Mix Challenge - Gossip and Discussion

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?
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Intensity intensifies...
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Uncle E wrote: However, if you don't want to learn proper metering, just be sane with your compression settings (especially on the main buss) and lower your master fader -3 at the time of exporting, you should be able to stay roughly within the guidelines of the competition that way.

The nice thing about this first mix challenge is that the song's arrangement is just about impossible to get over -18dB RMS average.
I didn't want to say anything about it at first, but I know what Compyfox is getting at with the -18dBFS reference. Basically, if there is a program signal, with a -18 rms level, then there is very little chance of anything going over 0dBFS peak. Even the most asymmetric program signals will find it difficult to get a crest factor of 18dB. There are absolutely exceptions to this, but he is right to say that -18dBFS RMS is an appropriate reference volume per channel. It's my opinion that VU meters aren't the best tool to determine when the signal reaches this reference, but if he wants to tout them I am okay with that. Combine a master bus gain reduction of 3-6dB and the track is gonna be in the correct gain range really fast. But this whole paradigm is really just a best guess at what could be running through the mixer at any time. Using a digital (floating point) mixer, you can set gains almost anywhere and be confident that the master fader will eventually set the correct level for the mix. Some people's gain staging is all over the place, and there is a lot of reasons for that, so they will have their own method of setting up a mix. The important point is that the mix ends by being at the right gain. It's just preference, and I haven't heard any truly unruly mixes yet.

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Uncle E wrote:The nice thing about this first mix challenge is that the song's arrangement is just about impossible to get over -18dB RMS average. My channel compressors are all SMASHED and I probably would have gotten into trouble if the arrangement were fuller. If someone gives us a clubfloor banger loaded with pre-compressed Vengeance and NI drum samples, we'll need to be more careful.
You probably didn't "level in" each channel.
Most of the time, i had to raise the input gain by 2-8dB, though I did have to lower the vocals by a couple of dB to have 0VU on my VU.

The rest is up to how well you mix.



Oh and hibidy:
I don't have rig issues, my webpage was hacked.




If I take off the Sunday for music stuff as well (which I don't intend to do), I might make it, post my own entry. If not, then funk it.

Still working on concepting a probably 5-10min long video to show how "I" do my project setup with leveling in signals and stuff, which requires that you have at least a basic knowledge of a digital mixer and an analog type VU. If Nine of Kings is cool with that, I'd like to use his song for this particular purpose. Won't upload it to YT however - I don't have a Google account. But it'd create an excellent bandwidth test for my server.
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Do you want it on YT? I or somebody else could upload it on your behalf (with links to your stuff etc.), unless you don't want it there at all...
You need to limit that rez, bro.

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See the link in my sig with the discussion about a video tutorial series?
It is planned to have a YT channel at some point. But I think I'll first go the round that Eric Beam (Rhythm in Mind) did in his early days: videos on his own web space. This should work for the time being. Haven't even worked on anything on that behalf yet. Just no time.


But since this topic is coming up over and over, I think it's time I address this in short video form.
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wish I had known about this earlier. Not sure I can do a mix in a day or two.

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Arglebargle wrote:wish I had known about this earlier. Not sure I can do a mix in a day or two.
The design of the KVR Mix Challenge is to replicate a real world mix assignment. A day or two is really all the time we want you spending on the mix because that's about how much time you spend on on a professional mix. If you can free yourself up to do it today and/or tomorrow, please join in! Many of us spent less than 6 hours on our mixes.

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you're right, it only took me a couple hours. I'll upload it tomorrow.

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It really depends on how much work you put into it. If you don't "strip-silence" or analyze every track (like I did), you can pull that off within 4-5 hours absolute max.

Stripping each track of silence, finding out the correct BPM, finding out if the tracks can be used in "Mono" or are "stereo" to begin with (some guitar tracks are both!), cutting the track into better manageable takes, properly leveling in each track, etc does use up a lot more time. I currently invested about 4 hours for this.

Now it's short past 12pm (noon) over here, and maybe I can pull off a suitable mix by 8pm to 10pm latest. Which is still a realistic time frame for such a mix (8-10 hours, if you really go wild with it).



Anyway... less than 12hours left - good luck to all participants.



EDIT:
I also got permission by Nine of Kings to use his track for video tutorials, which can be used as great "built up" for future MC's as well. If the time allows it, I'll create a short video on "leveling in" and "using a reference level for mixing ITB" by next week, or within the first week of the next challenge latest.

Speaking of which... we should start finding more content. I think "mix challenges" for the time being are better and more interesting than "Mastering Challenges" IMO - there is more to learn from it. And we can still start a "second challenge" that runs in parallel.

Could those people that offered tracks please get in touch with both Eric and me? Thanks.
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The first KVR Mix Challenge has ended.
Thanks for your participation. I hope you had fun while mixing and you could learn a thing or two in the process.


Eric just informed me, that there are two participants where there are issues in terms of playback/download. Those entrants that have the issues were already contacted. Once that is sorted, I'll create the thread. Though not before tomorrow evening, after I finished my live mixing job. Thuesday latest.

In the meantime, those that didn't post their documentation (and may it only be a couple of sentences), please do so. No points will be cut. But it will be a disqualification for MC02 and onwards. Nobody can learn from you if you do not even hint at what you did. See it as some sort of general chat with your "virtual client". Tell him (us) what you did, why you did it. Don't be like Ugh with a huge club and react like "here, your track, enjoy or STFU!".

You can only post a screenshot, just 2-3 sentences like "I used host internal plugins only, my focus was no focus at all - I just mixed how I felt like it". That'd suffice!



I also managed to post a mix, though I'm not 100% happy with the vocals and one or another guitar track. But... well... Time limits, couldn't work sooner on it. 11:30hours of work put into it. Hopefully it's still enjoyable.

And as bonus, you get to see my mixing console setup! But no further detail in terms of settings. ;)



Anyway... if everything works fine, the next MC should start at the beginning of July - and I think the focus will be on "multi-track mixing" again. It just makes more fun and is better for learning purposes (IMO!)

I raise my voice again to those people offered tracks so far - please get in touch with both Eric and I. Are you new to the game and want to offer a track, since you're stuck on your own? Please do so! The more, the merrier. Though please take note of the rules regarding GEMA/RIAA members and their content.



Anyway... have fun while listening. Voting startes within the next days. So please stay tuned.
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And the voting thread is live!

Once more a thank you to all participants - I hope you had fun.

A big shout out to our song provider: Nine of Kings

On that behalf - WE NEED A NEW SONG FOR MC02!
Please get in touch with us, so that we can start on 1st July 2014!
(preferred is a multi track mix - more fun, more to learn)

Another thank you goes to satYatunes for getting in touch with the sponsors. He will take care of the winner licenses.
Of course, thank you to all sponsors as well!

Also thank you to Uncle E, for restarting this challenge and playing the good cop.



Now please listen to all entries and cast your three votes.
If you want to comment on the mixes, please do so in here. I am really, really curious who will be on the winners' podium.
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Compyfox wrote:And the voting thread is live!
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 2&t=414453

Remember, you must vote to qualify for prizes!

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Currently we have 7 votes, so somebody didn't use his 3 available votes.
And the voting is ending on the night from 30th June to 01st July!


So get on with it, people!




IMPORTANT EDIT (25-06-2014 / 2:50am):

I hereby state an official public apology towards user "do_androids_dream", also known as "Loz Grover".

We (or rather I) decided to disqualify his entry, since he sent in a revision of his production, which in turn was a violation of the rules. After throwing around a lot of PM's with Uncle E, we agreed on putting him back into the pool.


The Issue:
After listening to all tracks, I found a couple of discrepancies and rule violations from several entrants. This will span new rules for MC02, where "sound replacement" (like Drum Replacement, etc) will be out-ruled, and "sound design" will be asked to be reduced to an absolute minimum (like: "do not add that many filters, so that the original synth track sounds like a new synth").

The entrants in questions were actually user Halma (who changed the synths so far, that they were almost something different - this would count as "sound design" rather than mixing)l. Then user kbaccki (he initially submitted a mix with an altered arrangement), who took our good will and also submitted a revision of his track (his original release has a different mix!) - and we didn't realize it until after the release. Also, I am not too sure if user Wooden Cube used a drum replacement tool - I know how to shape a sound with EQ and compression, but this snare sound throws me off (maybe it's the used reverb). Chances are that some users even re-uploaded their stuff due to "server hick-ups", so we don't know if the tracks are any different.

Eric and I are still working on certain details for MC02. But I will create a dedicated rules thread this time around and will link to it from the submission and votes thread. It's just a warning beforehand.


The Solution:
Since the rules were not ironed out with MC01, both Eric and I agreed on cutting EVERYONE some slack. Furthermore will I take the full blame for this hick-up. That means, even if a particular entrant violated the rules, we close our eyes this time around. So everyone has a chance to win.


What is happening now?!:
I just updated the votes thread with the missing track. I made it possible to change the votes within the next 24hours, after that, I turn off the system again. This way, cast votes can be changed. Also the one person that only cast one vote, can add more votes.

This is to ensure that the re-added track by Android/Loz get's the same chance as everyone else. So please accept the funk up from my side and give Loz's track a listen, and maybe even a vote.



Though one final warning:
Next time, if there is just one slight violation of the rules, it's GAME-OVER.
So before you participate, please read and agree to the rules.



Sorry for the inconvenience.



EDIT:
Due to the circumstance of editing the vote, all votes got unfortunately reset.
Please re-cast your vote.
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Mine is non streamable...that sucks. Any chance to change it? Anotrher upload location maybe? My dropbox link does not work for some apparently...

Regards
Sebastian
Underground Music Production: Sound Design, Machine Funk, High Tech Soul

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