Any/many EnergyXT Linux users here?

[AVLinux]

Hi,

I maintain a ready-to-use multimedia focused Linux OS called AV Linux. AVL is a bit different than some other similar projects in that it features Open-Source (ie Ardour, Qtractor) Cross-Platform (ie Renoise, Pianoteq) and Commercial demos (ie linuxDSP, Loomer) side by side so users can try all the options and find out what suits them best. In years past the Linux demo of EnergyXT 2.X was featured but due to some Live media issues as well as a horrid drought of pro-grade VST's for Linux it regrettably fell by the wayside...

A month or so ago I became curious about what had become of EnergyXT and noticed the latest 2.7 release and decided to take another look. Although on the surface the changelog didn't look terribly deep on 2.7 version one thing that had changed on the landscape was the large amount of LinuxVST's so I actually moved beyond a cursory glance and put EnXT to a full test on an Audio-heavy project with a few MIDI tracks and was very impressed by EnXT's stability and light footprint. It's MIDI editing capabilities may seem to be aging in comparison to other Win/OSX DAWs but in my world where full-featured MIDI editors are still few and under heavy development with lacking features EnXT is still a joy to sequence with...

I was even more surprised when I inquired about featuring EnergyXT 2.7 (as demo) with full and proper JACK support on the next AVL (6.0.4) release and received a reply from Jorgen with his blessing within a couple of days..

So finally to my question(s)... is EnergyXT still an item of interest to Linux users ? I have to admit to being rather puzzled by it's relative lack of mention on Linux music strongholds like LinuxMusicians.com... I personally have to admit to not giving it an adequate appraisal in it's heyday but now that I have it really doesn't seem that lacking especially in the microcosm of Linux Audio (OK, well yes BitWig has changed the playing field somewhat..)

Are there any/many EnergyXT Linux users active on this forum? or is this not an appropriate place for this discussion? I'd love to hear what current Linux users have to say about EnergyXT 2.7..

Shameless link for the curious:
http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html

[robogone]

I just gave my license away to a user here, but not sure what platform he uses.

[OBSOLETE160530]

[farlukar]

I really tried to love eXT/Linux back in '07, but it had some issues with whatever window manager I was running then, and in my experience the Windows version in WINE worked better than the Linux version, so I had precious little use for eXT/Linux because eXT/Win works better in Windows than in WINE anyway.

(And 1.4 worked better than 2.0, but that's another story.)

[codec_spurt]

Hi,

I maintain a ready-to-use multimedia focused Linux OS called AV Linux. AVL is a bit different than some other similar projects in that it features Open-Source (ie Ardour, Qtractor) Cross-Platform (ie Renoise, Pianoteq) and Commercial demos (ie linuxDSP, Loomer) side by side so users can try all the options and find out what suits them best. In years past the Linux demo of EnergyXT 2.X was featured but due to some Live media issues as well as a horrid drought of pro-grade VST's for Linux it regrettably fell by the wayside...

A month or so ago I became curious about what had become of EnergyXT and noticed the latest 2.7 release and decided to take another look. Although on the surface the changelog didn't look terribly deep on 2.7 version one thing that had changed on the landscape was the large amount of LinuxVST's so I actually moved beyond a cursory glance and put EnXT to a full test on an Audio-heavy project with a few MIDI tracks and was very impressed by EnXT's stability and light footprint. It's MIDI editing capabilities may seem to be aging in comparison to other Win/OSX DAWs but in my world where full-featured MIDI editors are still few and under heavy development with lacking features EnXT is still a joy to sequence with...

I was even more surprised when I inquired about featuring EnergyXT 2.7 (as demo) with full and proper JACK support on the next AVL (6.0.4) release and received a reply from Jorgen with his blessing within a couple of days..

So finally to my question(s)... is EnergyXT still an item of interest to Linux users ? I have to admit to being rather puzzled by it's relative lack of mention on Linux music strongholds like LinuxMusicians.com... I personally have to admit to not giving it an adequate appraisal in it's heyday but now that I have it really doesn't seem that lacking especially in the microcosm of Linux Audio (OK, well yes BitWig has changed the playing field somewhat..)

Are there any/many EnergyXT Linux users active on this forum? or is this not an appropriate place for this discussion? I'd love to hear what current Linux users have to say about EnergyXT 2.7..

Shameless link for the curious:
http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html

Hi.

First off, thanks for a great distro. I've used it on and off for the last couple of years. Haven't used it recently, but I dl'd the latest .iso to install coz I have Harrison Mixbus and it is very unstable in windows. I quite like Mixbus for what it is and I'm looking forward to using it with AVLinux.

I would imagine that EnergyXT2 is the best sequencer available on Linux. I haven't actually got around to installing it for one reason or another, yet, but again, I plan to soon. I recently installed Bitwig to Linux Mint Maya KDE (LTS) that was on a usb stick and working well, but the usb stick failed and I lost my entire install. I had backed it up a few days previously though.

Bitwig just feels all wrong. No way would I pay money for it. It has potential for sure, but the interface is clunky. I actually found it very stable once I got it installed (took me about six hours) and it has loads of great features. But just hate that Java thing they got going on. Don't see how that is ever going to be improved.

So, yes I am VERY interested in getting EnergyXT2 going on Linux. I have LMDE on my hard drive and dual boot through grub to get to that or windows. I'm having some problems with it at the moment that I have to sort out but it is just time to get it all done. I need to sort it coz I have my web development stuff on there with a LAMP stack for my Drupal site.

I have a third partition with nothing on it at the moment that I sectioned off for future use for another Linux distro. Who knows? It seems silly to put 2 Linux Mint installs on there. The Maya KDE that I was checking out surprised me with its stability compared to other KDE systems, but it is still close but no penguin at the end of the day. It looks beautiful and has loads of great features, but the Debian edition is much more stable overall. So, I may even put AVLinux on there, I'll have to see.

I could put another Debian expert install on there like I have on an old laptop, but again, two Debians on one system? A bit of variety would be good. I know the LMDE is perfect for surfing the web and building sites and it is a rolling release so I won't have the rug pulled out from under me in six months time.

I know that AVLinux is Debian based, but it is a very different flavour and you have done most of the hard work to start with! So it kind of makes sense the more I think about it. And I really like XFCE too. I know that LXDE is supposed to be lighter, but on that old laptop with a Debian Small CD install this time (I was experimenting), I got rid of LXDE and put XFCE on there instead coz it was actually much more efficient.

I'm not interested in Bitwig. I have Ableton and I love it to pieces. I am interested in EnergyXT2 though and the Harrison Mixbus I have. I'm not worried about 3rd party VSTs for Linux, though it would be nice, but I'd be happy to use what XT has internally (synth/sampler, drum sampler). Hell, I might even buy that synth that Jorgen knocked up and that is being sold in the XT shop.

I disagree about the midi editing though in XT. It is rather good once you get used to it. I know that people say that FLStudio has the best piano roll editor (I have that too btw), but you have to remember the shortcuts and what not to use it to its full potential. When you are flitting about between DAWs as I do, then it just becomes a pain, power or not. Ableton's midi editor is basic, but it does the job. And I don't know if you have explored the right click options in the editor but it has lots of powerful features that other editors don't have. For example:

1: Create a note of one bar duration. Right click>Process>Slice - this will split the note into 16ths say if your quantisation value is at that or whatever it is set to.

2: Random. Speaks for itself, but can be very useful sometimes.


Anyway, I see that you include EnergyXT2 in demo form in the distro. I assume it is just a case of putting in my serial and good to go kind of thing. Saves me installing it. That's a plus.

But no Harrison Mixbus (unless I missed it). No big deal, I suppose.

You also have Virtual Box as well by the looks of it. That is a very big plus as I have a few Virtual disks with XP and even Debian (KDE) on. That is a very big plus.

Another bonus is Inkscape.

I'm kind of tired of distro hopping now. I have a pretty good idea of what is what and I just want to get something going where I can get some work done.

Mmmm... I'll install to a new usb stick or SD card and then see about putting it on my spare partition. I've just got Terabyte Image for Linux and a new 2TB HD so I need to get everything backed up first. Nasty business, multi-boot (shiver). I'm just trying out this program from them too for help with that:

https://www.terabyteunlimited.com/bootit-bare-metal.htm


And this is as good a place as any to talk about XT and Linux, so feel free.
There are quite a few old experienced Linux heads about that drop in every now and again, and they know about all kinds of arcane stuff like Jack that I have absobleedinlutely NO idea about (shudder).


Oh, and feel free to take any of my 'skins' for XT and include them or do whatever you want with them. No need to ask, and no credit necessary.

[AVLinux]

I really tried to love eXT/Linux back in '07, but it had some issues with whatever window manager I was running then, and in my experience the Windows version in WINE worked better than the Linux version, so I had precious little use for eXT/Linux because eXT/Win works better in Windows than in WINE anyway.

(And 1.4 worked better than 2.0, but that's another story.)

hehe..

2007 was not a very lovable time for Linux Audio... in fairness that might as well be 20 years ago, things have come a long way.. in retrospect having Linux support in eXT was pretty cutting edge but at that time Windows certainly had better potential and a lot more plugin choices.. The fact that JACK has always been a arms-length add-on for the Linux version of eXT only added to the confusion I suppose... and then it wasn't until years later that falkTX properly integrated it...

I suppose looking at things objectively that proper Linux Audio integration (ie libaam-jack) came a bit late after most of the active development on eXT had slowed and the prominent Open-source Linux DAWs had matured nicely in that time frame. Things are starting to make sense..

All said though I'm still diggin' 2.7

[AVLinux]

@codec_spurt

Hi, thanks for the reply and clarification, just the info I was looking for.. BTW the AV Linux LiveDVD is the ONLY place you can get a demo of both Harrison Mixbus and all of the Harrison LV2 plugin demos. AV Linux 6.0.4 is almost ready to push out the door and will have the latest Mixbus 2.5 + Harrison plugins, as well as Renoise3-demo, Pianoteq5-demo, all the linuxDSP demos as well as the great Open-Source Ardour3, Qtractor and literally hundreds of LV2 and VST Plugins. For those who want to try their Windows stuff ArdourVST, Wine and WineASIO are also on there making Reaper just a matter of running the installer... and now on top of that eXT 2.7+libaam-jack...

No tracktion or Bitwig though...(yet)

Thanks, and yeah I'm lovin' those skins I may put the AKAI-REN-Final one as default if you're cool with that

[codec_spurt]

@codec_spurt

Hi, thanks for the reply and clarification, just the info I was looking for.. BTW the AV Linux LiveDVD is the ONLY place you can get a demo of both Harrison Mixbus and all of the Harrison LV2 plugin demos. AV Linux 6.0.4 is almost ready to push out the door and will have the latest Mixbus 2.5 + Harrison plugins, as well as Renoise3-demo, Pianoteq5-demo, all the linuxDSP demos as well as the great Open-Source Ardour3, Qtractor and literally hundreds of LV2 and VST Plugins. For those who want to try their Windows stuff ArdourVST, Wine and WineASIO are also on there making Reaper just a matter of running the installer... and now on top of that eXT 2.7+libaam-jack...

No tracktion or Bitwig though...(yet)

Looking good! If Tracktion or Bitwig was on there, I might consider buying them, but it's their loss if they don't want to play. I'm getting too tired and bored of this game now to be running around after people. This is Linux, they should make it easy. I'm sure they have their reasons.

Well.

I just torrented the .iso and made a disk for it in VBox to run the LiveCD with a view to installing. No problem making the VD, however..

I could not change the screen resolution from 1024x768. VBox was telling me I needed to change to 32 bit in the guest OS. Couldn't figure that out. Tried to install the ATI drivers, seemed they were already installed. Tried again to install the fglrx-gfx or whatever and it wanted to wipe half the system. I can find absolutely no way to change the graphics beyond this resolution and can find no way to install gfx drivers even though I am unsure of which ones to dl in the VBox.

I tried to install to disk (vd) and you say to use Remastersys but there are a couple of different versions of Remastersys and I am unsure which one to use. Neither seem to be appropriate. I went through GParted and made up a home and swap for it. One was about 3GB to accomodate the image and the rest was about 1GB that I had left. I was limited to a size of 4GB because I put it on a FAT 32 partition which is limited. I later moved it to NTFS when I cleared some space, but I am not sure this is big enough. VBox tells me it needs 8GB. I will have to make up a new disk and try again. It found the home partition, but it just gave me the option to exit when it did not find the swap. I formatted to ext2.

Also the mouse driver was all over the shop with no way to change it. It was very very difficult to use.


I'm sure it's just me being not very bright, and I am prepared to spend a bit of time getting it set up, but so far it has been a very frustrating experience. I'd like to do a test run first in VBox to get a feel for things, especially how the installer works. I'm not sure if that makes things easier or more difficult.

Things like the mouse not working properly and the terrible screen resolution just compound the frustration. I accept this is probably all my newbness and inexperience.

I'm going to give up on this for now and have another go when you get 6.04 out. I'd really like to get this to work. Even if it is just to have a working install of Mixbus and XT. People don't appreciate how difficult it is to even install some programs in Linux. I regularly fail at being able to do this what with all the different package managers and different distros.

I am a bit weary with Linux though truth be told. I once spent a whole week (five working days) to get Amarok to work on Kubuntu. Was it worth it? I don't know. I don't use Kubuntu any more, and it is practically impossible to get Amarok to work on KDE anyway.

Any instructions you could include to help people get off the ground would really benefit the whole project as I see it.

It's nearly always the same pitfalls across the board on all distros.

1: Gfx don't work. Can't change resolution. No multimonitor support.
2: Need to install Gfx drivers, but this is hardly ever as straightforward as downloading the requisite drivers.
3: Can not find a way to burn the .iso to usb to check out a live persistent install. Follow instructions, but they do not work.

I have lost the count of how many times this has happened. They are the absolute top 3 bugbears of Linux. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, your distro seems to have fallen prey to them as well. Don't get me wrong, I think it is amazing what you have done. The amount of work you have put into this is incredible. And you are a million times cleverer than me for being able to do it.

I however have spent months setting up distros, making detailed notes. Getting them to work. I'm a dab hand at fglrx on most systems by now becasue my laptop runs very very hot when I run sensors. Installing the Catalyst drivers is the only way to bring the temps down.

But I really am not criticising you or your distro, I think it is just me not being very bright. I have tried to get help, but people just say RTFM. Even Knoppix which I run quite a bit and love to death, do you you think I can get the Catalyst drivers to install on there? Yes, I can install them to an otherwise persistent usb stick, but are they ever there when I reboot? No.

At the end of the day, it is diminishing returns. I already have a perfect working install of my DAWs on both WinXP and Win7, both of which I am very very happy with.

The Linux stuff is just for fun!



Just some thoughts and initial findings, fwiw.

@codec_spurt
Thanks, and yeah I'm lovin' those skins I may put the AKAI-REN-Final one as default if you're cool with that

Sure. No problem. Take what you want and use it how you want. No credit needed.


cheers.

[AVLinux]

Hi,

I can't reply in depth right now but for the best experience in Virtualbox I'd suggest a virtual drive of at least 16Gb, you also will want to install the VBox guest additions in order to get the capability to have larger screen resolutions, I think almost any Linux distro will require this step to fully work in a VM.. please note that JACK is the audio core of AV Linux and JACK performance in a Virtualbox environment is possible but not optimal, although as you say it is a great place to get your feet wet and try things out..

As far as Video drivers it is a constant struggle and AMD/ATi is extremely frustrating and routinely pulls Linux support on cards that aren't all that old. Also because AV Linux uses a customized kernel for better Audio performance it requires a 3rd party script called SGFXI to handle the Proprietary Vid drivers. I'm not trying to discourage you and glibly tell you to RTFM but the AV Linux Manual really has a wealth of information on how to install 3rd party proprietary vid drivers, the manual can be found on the AV Linux desktop when you run it Live. I would really suggest waiting for AVL 6.0.4 though because it has a newer version of gcc that is now required by SGFXI...

I'll try and get back soon with more info..

[codec_spurt]

Hi,

I can't reply in depth right now but for the best experience in Virtualbox I'd suggest a virtual drive of at least 16Gb, you also will want to install the VBox guest additions in order to get the capability to have larger screen resolutions, I think almost any Linux distro will require this step to fully work in a VM.. please note that JACK is the audio core of AV Linux and JACK performance in a Virtualbox environment is possible but not optimal, although as you say it is a great place to get your feet wet and try things out..

No problem. I can figure it out. I was pretty exhausted yesterday and overworked, and I should have just left it, but you know...

I'll put 16GB for the VD. I have guest additions installed already, but like I said, my brain was a bit muddled. As for audio, I'm not bothered about that in a VM. It's just to check out the look and feel and also the installation procedure to disk when/if I decide to dedicate to an actual partition on my HD.

Hi,

As far as Video drivers it is a constant struggle and AMD/ATi is extremely frustrating and routinely pulls Linux support on cards that aren't all that old. Also because AV Linux uses a customized kernel for better Audio performance it requires a 3rd party script called SGFXI to handle the Proprietary Vid drivers. I'm not trying to discourage you and glibly tell you to RTFM but the AV Linux Manual really has a wealth of information on how to install 3rd party proprietary vid drivers, the manual can be found on the AV Linux desktop when you run it Live. I would really suggest waiting for AVL 6.0.4 though because it has a newer version of gcc that is now required by SGFXI...

I'll try and get back soon with more info..

I did RTFM actually! But I think the combination of being tired and the frustration of the mouse not working properly, got the better of me. I can figure it out. In fact, I think I have actually learned everything I needed to, which was more to do with the disk install than anything else. I have an idea how that works now, and even though things got a bit weird in GParted (which I use all the time and can use very well) I put that down to the too low size of the VD.

Anyway, thanks for getting back to me. I'm really looking forward to 6.04 and have made the decision to put it on my disk. That is quite a compliment considering how much distro hopping I have done .

I was thinking of writing a little tutorial for total noobs, on how to dl the torrented .iso, MD5 check it, and get it on a bootable usb stick etc.. so that anyone that actually owns a copy of EnergyXT2 or Mixbus can get up and running with it in no time. Doing it in VBox just complicates things, but it has served its purpose. No one would want to run it in a VM to do any serious work.

Also I'm experimenting with an amazing tool called BareMetal by Terabyte Software, which manages and backs up partitions. I may extend the tutorial to include the repartitioning of the hard disk for purposes of dual boot and putting on AVLinux.

One good thing in the VM was that AVLinux connected straight to the net out of the box. That helps.

Anyway, don't worry about me. I'll dl 6.04 when it arrives and just jump in installing it to my disk. I'm half way through backing up my 750GB HD and all the partitions - when that is done, It'll be time to play!

[fladd]

I think quite a lot of energyXT users (not just linux ones) just gave up on it after seeing the development being so slow.

There is another forum for eXT requests, this topic sums the community comments nicely:
https://getsatisfaction.com/energyxt/to ... till_alive

Yes, most of the old user base has indeed moved on to other software as there was practically no development over the last 7 years. XT2 was coming short of the expectations also (with less features then version 1 of the same software) right from the beginning. I myself was mainly interested in it because of the Linux support, but there were a lot of problems (one of them was that it did not work at all without compiling a jack enabled libaam.so). So I also moved on.

However, as I can read in the thread you linked, Jorgen seems to have gained back full control over the software, so maybe things will change in the future. My hopes aren't hight, though.

[aardbewoner]

Using AvLinux 6.0.4 that include a demo of Energy-xt ,i found that it all works smooth.
As i have a regkey i try that and got one working Energy-xt
Hoping that now energy-xt is revived under Jorgens hands it grow again.
And a THANKS to Macq of AvLinux who made it working