KVR Audio

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Tue May 27, 2014 5:19 pm

One thing I've noticed that I've never been able to get my head around is that when I play external hardware live (AN1x into Motu Midi Xpress into PC) then I get next to zero latency.

When I sequence from Cubase, the latency appears.

I'm going back to Atari ST!!!!

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Tue May 27, 2014 5:21 pm

tehlord wrote:One thing I've noticed that I've never been able to get my head around is that when I play external hardware live (AN1x into Motu Midi Xpress into PC) then I get next to zero latency.

When I sequence from Cubase, the latency appears.

I'm going back to Atari ST!!!!

Well exactly. How can it be fine on an Atari and then screwed on PC's 20 years later?
This is what I don't get, and fail to believe. It must, just must, be possible.

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Tue May 27, 2014 5:25 pm

Mushy Mushy wrote:
tehlord wrote:One thing I've noticed that I've never been able to get my head around is that when I play external hardware live (AN1x into Motu Midi Xpress into PC) then I get next to zero latency.

When I sequence from Cubase, the latency appears.

I'm going back to Atari ST!!!!
Well exactly. How can it be fine on an Atari and then screwed on PC's 20 years later?
This is what I don't get, and fail to believe. It must, just must, be possible.

Well the ST was designed to handle MIDI all along, wheras a PC puts a low priority on it.

I've heard many times that some motherboards are considerably better than others too.

I think there's a reason why there are SO many more people doing hardware jams on Youtube with Elektrons and MPC's than with their computers

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Tue May 27, 2014 5:30 pm

The Atari ST has a dedicated chip for MIDI. Being completely separate from the main CPU, the MIDI clock was not affected when the hardware interrupts the OS to notify about disk access (for example) - so it just ran in the background all the time, in perfect sync.

Modern PCs/Macs do away with this additional chip because they're designed for general purpose stuff - from games to spreadsheets - and it saves on costs.

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Tue May 27, 2014 5:32 pm

I've always wondered why a manufacturer hasn't created a 'media' only motherboard, stripped of all the overclocking crap and other such nonsense. Something with built in MIDI.

Even at a premium, I would have thought the market was large enough these days to make it financially viable.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Wed May 28, 2014 8:59 am

The timestamp setting made sod all difference so Sync Gen it is.

I've already heard back from David @ InnerClock. He emailed at 6am his time (Go back to sleep man, I can wait).

Hardware!!!! It's a PITA. Nothing ever works properly. And when it does I'm only ever 5mins away from requiring another cable.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 10:13 pm

Fixed it. Temporarily at least.

I've been using Cubase since SX and have only just discovered the Track Delay in the Inspector

This has now been adjusted to -552ms on the audio input monitoring channel. It's not perfectly in sync but more than enough to work with.

Aceeeed time

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:39 am

I'm still trying to find a solution to this annoyingly.

I will be buying a Sync-Gen but I don't really have the £500 at the moment.
However, I do think I've had an epiphany.

Can I buy an el cheapo sequencer and set the PC (Cubase) as a slave, and also sequence bits of hardware?
The timing should be pretty spot on I would hope...

The question then becomes which sequencer? Under £100 would be wonderful. That said, I'm already looking at MPC500's for £150ish...

Thoughts?

Acid Mitch · Post by **Acid Mitch** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:06 am

Mushy Mushy wrote: Well exactly. How can it be fine on an Atari and then screwed on PC's 20 years later?
This is what I don't get, and fail to believe. It must, just must, be possible.

It's because with the Atari you weren't sequencing and recording from the same computer.
Sequence from one device and record into another and you get no such problems.

Acid Mitch · Post by **Acid Mitch** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:08 am

Mushy Mushy wrote: Can I buy an el cheapo sequencer and set the PC (Cubase) as a slave, and also sequence bits of hardware?

Depends on the sequencer. Cubase no longer syncs to incoming MIDI clock. I think it still slaves to MTC, but I could be wrong about that. So , you'd need a sequencer that puts out MTC. I don't know any sequencers in your price range that do that.

Acid Mitch · Post by **Acid Mitch** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:10 am

Mushy Mushy wrote: That said, I'm already looking at MPC500's for £150ish...

Thoughts?

Avoid the 500. Save a little more and get a 1000, 2000xl or ASQ10.
Those are the next cheapest MPC options.
You'll probably still want an inner clock though.

UltraJv · Post by **UltraJv** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:20 am

Id want to be sure that its not the TT before shelling out. Can you Sync Cubase to the TT? Which ever is master, make it slave. Have you got the latest TT firmware? It addresses sync problems :

"Resolves incompatibilities with some 3rd party devices via MIDI resulting in the Bass Bot being several milliseconds out of sync with the master clock when responding to a MIDI START command."

http://cyclone-analogic.com/instadj_v1-1/

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:28 am

Acid Mitch wrote:You'll probably still want an inner clock though.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:29 am

ZenPunkHippy wrote:
Acid Mitch wrote:You'll probably still want an inner clock though.

I know. He's even worse than you

Acid Mitch, reading through your comments now

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 10:30 am

Acid Mitch wrote:
Mushy Mushy wrote: Can I buy an el cheapo sequencer and set the PC (Cubase) as a slave, and also sequence bits of hardware?
Depends on the sequencer. Cubase no longer syncs to incoming MIDI clock. I think it still slaves to MTC, but I could be wrong about that. So , you'd need a sequencer that puts out MTC. I don't know any sequencers in your price range that do that.

Oh, well that quickly scuppered my plans.

Realigning MIDI Clock Delay on Cubase 4.5 (PC)