why not analog-style limiters?

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TheoM wrote:Did you try the idea of zero latency compressor with limiter on output?
Theo,
Im not searching for any hearable compression this time - only want to control peaks in analog style /=without harsh digital distortion and without lookahed/

AFAIK there are 3 way to achieve this goal /control peaks/:
-soft or hard clipping
-tape or tube compression and saturation
-analog style limiting

Im searching the last one...becouse we have enough of clippers,saturators and tape machine simulators...but not any single one good analog style limiter

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Quinto Sardo is pretty open minded. Try to talk him into doing a version of an analog style limiter in the modern sense.
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A.M. Gold wrote:Quinto Sardo is pretty open minded. Try to talk him into doing a version of an analog style limiter in the modern sense.
I have nothing against Quinto directly /actually he was kind enough to allow me to test some of his plugins/ but untill he stops his no demo policy Im not prepared to contact him again...missing demos are always major obstacle for me and buy-return back policy is not a good solution for me becouse of many reasons /all was discussed eaarlier in different thread and I dont want to go into details again/

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kvaca wrote:lately we can see many new and intersting analog modelling vst plugins - be it tube saturators, console plugins, preamps or equalizers...OK, I can get it, but I still cannot see any new dedicated and hi-quality analog style limiter... /= think brickwall but without latency and with nice harmonic distortion/ and I need to say that Im not talking about simple clipping here,too...a lot of good clippers around already...
so - am I missing something, or all what people need today is tranparent brickwall limiter with lookahead like Elephant or L2?
But isn't the brickwall thingy as far as you can come from analog style?

I see analog style limiter = compressor with high ratio.

And why should distortion come from limiter?
Who cares where distortion come from, it could be from any other plugin after/before instead.

And why should there be zero latency, limiter usually matter during mixing.

And finally - why is there 7 pages of this thread - handling a non-topic? ;) :D

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lfm wrote:
kvaca wrote:lately we can see many new and intersting analog modelling vst plugins - be it tube saturators, console plugins, preamps or equalizers...OK, I can get it, but I still cannot see any new dedicated and hi-quality analog style limiter... /= think brickwall but without latency and with nice harmonic distortion/ and I need to say that Im not talking about simple clipping here,too...a lot of good clippers around already...
so - am I missing something, or all what people need today is tranparent brickwall limiter with lookahead like Elephant or L2?
But isn't the brickwall thingy as far as you can come from analog style?

I see analog style limiter = compressor with high ratio.

And why should distortion come from limiter?
Who cares where distortion come from, it could be from any other plugin after/before instead.

And why should there be zero latency, limiter usually matter during mixing.

And finally - why is there 7 pages of this thread - handling a non-topic? ;) :D
I think these 7 pages are here for people like you - just to avoid another useless post :shrug:

hint - all your comments were deeply discussed earlier...on these 7 pages :wink:

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kvaca wrote: I think these 7 pages are here for people like you - just to avoid another useless post :shrug:

hint - all your comments were deeply discussed earlier...on these 7 pages :wink:
Yes, I know, but it seems that it was forgotten. The same arguments looping. ;)

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lfm wrote:
kvaca wrote: I think these 7 pages are here for people like you - just to avoid another useless post :shrug:

hint - all your comments were deeply discussed earlier...on these 7 pages :wink:
Yes, I know, but it seems that it was forgotten. The same arguments looping. ;)
I think its not a problem of topic itself but of some people not willing to read what was written earlier and still trying to help somehow and the inevitable result is arguments looping...but I still do care about any idea or comment concerning this topic - except your comment that this is non-topic :wink:

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No. I think it's you who won't accept what an analogue limiter actually is. But here we go around again.

lfm quoted:
But isn't the brickwall thingy as far as you can come from analog style?

I see analog style limiter = compressor with high ratio.
Exactly. It seems that's not good enough. Not only is there widespread demand for digital to emulate analogue (not unreasonable IMO), now digital has to emulate analogue that is emualting digital. THat's all a limiter is in the analogue world - a compressor. He won't listen though.
Last edited by kritikon on Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kvaca wrote:
I think its not a problem of topic itself but of some people not willing to read what was written earlier and still trying to help somehow and the inevitable result is arguments looping...but I still do care about any idea or comment concerning this topic - except your comment that this is non-topic :wink:
Don't get wound up - I'm just kidding, bored to death, kind of.
:)

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Just a word about "no demo's", if a dev doesn't do demo's his plugins are likely to be cracked less quick. Some of you have a harsh stand against "no demo's", and while i understand and respect your opinions, you should also think about the dev who's trying to protect his productions. Namely the low prices plugins.

/OT

I am also very interested in a nice analog-style limiter, preferably cross platform.

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kritikon wrote:... now digital has to emulate analogue that is emualting digital.
could you name at least one hw analogue limiter which is directly emulating digital lookahead limiter? :o

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kvaca did you try that clipper i posted?

i think a shaped, oversampled clipper is going to be the closest thing to an "an analog peak limiter" which limits things through saturation and analog style clipping, versus compression and attack/release stage.

it allows you to shape the curve of the clip (which is where a lot of the "analog" tone comes from, ie. the shape that different transistors/transformers/tubes/tapes clip the signal often has to do with the resulting sound that we like so much)

if you can then take that shaped clipping and oversample it so nyquist is well out of frequency range, then you should have something that sounds like what you would get from an analog clipped/saturated signal. theoretically.
Has anybody ever really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

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@midnight wrote:kvaca did you try that clipper i posted?
yes...but I dont want to comment it here becouse...I like that idea /a clipper with 2 thresholds/, but...to cut long short - I dont want to do another harm to this dev...

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kvaca wrote:
TheoM wrote:Did you try the idea of zero latency compressor with limiter on output?
Theo,
Im not searching for any hearable compression this time - only want to control peaks in analog style /=without harsh digital distortion and without lookahed/

AFAIK there are 3 way to achieve this goal /control peaks/:
-soft or hard clipping
-tape or tube compression and saturation
-analog style limiting

Im searching the last one...becouse we have enough of clippers,saturators and tape machine simulators...but not any single one good analog style limiter
you don't need to use the compressor mate.. just have 0 threshold and ratio :shrug:

Oh did you try mix control.. inexpensive, and 0 latency, ZERO.

the limiter is quite soft.

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TheoM wrote: Oh did you try mix control.. inexpensive, and 0 latency, ZERO.
the limiter is quite soft.
I thought MixControl was discontinued /becouse this is still written on their site/
so I have overlooked that demo...tried...and - you are right - its smooth, works as expected,no harsh distortion even in fastest release :shock:

its a good and almost clean limiter, hard to belive it doesnt use lookahead...the only complain I have is that actually its a channel strip with added limiter and I would still prefer dedicated limiter plugin with some more features, different styles etc...

so now - thanks to all people contributing to this topic - I have at least 2 viable options for analog style limiting: punchy saturating limiter inside C165 compressor plugin and smooth final limiter in Mixcontrol channel plugin...not too bad, but also not too good when compared with dozens of available digital-style limiters... :shrug:

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