Best reverb, for all jobs? (ongoing process)
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- KVRer
- 26 posts since 9 Nov, 2012
Acon reverb and valhalla, I stay out of convolution, maybe altiverb for convolution, also oxford reverb is nice sometimes it has strong early reflections, grat for rooms.
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- KVRist
- 262 posts since 26 Jan, 2013 from TX
Thanks for your reply ... sounds like it will be fun to play with. If it's possible to get the new VVV to sound like that Nonlin2, it'll certainly get a lot of use here!valhallasound wrote: Similar idea, but different execution. The Nonlin2 mode seems to be a LOT simpler than what I am doing with the VintageVerb Nonlin algorithm. RMX16 Nonlin2 is also mono-in, stereo-out, while the VintageVerb version maintains a true stereo path. The VintageVerb Nonlin can get gated sounds like Nonlin2, as well as reverse and truncated reverbs. I really like the truncated reverbs with a short Size setting for adding "air" to a sound.
This isn't to say that the VintageVerb version is better than the RMX16 Nonlin2. Just different. The Nonlin2 algorithm can get pretty grainy, but this can also add a lot of excitement to a snare drum or an overhead mike.
Sean Costello
Cheers,
Eddie
The future exists in all directions.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
Curious, because I've heard people say this, why "stay away" from convo verbs?DamienStaab wrote:Acon reverb and valhalla, I stay out of convolution, maybe altiverb for convolution, also oxford reverb is nice sometimes it has strong early reflections, grat for rooms.
- KVRAF
- 25052 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
Of everything mentioned here, I would go with the Hofa. I'm interested in realism. I think the list price isn't high. I use VSL Hybrid Reverb, which is convolution with algo tails. But it's one of 11 plugins in Vienna Suite. Albeit one of those is VSL Convolution Reverb.hibidy wrote:I think "realistic" is probably as good a description as any.Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote:What are you looking for in verbs?
But I think I've found what I'm looking for. Hofa IQ verb. It's just a matter of some more testing, getting into contact with them over a couple of niggles, and getting the best price.
- KVRAF
- 25052 posts since 20 Oct, 2007 from gonesville
Deliriously so. I have anything from realistic to some really trippy things. So in terms of 'for all jobs', this kind of thing. I don't have any real use for 'vintage' Lexicon emus type.
The slapbacks there can be moved around by automation. I like these kinds of instances sent from the 'hall' which most things go to, and a bus with a plate. Since they came out with this I've gone wetter and wetter because the sound is so fantastic. I used to be real shy of reverb.
One of the really great things is this setting for the late reflections 'X-Fade': at 100% it's complely diffuse, at 0% the effect is that the reflections are completely localized to where I have focused the origin (through power-panning).
The slapbacks there can be moved around by automation. I like these kinds of instances sent from the 'hall' which most things go to, and a bus with a plate. Since they came out with this I've gone wetter and wetter because the sound is so fantastic. I used to be real shy of reverb.
One of the really great things is this setting for the late reflections 'X-Fade': at 100% it's complely diffuse, at 0% the effect is that the reflections are completely localized to where I have focused the origin (through power-panning).
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
The Hofa is good so far. I keep thinking it's gonna rear it's ugly head though.jancivil wrote:But, this can't be 0 latency, that effect is going to be wambly in Ableton.
- KVRAF
- 3426 posts since 15 Nov, 2006 from Pacific NW
There are several reasons that have been put forward, some of which I am probably guilty of putting forward:hibidy wrote:Curious, because I've heard people say this, why "stay away" from convo verbs?DamienStaab wrote:Acon reverb and valhalla, I stay out of convolution, maybe altiverb for convolution, also oxford reverb is nice sometimes it has strong early reflections, grat for rooms.
- Static sound. For big, long ambient decays, a convolution impulse can sound static and cold. Meanwhile, a modulated reverb will add a lot of complexity to a simple synth sound.
- CPU usage. In the past, the CPU cost of convolution reverbs was considerably higher than the algorithmic reverbs of the time. However, algorithmic reverbs have gotten better and more complicated over time, so the CPU of these has gone up. Modern Intel processors have SIMD that makes FFTs really cheap, so convolution can be fairly efficient on modern computers. The cost of a convolution reverb goes up with the impulse length, so algorithms still have the advantage for huge reverbs.
- Lack of real-time adjustment. An impulse is fixed. If you want to adjust the decay length or damping, you either need to choose a new impulse, or the plugin needs to recompute the impulse with the new parameters.
- Barry Blesser has written about how large acoustic spaces are essentially time variant, due to variations in air temperature causing speed of sound changes. The upshot is that a reverb impulse will not be a realistic "snapshot" of the room, as the high frequencies will be "averaged" which causes a loss of treble. Of course, an algorithmic reverb starts out as 100% fake, so the realism argument doesn't really support algorithmic reverbs.
Personally, I feel that convolution does a great job with short rooms, and can capture time-invariant artificial reverbs (i.e. plates and springs) fairly well. I also think that convolution is an amazing tool for creative sound design, as any sample can be used as the convolution impulse. In my opinion, algorithmic reverbs have the lead in big, lush reverbs, as used for ambient and electronic music. Convolution is more "realistic," but algorithmic reverbs can be more flattering to an input signal.
Sean Costello
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- KVRian
- 1400 posts since 9 Feb, 2012
You know reverberation is a winter sport, right?
I'm still diggin' SSL Duende X-Verb the most, but I love our Valhalla, Exponential, Relab and Lexicon, too.
EW Spaces for convolution, maybe? (though I guess that's a fixed library of IRs)
HOFA looks interesting... I have some of their DDP tools, though I'm not in that line of work much anymore (they just added ISRC for WAV, which is cool).
Good luck!
Oh, thanks for mentioning Open Air... hadn't checked that out yet, even though I have it.
I'm still diggin' SSL Duende X-Verb the most, but I love our Valhalla, Exponential, Relab and Lexicon, too.
EW Spaces for convolution, maybe? (though I guess that's a fixed library of IRs)
HOFA looks interesting... I have some of their DDP tools, though I'm not in that line of work much anymore (they just added ISRC for WAV, which is cool).
Good luck!
Oh, thanks for mentioning Open Air... hadn't checked that out yet, even though I have it.
WEASEL: World Electro-Acoustic Sound Excitation Laboratories
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
@Sean:
Interesting.
For me I'm simple. It either sounds good or it doesn't. I don't know that I'm experienced enough to pick out some of the finer details. I guess that would be translated as "then live with what you have" but a led to b and a small can of worms was opened.
Interesting.
For me I'm simple. It either sounds good or it doesn't. I don't know that I'm experienced enough to pick out some of the finer details. I guess that would be translated as "then live with what you have" but a led to b and a small can of worms was opened.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
That would be summer sport here I'll be curious to know if you have any thoughts on open air. I may just have lost the plot completelyantithesist wrote:You know reverberation is a winter sport, right?
I'm still diggin' SSL Duende X-Verb the most, but I love our Valhalla, Exponential, Relab and Lexicon, too.
EW Spaces for convolution, maybe? (though I guess that's a fixed library of IRs)
HOFA looks interesting... I have some of their DDP tools, though I'm not in that line of work much anymore (they just added ISRC for WAV, which is cool).
Good luck!
Oh, thanks for mentioning Open Air... hadn't checked that out yet, even though I have it.
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robertszalapski robertszalapski https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=232813
- KVRist
- 173 posts since 29 May, 2010 from Austin
I stay away from convolution because I had trouble mixing with it, then bought ValhallaRoom and found it much easier to work with.