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MUX questions

SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Sat Nov 04, 2017 5:39 pm MUX questions

Hi,

I'm actually creating my very first MUX! Having watched the movies and played around with this for a few hours, I'm already doing very cool things.

The MUX I'm working on is a multi effect, loosely inspired by, and sort of a combination of, SoundSpot's Nebula and Audio Damage's Mangleverb, but it's more powerful actually. :tu: Only in MuLab!

This thread is for my questions re this project. First up:

I have attached an LFO to the Vintage Echo 1, and have then dragged them both into a new MUX effect. This way, I have an LFO-controlled echo effect (like Nebula). :) However, I would like to control the amount of LFO affecting the echo, so how can I do that? I tried using the amplitude of the LFO, but that only takes care of the volume, when what I want is a wet/dry mix. So: a knob where a setting of 0 means no LFO on the echo, whereas 100% means the echo is totally controlled by the LFO.

Boy, I'd never thought I'd pose a question like that on the KVR forum! :o
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mutools
KVRAF
 
9165 posts since 24 Jun, 2008, from Europe

Postby mutools; Sun Nov 05, 2017 3:50 am Re: MUX questions

What about simply using the LFO's Amplitude parameter?
SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Sun Nov 05, 2017 4:46 am Re: MUX questions

mutools wrote:What about simply using the LFO's Amplitude parameter?


Hi, thanks, no it's not what I'm after (at least by itself).

I _am_ using the Amplitude parameter right now, but what it does is to affect the volume of the entire signal going to the delay part of my combined effect. I want something like an audio balance unit, so that I can define how much of the signal is affected by the LFO (="wet"), and how much goes to the delay without going through the LFO (="dry").

Here's a screenshot of what it looks like at the moment.

LFO.PNG


Since the LFO has its own power button, I can switch it on or off completely (i.e., hear the delay with or without LFO, but not define how much LFO should be added.

The idea with this project is to add flanger, chorus, etc, and have each of them controlled by separate LFO's, to create a monstrous and great looking multi FX creative plugin. :tu:
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sbj
KVRian
 
1014 posts since 17 Aug, 2012, from Old Zealand

Postby sbj; Sun Nov 05, 2017 5:27 am Re: MUX questions

Hi SparkySpark

Here is a little example attached you can try.

Maybe it is what you are looking for?
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Sound C loud
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SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Sun Nov 05, 2017 5:37 am Re: MUX questions

Hi,

Thanks a lot for trying to help me out!

Well, not really what I'm trying to do. In your example, if you set the balance to 100 (max) you get an LFO on the sound. If you set it to zero, the sound is dry. What I'm after is that when set to zero, it should be just reverb (delay in my case). At 100, it should still be a reverb, but first going through an LFO.
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SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:32 am Re: MUX questions

Hi again,

I stopped worrying about that, and instead went ahead and created a movie of how it works at the moment. Note that this is just the delay part. I'm thinking of doing more or less the same thing with some other presets, to try to make an interesting plugin.

Here's a two-minute movie of how it looks for now! :)

https://youtu.be/imyZGiDiH3c
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Go MuLab!
SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Tue Nov 07, 2017 3:15 pm Re: MUX questions

Hi again,

Wow is this thing coming along nicely! It's now quite a beast and I can't wait to show it to y'all! :)

I understand that MuLab must be more important to look at than the workflow of MUX (and I support that wholeheartedly). That being said, since I'm a programmer myself, I'd like to share some thoughts on minor improvements that I think could be rather easily fixed. I number them here in case someone wants to comment on them.

1. At least in the beginning, I often made the mistake of dragging an item to my MUX while not in Edit mode. This causes the MUX in question to be substituted by the other one (I don't mind them being replaced per se). I also sometimes pressed Delete once too many when deleting something, causing my MUX to be deleted, even in Edit mode. What I would like is a dialog saying "To you want to save your changes before closing? Yes, No, Cancel" when in Edit mode and something has been changed but not saved. I think this would just need adding a boolean somewhere in the code.

2. If possible (not sure if it is - it depends on the data structures) I'd like to be able to change the names of the controls. For example, a Max knob might have the phrase "Frequency" on it. If I need to make it smaller, the words start becoming abbreviated in a clever way (vowels go missing). However, I'd rather - if possible, that is - do this myself, so that I can write "Freq" or why not "FREQ" instead of "Frqc" or so.

3. I've noticed that some controls have differing value ranges, like 1 - 30, -100 - 100, or 0.5 - 25. If possible (see above), I'd like to be able to set the ranges myself. For example, I feel it's a bit confusing having the LFO go below zero. (I assume it turns the LFO upside down.) So I'd rather like being able to set the range from 0 - 100 as usual on the front panel (I don't mind if more values are possible to set in the popup MUX).

4. I assume that the LFO types are set in an array. If so, would it be possible to cherry-pick which one to use? I've recently played around with the Nebula plugin from Soundspot, and they limited themselves to just four envelope types. In MUX, there are... 16 perhaps? For my specific purposes, these are just inconveniently many. An alternative would be a new "LFO Reduced envelope types" module, if that's easier to do.

5. In Modular view, it's possible to drag-select items. In Edit mode in the MUX, it's not. It would be nice if this could be done, if it's easy to code and perhaps just an omission.

6. If possible, I'd like the option of being able to add text boxes, both for one-liners and for entire text passages (like help files). Perhaps the graphics library already supports this? If so, then ideally, I'd like this with a few different fonts and font sizes (to write the name of the MUX etc).

7. I have LOTS of knobs and other controls in my MUX, and I move them around and change their sizes all the time, as space becomes more and more limited. A time-saver at the moment is the "Copy colors" and "Copy size" contextual menu options. Since the code logic is already there, I'd like an option saying "Copy colors and size" to get both at once. And while I'm on this subject, I've noticed that the X and Y positions are relative to the nearest container (frame). Thus, I think it'd be just as easy to add an option saying "Copy position" (or "Copy relative position"). And to top it off, "Copy colors, size, and position". :)

8. I know that the frames can share the parent color attributes. I think that this could optionally be set for the "mother MUX" background so that every frame, and every MUX/module that inherits from the mother MUX, inherits the same color scheme. That would be really helpful. For now, I have to go over every knob, frame, etc for the mother MUX, and every MUX it inherits from (= the popups) and the modules if I make a change in the color scheme. I guess that this could be, once again, be fixed with a boolean:
if !(inheritColors) myModule.bgColor = rgba(156, 72, 113, 0.7); else myModule.bgColor = parent.bgColor;

8b) Speaking of which, I sometimes think that MuLab would look even better if all instruments and effects had the same color scheme. In the Settings, there could be a similar option for MUX bg colors and control/knob colors, so that all synths and fx would look like ONE engine and not a multitude. However, this is a matter of taste, and as I said, it could be optional. (I know one user here who would be delighted to have very MUX set in pink. :) )

9. I understand that MUX works in a separate, VST version. Does that mean that it would be technically possible to export every MUX as VST instruments/effects? If so, then MuLab could become a successor to SoundEdit! That would bring hoards of new users to MuTools. :)

Actually I have no big concerns relating to MUX. It's a fantastic concept that works exceptionally well! And if could export to VST, it could boost MuLab sales A LOT, I think.

So, great job, Jo, and it's a delight playing around with MUX, just like with all other parts of MuLab. :clap: :clap: :clap:

Petter
Making music is a nine-to-five job:
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Go MuLab!
SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:58 am Re: MUX questions

Hi again,

Since I have so many effects in my MUX; it can easily distort. Therefore, I'm thinking of adding a brickwall limiter (or whatever works) between each filter. (I have separate gain controls between each effect, but want to tame the sound when it's louder than 0 db (or should it rather be minus 3?).)

I'm trying to add the Audio limiter module, but I don't know how to set it. I have been reading articles like http://www.practical-music-production.c ... miter.html but I don't know how to set it in MUX.

So: how would I set the limiter shown in the img to cut everything above, say, 0 dB, preferably without distorsion? Or if I should use a compressor instead, the question remains the same.

limiter.PNG


Thanks!
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SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:02 am Re: MUX questions

I also wonder my the Frequency level meter (the grid) only goes to minus 12 and not to zero (or minus 6, as the displayed number is an increment of 6). Now, I can't see if the sound distorts, which I find very puzzling.
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bibz1st
KVRian
 
1452 posts since 29 Mar, 2013

Postby bibz1st; Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:36 am Re: MUX questions

Quick answer to a 3 of your queries, have'nt got time to go into details though, Im at work.
2. yes you can easily rename them, double click or right click the name.
3. Assign the controls you want to Metaparameters (you can set any range you want within them) and then have those on your front panel instead.
6. You can, to a point, see one of Urviehs Muxs' in Mulib for a good idea on this, I forget which one it is.
Beauty is only skin deep,
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SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:08 am Re: MUX questions

bibz1st wrote:Quick answer to a 3 of your queries, have'nt got time to go into details though, Im at work.
2. yes you can easily rename them, double click or right click the name.
3. Assign the controls you want to Metaparameters (you can set any range you want within them) and then have those on your front panel instead.
6. You can, to a point, see one of Urviehs Muxs' in Mulib for a good idea on this, I forget which one it is.


Hi, thanks a lot! Yes, I recall there was a MUX a few months ago with a help file, but couldn't find it, and didn't know if it was the right way anyhow. :)

Great to hear about 2 and 3. Can't believe I missed 2! :dog: UPDATE: Are you sure?
I know I can update the name of a reverb or so, but when I doubleclick a Maxiknob, this is what I get:


renameAControl.PNG


Metaparams... well, need to look into that one... :)

(BTW, I've now sorted out my question on the LFO stuff. It was a bit tricky since my MUX is so deeply nested, but it worked eventually.)
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bibz1st
KVRian
 
1452 posts since 29 Mar, 2013

Postby bibz1st; Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:34 am Re: MUX questions

Lock the front panel and try it from there
Beauty is only skin deep,
Ugliness, however, goes right the way through
SparkySpark
KVRian
 
813 posts since 30 Aug, 2004, from Skövde, Sweden

Postby SparkySpark; Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:43 pm Re: MUX questions

bibz1st wrote:Lock the front panel and try it from there


Thanks! Worked like a charm. Now I was able to shave off 50 px from the plugin. :)
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Go MuLab!
mutools
KVRAF
 
9165 posts since 24 Jun, 2008, from Europe

Postby mutools; Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:37 pm Re: MUX questions

SparkySpark wrote:Thus, I think it'd be just as easy to add an option saying "Copy position" (or "Copy relative position").

That's added in M7.6.12, see viewtopic.php?p=6899825#p6899825

8. I know that the frames can share the parent color attributes. I think that this could optionally be set for the "mother MUX" background so that every frame, and every MUX/module that inherits from the mother MUX, inherits the same color scheme.

Thx for the suggestion, taken note on the long wishlist.

9. I understand that MUX works in a separate, VST version. Does that mean that it would be technically possible to export every MUX as VST instruments/effects?

Even no need to export it, MUX Plug-In is a VST plug-in.
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pljones
KVRAF
 
6003 posts since 8 Feb, 2003, from London, UK

Postby pljones; Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:33 am Re: MUX questions

mutools wrote:
9. I understand that MUX works in a separate, VST version. Does that mean that it would be technically possible to export every MUX as VST instruments/effects?

Even no need to export it, MUX Plug-In is a VST plug-in.

Just to expand...

If you use MuLab, it has MUX built in, not as a VST. You need to purchase the VST version separately to use MUX patches in other VST hosts.

Also, just by creating a MUX patch and saving your MuLab project does not save your MUX patch in a way the VST version can get at it -- you need to save the patch (i.e. to your user library with its own name).

But once you have MUX VST, it can load any MUX patch (factory, your own, from MuLib) - no need to export "new VSTs" for each patch.
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