I am very surprised.

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TheoM wrote:wow albert your second hand buying rules are unique to what i have ever seen before...

software doesn't degrade over time like a vehicle or home does.

a third OF what it is brand new?


so you'd only buy mulab for 33 euros second hand, not even half price?

wow.
That's harsh
Yes harsh maybe. Ok, I can think of situations I could be tempted to stretch upon 50%, so I should maybe change to that %. Also do not get me wrong, I'm talking about buying music software (and other, hobby related, things) that I do not need for a living. I do not expect anyone to sell me a 1-year old car or house for a third of its original value, I know it doesn't work that way.

But again, that's my point, keep it into perspective and don't make a lawsuit issue out of every $ 50 or so you may lose (or not be able to resell). And to repeat myself, I do realize for some it is a matter of principles no matter the (small) amount of $.

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hibidy wrote:
hibidy wrote:
I wonder, did mutools ever fix the valhalla/recabinet/whoever preset/gui issue or is still the "plug ins" fault.
Please kind sir(s) could someone please take the time out of the busy banter and answer this, or maybe it was answered somewhere in the midst of all the volleying and I just missed it?
Yes i replied on that, see http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 40#5246240

Lets please discuss this in the MuTools forum.

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hey i totally accept your viewpoint man, after all that's what makes us all unique :)

I will say though, that those $50 here and there add up quickly if you've got G.A.S (many here do, myself very included :lol:)

I am looking at my ilok and elicenser now in the respective license tools, and my list of plugs in logic, and there is easily 10 k of software there. Plus my 3 computers and hosts.. wow...

I would like to think i could get 5k back when the time comes (IF it does, i need to stop being negative about my health).

cheers:)

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mutools wrote:
hibidy wrote:
hibidy wrote:
I wonder, did mutools ever fix the valhalla/recabinet/whoever preset/gui issue or is still the "plug ins" fault.
Please kind sir(s) could someone please take the time out of the busy banter and answer this, or maybe it was answered somewhere in the midst of all the volleying and I just missed it?
Yes i replied on that, see http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 40#5246240

Lets please discuss this in the MuTools forum.

Ok i know this is REALLY off topic but i have been going nuts for YEARS trying to work out how to point to a specific POST like you just did.

PLEASE anyone reading this PM me if you have the time to tell me. Much appreciated.

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At the header of each post, at the left of where it says "Posted...", right-click that icon ;)

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TheoM wrote:except of course for collectors.
I sold some of my pristine intellivision games for bucketloads.
Yeah, some of the classics might be worth something some day, but not right now. I'm still angry that my mum chucked our CPC 464 for no apparent reason because it's a piece of computing history :(


But the point still stands that something like say Fruity Loops 3 or my ancient version of Magix Music Maker (from 1997?) is probably not going to sell for a million dollars any time soon, license transfer or no.

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Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?

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hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.

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Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.
And your point is? I expect people to eventually fix bugs, not point fingers at at least two other products and leave customers in the cold. But I guess it's ok for others to talk about "whatever" and not for some?

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hibidy wrote:
Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.
And your point is? I expect people to eventually fix bugs, not point fingers at at least two other products and leave customers in the cold. But I guess it's ok for others to talk about "whatever" and not for some?
My point is that if there is an outstanding bug from the get go, you can see it is there by using a demo. If three years go by and a bug hasn't been fixed for whatever reason, I don't think it is fair to be demanding fixes. Fixes are never promised at the outset, yet people just expect upgrades and updates for free.

This is actually a separate discussion to the one of license transfers if you ask me. You're trying to use existing bugs to validate your opinions on license transfers, which is what is known as a strawman.

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sjm wrote:
TheoM wrote:except of course for collectors.
I sold some of my pristine intellivision games for bucketloads.
Yeah, some of the classics might be worth something some day, but not right now. I'm still angry that my mum chucked our CPC 464 for no apparent reason because it's a piece of computing history :(


But the point still stands that something like say Fruity Loops 3 or my ancient version of Magix Music Maker (from 1997?) is probably not going to sell for a million dollars any time soon, license transfer or no.
of course you are right, re fruity, magix, music soft in general, etc, except where something is current and being updated, like if i buy twin 2, and it is updated forever as it HAS been so far with every compatibility update./64 bit it has ever needed, then i don't feel anything less than 50% is fair for S/H sales. Unless there has been some huge sale like a no brainer and everyone got it for $20, then it becomes very grey, cause you never know if the seller is trying to make a large profit or a fair price. No brainers destroy value of music software, above anything else, will always maintain that stance :)

PS.. wanna know a true backstab? regards to my intellivision stuff.. My father supported a divorced relative who would have been on the streets and gave here $150 a week out of his own wage. My grandfather gave her his spare house RENT FREE for her and her children. I used to babysit all the time, and i took the intelli over and some games, thankfully only maybe 10, and i hadn't been there for a while as she was reconciling with hubby. they got back together, moved, are *filthy* rich now, like dripping in it, and when i asked where my box was, she said she just threw it all out. There could have been a couple of k , or at least 1 k of sales.

We've never heard from them again except for funerals, and they are all driving $200,000 cars and live their snobbish life.

And i AM holding a grudge, i can't seem to let it go.

don't know why i told that, but just had it get it off my chest. :lol:

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Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:
Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.
And your point is? I expect people to eventually fix bugs, not point fingers at at least two other products and leave customers in the cold. But I guess it's ok for others to talk about "whatever" and not for some?
My point is that if there is an outstanding bug from the get go, you can see it is there by using a demo. If three years go by and a bug hasn't been fixed for whatever reason, I don't think it is fair to be demanding fixes. Fixes are never promised at the outset, yet people just expect upgrades and updates for free.

This is actually a separate discussion to the one of license transfers if you ask me. You're trying to use existing bugs to validate your opinions on license transfers, which is what is known as a strawman.
in the case of IL i bought their windows stuff and automatically got the mac versions when i moved 100% to mac for the last almost 5 years.. never have worked since day one.. should i not expect them to, just because the windows one did and tHAT'S the one i demoed?

:?

i LOVE toxic biohazard and Poizone and would be happy to keep my account as for the price i am asking those two alone are worth it.. but they simply are BROKEN.. isn't it reasonable after a 3 year topic in their forum (or 2?) and ultra patience, to be able to offload this?

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Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:
Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.
And your point is? I expect people to eventually fix bugs, not point fingers at at least two other products and leave customers in the cold. But I guess it's ok for others to talk about "whatever" and not for some?
My point is that if there is an outstanding bug from the get go, you can see it is there by using a demo. If three years go by and a bug hasn't been fixed for whatever reason, I don't think it is fair to be demanding fixes. Fixes are never promised at the outset, yet people just expect upgrades and updates for free.

This is actually a separate discussion to the one of license transfers if you ask me. You're trying to use existing bugs to validate your opinions on license transfers, which is what is known as a strawman.
Oh brother. This thread is even more ridiculous than the norm.

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TheoM wrote:PS.. wanna know a true backstab? regards to my intellivision stuff.. My father supported a divorced relative who would have been on the streets and gave here $150 a week out of his own wage. My grandfather gave her his spare house RENT FREE for her and her children. I used to babysit all the time, and i took the intelli over and some games, thankfully only maybe 10, and i hadn't been there for a while as she was reconciling with hubby. they got back together, moved, are *filthy* rich now, like dripping in it, and when i asked where my box was, she said she just threw it all out. There could have been a couple of k , or at least 1 k of sales.

We've never heard from them again except for funerals, and they are all driving $200,000 cars and live their snobbish life.

And i AM holding a grudge, i can't seem to let it go.

don't know why i told that, but just had it get it off my chest. :lol:
I can totally sympathise. I guess they never appreciated them the way you did.

There were obviously a lot more of the 8 bit home computers manufactured, but I'm assuming that at some point in the next 50 years or so, they'll become quite the collector's item - they were after all the first popular home computers ever. I don't think my mum saw it that way - to her it was just a piece of outdated junk and went to the tip. Maybe I need to scour ebay...

I'm off to band practice in a second, and the guy whose house we play in has a ZX81 in the practice room. I hadn't seen one of those for about 30 years :)

Anyway, enough OT from me...

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hibidy wrote:
Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:
Amberience wrote:
hibidy wrote:Then I'll bring it on topic ;)

I don't care for the idea that a product that I bought into on the premise of "small/local" developer that didn't deliver on fixing a basic problem (where the problem became he said/she said) doesn't have a resale policy because of the reasons outlined which seem to be "pirates are bad so all suffer". Now I have a product that doesn't work properly on my system for my needs and I'm out the cash.

Is that on topic enough?
This is why demos and trials and freebies exist.
And your point is? I expect people to eventually fix bugs, not point fingers at at least two other products and leave customers in the cold. But I guess it's ok for others to talk about "whatever" and not for some?
My point is that if there is an outstanding bug from the get go, you can see it is there by using a demo. If three years go by and a bug hasn't been fixed for whatever reason, I don't think it is fair to be demanding fixes. Fixes are never promised at the outset, yet people just expect upgrades and updates for free.

This is actually a separate discussion to the one of license transfers if you ask me. You're trying to use existing bugs to validate your opinions on license transfers, which is what is known as a strawman.
Oh brother. This thread is even more ridiculous than the norm.
Indeed! I too am massively incredulous that people don't agree with me! :hihi:

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