KVR Audio

jacqueslacouth · Post by **jacqueslacouth** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:49 am

Last year I was feeling kind of stale. I looked around the studio and saw far too many synths that had not been touched in years. I started working through them and basically felt kind of meh, so I decided to offload them on Ebay and do something totally new.....

Eurorack! It seemed kind of exciting, there was much chatter about it in forums and an ever increasing number of videos on Youtube. There was lots of flashing lights, geeky cable patching and all sorts of clever bleeps and bloops...I wanted in!!!

So early last year, I bought a beautiful 9u x 104HP timber case and started researching modules full time. The year went by in a blaze of new, exciting, shiny things arriving from boutique electronics companies around the world. I was patching cables in and out like a madman. The excitement of my first beeeeeeep, the elation of a bloop, jizzing my pants over a bzzzzzzzzz.

Then it struck me....I hadn't made music in 12 months. No matter what I did, no matter how expensive and widely lauded the VCO or the filter or function generator or whatever. The bleeps and bloops were just not making musical sense. I returned to Youtube to see if I was missing something, but this time I saw with less bedazzled eyes. Sure, there are some musical pieces out there, but without getting into another story (and setting off a pretty tired KVR argument) the actual tone of much of this very expensive gear is basically crap.

I get that modular is a different world, but I first and foremost, a musician, a songwriter. I like music, I like experimental sounds in music, but I am prepared to call a lot of the modular scene for what I see it as. Especially the "West Coast" scene is the realm of geeks who like playing with noisy electrical devices to make sounds in clever ways, but for me (and I emphasise ME) it is a distraction from music. It is VERY expensive in the end and I honestly believe that not one sound that has come out of my modular can hold a light to any of the better softsynths of today, either in sound quality or in assisting my creative flow in music production.

So....I have come to the decision to cut my losses. I'm selling off the lot and going 100% ITB. I've fought this for a long time, but in the end, I can no longer continue to argue the superiority of Hardware over Software. Each has their place in the wonderful world of music making, but for me, it is time to go with the times.

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:31 am

I know how you feel.

I went modular after loosing interest/inspiration with ITB - found I was spending more time installing and updating (my own fault for having to many plugs) than music making and once in front of a PC there were just too many other distractions.

Modular is quite difficult (each module can take time to learn) and often after hours of patching the results could have been achieved in 5 minutes with a plugin! With modular I think you have to enjoy the journey, the taktile and visual experience, the unexpected! It is slow and often leads to nothing. ITB is fast (and often leads to nothing!)

I don't use my modular that often, but I don't feel bad about that; it looks great in the studio (better than plugs I don't use) I also like the Euro rack community and ethos (muff wiggled etc) so am sticking with it- figure it's probably a 10 year apprentaship!

A good compromise is something like the electron boxes with overbridge- if you sell a few modules try an A4, great CV sequencer, 4 analog voices with FX and you can use it as a VST or a Modular interface...half way house.

justin3am · Post by **justin3am** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:44 am

Got anything good for sale?

It's all good... we all have preferences. I appreciate those who jump into modular with both feet, to unload their rig a year later. I've gotten a lot of great deals that way.

I think it depends on what you want from your synth. It's really easy to get into a eurorack system and make some wacky sounds. I love doing that and may spend long periods of time, just experimenting with different methods of patching without recording a note. When it comes to using a modular in a structured musical context; as with any instrument, it requires years of commitment to really master. I wouldn't count myself among those who have that level of skill but there are some who make beautiful music with their synths (Alessandro Cortini, Keith Fullerton Whitman, Todd Barton, etc). I do aspire to that, though. It's been quite challenging but it's also rewarding. Once I've achieved something I'm happy with, I feel something that I didn't get when working primarily in the box.

That said, I have always been drawn to modular environments. When I got my start, I always loved working with the patch bays. When I started with computer music I gravitated toward Reaktor, then Numerology and Max/MSP. When I stared working with hardware again it was natural to be interested in analog modulars. I've been using eurorack synths for almost 9 years now. They have gone from providing background fx and simple synth parts, to being the focus of most of my work.

When it comes to making the modular synth work in the context of a song, I was pretty disappointed when I was mostly making basic subtractive patches or sounds which didn't seem to be under my control. Once I got a better feeling for my instrument's boundaries, I started to find a more significant role for it in my music. Now I'll construct a whole song around a synth patch, and I'll use switches and logic and cascaded sequencers to to develop the structure for a song by letting the patch evolve in one direction or another. Shit, this is starting to sound really pretentious... Here are some recent videos I find pretty inspiring:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvrxQbh6vAg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6hJa2lRRgM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgvAM18srr4

DJ Warmonger · Post by **DJ Warmonger** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 8:28 am

Yes, it' sad to watch tech geeks sitting in dark rooms and watching blipy machines.

That's why I don't buy anything until I'm sure how it can be integrated into my workflow.

jacqueslacouth · Post by **jacqueslacouth** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 9:52 am

I don't regret the experiment for one minute, I think it was something I was always going to do at some point, actually NEEDED to do. I learnt a lot about synthesis along the way,(and the modular is definitely the coolest looking thing in the studio) but in the end, it really wasn't my thing.

On a personal note, I struggle big time with mental illness and I feel a need to reduce my attachment to, and desire for material possessions. I need a giant dose of spiritual bran.

Musically, for myself, I started as a guitarist in a new wave/punk/ska band....keys had a place but it was always a very simple sound and that is what I still like to listen to and is very much the crux of how I write music.

I have a hell of a lot of admiration for those with the perseverance to prevail in the modular game, but with my current state of health, I doubt I would get far down the road before I go belly up...so I'll keep it basic (coz basically, I'm pretty stoopid

)

suthnear · Post by **suthnear** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 10:18 am

You're not stupid. Recognising that something you have invested considerable money and time in is a dead end street shows you have an adaptable mind. I love my modular but it took me years to integrate it properly into my studio (expertsleepers' Silent Way being the main driver of that). Essentially I treat my modular as a variable number of interesting mono synths. What I get from them that I don't from VSTs (which I love for different reasons) is a sense of unpredictability and, coupled with that, the need to commit parts to audio (since they might not sound quite the same next time), unpatch (because I need the cables, modules, etc for another part) and move on. This has been very helpful to music making for me. I find with VST only tracks that I find it difficult to commit and so often never get beyond the live's session page. And I like the physical interface, too, which helps. I spend a lot of time staring at a computer and it's nice not to.

DJ Warmonger · Post by **DJ Warmonger** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 10:48 am

Entering modular for the sake of modular is bad idea if you are not fluent with synths as such and know exactly what they do. There are two approaches that seem to work:

- Use conventional synths with some extra CV connectivity on top of that, like guy in this video:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/SemiModular/?fref=nf

- Use Eurorack explicitely as weird FX / drone machine or sample source and from there process it with your usual tools.

topaz · Post by **topaz** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 10:50 am

Same situation

I not only had a nice setup but I built most of it too.

I sold pretty much all of except I kept the Pittsburgh system 10.1 plus a few more modules to fill a DIY built 3U 84hp rack and DIY modules and DIY power supply.

I have quit a few pcbs and a power supply to build but will sell those.

Having too much gear in general is as counter productive as not having enough.

Having a single row rack has proven way more productive than having 3 rows.

chaosWyrM · Post by **chaosWyrM** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:18 pm

interesting post.

i have been feeling a bit of a craving for some modular equipment lately. though i dont nearly have the cash for it.

i do understand when people say they just see (hear) bleeps and bloops and nothing really musical....but then i see things like this and im like....OMG...i WANT some of that!!! and look what can be done with not a ton of gear.

i could listen to stuff like this all day:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5Z0R9DS4u0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyXi8uMmCuE&t=505s

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:25 pm

Those are both really nice videos, but, neither one has a whole lot of "modular" happening. The second one is super nice and chill, but, please note the H9, that's where so much of the character is coming from, well, that and the 303.

I, like the previous poster, have just a small modular (and some nice vintage semi-modular stuff) and mine is also DIY. I don't use it much, but, I'm getting ready to do a bit more with it. I think that stuff like what you've posted just does sound better with analogue gear. It can also be fun to do, but, with respect to the OP, you really have to just get down and record it. I think that's where a lot of time is spent, not recording and then reflecting on how you are going to recreate things. I give up on that, just record, it's either cool or it isn't.

I think that the bigger the hardware setup gets, and the more expectations that you put on it, the more difficult it is to enjoy.

foosnark · Post by **foosnark** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:27 pm

I am really enjoying my foray into modular, and I'm making more music than ever. (And spending more money

)

But I've started small, with a 3U skiff and plans for another 3U to be filled in eventually. Meanwhile I'm still using MicroBrute and software. I'm definitely staying in software for sequencing, effects and infrastructure, despite people at the Muff Wiggler forum who insist everyone wants to get rid of the computer eventually.

To me though, the whole point is finding inspiration in new sounds and new workflow -- if you're not getting that inspiration then it's time to look elsewhere.

This is why I'm getting out of (non-modular) small desktop synths generally, because those provide me with a short burst of excitement followed by dust collection and having a bunch of little devices always in the way. It took me a couple of years to realize that.

Other things, like going to VST in the first place and switching to Maschine as my host, proved to have a more enduring benefit and I expect Eurorack will be that way for me.

RichieWitch · Post by **RichieWitch** » Tue Jan 17, 2017 8:13 pm

For me, I got into Eurorack in order to build an FX bus for my hardware synths, but there came a point when I realized I wanted to build a custom instrument unlike anything else out there--my own personal vision.

It took 12U of Euro to get there, but now I have an instrument that I can say, "this song needs a sound like this" and I can grab a fistful of patch cables and make that sound. I don't own (nor am I aware of) any softsynth that could produce what I'm getting from my Euro. I use it in every song now, and usually on more than one track.

I think I got lucky. I have an engineering brain and had a bolt-out-of-the-blue moment where I knew I wanted to build a very specific instrument and modular was the only way to get there.

deastman · Post by **deastman** » Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:40 am

I've told my story a few times already, but hey, why not?

I got into Doepfer, aka Eurorack, starting in 1996. It wasn't like software was an option. Sure, the Nord Modular came out soon after, and yes, I got one of those too. But at that time, your options were much more limited, and modular was the best way to explore an entire universe of strange sounds which went way beyond the average polysynth.

And even now, whenever someone complains that modulars are only used to make weird, unmusical noises, my response is always the same: Yes, of course... what did you think it was used for? Putting in a whole lot of extra effort just to make a simple sound like a $500 monosynth makes no sense whatsoever. Why would you do that? Modulars are best at making strange, unmusical sounds.

Of course I'm being a little tongue in cheek, because I think any sound can be musical in the right context. A lot of the suggestions made earlier are spot on- sequence from a DAW, process other instruments with it, make drones and atmospheres, or sample it for further manipulation ITB.

.jon · Post by **.jon** » Wed Jan 18, 2017 8:26 am

For me the most desirable and inspiring aspect of a modular synth is CV, the myriad ways to generate, route, process and interact with the sequences and modulation. Using a modular just as a sound source like a plugin sounds very expensive and awfully cumbersome, but creating the whole melodic structure and timbral progression of a song inside the modular as a combination of generated CV and live interaction is a clear departure from the usual DAW workflow.

Years ago I used to build these kinds of patches in energyXT, but now Blocks is like a dream for me. Learning about modules and methods in Blocks has also changed my Modulargrid sketch a lot, so I'm very happy I got Reaktor first before going module shopping.

jacqueslacouth · Post by **jacqueslacouth** » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:23 am

A YEAR later!!!

Well, that was an unexpected and cathartic experience.Eventually I sold off all the modules and the case (thankfully, very little depreciation on most). The funny thing was, the more I looked around the studio, the more I was thinking "why the F..k do I need that, haven't used it in years". I started listing more and more for sale. Today I sold my last remaining hardware synth but still have a bunch of other stuff listed on eBay.

The upshot? I no longer have a studio in my home. I now have the most awesome of man caves with lots of shiny new toys. Sure I still have a few guitars and lots of ITB music making capabilities for when it strikes me to do so. I was also able, after all these years to put a swag of cash back into the family coffers, AND, I'm not looking around aroom thinking I really need to do something with all this gear. I'm treating my hobby like a hobby....PLUS I now have a most excellent 4K UHD TV and a Playstation Pro with a booming home theater system. Growing up (old) is not all bad...

The End of My Last Great Synthesis Adventure (Bye Bye Eurorack)