Ace vs Hive - differences, strengths and weaknesses?

[Shiek927]

I think it's grossly unfair to label Hive the "EDM synth", like I see so many do. Sure, it does the banging in-your-face EDM slams well, but its capabilities goes way, way beyond that.

I may be slammed by saying so but so be it: I think Hive is the most versatile synth of all the U-He synths. It can be as clear as the finest crystal, as sublime as a gentle summer wind or dirty as f*ck. Or produce perc sounds in a drum container. It's the one synth that's always featured in my projects. Always. From Ambient to Techno, pop to new age, from weird experimental psychedelia to classic funky house: Hive is there somewhere.

Man, writing this makes me realize how much I love that thing.

This makes me think you've never used Zebra or Bazille.

Different strokes!

I wanted to like Diva. I really REALLY did, but I couldn't. Unless you're doing filmscore, Deep House, classic Trance, or a really REALLY retro style, it's really not a very versatile synth. It's got a great sound, but it just isn't modern or punchy enough for my taste. It's a much more limited synth than meets the eye. As great as it sounds, I found it to be the weak-link in a few of my dance tracks, and I've gotten much better results since I've stopped using it.

As for Zebra, it just sounds old-fashioned to me? ^^;. I guess once ZDFF started being a thing, it was hard to look back. It sits with Massive and other synths as sounding "last-gen". A ridiculous thing to some people, but it's hard for me not to want to use Hive's fuller punchy sound, even at the expense of less features. There's Serum and other more modern synths to help fill in the blanks.


And then there's the character ^^. Hive, like Diva, has character right from the onset. Zebra is very very 'neutral' and clear, and you're meant to stack things up to give it character with it's bajillion features. It's not something I'm personally crazy for since I'm not much of a sound-designer .

[pdxindy]

I wanted to like Diva. I really REALLY did, but I couldn't. Unless you're doing filmscore, Deep House, classic Trance, or a really REALLY retro style, it's really not a very versatile synth.

You are welcome to like or not like whatever synth... but Diva is a very versatile synth

[Shiek927]

I wanted to like Diva. I really REALLY did, but I couldn't. Unless you're doing filmscore, Deep House, classic Trance, or a really REALLY retro style, it's really not a very versatile synth.

You are welcome to like or not like whatever synth... but Diva is a very versatile synth

I personally just didn't feel that way. It certainly is a wonderful sounding synth, but I ironically found it to be TOO lush. It's far from punchy, and just isn't all that great for modern dance styles. It's more for filmscore, or reaaaally retro styles like classic Trance that are airy.

It's not it's fault necessarily. The whole point was to model those classic synths, but I just didn't find it very useful for me. Hive perfectly captured the versatility and punchy sound I was hoping for, at a much smaller CPU print .

[pdxindy]

I wanted to like Diva. I really REALLY did, but I couldn't. Unless you're doing filmscore, Deep House, classic Trance, or a really REALLY retro style, it's really not a very versatile synth.

You are welcome to like or not like whatever synth... but Diva is a very versatile synth

I personally just didn't feel that way. It certainly is a wonderful sounding synth, but I ironically found it to be TOO lush. It's far from punchy, and just isn't all that great for modern dance styles. It's more for filmscore, or reaaaally retro styles like classic Trance that are airy.

It's not it's fault necessarily. The whole point was to model those classic synths, but I just didn't find it very useful for me. Hive perfectly captured the versatility and punchy sound I was hoping for, at a much smaller CPU print .

Understandable... however, a synth not doing what you want it to, does not mean it is not versatile. Diva is more sonically diverse than Hive is. Hive just happens to be better suited to your needs. I'm happy to have both!

[Beamboom]

This makes me think you've never used Zebra or Bazille.

I've not given Bazille a very long test run. I admit that. I should do that eventually.
When I decided on my first U-He synth I installed all the demos and after a rather quick initial testing I decided to focus on Zebra, Diva and Hive. That may have been unfair to the ones left behind, I can accept that.

Both Zebra and Diva are extremely capable synths, that's pretty darn obvious. Gorgeous and impressive. Very rich sound.

But after browsing the presets and with my limited skills in synth programming I could not shake the retro feel off Diva. If I ever want to create some Jarre'ish stuff I'd be all over it. But I agree with Shiek, it came across as a very "film score" kind of machine.

To be honest: Zebra I just found to be too f'ing complicated. It confused me.
Again, I'm no experienced sound designer and with Zebra I'd have to be 100% dependent on using pre-made patches for a very long time. Zebra had some really cool factory presets, but also a lot that just felt irrelevant for me. It was very impressive, borderline overwhelming, but there was "something" that just didn't feel right. The ratio of presets I could see myself actually using were pretty low.

With Hive however, my interest were awakened after only browsing a few factory patches. From stomping, crystal clear screamers to warm cuddly leads to gentle ambient ice cold digital space winds, it just screamed "THIS!". Whatever it did, it did it so expressively - and so crystal clear. And when I right away could start tweaking some of the presets to my liking almost instinctively in the GUI (with the expected result being produced), well then there was no doubt for me any more.

Obviously I want to get Diva (maybe even Zebra) at some point, the U-He VST's are just too friggin' good and I want'em all. There's times I even look for an excuse to purchase it, but every time I just return to Hive and say "I find exactly what I need right here". And that's regardless of genre I am working on.

EDIT: Uhm... Sorry to OP for hijacking this thread btw.

[terminus_one]

EDIT: Uhm... Sorry to OP for hijacking this thread btw.

No worries It's great to hear people's experiences between the different u-he synths – real quality products!

In the end I got both Ace and Hive, and don't regret the decision one bit!

[Shiek927]

It's all valid .

Different strokes, and all. In a way, just looking at the synth packs that are commonly made for a synth will tell you where it's strengths are, regardless of what it is or how versatile other people say. Most of Diva's libraries fall into scoring or veeeery retro EDM. The filters are great, but it's chunky sound isn't what you want for most things.

As for Zebra, it honestly was the synth that burned me away from sound-design xD. I used it for about a year, before finally pushing sound-design away. It just wasn't the road I wanted to go on, as intuitive as Z2 genuinely is. It's really not the synth's fault, but it just wasn't what I wanted to do. Hive has the sort of simplicity, speed, and character that makes you focus less on sound-design and just getting the dumb patch finished so you can get back to the song. It's a wonder for us preset-tweakers XD.

But not everyone agrees, which is fine! I love how u-he has different choices for everyone ^^.

[Howard]

Diva is more sonically diverse than Hive is

Much as I love the sound of Diva, I can't agree with that. Hive's audio routing options, the effect modulation etc. all add up to it being (by far IMHO) the more sonically flexible. Of course Zebra beats both in that "discipline"!

[pdxindy]

Diva is more sonically diverse than Hive is

Much as I love the sound of Diva, I can't agree with that. Hive's audio routing options, the effect modulation etc. all add up to it being (by far IMHO) the more sonically flexible. Of course Zebra beats both in that "discipline"!

Perhaps we have different ideas of what sonic flexibility means. For me when I say that, I mean the diversity of raw timbres the Osc's and filters can make.

To me, Hive always sounds pretty much the same. A few basic waveforms and a pretty generic sounding filter (good quality, but not lots of unique character). Because it is so fast and easy to do modulations, that provides the interest... that and as you say the ease of modulating the FX.

Diva has Osc sync, cross mod, ring mod, filterFM and feedback, voice stacking, 5 distinct filter models that have all sorts of timbres that Hive doesn't. The Uhbie filter with its morphing is unmatched in Hive. The Bite filter with resonance turned up... Hive cannot touch that. There are also the variety of Osc models with quite a diversity of tonalities and especially the Digital Osc which can make lots of timbres that Hive cannot come close to.

[Shiek927]

Diva is more sonically diverse than Hive is

Much as I love the sound of Diva, I can't agree with that. Hive's audio routing options, the effect modulation etc. all add up to it being (by far IMHO) the more sonically flexible. Of course Zebra beats both in that "discipline"!

Perhaps we have different ideas of what sonic flexibility means. For me when I say that, I mean the diversity of raw timbres the Osc's and filters can make.

To me, Hive always sounds pretty much the same. A few basic waveforms and a pretty generic sounding filter (good quality, but not lots of unique character). Because it is so fast and easy to do modulations, that provides the interest... that and as you say the ease of modulating the FX.

Diva has Osc sync, cross mod, ring mod, filterFM and feedback, voice stacking, 5 distinct filter models that have all sorts of timbres that Hive doesn't. The Uhbie filter with its morphing is unmatched in Hive. The Bite filter with resonance turned up... Hive cannot touch that. There are also the variety of Osc models with quite a diversity of tonalities and especially the Digital Osc which can make lots of timbres that Hive cannot come close to.

I know what you mean. I wish Hive had more of this stuff .

But while Diva has a much larger feature set, don't underestimate the depth it can do. With just a few bread n butter waveforms, we've seen presets for far more genres than Diva. In particular, listen to the ambient stuff like "Transmitting Spheres" or one of Howard's patches, for the kind of quality you can get. It really does sound analog!

[nichttuntun]

I think it's grossly unfair to label Hive the "EDM synth", like I see so many do. Sure, it does the banging in-your-face EDM slams well, but its capabilities goes way, way beyond that.

I may be slammed by saying so but so be it: I think Hive is the most versatile synth of all the U-He synths. It can be as clear as the finest crystal, as sublime as a gentle summer wind or dirty as f*ck. Or produce perc sounds in a drum container. It's the one synth that's always featured in my projects. Always. From Ambient to Techno, pop to new age, from weird experimental psychedelia to classic funky house: Hive is there somewhere.

Man, writing this makes me realize how much I love that thing.

I feel exactly the same <3 <3 <3.

It's the synth I've always wanted. A fat modern punchy synth that (almost) has Diva's sound, but with Sylenth simplicity. Even better, it's character is that of a 90's synth like a vintage Roland or Korg keyboard, which I adore. It can handle most EDM styles, and has beautiful sounds for ambient or whatever else you do :3.

I only wish u-he would put more into it, to compete with Spire and make it even more versatile. FM/Sync, more waveforms, limited wavetable capabilities, etc. That way, it can also pull off Dubstep, Complextro, and other digital styles that a subtractive synth, even one as good-sounding as this, can't pull off. I supposed that's why I have Serum, Razor, and other synths .

Even then, Hive is my favorite synth I've ever used and it's character makes me want to heavily use it all the time, just because I love it ^^.

Hi,
don´t get me wrong. HIVE is nowhere close to sound like DIVA. Compared side by side HIVE is even thin and weak sounding. A real letdown. But I think comparisons aren´t good for anything. Regarded on its own HIVE is great and luckily provides so many options to patch interesting sounds one would not associate with EDM-"crap-sounds" (being a bit sarcastic here. Of course I am aware of the fact that in truth there is nothing like a "crap-sounding" sound. Sound is just sound - it´s everywhere and ZEN people even say "everything IS sound"). HIVE is great for what it is. And DIVA is great for what it is But please don´t think while buying HIVE you get something like DIVA. They are totally different to each other. Like fire and water.
Have joy.