Hello and a suggestion- chord mode

[Lukesleepwalker]

Thanks, bobdog. Good to know that it's worth sticking with it!

[Roger_Linn]

FYI, Chord Player is now available for LinnStrument:

http://www.benjaminsoma.com/store/p9/Ch ... rs%29.html

[thedommer2000]

Just wanted to follow up on this. Love that there is now chord software that can be used. Loots great but its only Ableton Live mode unfortunately.

Roger - The linnstrument is turning into a beast. With sequencer mode its now 2/3 there. Its one part expressive instrument, 1 part sequencer, and a third chord mode would make it perfect. I am just about to buy one. To be honest I kinda assumed it had a chord mode and was surprised that it didn't. With a grid like that a chord mode and sequencer are two must haves. One part of that is down but the chord mode would be amazing for, not just performance, but writing! Its a wonderful way to experience chord progressions that you wound never have thought of.

Anyways, definitely something I'd love to see integrated. At the very least I am hoping this Ableton plugin can make it into other DAWs. I use studio one and I'm not going to switch for one plugin. To much time invested in learning it.

[Roger_Linn]

Thanks for the suggestion. We might add such a feature in future but it’s somewhat tricky. The problem is that to do anything more than the auto-chord feature of cheap kids’ keyboards, a fairly extensive UI (chord type, inversion, bass note, key, chord complexity, octaves, pitch range, rhythmic pattern, etc.) is needed, and there’s no more room for printed parameters on the panel to identify such parameters. Regarding the Sequencer, we added printed panel parameters for correct ease of use, and it wasn’t a problem to use 1/3 or half the playing surface for the UI of a Sequencer. However that isn’t the case with auto-chord because you need the entire playing surface for playing, especially for split keyboard use, for example auto-chord on left and soloing on right.

However, the good news is that Chord Player isn’t the only such software. A search for “auto chord software” or “auto accompaniment software” will give you other such applications that work with any MIDI keyboard or controller.

FYI, my guiding principal for adding features is stated on the LinnStrument FAQ page. (LinnStrument Support Page / FAQ button.) Search for “Can you add this feature?”

[John the Savage]

I just want to play devil's advocate here for a second — not to start an argument or discount the idea of a chord mode — but the one thing I like most about the LinnStrument is that it's one of the only modern playing surfaces, despite being a MIDI controller, that might be considered a real instrument, geared towards adept musicians, designed to play rather than to poke at with one finger while MIDI and clever programming do the work. In many respects, the sequencer, the arp, and the customizable note lights already constitute a chord mode of sorts.

Admittedly, humbly, I say this from the perspective of someone who wouldn't be caught dead using a chord mode, and might even be fired for doing so (or at very least laughed at). In the same way that I would never use a vocal processor, no matter how comprehensive, that offers pitch correction; or a guitar pedal that automatically generates backing tracks...

Fun? Sure. Dignified? No!

I echo Roger's concern that such a feature is something most often found on toy keyboards aimed at children. The price point of the LinnStrument, much like the Tempest, is undeniably somewhat prohibitive, in the sense that these devices are clearly designed with professionals in mind. As such, it's my opinion that there is a real risk of lowering the device's perceived stock value by adding features that pander to amateurs (and I promise I don't use that word derisively, there's nothing wrong with being an amateur, I'm just saying, you have to consider the league).

Don't get me wrong, I can understand the usefulness of chord generators in some contexts, but modern music production is already so stilted, it's hard to find any integrity in it. The LinnStrument brings a refreshing breath of virtuosity back to the stage. Anyway...

Cheers!

[pdxindy]

It is also so easy to use VST's for that purpose...

I would rather the space on the Linnstrument be used for customizations for actual expressive playing

[Roger_Linn]

Hi pdxindy--
I wasn't aware of any plug-ins that provide an auto-chord function. Could you suggest one or more of them so that thedommer2000 or others with similar interests will have a solution?

[thedommer2000]

Thanks for the response Roger. Totally get what you are trying to do with the Linnstrument. I just see all those pretty lights and would love a simple chord mode. My music theory is less than ideal so any "gimmick" to pull ideas out always help. Heck thats why I am getting the Linnstrument! The way it's laid out will shake my brain up a bit along with the fact that its awesomely expressive. (I'm most psyched about that part obviously, particularly on some brass)

That Ableton Live chord program looks fantastic and is pretty much exactly what I was thinking. I hope it comes to other DAWs. Again, not to undermine the purpose of the Linnstrument. Just another thing that makes it useful in more situations for me. A mode like this could be a starting point for figuring out chords that sit under a melody for me, or creating a bit of a structure then building from there. I don't consider these things "cheap" as John the Savage seems to think. They are a great way to get somewhere quickly. And for me thats a fantastic starting point. Same reason why I use tons of different synths and instruments. Inspiration that takes me in all sorts of directions.

Speaking of which. You aren't in the middle of a Linnstrument 2 are you.... I'd hate to pick mine up Friday and a week later see the Linnstrument 2.

[thedommer2000]

Also just wanted to add - For things like the chord mode and even a sequencer, while its nice to have it on the linnstrument, I actually prefer it on the computer. That's where I compose and using the linnstrument as a controller allows me to keep the complexities and editing in the box for instant recall. So in that sense I am on board with not bogging the linnstrument down to much.

[Roger_Linn]

I have no current plans for a LinnStrument 2. I’m not sure what I could add without making it too big. Also, LinnStrument’s modular design allows for easy upgrading if I do change something in future. For example when I added the step sequencer, I offered replacement top panels with the new printed sequencer parameters for only $69 including shipping to anywhere.

[Lukesleepwalker]

I was thinking the other day that I'd appreciate a chord helper that still relied on me to "input" the chord shape but helped me with some of the ergonomics issues with the LS. With practice I've gotten pretty good at forming most of the chords, as I've done on stringed instruments and piano keyboards. But there's still something about the flatness of the surface that has made the LS more of a challenge. Perhaps I'm just whining and need to put in yet more practice (and I don't think I observe the "virtuosity" laws as much as others), but I have to admit that there are times where I say to myself: I wish I could "record" a chord shape to assign to a single key or maybe a couple.

[John the Savage]

I don't consider these things "cheap" as John the Savage seems to think. They are a great way to get somewhere quickly.

First of all, I didn't use the word "cheap", Roger did. I just happen to agree with him. Learning an instrument is not about getting somewhere quickly, it's about the achievement of it. There are plenty of learning tools out there already, and a thousand more ways to cut corners. The LinnStrument needs a chord mode like a cello needs fret markers.

I don't think I observe the "virtuosity" laws as much as others...

I'm going to take this in good humor as a subtle dig at some perceived snobbery on my behalf, and that's fair; but I assure you, I would never condescend to anyone. My point is simply that not every musical device is designed with the learner in mind, or meant to help aspiring music producers side-step the learning curve. You have to concede that there are true instrumentalists out there, people who get hired to play and admired for their proficiency. They're not elitists, they're musicians for crying out loud. Maybe some of you don't know this, but Roger Linn used to tour as a guitarist for a very heavy cat named Leon Russell. I am also a career session player. Roger's vision for the LinnStrument (as he'd tell you himself) was to bring a degree of virtuosity back to modern [electronic] music, which has frankly become a mockery of quantization, pitch correction, stems, samples, factory sounds, groove templates, plugin presets, user scales, arpeggiators, automatic chord progression generators, etc...

The LinnStrument's current feature set is something that working professionals can boast proudly. It gives you all the tools you need to create and perform music; with the one caveat being that you have to actually understand music.

Practice, folks, it will set you free (wink). In the meantime, there's this:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/is ... -step-sequ

Cheers!

*Edit: I just realized I quoted the wrong person above, so I just changed the user name for the first quote to the correct name...

[Lukesleepwalker]

John, I appreciate that you are taking the discourse in good humor and I acknowledge that your point of view is widely shared due to its merit. Not only have I gratefully shared the stage with virtuosos but I plunk down my hard earned cash to see the local symphony orchestra, many jazz acts that tour through town, etc. To see virtuosity of course!

However, I also appreciate the artists playing punk rock and EDM and crunk in the local clubs. The mental model I have of the LS, due to the proximity to the guitar note layout and the blinking Push-like lights, is not of a cello but of a guitar for the next age, capable of "this machine kills fascists" forms of expression as much as Andres Segovia. It could very well be that Roger envisioned the cello, and if so, then my mental model will spring up elsewhere, I suspect.

[Roger_Linn]

To dommer: Regarding auto-chord, I must admit that while I’m pretty good at expressive solo lines, I don’t have a pianist’s talent for playing simultaneous chords and solo lines. For such situations, I can see how an auto-chord feature would have merit, especially if it differentiated itself from kids’ keyboards’ auto-chord features, perhaps by using pressure in creative ways similar to how the Arpeggiator’s Replay All feature works.

I do appreciate that your interest in such an auto-chord feature is in addition to LinnStrument’s primary function as an expressive musician instrument. Otherwise any on/off switch grid controller could do what you want and therefore LinnStrument would be a waste of money.

To all: Regarding auto-chord, I’m open to any suggestions on how to implement such a feature in a creative way that uses LinnStrument’s expressive control and yet doesn’t require a complex and confusing UI.

[John the Savage]

John, I appreciate that you are taking the discourse in good humor and I acknowledge that your point of view is widely shared due to its merit. Not only have I gratefully shared the stage with virtuosos but I plunk down my hard earned cash to see the local symphony orchestra, many jazz acts that tour through town, etc. To see virtuosity of course!

However, I also appreciate the artists playing punk rock and EDM and crunk in the local clubs. The mental model I have of the LS, due to the proximity to the guitar note layout and the blinking Push-like lights, is not of a cello but of a guitar for the next age, capable of "this machine kills fascists" forms of expression as much as Andres Segovia. It could very well be that Roger envisioned the cello, and if so, then my mental model will spring up elsewhere, I suspect.

I assure you, Luke, I'm just making conversation here. Some people want a chord mode, whereas others do not, and that's fair. We all have our reasons, we've all presented our arguments, and ultimately it's in Roger Linn's hands. I don't begrudge anyone their musical taste or skill level. In fact, I work in all capacities as a musician, producer, songwriter, and audio engineer. It's my chosen career, and indeed the only job I've ever had (28 years and counting). I've toured with roots bands, rock bands, electronic bands, and every imaginable hybrid thereof. I appreciate them all.

I'm simply making the point that you can't please all of the people all of the time, and trying to do so (at least in terms of modern technology) often results in buggy, convoluted products that serve no one well. The LinnStrument, as I've come to understand it, was meant to be seen as an expressive instrument first, a MIDI controller second, and a [basic] sequencer as a distant third. And in that respect it provides, quite elegantly, all the necessary tools to configure it accordingly. It was not, however, designed as a learning tool per se (not that it can't be used that way). In keeping with the above ideology, adding a chord mode would not only exceed the capacity of the interface (as Roger keeps hinting at), but it also stands to draw some sideways looks from those of us who have adopted it as a dignified instrument.

I didn't say you couldn't use it for playing Punk Rock, EDM, and Crunk — quite the opposite in fact — I think it would excel at those things. But punk rockers prided themselves on taking the three chords they knew and putting them out there loud and proud, no safety net, no strings attached. It's a lost art in this modern day of automation and A.I.

I dare say the LinnStrument stands as a challenge to lose the training wheels and leave it all on the stage again (wink).

Cheers!