and folder path to the instrument in the recording you posted?
Also the articulation.
Please give it to me like:
Path example:
S:\Diamond\_TVEC_4_Diamond_Instruments\00_T4_violin_instruments\a 1st Violins 18,9,4,1 Players All Articulations.nki

I'd like to check mine and make sure it's not the same as yours.
After I tell Kontakt where to find the samples it consistently plays fine. It's only after i save the .nki that the noise is there. It then stays there after I remove the instance of Kontakt and reload it again, restart the DAW/PC etc.

I HAVE noticed that when loading TVEC-4 instruments it consistently can't find the samples until I tell it to search the entire 'KH Diamond Orchestra' parent folder, but loading most of the other older instruments works fine. I wonder if this is related somehow.

I think that one that I posted was the TVEC4 2nd violins with the 'smooth' articulation, but it seems to happen with all the TVEC4 strings across the smooth and pp/mf/ff accent articulations. As soon as i get home tonight I'll confirm some instruments that are definitely doing it and will send through the paths like you describe. Thanks!

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^^^^
I think that you will be much better off sorting out the folder hierarchy so that the samples are in the expected place. I have not run into that issue and did double-check the folders against the list that KH included in the downloads. Have a look around.

PS I was also thinking that the use of trumpet samples in the oboe instrument was "by design" too.
DarkStar, ... Interesting, if true
Inspired by ...

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DarkStar wrote:^^^^
I think that you will be much better off sorting out the folder hierarchy so that the samples are in the expected place. I have not run into that issue and did double-check the folders against the list that KH included in the downloads. Have a look around.

PS I was also thinking that the use of trumpet samples in the oboe instrument was "by design" too.
I agree. I got my folders in the right place and have never had a missing samples error message.

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Thanks a lot to everybody for the help. I have a fix for the time being - I noticed that the noise is directly linked to HPC. If I move the HPC velo value up to 127 (effectively turning it off), the noise doesn't happen. Further updates below for anybody interested:
DarkStar wrote:^^^^
I think that you will be much better off sorting out the folder hierarchy so that the samples are in the expected place.
nousndthem wrote:Also, what is the exact name and folder path to the instrument in the recording you posted?
I had a closer look at the folder structure and you're right - the way I had extracted them had created an extra layer of subfolders. After painstakingly fixing this for every one I have no more missing samples issues!
tdm wrote:Man, that's weird. An interesting experiment would be to go into the Group Editor and find one of the groups that "lights up" when you play some notes. Select that group, and select Group Solo. When you play notes, you will only hear that group. If the selected group is part of a round robin, or a different velocity level, you will have to play it a bit to hear that soloed group. I would be interesting to know if it still sounds noisy when it plays. If not, the noise is coming from another group.
nousndthem wrote:Also, what is the exact name and folder path to the instrument in the recording you posted?
I had a closer look at the 1st Violins instrument, which has the following location on my PC:
D:\Library\Orchestral\Kirk Hunter Diamond\_TVEC_4_Diamond_Instruments\00_T4_violin_instruments\a 1st Violins 18,9,4,1 Players All Articulations.nki

After I save this instrument, the noise will consistently play if I have the group "A Lv leg b" soloed. The noise triggers only after the 'attack' has played (e.g. if I hold down the note the noise blast happens shortly after the attack). If I solo the "Ahv leg b" group, it consistently DOESN'T play the noise. The note I was triggering is the lowest one in its range - G2.

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Sounds like you need to track down the group that has the noise in it by soloing groups and then look in that group to find the sample that is the noise sample.

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nousndthem wrote:Sounds like you need to track down the group that has the noise in it by soloing groups and then look in that group to find the sample that is the noise sample.
Doing this reveals that ConVnsHpc.040.wav is one of the culprits. The WAV itself looks and plays fine when loaded in a separate audio editor, but looks and sounds like noise in the Kontakt wave editor window. In any case it's not a showstopper now as I can just turn off HPC and don't miss it too much. Still, pretty weird though!

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If the .wav file is ok then it must be a problem with the programming in the instrument?

What is HPC?

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CJ_83 wrote:I had a closer look at the 1st Violins instrument, which has the following location on my PC:
D:\Library\Orchestral\Kirk Hunter Diamond\_TVEC_4_Diamond_Instruments\00_T4_violin_instruments\a 1st Violins 18,9,4,1 Players All Articulations.nki

After I save this instrument, the noise will consistently play if I have the group "A Lv leg b" soloed. The noise triggers only after the 'attack' has played (e.g. if I hold down the note the noise blast happens shortly after the attack). If I solo the "Ahv leg b" group, it consistently DOESN'T play the noise. The note I was triggering is the lowest one in its range - G2.
I think you only hear the group that is selected and soloed, so I believe the offending group is the "A Lv leg b" group.

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nousndthem wrote:If the .wav file is ok then it must be a problem with the programming in the instrument?

What is HPC?
"Human Pitch Correction". I think it modulates the pitch briefly to simulate a human player, or something along those lines.

And although the WAV itself is OK when viewed in an audio editor, the sample when viewed in Kontakt is just the white noise. I wonder if it's 'corrupting' the sample somehow when it loads into Kontakt, but without actually affecting the file itself.

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