u-he

pdxindy · Post by **pdxindy** » Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:39 pm

I very much like ACE... It is a solid synth in its own right.

but after using Bazille so much, I miss some of the Bazille modules such as lag generators, quantizer, rectifier, sequencer and also the Bazille Envelopes are more capable with Rate and Amp mods plus the looping options.

Bazille is also more flexible for making feedback loops with the filters. Overall, I like the gain structure of the Bazille filters more than ACE... though I also find some lovely sweet spots with ACE as well.

ACE just immediately sounds more like a classic analog synth. It also makes some really sweet sync sounds which Bazille cannot do. ACE is easier to get started. I'm glad I have both. If I had to choose, I would take Bazille.

killmaster · Post by **killmaster** » Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:50 pm

pdxindy wrote:I very much like ACE... It is a solid synth in its own right.

but after using Bazille so much, I miss some of the Bazille modules such as lag generators, quantizer, rectifier, sequencer and also the Bazille Envelopes are more capable with Rate and Amp mods plus the looping options.

Bazille is also more flexible for making feedback loops with the filters. Overall, I like the gain structure of the Bazille filters more than ACE... though I also find some lovely sweet spots with ACE as well.

ACE just immediately sounds more like a classic analog synth. It also makes some really sweet sync sounds which Bazille cannot do. ACE is easier to get started. I'm glad I have both. If I had to choose, I would take Bazille.

thanks a lot!! Pretty much with this response, I think I'm going to start with Bazille and visit ACE later. It'd be great if there are presets that are kinda like tutorial presets showing the hookup of all the unique aspects!!

mevla · Post by **mevla** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:30 am

IMHO there are not enough soundsets developed for both. I do have some for ACE and Bazille, but compared to Diva, Zebra and Hive they don't have much. Kyhon's sounds for ACE are inspiring and so is the Valis soundset for Bazille. For some reason, some people find it a feat to have such synths capable of inspiring sounds do simple noises and electronic farts. Bazille has tremendous expressive capabilties but then, even The Unfinished did not tap it fully. Maybe it's the cables.

Tp3 · Post by **Tp3** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:21 am

killmaster wrote:Are they totally different?

No.

They are both ACE !

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:30 am

Do go try BazilleCM. Its 2 of the 4 osc and no fx, but it quite useful and eases you into Bazille. For my 2 cents., I go with Bazille. You need to have a strong machine however to really take full advantage of it. Again get the CM version and get your feet wet.

mclstr · Post by **mclstr** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:33 am

mevla wrote:IMHO there are not enough soundsets developed for both.

Who needs presets. You make your own:-)

I do use presets created by others, but the idea is to make you own and there are several thousand out there for ACE and Bazille.

I do not own ACE. I don't see the point since Bazille will pretty much do everything ACE can do plus more.
I do suspect that ACE is easier to learn though.

So my experience has been with Bazille. I come from an old school modular world and so tend to like the interface.

The common complaint from most sound designers is that they haven't wanted to spend the time involved to learn how to control it effectively.
It isn't profitable to spend so much time creating a bank of presets to sell. It's more profitable to create presets for synths that have limits to help you make sounds quickly and help you avoid creating garbage.

Bazille allows you to make some really unusual, amazing sounds, if you are willing to learn the beast.

Compared to most synth plugins, Bazille is a wild horse.
Like modular synths, it takes time and a lot of experimentation to get good results. You don't create good music with it until you practice..

Just like modular synthesis, it is very easy to get bad results with Bazille. There is no hand holding. You can turn a knob too far, max your CPU, make an incorrect patch, make your filters distort or go into oscillation, ...
You can very easily loose control and create garbage at first.

But it is very flexible and capable of making sounds you can't create with other instruments.
I have created a few presets with it that really stand out as unique.
Some day I may upload a bank of presets when I get organized.

For me there is something about having so much in one package. I no longer have to worry about having enough oscillators, filters, ... and methods of modulation/cross-modulation.

mevla · Post by **mevla** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 3:23 pm

mclstr wrote:I do suspect that ACE is easier to learn though.

Yes. And combined with Dan Worrall's 4-part tutorial on youtube, is great !

Understanding of the capabilities is certainly key. I do not create my own sounds so far. I did start to modify some to better fit a context. I took the ACE tutorial above and the some 3-hour Bazille course at Groove3. During that time I followed along, created the sounds, modified them a bit. The real 'speed' learning though is in deconstruction. This is what I should do next. Take patches I ilke and deconstruct them cable after another cable, then reconstruct, etc..

I agree that Bazille can make extraordinary expressive sounds. Some soundsets points to that direction. You're absolutely right in saying that it's easy to get bad results. There's a range of action though that can yield great results, like balancing on a tight rope and to get to that range is what could take some time and, is specific for each type of sound.

Please do upload your presets !

Your comment gave me an inspiration for the next session. I'll open up Bazille and spend some time.

Garzita · Post by **Garzita** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:44 am

In summary

Bazille has way more features when it comes to Mod sources, you can literally get lost for hours just messing around with it, it can do some weird digital sounds that are amazing, the sequencer is top notch and kind of reminds me of the Filterscape VA EQ morph which I LOVE!!! the learning curve is steep though, just the OSC section is a challenge to understand what is going on sometimes. But it is my go to synth when I want to come up with weird sequenced sounds or experimental soundscapes.

ACE, though with less mod sources, is more accessible and I find that I go to it whenever I need some bass, for some reason, the limited mod sources can inspire you to find ways around its limitations, for example, I love using the Mapper in Quantize mode with the RAMP as its source and have it connected to the tuning of the OSCs as a sequencer, man I have come up with some amazing disco basslines with that setup.

igoramos · Post by **igoramos** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 2:49 pm

Thanks everyone! Appreciate all the input. Its super helpful while I'm learning. Kinda points me to things I might not notice rightaway.

krabbencutter · Post by **krabbencutter** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 5:37 pm

I second Bazille CM (or Beat Magazine's BeatZille, if you're living in Germany). For a couple of bucks it's a pretty powerful piece of software! Also make sure to check the Tips & Tricks Section from the Bazille User Guide

mevla · Post by **mevla** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 8:38 pm

Last time I got it, maybe a year ago maximum, Beatzille was free.

mclstr · Post by **mclstr** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:15 pm

mevla wrote:Please do upload your presets !

I just uploaded a bunch to the downloads section:
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/bazille ... /downloads

killmaster · Post by **killmaster** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:37 pm

mclstr wrote:
mevla wrote:Please do upload your presets !
I just uploaded a bunch to the downloads section:
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/bazille ... /downloads

Thank you! I didn't even know about the patch download area here at KVR! o man, whole new worlds...

mevla · Post by **mevla** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:47 pm

I was not aware either of the download section ! Thanks.

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:19 pm

All i can say is that ACE is from all U-he synths after using and trying all of them my favorite when it comes to rich analog and vintage style sounds.
So i wished U-he would release an ACE XL and stop Zebra 3 and Repro 5 right now (dramatized of course)

Not sure what it is but it has a tone and character which talks to me in a way where the others let me cold a bit now.

u-he

KVR Audio

What would you say comparing ACE and Bazille