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db3
KVRAF
 
1822 posts since 22 Aug, 2012

Postby db3; Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:52 pm Re: Reason?

RE capability is actually due a significant update with the Reason 7.1 release. Expectation is that devs will finally be able to implement more advanced interactive GUIs.
-dthree-
stroker_ace
KVRist
 
313 posts since 13 Feb, 2010

Postby stroker_ace; Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:54 am Re: Reason?

db3 wrote:RE capability is actually due a significant update with the Reason 7.1 release. Expectation is that devs will finally be able to implement more advanced interactive GUIs.


I don't see that making much of a difference, do you? They'll look cooler and will be easier to use, but as long as most devs keep away from the format, and as long as you can't transfer rack extension licenses, it's literally just window dressing.

And with this update, I'm sure they'll be adding more GUI hoops devs will have to jump through; ask Urs from u-he about those hoops. He banged his head against their GUI guidelines for months, if I remember correctly.
"The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." - Carl Jung
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V0RT3X
KVRAF
 
6928 posts since 3 Jul, 2012, from Canada

Postby V0RT3X; Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:56 am Re: Reason?

heres a ambient track i made in reason just using subtractor, maelstrom, thor and effects. https://soundcloud.com/v0rt3x8/slowly-dying
Developers please focus only on 64bit development. Let 32-bit finally die and become a thing of the past.
db3
KVRAF
 
1822 posts since 22 Aug, 2012

Postby db3; Wed Apr 02, 2014 2:09 am Re: Reason?

stroker_ace wrote:I don't see that making much of a difference, do you? They'll look cooler and will be easier to use, but as long as most devs keep away from the format, and as long as you can't transfer rack extension licenses, it's literally just window dressing.

I think the changes will probably allow for easier porting of VST to RE as there will be less restrictions. Also I'd be surprised if they don't introduce cpu optimisation for REs as Urs has previously mentioned.

Totally agree on the transfer policy. I'm not willing to invest further until they open up that market.
-dthree-
stroker_ace
KVRist
 
313 posts since 13 Feb, 2010

Postby stroker_ace; Wed Apr 02, 2014 5:48 am Re: Reason?

db3 wrote:
stroker_ace wrote:I don't see that making much of a difference, do you? They'll look cooler and will be easier to use, but as long as most devs keep away from the format, and as long as you can't transfer rack extension licenses, it's literally just window dressing.

I think the changes will probably allow for easier porting of VST to RE as there will be less restrictions. Also I'd be surprised if they don't introduce cpu optimisation for REs as Urs has previously mentioned.

I don't think there will be all of that in a .1 update. In spite of the fact that they're woefully behind everybody else, they still take their sweet time in implementing essential features/updates.

db3 wrote:Totally agree on the transfer policy. I'm not willing to invest further until they open up that market.

Word.

I can buy Syntorus and ÜberMod here in the Market Place for less than the price of that new chorus effect rack extension. And I can re-sell them and basically get 100% of my money back, should I tire of them.

Brilliant!

It's just a bit of work going through all these fantastic plug-ins. :D

At this point, why the hell would anybody jump on the Reason train?!? :? Yeah, I know the "cool routing capabilities" argument, but that's not nearly enough, imo........not when you compare all the other features of all the other DAWs, not to mention all the plug-ins Reason can't run.
"The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." - Carl Jung
kmonkey
KVRAF
 
3864 posts since 17 Aug, 2004

Postby kmonkey; Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:13 am Re: Reason?

V0RT3X wrote:heres a ambient track i made in reason just using subtractor, maelstrom, thor and effects. https://soundcloud.com/v0rt3x8/slowly-dying


Very nice..
tonkatodd
KVRist
 
305 posts since 25 Jun, 2010

Postby tonkatodd; Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:02 am Re: Reason?

stroker_ace wrote:
db3 wrote:
stroker_ace wrote:
I can buy Syntorus and ÜberMod here in the Market Place for less than the price of that new chorus effect rack extension. And I can re-sell them and basically get 100% of my money back, should I tire of them.

Brilliant!

It's just a bit of work going through all these fantastic plug-ins. :D

At this point, why the hell would anybody jump on the Reason train?!? :? Yeah, I know the "cool routing capabilities" argument, but that's not nearly enough, imo........not when you compare all the other features of all the other DAWs, not to mention all the plug-ins Reason can't run.


Picking one Chorus effect in the shop as an example doesn't really prove any point as the same can be said pointing out a $500 reverb vst as an example not to use vst, Doesn't make any sense. I use Reason almost everyday and have done for years and more so lately as some of the rack extensions are incredible. I can understand the work flow not being to everyone's taste but even with that in consideration I can't really believe any one musically creative not being able to create with it. If someone cant then maybe they should try something else like drawing or painting maybe. Though if plug ins and instruments are only being used for trading on a second hand market then Reason definitely isn't the way to go.
stroker_ace
KVRist
 
313 posts since 13 Feb, 2010

Postby stroker_ace; Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:16 am Re: Reason?

tonkatodd wrote:Picking one Chorus effect in the shop as an example doesn't really prove any point


Sure it does; it was a timely, real-world example. I was in the market for a chorus/mod plug-in, and I compared my options.

It was an incredibly easy decision to make.

tonkatodd wrote:as the same can be said pointing out a $500 reverb vst as an example not to use vst, Doesn't make any sense.


I agree that your point doesn't make any sense, as $500 reverb VSTs aren't the only option, and that's what this is about; options, both before and after you've made your purchases.

With VSTs, you can go freeware, donationware, you can spend $20 on a plug-in, or you can spend $200 on a plug-in. No matter what you're looking for, there will be tons of options.

And with some (most?) of the ones you pay for, you can sell their licenses should you outgrow or tire of them, and recoup some, if not all, of your money.

With rack extensions, you have a very tiny, tiny pool to pick from, they will more than likely be weaker than their VST counterparts, and once you buy one, you're stuck with it.

It's completely obvious which is the better system.

If it wasn't, Propellerheads would be a much bigger player in the DAW market, and devs would be lining up to produce rack extensions rather than heading for the hills.

They can exaggerate their sales numbers, but they can't hide the lack of rack extension developers, and that speaks volumes.

tonkatodd wrote:I use Reason almost everyday and have done for years and more so lately as some of the rack extensions are incredible. I can understand the work flow not being to everyone's taste but even with that in consideration I can't really believe any one musically creative not being able to create with it.


Who said that?

tonkatodd wrote:If someone cant then maybe they should try something else like drawing or painting maybe. Though if plug ins and instruments are only being used for trading on a second hand market then Reason definitely isn't the way to go.


No, it isn't, considering there is no second-hand market for rack extensions. :roll:

But what about people who don't like being stuck with one set of tools?

If you want to stay on a non-transferable tricycle all your life, knock yourself out, tonka toy, but don't pretend it's in any way superior, or even close to being equal, to the situation with VSTs.

If you make music like you argue a point, you should give away earplugs with every listen.
"The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong." - Carl Jung
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Tronam
KVRAF
 
1592 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA

Postby Tronam; Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:49 am Re: Reason?

I love it when people relentlessly belittle the tools I enjoy using.
highkoo
KVRAF
 
3742 posts since 25 Jun, 2004

Postby highkoo; Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:04 am Re: Reason?

I love cognitive dissonance. :)
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3rdFloorSound
KVRer
 
17 posts since 20 Jul, 2012, from Upstate NY

Postby 3rdFloorSound; Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:15 am Re: Reason?

Tronam wrote:I love it when people relentlessly belittle the tools I enjoy using.

Yeah, at first it's aggravating, then you wonder why you're aggravated because it shouldn't make a difference as long as you're getting the results you're striving for, then you wonder why the other person gives a crap at all.
Personally I think if there must be an argument it should be about something substantial, like a fart under a thick blanket.
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Tronam
KVRAF
 
1592 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA

Postby Tronam; Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:58 am Re: Reason?

On a more positive note that doesn't involve cyclical ranting about rack extension politics by forum lurkers who don't even use the program, Propellerhead threw up a fun video challenge last month to see what Reason users could do in 5 minutes. I only managed to watch a small percentage of the numerous entries, but the winner was just announced today. A few were pretty impressive actually. Many of them were mostly just building up a groove of some kind, but this fellow Speo manages to narrate his way through making patches and even some basic arranging. It's always cool to see users in action who understand their tools this fluidly, no matter what their environment of choice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TcdxszIf34c
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Tronam
KVRAF
 
1592 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA

Postby Tronam; Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:10 pm Re: Reason?

highkoo wrote:I love cognitive dissonance. :)

In what way? A love/hate relationship with Reason? Wouldn't you prefer to just switch to a program that promotes a state of cognitive consonance instead or is it one of those scenarios where you know it's not good for you, but you just can't stay away?
highkoo
KVRAF
 
3742 posts since 25 Jun, 2004

Postby highkoo; Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:25 pm Re: Reason?

Tronam wrote:
highkoo wrote:I love cognitive dissonance. :)

In what way?

Its an interesting phenomenon.
And most post-RE Reason threads are full of it.

i.e. Logic dictates certain likely scenarios, but feelings make those things uncomfortable for some people to even discuss.

This thread seemed to be looking at it logically for a minute.
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V0RT3X
KVRAF
 
6928 posts since 3 Jul, 2012, from Canada

Postby V0RT3X; Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:55 pm Re: Reason?

kmonkey wrote:
V0RT3X wrote:heres a ambient track i made in reason just using subtractor, maelstrom, thor and effects. https://soundcloud.com/v0rt3x8/slowly-dying


Very nice..


thx

Reason is pretty fun stuff :)
Developers please focus only on 64bit development. Let 32-bit finally die and become a thing of the past.
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