Are Rules REALLY Meant To Be Broken?

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thecontrolcentre wrote:Of course "the rules" should be broken. There would be no progress otherwise.
The question is, which rules. And why they gotta be broken, when you just can improve on them. This "breaking rules because they're meant to be broken" stuff rather resembles the need to pull yourself clear, or the need to be unique, or individual. Handcraft like mixing and mastering surely isn't possible without applying certain rules, otherwise it will simply sound like crap. I don't know if you really can and want to call experimenting breaking the rules.

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chk071 wrote:
thecontrolcentre wrote:Of course "the rules" should be broken. There would be no progress otherwise.
The question is, which rules. And why they gotta be broken, when you just can improve on them.
No, you've got to break them. AC/DC insist upon it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDQA0wJC2G0

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:D

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this is an interesting thread people

I'm reminded of what we were taught in college - you have to learn all the rules inside and out before you break them
Picasso & Dali painted exquisitely detailed classical pieces before they went totally abstract (for example)
Dali from 1921 : https://www.facebook.com/SalvadorDaliPa ... =1&theater
Picasso 1895 : https://www.pinterest.com/pin/318840848600477919/

no - I don't think you need years of theory and composition study to make modern music. However, a solid understanding of theory and harmony will certainly help you make better music !

peace
expert only on what it feels like to be me
https://soundcloud.com/mrnatural-1/tracks

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wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
This entire forum is wading through predictions, opinions, barely formed thoughts, drama, and whining. If you don't enjoy that, why are you here? :D ShawnG

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Zexila wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
Hey look at that. Somebody with some originality.

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wagtunes wrote:
Zexila wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
Hey look at that. Somebody with some originality.
Not really, whole sub genre is alike, like every EDM sub genre, it's not crazy someone throws some unexpected element, but that's hardly breaking the rules, when 90% of the track is following the norm.

So yeah, agree with you on this one, adding 10% out of the norm is hardly breaking the rules.
This entire forum is wading through predictions, opinions, barely formed thoughts, drama, and whining. If you don't enjoy that, why are you here? :D ShawnG

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Zexila wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
Full disclosure: I dig the track that was linked to.

That said:

- That's clearly a synth playing the line, rather than an electric guitar. The articulation and pitch bending are very indicative of a synth, rather than a guitar. (Yes, there's a video clip of a dude with a guitar, but he's clearly not playing the part that's on the recording.)

- The guitar-esque synth part is cool, but it's also a repeating 8-bar figure. Which is a very different kind of musical effect than a solo (whether on guitar or synth or anything else) jamming throughout the length of the track with different lines and licks.

Not trying to be a jerk - just tossing my two cents into the community piggy bank. :D

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andrelafosse wrote:
Zexila wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
Full disclosure: I dig the track that was linked to.

That said:

- That's clearly a synth playing the line, rather than an electric guitar. The articulation and pitch bending are very indicative of a synth, rather than a guitar. (Yes, there's a video clip of a dude with a guitar, but he's clearly not playing the part that's on the recording.)

- The guitar-esque synth part is cool, but it's also a repeating 8-bar figure. Which is a very different kind of musical effect than a solo (whether on guitar or synth or anything else) jamming throughout the length of the track with different lines and licks.

Not trying to be a jerk - just tossing my two cents into the community piggy bank. :D
You are absolutely right, it's probably the Nord Lead, guitars in psytrance aren't really best representation of what guitar can do, it's more like an cliche element (chugga&co), saying that as someone who dig Children of Bodom.
This entire forum is wading through predictions, opinions, barely formed thoughts, drama, and whining. If you don't enjoy that, why are you here? :D ShawnG

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A few random thoughts about "rule-breaking":

Being able to work in a particular style authentically is often about more than just being able to get the right purely technical bits correct. A lot of it has to do with being able to speak the language of a style, and recognize the subtleties therein.

This isn't just an EDM thing. A lot of classical or jazz musicians sound really awkward when they play rock, even though they might know their pentatonic scales and power chords, because they don't really speak the language authentically. Same goes for a formally-trained musician who wants to make future bass or dubstep: it'll help to have access to sidechained compressors and wobble bass, but that's not the whole picture.

Knowing how to correctly pronounce the words in a dialect is different than being able to use those words to speak within that dialect fluently and authentically. To do that, you have to really immerse yourself in that dialect - both as a listener, and as a creator. Taking lessons, watching tutorials, and the rest is a great way to develop some basic vocabulary; using that vocabulary authentically is a more long-term thing.

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Zexila wrote:You are absolutely right, it's probably the Nord Lead, guitars in psytrance aren't really best representation of what guitar can do, it's more like an cliche element (chugga&co), saying that as someone who dig Children of Bodom.
:tu:

I like the line, though! And it sounds like it could have been inspired by some '80s shred guitar playing, for sure.

I know nothing about psytrance, or guitars in EDM in general - are there other examples that come to mind? I'm intrigued.

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andrelafosse wrote:
Zexila wrote:You are absolutely right, it's probably the Nord Lead, guitars in psytrance aren't really best representation of what guitar can do, it's more like an cliche element (chugga&co), saying that as someone who dig Children of Bodom.
:tu:

I like the line, though! And it sounds like it could have been inspired by some '80s shred guitar playing, for sure.

I know nothing about psytrance, or guitars in EDM in general - are there other examples that come to mind? I'm intrigued.
https://www.discogs.com/artist/22666-SUN-Project
https://www.discogs.com/artist/14602-Infected-Mushroom (older stuff)

there's more probably, but nothing significant, these guys tried&failed too, it's too cliche sounding

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ctL47LuMeg

Yeah, we had thread like that before

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=441707
This entire forum is wading through predictions, opinions, barely formed thoughts, drama, and whining. If you don't enjoy that, why are you here? :D ShawnG

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andrelafosse wrote:
Zexila wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Actually, you're confirming what I'm saying. No, you wouldn't hear a screaming guitar solo on an EDM track
Oh really :hihi:

https://youtu.be/Tz3Sgk6M8SU?t=3m23s
Full disclosure: I dig the track that was linked to.

That said:

- That's clearly a synth playing the line, rather than an electric guitar. The articulation and pitch bending are very indicative of a synth, rather than a guitar. (Yes, there's a video clip of a dude with a guitar, but he's clearly not playing the part that's on the recording.)

- The guitar-esque synth part is cool, but it's also a repeating 8-bar figure. Which is a very different kind of musical effect than a solo (whether on guitar or synth or anything else) jamming throughout the length of the track with different lines and licks.

Not trying to be a jerk - just tossing my two cents into the community piggy bank. :D
Yup. I was a little excited to hear some EDM with an actual section of "screaming guitar"... and I was let down.
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud

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That Skazi video... The "chigachow!!!" vocal samples stopped me from listening to more than a few seconds. It's like shitting on a veggie-dog. The veggie-dog wasn't a gourmet meal, but it had some mustard on it and I was hungry, and then someone ruined it.

Also, I'm no guitar player, but even my self-recorded guitar loops sound less mechanical than the guitar in that song. It sounded like it was individual chugs being triggered on a keyboard.

The music could've been interesting but the rigid genre was still dominant. Maybe they should try with an actual guitar and a guitarist.
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud

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It could be interesting to hear some good collaboration of metal&psytrance, as I posted in that thread, this thing got that rush I dig, if these guys ever did psytrance thing, that would be great, but Skazi&co, just a bad attempt, distorted electric guitars just don't fit everywhere the same way they are used in their respective genres, as trance supersaw leads or whatever other way around, too cliche sounding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osSf6MjOVwQ

Some rules breaking can really render your stuff cheesy or weird, so yeah, it's mostly about ones taste in the end of the day.
This entire forum is wading through predictions, opinions, barely formed thoughts, drama, and whining. If you don't enjoy that, why are you here? :D ShawnG

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