Humanizing module

[Reincke]

Let's say my instrument is a multisampla or a VSTi. Will the amp approach work and sound as expected? And do I have to "hide" the instrument inside the polysynth?

No you can't put a complete MultiSampla or Vst plugin inside the polysynth. Please study the polysynth docs a bit more and you'll understand why.

Thank Jo. I have to admit that at this time I haven't recognized every line in the docs. But I see and understand what you meant.

Sorry if my requests sometimes seemed to be a bit "special". But I think there are very different approaches of making music with MuLab. Mine is to make music that sounds like a real band with acoustic instruments, working completely with software and without live recoding or hardware controllers. Others creates completely "electronic" music or do hard disk recording. Every approach has it's challenges and special requirements to MuLab, and nevertheless MuLab does an amazingly good job.

BTW: Have you seen my "little update" above? I gladly use the "event delay". It's good. Is there any chance for something like a "velocity modifier" module (incl. randomizing) in the future?
JR

[mutools]

Sorry if my requests sometimes seemed to be a bit "special".

No prob! As you wrote: everyone has its own way of doing things, that's cool

BTW: Have you seen my "little update" above? I gladly use the "event delay". It's good. Is there any chance for something like a "velocity modifier" module (incl. randomizing) in the future?
JR

It's not yet planned on short term, sorry.
But i have taken note on the wishlist.
For now, maybe there exists a vst plugin that does the job?

[mutools]

Is there any way to drag the min/max delay of the "event delay" module as parameter knobs? Controlling them is (for me) more intuitive then the delay and random parameters.

No, the min/max are fixed properties. The actual delay parameter is there too, it's a knob. Why don't you use that parameter knob?

[Reincke]

For now, maybe there exists a vst plugin that does the job?

Yes, Tobybears "Humanisator". That's where I'm coming from. It does not allow to specify an randomized offset to the note's velocity but just an absolute range (min/max) in which the velocity will be randomized.

Is there any way to drag the min/max delay of the "event delay" module as parameter knobs? Controlling them is (for me) more intuitive then the delay and random parameters.

No, the min/max are fixed properties. The actual delay parameter is there too, it's a knob. Why don't you use that parameter knob?

Well, indeed I use that delay parameter knob (and it works). I merely think it's more simple and intuitive to specify the min/max millisecond range of the randomized deviations.

[mutools]

Well, indeed I use that delay parameter knob (and it works). I merely think it's more simple and intuitive to specify the min/max millisecond range of the randomized deviations.

I don't understand what's missing. Please elaborate.

[Reincke]

I don't understand what's missing. Please elaborate.

OK, that's what I want to do: A MuX with two knobs: 1) min delay, 2) max delay, each in milliseconds. The MuX with event input/output should add a random delay at each note event that went through. The delay should be in the given range (min/max). So that's for the delay humanization.
For velocity humanization the MuX should have two further knobs: 3) decrease velocity, 4) increase velocity, each in percent or absolute values. The MuX should increase or decrease the given velocity of each note event that went through by a randomized value in the range specified by the knobs. Values below 0 or above 127 should be clipped.
That's it. Any idea?
JR

[AndreasD]

For note timing i get the best random results with the following:
Setup a Event Delay module with Units=Beats, min=0.0.0, max=0.0.3000 (=1/16 note); Delay knob=0.0.1500; Random percentage to taste.
Then move your sequence 1/32 note too early (move left).

This gives a random pattern around (before/after) the exact note.

For pitch and velocity you can only do this with Mulab instruments inside the polysynth (which can include a multisampler), as Jo mentioned.
No way to do this with VSTs.

[mutools]

OK, that's what I want to do: A MuX with two knobs: 1) min delay, 2) max delay, each in milliseconds. The MuX with event input/output should add a random delay at each note event that went through. The delay should be in the given range (min/max). So that's for the delay humanization.

That's how it works. (except the min max are numeric editors, no parameter knobs)

And as events can't be moved back in time before an audio process cycle, Andreas' method is a good hint. I think everything is there to do what you want to do. Right?

[AndreasD]

To prove that it's all there as requested (for Mulab Instruments), here is a session where i randomize a drumset. And it's randomize for each note seperately!
The current setting is extreme! The more you bring the random knobs to 0 the lesser the effect.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/62409608/Rando ... .MuSession

[Reincke]

Thank you all, guys.

For note timing i get the best random results with the following:
Setup a Event Delay module with Units=Beats, min=0.0.0, max=0.0.3000 (=1/16 note); Delay knob=0.0.1500; Random percentage to taste.
Then move your sequence 1/32 note too early (move left).
This gives a random pattern around (before/after) the exact note.

Thank you Andreas for this hint. A fine solution for "past problem". I already thought about a slight delay of all other instruments. (Someone should write a software for that ... )
Instead of notes/ticks I prefer milli seconds, cause drummer's timing deviation usually does not depend on bpm but is fixed, e.g. between 0 an 30 ms. But that's a matter of taste.

For pitch and velocity you can only do this with Mulab instruments inside the polysynth (which can include a multisampler), as Jo mentioned.
No way to do this with VSTs.

For me VSTi is essential (as I pointed out before).

That's how it works. (except the min max are numeric editors, no parameter knobs)

You mean I had to open the deep editor and change numeric values?

And as events can't be moved back in time before an audio process cycle, Andreas' method is a good hint. I think everything is there to do what you want to do. Right?

Not quite:
- no VSTi support
- no change of velocity
- no knobs for min/max event delay in the play editor
The MuX should support all kind of instruments, no matter if it's VSTi or MuInstr. It simply should change the the note's velocity and timing. A note events does not know what target it will be assigned to. Right?

Maybe a case for the wish list?

To prove that it's all there as requested (for Mulab Instruments), here is a session where i randomize a drumset. And it's randomize for each note seperately!
The current setting is extreme! The more you bring the random knobs to 0 the lesser the effect.
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/62409608/Rando ... .MuSession

Thanks again. Will test it tonight.
JR

[mutools]

That's how it works. (except the min max are numeric editors, no parameter knobs)

You mean I had to open the deep editor and change numeric values?

Oh, were you talking about a certain preset all the time?
Yes i was talking about the Event Delay module itself.

[Reincke]

Yes i was talking about the Event Delay module itself.

Me too. It just would be more handy to have knobs instead of several clicks to change numeric values. Thanks anyway.
Jo, do you have any idea about the "Not quite" part of my previous post? At least randomized changes the note's velocity (not the audio's volume) would be a great step. Can we have e.g. a "face lift" of the note modifier module in the future?
Thanks in advance.

@AndreasD: Have tested your "Random%20Drumset.MuSession". A fine workaround for polysynth. Tricky! Must keep this in mind, uh - in user library. I think two challenges remain: changing the volume isn't the same as changing the note's velocity, especially for layered drum samples. And last not least the absence of VSTi support. Maybe someday dreams come true ...
JR

[mutools]

Yes i was talking about the Event Delay module itself.

Me too.

Well you can change from beats to milliseconds there.

Jo, do you have any idea about the "Not quite" part of my previous post? At least randomized changes the note's velocity (not the audio's volume) would be a great step. Can we have e.g. a "face lift" of the note modifier module in the future?

I think the randomize timing part is there, also for VSTis.
The only thing you are missing is that the min max are not knobs as you would want. Though the actual delay time parameter is a knob.

Previously i already added a note on the WL about randomizing velocities, didn't i mention that?

[Reincke]

Thanks Jo, I fully agree to your last post. (The fine millisecond feature was already known to me.)

Previously i already added a note on the WL about randomizing velocities, didn't i mention that?

Yes, you did. Sorry for going in circles. I misinterpreted one post. I'm curious about this feature.
JR