Psytrance basslines

[ParadoxMachine]

If the rubbery-type bass is the aim, I didn't get there with a phaser and without the osc phase retriggering. The resulting sound was a bit more solid, a bit meaner, with a bit more bite and a little rattling spike that sounds like it's in the mids, but isn't. See the bass-range sound becomes sharpened, so what comes out is a bit more percussive, and rock solid.

Addendum: An .flp shared on Image-line forums unveiled a very nice sound, but here's how he did it:

3xOsc, 1 saw. Very little Hold, a little more decay, all else zeroed. Note: F1, notes shrunk just a bit (don't know the exact measure.) That's all well and good, but for his effects rack, here's what he did: Parametric EQ1-Soundgoodizer-EQ1-Soundgoodizer-EQ1-Soundgoodizer-Fruity Filter. He basically soundgoodized various sections of the spectrum (different ones each time) after every EQ and capped it off with a LPfilter.

[Zexila]

Nice tip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ402ruluRo

You can get something like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4Hr2quSIdA

[Lejurai]

What do you use for your bass and how do you process it?

In software world Hive is nice for psybass. Snappy sound and has good built in fx for tweaking the sound (distortion, phaser and eq basically). One synth that is built for psy basslines is G-Sonique Alien303 that is also really nice. They released V2 some time ago.

In hardware then.... Virus is really a kickass for psy but you need to know what you do since you have to record everything Get couple of more hardware synths that you can built the song at once I can recommend waldorf synths. Cheap and awesome.

Processing then. Different types of distortion (sometimes directly, sometimes in parallel), depending on what I'm after. Little compression sometimes that things don't get out of hands. EQ is important of course, can't give any tips on that, just do something that sounds good.

Sometimes I do that basic kbbb and sometimes k/b bbb and have lfo tool for pumping the bass. Sometimes pumping for the whole freq range and sometimes only below 300-something that pumps the bass but keeps that juicy higher frequency dädädädä dädädädä dädädädä dädädädä untouched.

And if you're after some rubber sounds, THE MBest phaser I've found for it... Is... *drums raise the tension*.. MPhaser!! Works nicely on any track to give some movement.

[ParadoxMachine]

My first attempt at a psy bass in a full song wasn't KBBB but a K/B BBB, with the note velocity of that first B turned down significantly. The velocities of the other notes were also in ascending order, left to right, instead of a 50-80-70 (sort of) "peak." With full quarter notes, it was a nice groove, just not very bass-like in terms of sound (didn't help that the notes were smack on C5 as opposed to something lower.) I see others doing the K/B BBB bassline, but the jury's out on whether it works better than a KBBB. Thoughts?

[recursive one]

Playing with velocities helps getting it more groovy. The track I'm working on right now has it like that "k b(60)b(100)b(100)", velocity is linked to global volume and filter envelope. Things like that work best for slower progressive-type tracks, around 135-140 bpm, if you are at 145 bpm or higher you probably want steady "machine gun-like" pattern.

Adding a little bit of swing may also help (again, for proggy tracks).

Thanks to Terrafractyl, Purple Sunray and other people who replied here I finally figured out how to make a decent bassline - I use Sylenth, some equalization like in Daniel Lesden tutorial I've posted above, transient shaper and a multiband compressor (Tricomp in Studio One is really great for this, but something like Xfer OTT or Sausage Fattener also may work), sidechain from a ghost kick.

[ParadoxMachine]

I'm still struggling. XD

On that note - thoughts on compressing the bassline?

[recursive one]

I'm still struggling. XD

On that note - thoughts on compressing the bassline?

Sidechaining from the kick or a ghost kick helps getting the right groove - you don't do noticeable ducking like in EDM/pop trance, rather smth subtle to get kick/bass working as one instrument.

Multiband compression can make the bassline more fat

[Lejurai]

I'm still struggling. XD

On that note - thoughts on compressing the bassline?

If it has too big start transient, I squash it to taste to get some bass to the bass so I can bass while I bass.

[PieBerger]

I'm surprised no-one has mention note length! This has a big impact on the sound and feel of of a psy bassline. Full-on and progressive basslines are usually tighter and can benefit from a shorter MIDI note, whereas darker styles tend to have a more drawn out, almost drone-like, feel to them and you can usually get away with a longer ntoe, imho!

I personally like my bass as 1/16th, less 1/64th (so 3/64th long) with a little bit of release to make it sound more natural/rolling. I mostly use my ears to feel it out and then I use Vengeance CM scope to check that the tail of the preceding note doesn't clash with the next transient (and adjust accordingly). I really recommend getting this plugin, you can sync the scope to host tempo, which makes it really easy to check the phase and or overlap of your kick and bass notes, among other things.

[Lejurai]

I use envelopes for that and play with note lenghts in sequences

[andymcbain]

What do you use for your bass and how do you process it?

Sorry to dig up old threads, but I'm a huge psytrance bass nerd and I felt compelled to chime in.

I'm currently getting the best psy basslines I've ever got from Avenger by Vengeance Sound. Reasons being -

• - Great sounding saw wave - and control over the individual harmonics - which negates the need for any "surgical" EQ.
  
  - The choice of an 18dB Low Pass filter - I personally prefer the sound of 18dB rather than 12 or 24. The analogue modelled filters sound very good to my ears.
  
  - Tight envelopes and the choice of more flexible envelopes if you want to deviate from the usual ADSR.
  
  - Variable oscillator phase start. I love tweaking this to shape the attack of the note.

Processing wise - Fabfilter Saturn, with cutoff points around the 2nd and 4th harmonic (off the top of my head) smears the phase of the sawtooth in a nice way and seems to "stabilise" the sound - something particularly noticeable in headphones. This is the same principle of using the old Quadrafuzz in Cubase on it's default settings. You then have the option to add a bit of distortion or saturation if you want.

Compression isn't totally necessary - but I've found Slate Digital's "Monster" with attack at full and release on lowest setting - "Punch" control enabled - and the wet / dry mix at 10-20% helps to bring out the attack a little more - in a nice way.

After that, gentle EQ slopes with any old EQ to remove a bit of midrange to smooth things out.

I'll also re-sample individual notes after this processing is done. Once again, not 100% necessary but I just prefer to work with audio

If you try any of this yourself please let me know your thoughts!

Andy

[Lejurai]

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=475377&p=6672115#p6672115

[recursive one]

What do you use for your bass and how do you process it?

Sorry to dig up old threads, but I'm a huge psytrance bass nerd and I felt compelled to chime in.

I'm currently getting the best psy basslines I've ever got from Avenger by Vengeance Sound. Reasons being -

• - Great sounding saw wave - and control over the individual harmonics - which negates the need for any "surgical" EQ.
  
  - The choice of an 18dB Low Pass filter - I personally prefer the sound of 18dB rather than 12 or 24. The analogue modelled filters sound very good to my ears.
  
  - Tight envelopes and the choice of more flexible envelopes if you want to deviate from the usual ADSR.
  
  - Variable oscillator phase start. I love tweaking this to shape the attack of the note.

Processing wise - Fabfilter Saturn, with cutoff points around the 2nd and 4th harmonic (off the top of my head) smears the phase of the sawtooth in a nice way and seems to "stabilise" the sound - something particularly noticeable in headphones. This is the same principle of using the old Quadrafuzz in Cubase on it's default settings. You then have the option to add a bit of distortion or saturation if you want.

Compression isn't totally necessary - but I've found Slate Digital's "Monster" with attack at full and release on lowest setting - "Punch" control enabled - and the wet / dry mix at 10-20% helps to bring out the attack a little more - in a nice way.

After that, gentle EQ slopes with any old EQ to remove a bit of midrange to smooth things out.

I'll also re-sample individual notes after this processing is done. Once again, not 100% necessary but I just prefer to work with audio

If you try any of this yourself please let me know your thoughts!

Andy

Huge thanks for your input!

I don't have any of the plugins you use except for Saturn, but I think I've now found my way to make basslines with Sylenth, Studio One Ampire (it is a guitar processing plugin, but I disable all the cabinets and stuff and use the tube saturator module and the parametric equalizer), Stduio One Tricomp for brutal multiband compression (it doesn't affects the envelopes but gives some nice thickness to the sound ), a bit of transient shaper and an equalizer which does cuts and boosts corresponding to the note harmonics. Sometimes Saturn too for adding a bit of upper midrange distortion but it isn't always needed and doesn't fit every track.

Here are the results

https://soundcloud.com/recursion-loop/andromeda-nebula

https://soundcloud.com/recursion-loop/r ... ing-wakeup

Basically my process is based on a modification of this technique

http://daniellesden.com/blog/all/psytra ... synthesis/

[andymcbain]

Huge thanks for your input!

I don't have any of the plugins you use except for Saturn, but I think I've now found my way to make basslines with Sylenth, Studio One Ampire (it is a guitar processing plugin, but I disable all the cabinets and stuff and use the tube saturator module and the parametric equalizer), Stduio One Tricomp for brutal multiband compression (it doesn't affects the envelopes but gives some nice thickness to the sound ), a bit of transient shaper and an equalizer which does cuts and boosts corresponding to the note harmonics. Sometimes Saturn too for adding a bit of upper midrange distortion but it isn't always needed and doesn't fit every track.

Here are the results

https://soundcloud.com/recursion-loop/andromeda-nebula

https://soundcloud.com/recursion-loop/r ... ing-wakeup

Basically my process is based on a modification of this technique

http://daniellesden.com/blog/all/psytra ... synthesis/

Nice results mate - solid and fat sounding

Sylenth seems to be a really popular choice for psy bass - though it's a popular choice for lots of things! I just never got round to buying it as I wanted to explore the capabilities of some of the "Underdogs"... I've also had great results (with minimal effort) from U-He Bazille (and Beatzille - the free version) and Melda's MPowersynth.

Personally I don't like too much processing - but there's no rules as we all know. I resisted the multiband compression/distortion thing for ages but now I see why it's such a popular trick - as you can alter the phase of the sound in a really nice way just by putting the bands in certain places - without any distortion or compression happening at all.

I'm working on a new track with a friend this weekend so I'll post some results... on the other thread that was pointed in my direction

[recursive one]

Thanks for listening

Yes, multiband processing seems to be commonly used for psybass. There is a kind of "urban legend" that the old Quadrafuzz in Cubase has some very special crossovers messing up the phase in some magic way.

Also it seems that everybody but me resamples the basslines