Why are there no close to hardware native vst effects?

[Meffy]

[snip of yeesh-worthy concert experiences] So yeah, nothing like the recording really.

:)

Coo. >_<

I can think of some musical acts I'd rather see in concert (but can't because tickets cost more than a month's food budget for me) than hear a recording, some the other way 'round, and some where it's a toss-up.

[MFXxx]

Why are there no close to native vst effects hardware ?

flip it

[kritikon]

Another flame question if you ask me. Is the OP not aware that a substantial number of classic quality h/w FX are digital? It is definitely not an exclusively analogue arena. In fact some of the real classics are absolutely digital and are absolutely native as well. Lexicon? And that there are plenty of digital medium-level h/w FX that have been surpassed by native FX several years ago? Personally it's one of the distinct areas that DAWs have an advantage over h/w - the FX field. I have several h/w FX boxes that are now completely redundant. Some of them cost me an arm and a leg years ago, yet the basic freebies VSTFX can outperform most of them.

One of my old top of the range Digitech jobbies was 700 quid or something daft when I bought it - modular FX and all kinds of bells and whistles - multiple in/outs that are all configurable. And when I bought QuantumFX a few years ago, it was embarrassing to find how much easier, better, more powerful and better value the s/w was and is.

I'm a die hard analogue enjoyer - still got loads of synths etc but I rarely bother with any OTB FX any more except my Lexicon. And if I could rationalise to the missus buying the native Lexicon verbs, I would seriously no longer use any h/w FX except VCA compressors and overdrive. Use what's best of both worlds, and I find it hard to see how h/w FX can compete with s/w FX except the real character exceptions. Anyone who doesn't benefit from using s/w FX is quite frankly an idiot in this day and age.

In direct answer to the question "Why are there no close to hardware native vst effects?". There are. In fact there are hundreds of them. Boss, Zoom, Digitech, Behringer, Lexicon, TC and plenty of others all have equivalents or better in s/w.

If what you mean is analogue h/w then please specify that, because I get really irritated by this misconception on KvR that h/w is somehow a distinct entity, when swathes of h/w is digital. Which meana s/w sold in a box.

[kritikon]

SOrry, I forgot to add...


...

[trimph1]

I don't beeping care if they come out of a toothpaste tube....if'n the dang things work and they do my mixes well...who the beep cares...




















edit: mising letters!!!!

[whyterabbyt]

All my VST effects are close to my hardware effects. Mostly about two feet away.

[Mushy Mushy]

I heard a quote from Moby yesterday saying "all my drum machines have had beer spilled into them. Try doing that with a VST"

Not sure how it relates to this thread, other than I thought it rather amusing.

[whyterabbyt]

I heard a quote from Moby yesterday saying "all my drum machines have had beer spilled into them. Try doing that with a VST"

Not sure how it relates to this thread, other than I thought it rather amusing.

Hell, a 'Moby is a sloppy drunk' post relates to any thread.

[Mushy Mushy]

I heard a quote from Moby yesterday saying "all my drum machines have had beer spilled into them. Try doing that with a VST"

Not sure how it relates to this thread, other than I thought it rather amusing.

Hell, a 'Moby is a sloppy drunk' post relates to any thread.

To be fair though, it's probably more suited to the equally ridiculous "Diva & TAL examination" thread.

[Ch00rD]

[...] I should note that one of the current UA algorithm developers, Tim Stilson, published a paper on digital emulations of the Moog filter back in 1996. I started working with Tim in 1999, and his code at that point had built-in soft saturation. It wasn't zero delay feedback, though.

I thought that Tim's work was incorporated into the UA Moog plugin when he was hired by them in 2007, but apparently the plugin had been developed before Tim came on board. David Berners worked on the UA Moog plugin, and had been at CCRMA with Tim back in the 1990s.

There was another CCRMA PhD, Harvey Thornburg, that had a presentation in 1998 about different nonlinearities within the Moog filter structure, but this presentation was never published. I know that a few papers came out around 2004 that claimed to "invent" nonlinearities in the digital realization of the Moog filter, but this was part and parcel of the original CCRMA realizations. Reaktor had a similar structure around 1999 or so IIRC, back when it was called "Generator."

Sean Costello

Interesting, thanks very much for elaborating, Sean! It's one of my favorite plug-ins, and such details are hard to come by.

Perhaps you also know something of the relation between the overdrive and the filter on that plug-in design? Iirc (from some discussion on the UAD Lexicon 224 plug-in elsewhere, in comparison to Vee3), you don't have an UAD system yourself, so if you have no idea what I'm talking about here, never mind.

The thing is, imho the overdrive on the UAD Moog Multimode Filter sounds absolutely amazing, even with the filter switched off. Also, there is a 'lighter' (in terms of DSP load) version (by a factor of about 3) that does not feature the overdrive section, only the filter. So, the overdrive seems to require (much) more processing than the filter itself. This makes me wonder whether the light version - of which the filter sounds just about as good - also uses the 0dff approach, and/or whether that is perhaps part of the interaction between the filter and overdrive. To me it seems to be the case that the filter section does *not* feed back into the overdrive, but is somehow separate from it, as there is also a wet/dry mix for the filtered signal, whereas the unfiltered signal is definitely affected by the overdrive (and then some more saturation / clipping on the output, when pushed hard).

(PS: if this is going too much off-topic, I'll be glad to create a separate thread.)

[noiseresearch]

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[vata44]

I think digital effects are much better... but YMMV

[ZenPunkHippy]

All my reverb and delay effects are recorded in sacred caves. Beat that you analogue mavins

Peace out,
Andy..

[75ips]

Why do you think is there a lack of good emulators

I don't think there's a lack, I think it's more a matter of combining the right stuff. And by the looks of it, you just haven't found your secret combo yet.

[noiseresearch]

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