T-Racks CS . . . Some Good, Some Bad. My Rant.

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braj wrote:Sorry but when I worked in software development we tested on pre-release OS's and really tried to make sure any new OS was supported with any new release, we would be very careful to get it all covered. It isn't like it came out after CS, nor was trhere any message with the download that WIn 8 isn't supported yet. It took a tech support person to inform me about that. Not great. So while understandable that it isn't supported, it is still 'kind of dumb'.
It isn't on the Specs page for that reason. And again, official support is not announced by many others in our field. Plus, T-RackS Custom Shop was being developed before Windows 8 was available and no we weren't going to both develop and test gear that took this long using pre-release versions of Windows. It was enough to get it out the door for the OSes available while it was being coded. I've worked in software development for more than a decade too, before IK, and what we and many others in the field are doing with regard to Windows 8 isn't abnormal or dumb at all, I have to disagree with you on that regardless of my affiliation.

I do feel for early adopters of Windows (and Mac) operating systems, but I also believe they should be fully aware of the risks of this when using audio plugins.
Last edited by Peter - IK Multimedia on Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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We tested on prerelease OS builds all the time :shrug: but we were a professional QA house, so maybe you don't have those standards. No 64-bit Sampletank definitely indicates that.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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AudioGuy720 wrote: Car dealerships don't get a cut when you sell your used car directly to a buyer. Or publishers for a used book. Or computer companies for used computers!
The difference being that you can't sell your car and still keep a copy to drive.....you can't sell a book and still keep a copy to read....you can't sell your computer and still keep a copy for yourself to continue using..... :shrug:
Last edited by Teksonik on Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

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Brian @ IK Multimedia wrote:
A.M. Gold wrote:You have a point, though, if they had this big group buy and then raised all their prices immediately afterwards.
What we did was added more gear credit packs and made minor adjustments to the number of credits in some of the lower priced packs, in order to accommodate for the various T-RackS processor prices so users can buy them without having to buy more credits than necessary or be stuck with "left over credits."

We made these changes because this is what you all told us you wanted. Constantly. Over and over. In every Custom Shop related thread for the past year and a half on KVR. So we do our best to give you what you want, and now we get complaints in the opposite direction instead. :roll:
I was definitely one complaining a lot about that, as I considered it a little scammy to sell credits in increments that couldn't be completely spent (same way Microsoft does on XBL). So I definitely respect the change to allow users to buy just what they need in increments that can actually be used.

You will never make a change that everyone will like, and it's usually only the people who are unsatisfied who speak up about it. Lord knows I have spoken my mind about my problems with IK in the past, but personally, I am on-board with the new T-Racks Custom Shop changes so far (although I can also see how people in certain situations could be dissatisfied, particularly with upgrade pricing for the Grand bundle for people who own a lot of Singles).

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braj wrote:We tested on prerelease OS builds all the time :shrug: but we were a professional QA house, so maybe you don't have those standards. No 64-bit Sampletank definitely indicates that.
Ah I see you needed an opportunity to vent. We have very high standards and perhaps you missed how I mentioned at least twice that we're not unique in not posting the official support for Windows 8 at this time. Others are in the same boat, and it is like this every WIndows release. I apologize that you think we should have been beta testing an OS and developing our own T-RackS gear at the same time. Windows 8 is out, I already stated that we've been testing it for a while already with good results, and we'll post the official results and support when we feel ready (once again - just like other devs in the field at this time).

If you don't feel we're professional and want to use the plugins that we've produced to a VERY professional level despite your petty attempt at insult, why are you so present in the discussion about them?

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Because I am a customer. You release new products without supporting old products (St2), that is some business decision, not your engineer's capabilities. You release without testing on the current OS thoroughly, that is a business decision, not a technical one. I have no problem with your coders, it is your management and marketing side that disgruntles me. Having jam points, gear credits systems is proving frustrating for me as a consumer, and I really do feel misled into buying gear credits and not being able to use them for the cool new thing you told me to buy them for :shrug: you said we would need 300, I bought like 400, and now have no worthwhile way to spend them. So complaining about the Win 8 support is not really my gripe, and I admit I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill with that.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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I like the new TRacks Custom Shop idea.....in fact I hope IK does something similar for SampleTank 3 where samples can be purchased right through the interface....

I think the execution of this new TRacks system and upgrade paths could have gone a lot smoother but you've got expect some bugs when a change of this size is made....

The measure of the quality of a company's customer service is how they deal with customers who are unhappy. Let's give IK some time to work out the kinks and see if they take steps to address some of the complaints......

If after a reasonable period of time nothing is done to address the complaints then we burn them at the stake and grind their bones up to make bread......fair enough? :shrug:
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

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Teksonik wrote:I like the new TRacks Custom Shop idea.....in fact I hope IK does something similar for SampleTank 3 where samples can be purchased right through the interface....

I think the execution of this new TRacks system and upgrade paths could have gone a lot smoother but you've got expect some bugs when a change of this size is made....

The measure of the quality of a company's customer service is how they deal with customers who are unhappy. Let's give IK some time to work out the kinks and see if they take steps to address some of the complaints......

If after a reasonable period of time nothing is done to address the complaints then we burn them at the stake and grind their bones up to make bread......fair enough? :shrug:
Sounds like a plan, Stan.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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Fair enough. At the time my estimate was correct. We ended up able to offer more and better, and it looks like it comes out to 420 ( which does not in any way correlate with my graphic about the British Channel GUI design meeting posted elsewhere for those that enjoyed the HPC-worthy followup discussion) so it wasn't that far off from the 400 you have. In the group buy, the expenditure for the 400 you have would have been at 4-for-1 value, plus adding 20 now should put you into a fair economic place as far as buying them all a la carte, no? Again, I calculated what I had at the time for going all-in buying the models a la carte and had I known it would be more I'd have suggested more and estimated that way. I didn't want to say "buy 500-600 credits and use them over the course of time" or some other gross overestimation.

But I have to add I'm fully understanding your plight and not just because I don't want to make some awful-tasting bread!!!

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Brian @ IK Multimedia wrote:
A.M. Gold wrote:You have a point, though, if they had this big group buy and then raised all their prices immediately afterwards.
What we did was added more gear credit packs and made minor adjustments to the number of credits in some of the lower priced packs, in order to accommodate for the various T-RackS processor prices so users can buy them without having to buy more credits than necessary or be stuck with "left over credits."

We made these changes because this is what you all told us you wanted. Constantly. Over and over. In every Custom Shop related thread for the past year and a half on KVR. So we do our best to give you what you want, and now we get complaints in the opposite direction instead. :roll:
45 credits was 39.99, now it is 40 credits for 39.99.
There is no discount till 120 credits. That is raising prices. I don't think that is what "we" wanted. I know it isn't what "I" wanted.

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I also totally like the CS idea, just it has been rough trying to know where you stand, is this is good buy, is that, what should I do, I'm frustrated with it. Damn, I'm an impulse buyer, exactly who the store probably is made for, but it seems dumb to buy anything with points in the store, even with discounted points when a bundle is such a superior deal. I suggest make the individual units better deals, or make CS only mini-bundle deals you can buy with points, like a black-white bundle for 120 credits for instance, not a sale price, just a normal bundle price. the 4 Quad units could all be available at a special price and so on. Then it would for me be much more attractive to participate more in the store. Maybe have a regular buy 3 get one free deal. Something to make it more reasonable in comparison.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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Or just get away from credits and points. I would much prefer that.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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braj wrote:I also totally like the CS idea, just it has been rough trying to know where you stand, is this is good buy, is that, what should I do, I'm frustrated with it.
I can understand the frustration. The credits I bought in the 4x1 deal I fully intended to use on new AT3 gear and that's what I'll do. Luckily I didn't buy hundreds and hundreds of credits otherwise I'd be frustrated too at not being able to buy the TRacks 3 CS Grand bundle using gear credits.....

The frustration I have now is that I'm afraid to even try to install the free TRacks 3 CS shell update because of the WinXp issues. I love and use my TR3 and CSR plugins so much that I don't want to even take a chance of screwing anything up. At this point I can't even spend my credits on existing AT gear because my Custom Shop "client" is outdated. It's not a big deal as I don't need anything right now anyway....

IK is working on the issue so I'll give them time to find and release a fix before I attempt to install anything.....just need to have a little patience :)
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

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You can install CS and the old stuff will stay intact, irt doesn't seem there is a real risk, and you could just back up the originals just in case. I'd guess if you have any real issues it would be with the auth manager version.
If you have requests for Korg VST features or changes, they are listening at https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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Ah the "300" post that started it all
Peter - IK Multimedia (10/31/2012, Gear Credit Groupbuy Thread) wrote:The next set of gear coming that will use Gear Credits is (by pure estimation at this point) will likely afford you an opportunity to spend around 300 of those.
Image

You did say "pure estimation at this point." I think of lot of people, myself included, just held onto that 300 number as the end all be all.

again, you said "pure estimation," so........

ah well, i'm over it. got a good deal on a bunch of credits to use in the future.

lates

t-willy

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