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xoxos
Mr Entertainment
 
12018 posts since 29 Apr, 2002, from i might peeramid

Postby xoxos; Tue May 16, 2017 3:28 pm Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

yes yes i always forget that being friendly at parties is more important than a sustainable culture, it's how i show people the clever.

btw i lived on the arcology for over a year, so if you consider it some kind of semantic length measurement, i put my time in for those inches. don't worry, i know you have absolutely no idea of the scope of such things.
you come and go, you come and go. amitabha xoxos.net free vst. neither a follower nor a leader be
tagore "where roads are made i lose my way"
where there is certainty, consideration is absent.
DNAdisaster
KVRer
 
24 posts since 31 Jan, 2011

Postby DNAdisaster; Tue May 16, 2017 9:43 pm Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

Dismissing ideas, especially without even hearing them, seems... unwise. I honestly don't care how pompous or humble someone is (in this context anyway). I am interested in music and especially creating cool software for musicians to use, since that is my skill set. As satisfying as it may be to take someone down a peg or two, I think it is to the benefit of the community to forego your feelings and hear everyone out.
PurpleSunray
KVRian
 
520 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Tue May 16, 2017 11:42 pm Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

xoxos wrote:yes yes i always forget that being friendly at parties is more important than a sustainable culture, it's how i show people the clever.

btw i lived on the arcology for over a year, so if you consider it some kind of semantic length measurement, i put my time in for those inches. don't worry, i know you have absolutely no idea of the scope of such things.

you right. i have no scope to understand what you are a talking about. What party? What inches?
i wasn't writing about Paoplo, but about Linus. did you also lived in the linux mailing list for over a year? that would be a cool scope, can i join?

@DNAdisater
Don't worry. I do not care neither. Just enjoy feeding some fresh food into nerd troll lake from time to time
Last edited by PurpleSunray on Wed May 17, 2017 12:20 am, edited 4 times in total.
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S0lo
KVRist
 
393 posts since 31 Dec, 2008

Postby S0lo; Wed May 17, 2017 2:23 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

From the common practice. I'd say sound design for a synth is a very good way to get in. I've seen a sound designer once end up being a manual writer. And you can bet that they have their influence on the synth dev in one way or another.
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FabienTDR
KVRian
 
859 posts since 23 Feb, 2012

Postby FabienTDR; Wed May 17, 2017 7:00 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

Pheek wrote:I'd like to have something for my productions and shows, plus of course, help with promo and sales. I've had good start with other plugins development but it seems that reaching out to developers is very, very hard... just like reaching to labels or artists.


You are most probably asking the wrong way. These guys also do nothing else than sitting behind their email app, and reading this stuff. If they don't answer, you afraid them in a way or another. Simple as that.

The big elephant in the room is that "help with promo and sales" simply doesn't sound very convincing. Most experienced developers know well how elaborate these fields are and would never ever outsource them to another "online grassroots manager" without any experience, credits and obviously, even a serious lack of motivation.

All this sounds more like a classic Kruger Dunning missunderstanding. If you haven't done anything yet, you simply have no experience in the field. The whole reason why you think you do is nicely explained by Kruger and Dunning's work.

It's a bit like proposing your lawyer or even carpenter a whole new business model, with you as a "creative director". He will laugh. But he'll most probably not even take the time to answer.

Pheek wrote:I do not have the time and energy to make myself one.


If you don't, and have the arrogance to give up that early, you are clearly the wrong person for entrepreneurship. This quickly becomes obvious from the way you describe things.

The only way there is: Do something great and relevant (can be small), and then collaborate. Not the other way around.
Fabien from Tokyo Dawn Records

Check out my audio processors over at the Tokyo Dawn Labs!
xoxos
Mr Entertainment
 
12018 posts since 29 Apr, 2002, from i might peeramid

Postby xoxos; Wed May 17, 2017 1:08 pm Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

remind me about all those moments of inspiration *we* have had.

perhaps in this modern world there are in fact functional development teams that do real development, but in my experience, insight and ideas are generally borne by one individual who has the fortitude to withstand the cultural vectors that have inhibited whatever development from being obviate.

that's why i picked it up, not to put someone down (...) but to liberate someone from guilt trips about "lemme in to your team" so that they can

stand on their own feet and achieve things autonomously

because

standing on your own feet is how things actually happen instead of just getting bandied about

great development teams.. name them if you want. but make sure you figure out who actually had the ideas that made the oscillator oscillate, not the guy who said "an envelope on that would be good, and people like black guis". the original rhetoric was as manipulative as you claim my dismissiveness is.

tesla brothers are go! eh.
you come and go, you come and go. amitabha xoxos.net free vst. neither a follower nor a leader be
tagore "where roads are made i lose my way"
where there is certainty, consideration is absent.
Pheek
KVRer
 
17 posts since 28 Sep, 2004

Postby Pheek; Thu May 18, 2017 5:43 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

FabienTDR wrote:
Pheek wrote:I'd like to have something for my productions and shows, plus of course, help with promo and sales. I've had good start with other plugins development but it seems that reaching out to developers is very, very hard... just like reaching to labels or artists.


You are most probably asking the wrong way. These guys also do nothing else than sitting behind their email app, and reading this stuff. If they don't answer, you afraid them in a way or another. Simple as that.

The big elephant in the room is that "help with promo and sales" simply doesn't sound very convincing. Most experienced developers know well how elaborate these fields are and would never ever outsource them to another "online grassroots manager" without any experience, credits and obviously, even a serious lack of motivation.

All this sounds more like a classic Kruger Dunning missunderstanding. If you haven't done anything yet, you simply have no experience in the field. The whole reason why you think you do is nicely explained by Kruger and Dunning's work.

It's a bit like proposing your lawyer or even carpenter a whole new business model, with you as a "creative director". He will laugh. But he'll most probably not even take the time to answer.

Pheek wrote:I do not have the time and energy to make myself one.


If you don't, and have the arrogance to give up that early, you are clearly the wrong person for entrepreneurship. This quickly becomes obvious from the way you describe things.

The only way there is: Do something great and relevant (can be small), and then collaborate. Not the other way around.


This reply is freaking funny Fabien! If you knew my life and the entrepreneurship I have... I just run a label with a roster in and out of 150 artists++ (over 200 releases if that's not enought) plus do online coaching program with about 600+ people. And since I have a university degree in psychology, I do know very well of K&D's work. Thanks for pointing it out, I'm not that much of a n00b.

I came here in a very good mood but to see someone dropping that I'm arrogant when I try to reach out is just mind boggling. Why the hell would I forge new skills at 45 years old when I'm trying to be the best I can at what I do good?

Anyway, I'm out of this topic. Non-sense talks here.
+ thanks to anyone who provided valuable information though.
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FabienTDR
KVRian
 
859 posts since 23 Feb, 2012

Postby FabienTDR; Thu May 18, 2017 6:51 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

Why? Because the developer you are looking for also has to learn new stuff in his 40ies+.

This is simply the wrong attitude, you start the discussion with "I want to.." when a few sentences later you say "I do not have the time and energy to make myself one.".

This is the very reason why pl do not answer your emails. They are not sound. You don't look competent. Maybe you are, but then, why haven't you built such stuff before? Have you ever reached anything with this attitude?

Again, we get at least one weird email from random wannabe managers per week, all in the humorous tone of: "give me your company and I'll give you a share" or "I need you to develop XY, I'm open to give you a fair cut", "build me a toilet and you're allowed to use it for free". I'm sure that it's very similar for any other active dev with public presence.

This is nothing personal, but ppl without experience tend to radically overestimate their qualities and radically underestimate the whole challenge. This is by miles the last guy you'd want to join your team! The very, very very last one.
Last edited by FabienTDR on Thu May 18, 2017 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
Fabien from Tokyo Dawn Records

Check out my audio processors over at the Tokyo Dawn Labs!
PurpleSunray
KVRian
 
520 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Thu May 18, 2017 7:15 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

I came here in a very good mood but to see someone dropping that I'm arrogant when I try to reach out is just mind boggling. Why the hell would I forge new skills at 45 years old when I'm trying to be the best I can at what I do good?

Anyway, I'm out of this topic. Non-sense talks here.
+ thanks to anyone who provided valuable information though.

Com'on.. really?
Lets reverse it:

Hello Pheek.
I have seen you have released 200 releases and worked with over 150+ artists.
I really like music and would like to make some on my own that exactly fits my taste.
But I have no time or energy to learn an instrument or how to use a DAW.
So my idea would be that I tell you how my music should sound like, and you make it for me?
I have lots experience, listening to music since 30+ years.


Would you answer on that?
Numanoid
Suspended

Postby Numanoid; Thu May 18, 2017 7:41 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

Like Personal Jesus, there should be ads for Personal Developers: Someone to hear your ideas, Someone who cares
Pheek
KVRer
 
17 posts since 28 Sep, 2004

Postby Pheek; Thu May 18, 2017 8:23 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

PurpleSunray wrote:
I came here in a very good mood but to see someone dropping that I'm arrogant when I try to reach out is just mind boggling. Why the hell would I forge new skills at 45 years old when I'm trying to be the best I can at what I do good?

Anyway, I'm out of this topic. Non-sense talks here.
+ thanks to anyone who provided valuable information though.

Com'on.. really?
Lets reverse it:

Hello Pheek.
I have seen you have released 200 releases and worked with over 150+ artists.
I really like music and would like to make some on my own that exactly fits my taste.
But I have no time or energy to learn an instrument or how to use a DAW.
So my idea would be that I tell you how my music should sound like, and you make it for me?
I have lots experience, listening to music since 30+ years.


Would you answer on that?


That's called ghostwriting and yes, if you have the money and are friendly, I would try to work with you. Am I crazy? Maybe. But maybe you have incredible tastes and we get along. I did ghost writing before and it was actually fun but it's not my daily thing.
PurpleSunray
KVRian
 
520 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Thu May 18, 2017 8:45 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

That's called ghostwriting and yes, if you have the money and are friendly


But that is the point ppl make here.
In software dev this is not called ghostwriting, but simply "a project".

You have the money?
There are about x mio freelancer devs and little development studios out there.
But don't aproach them with "I have an idea I would like to bring in", but with "I want to run a project, it will be <xyz>. If you are interested, we can shedule a call to clarify details and work out a proper SOW and commecial offer".
You will get replies immediatly.

You don't have the money? Well, would you ghostwrite for me 4free (don't have the money and i'm not that friendly usually, but might still be better than if xoxos needs a ghostwriter )?
Pheek
KVRer
 
17 posts since 28 Sep, 2004

Postby Pheek; Thu May 18, 2017 8:55 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

PurpleSunray wrote:
That's called ghostwriting and yes, if you have the money and are friendly


But that is the point ppl make here.
In software dev this is not called ghostwriting, but simply "a project".

You have the money?
There are about x mio freelancer devs and little development studios out there.
But don't aproach them with "I have an idea I would like to bring in", but with "I want to run a project, it will be <xyz>. If you are interested, we can shedule a call to clarify details and work out a proper SOW and commecial offer".
You will get replies immediatly.

You don't have the money? Well, would you ghostwrite for me 4free?


My initial contact of this what to ask advice on how to approach dev and you, as well as some others provided help. Thank you for that, I'll be careful with my words in the future. :wink:

And yeah, great coincidence, I was on Freelancer to hire a programmer and almost finished summing up my description. I just thought it would be easier here. I thought I mentioned that I had funds...

And yes, I did some ghost writing for free in the past. Everything is a case per case thing. I believe you have to listen to people sometimes. In one case, it turned out to be a great investment in the mid-term.
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raysaul
KVRer
 
18 posts since 15 Jan, 2017

Postby raysaul; Thu May 18, 2017 8:56 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

(I must admit I'm quite surprised no one here appears to know about Pheek and his work. All I can say on that is "Hats off to you sir, and please forgive the uninformed. I for one am delighted to see you here, welcome!".
I'm not joking.
If I were a developer, I'd f***ing read his email.
Just saying.)
Last edited by raysaul on Thu May 18, 2017 9:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
PurpleSunray
KVRian
 
520 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Thu May 18, 2017 9:02 am Re: How to get in touch with a developer?

And yes, I did some ghost writing for free in the past. Everything is a case per case thing. I believe you have to listen to people sometimes. In one case, it turned out to be a great investment in the mid-term.


Yeah, but this is are very rare case. A friend asked me for a soltuion to copy DVDs (it was still 'legal' back than xD). So I did a DVD transcoding engine, mainly to see how DVD works and gave it away for free afterwards.
Tunred out to be a really good 4free investment, because a company aproached me soon after and asked me to make real application out of that engine (paid).

But this is not how things work usually.
If that guy would not have been my friend, the following reaction would have been very likley:
- I ignore him and his idea because I think it's crap.
- I ignore him, but pick up his idea because I think it's good.
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