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On why Z3ta+ will never sound like a Virus (applies to DUNE also), and my growing wishlist.

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

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Cyforce
KVRAF
 
2028 posts since 1 Feb, 2009, from Germany

Postby Cyforce; Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:30 pm

osiris wrote:I think Kontakt can sound like a Virus.
(I can think of Thrillogy.... :wink: )
*at the moment I can only think of it - I don't have 7 GB of hard drive to spare*


Well Thrillogy in Kontakt (http://www.cfa-sound.com/wp/reload-01-virusti/) can be smaller.
The 7 GB mass comes to the 2 included versions:
MULTI(3,6 GB)
- wav
- exs
- sfz
- nnxt
- halion

NKI(also 3,6 GB)
- just nki(monolith with script)

So you just can only use the nki version and save 3,6 GB diskspace.
:D
ImageImage
OUT NOW: TITAN-1 XFER SERUM PRESETS
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chk071
KVRAF
 
3272 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:43 pm

GeorgeZ wrote:
Cyforce wrote:Z3ta will never sound like Virus because Z3ta is Z3ta - and not a Virus. Just simple :hihi:


Quoted for truthiness!

Not only true but also the only appropiate answer on the millions of threads like this. :P
Crackbaby
KVRAF
 
2870 posts since 10 Sep, 2003, from Karlskoga, Stockholm, Sweden

Postby Crackbaby; Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:56 pm

Teksonik wrote:
osiris wrote: Z3ta 1.5 can sound creamy smooth to so rough it hurts.
Z3ta 2.1 has lost that.


How was it " lost " ? What was taken out of 2.1 that was in 1.5 ?


You know old guitars with old specs sound much better than the new ones. Same goes with software :hihi:
iPad Air - Gadget, Auria, Nave, BeatMaker2, Loopy HD, Impaktor, Sugarbytes Trio
Cymatic LR-16, Octatrack, Analog4, System-1, Bitwig, Too many unused plugins
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Teksonik
KVRAF
 
8801 posts since 15 Sep, 2001, from Las Vegas,USA

Postby Teksonik; Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:01 pm

Ohhh I see............ :lol:
None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
androidlove
KVRAF
 
6607 posts since 20 Jun, 2004, from Secret Underground Hideout

Postby androidlove; Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:30 pm

djanthonyw wrote:Honestly, they sound close enough. Who can even tell the difference unless they're the ones using them or they tell someone which is which?

http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... zetav1.mp3
http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... ss-iv4.mp3

The synth in the 2nd example sounds awesome. The Z3ta sounds like a toy compared to the Virus. I bought Z3ta for 20.00. It's fun to get ideas from, but I can't imagine it hitting the dance floor.
"Most people who experiment with drugs are not lying in the streets, suffocating on their own vomit. If you want to see some of that, go to the Pub on Saturday night at closing time." ozwest
BFunKu
KVRAF
 
2821 posts since 30 Oct, 2006, from The City that Started House Music

Postby BFunKu; Sat Feb 25, 2012 9:36 pm

When Sylenth1 first came out I sold my Access Virus Indigo because Sylenth1 sounded as good if not better than the Virus Indigo. I know at least 10 people who have sold their Access Virus synths because of Sylenth1. 8)
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Richard_Synapse
KVRian
 
550 posts since 19 Dec, 2010

Postby Richard_Synapse; Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:14 am

osiris wrote:I like Filter 1 choice and Filter 2 choice. And I like seperate Q and Res for each and Link.


A dual filter architecture is ihmo not that useful when cascaded serially, even less so when no dedicated envelope is available for the second filter. If the second filter is kept at a static cutoff is just serves an as EQ, which means lots of wasted CPU for a softsynth (as each voice has to be processed separately). The parallel case is more interesting, but here DUNE can do 8 things in parallel, and with different envelopes, which is a lot more.

Richard
Synapse Audio Software - www.synapse-audio.com
AKJ
KVRAF
 
1772 posts since 1 Mar, 2004

Postby AKJ; Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:35 am

osiris wrote:It's not strange if you've ever played with one. I also believe the Virus has 3 oscillators plus a sub.
More oscillators doesn't equal better sound.
Filters are a BIG part of this. That's why I said it would be nice to incorporate Rapture's filters into it. For whatever reason Z3ta 1.5 can sound creamy smooth to so rough it hurts.
Z3ta 2.1 has lost that.


True, the more is not equal to the better. But sound quality has 2 important factors:
1. the quality of the single components the sound is created from
2. the available "modules"/components and (routing) possibilities for creating the sound

regarding point 1: did did not do a direct comparison, but from what I hear in demos it does not appear to me that a virus has better quality. I really can't get why everybody is so absessed about the virus sound. just a soft-synth wrapped in hardware.

regarding point 2: here z3ta+ is a clear winner. It might like one or the other possibility of a Virus, but it offer 10 other things the virus does not offer.

And it's very true, a z3ta+ is not a virus clone. Imo it's one of the best soft synths and definitely very feature-rich. A much better candidate for a reference synth than a virus.

cheers, akj

ps: you did not have to delete your z3ta+ v1 when you got your V2. you can still use V1 if you prefer the sound. And just a tip: try disabling oversampling for some patches. sometimes a sound with aliasing is much better.
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tehlord
KVRAF
 
6796 posts since 22 Sep, 2008, from Windsor. UK

Postby tehlord; Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:43 am

BFunKu wrote:When Sylenth1 first came out I sold my Access Virus Indigo because Sylenth1 sounded as good if not better than the Virus Indigo. I know at least 10 people who have sold their Access Virus synths because of Sylenth1. 8)



I did the same.


Actually I had Sylenth before I bought my Virus Ti.


Sylenth can't do everything a Virus can, not by a long way. But if you're looking for that virus dirt for dance tracks then Sylenth pretty much nails it.

Plus you can have as many Sylenths open as you want :roll:
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osiris
KVRAF
 
7265 posts since 20 Nov, 2003, from Lost and Spaced

Postby osiris; Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:47 am

Well, don't forget split mode. It's just some of the more interesting sounds I've made are by running through a LP/BP or HP configuration and with HP/BP you have to be very careful with freq & Q.
It has to be open on the LP, while in the BP/HP it must be more closed, and the Q can't be too open on the BP/HP or you get feedback.
@Richard: Is this why you chose to go with the chorus/phaser combo, or was it a space issue?
What I see on Z3ta's Effects page is a lot of wasted space. I like the Routing tree, but I also like the drag & drop of DUNE(very innovative IMO).
But in Rapture you have 3 Fx Processors to run signal through and you can choose precisely what effect you want. I think Z3ta 2's effects page is not thought through. Keep the Distortion, keep the EQ, but make the Chorus/Phaser, the Delay, and the Reverb, FX 1/2 & 3 and have a dropdown box with a choice of ALL of these.
Thank you, that's my humble two cents.
Maybe I will try to do that preset in Rapture...
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djanthonyw
KVRAF
 
6710 posts since 20 Jul, 2004, from Boston

Postby djanthonyw; Sun Feb 26, 2012 8:17 am

androidlove wrote:
djanthonyw wrote:Honestly, they sound close enough. Who can even tell the difference unless they're the ones using them or they tell someone which is which?

http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... zetav1.mp3
http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... ss-iv4.mp3

The synth in the 2nd example sounds awesome. The Z3ta sounds like a toy compared to the Virus. I bought Z3ta for 20.00. It's fun to get ideas from, but I can't imagine it hitting the dance floor.


If they weren't labeled I highly doubt you or anyone else could tell the difference.
You are currently reading my signature.
AKJ
KVRAF
 
1772 posts since 1 Mar, 2004

Postby AKJ; Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:41 am

actually only blind tests will show valid results. but even then: it depends a lot on what kind of sounds you choose to compare and how talented the patch designers are...

actually I do not care too much how the z3ta+ comapres to a virus. I just wonder why people constantly make this comparison. And, as said, I any case z3ta+ should be the reference, since it has the more powerful engine...
androidlove
KVRAF
 
6607 posts since 20 Jun, 2004, from Secret Underground Hideout

Postby androidlove; Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:28 pm

djanthonyw wrote:
androidlove wrote:
djanthonyw wrote:Honestly, they sound close enough. Who can even tell the difference unless they're the ones using them or they tell someone which is which?

http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... zetav1.mp3
http://www.vengeance-storage.com/AudioD ... ss-iv4.mp3

The synth in the 2nd example sounds awesome. The Z3ta sounds like a toy compared to the Virus. I bought Z3ta for 20.00. It's fun to get ideas from, but I can't imagine it hitting the dance floor.


If they weren't labeled I highly doubt you or anyone else could tell the difference.

OK, try it.
"Most people who experiment with drugs are not lying in the streets, suffocating on their own vomit. If you want to see some of that, go to the Pub on Saturday night at closing time." ozwest
dsynth27
KVRist
 
112 posts since 15 Aug, 2011

Postby dsynth27; Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:09 pm

AKJ wrote:...but from what I hear in demos it does not appear to me that a virus has better quality. I really can't get why everybody is so absessed about the virus sound. just a soft-synth wrapped in hardware.

actually only blind tests will show valid results. but even then: it depends a lot on what kind of sounds you choose to compare and how talented the patch designers are...

actually I do not care too much how the z3ta+ comapres to a virus. I just wonder why people constantly make this comparison. And, as said, I any case z3ta+ should be the reference, since it has the more powerful engine...


I think the reference is basically what you prefer...most people if not all are not objective when making these types of comparisons. Just use what you prefer...

people argue about the Virus being software in a box but the software sounds da** great. I (and I am sure many others) would buy again if I had to.

Sylenth1, Dune, Diva, Z3ta+ all sound great as well (maybe not as great as a Virus TI....just joking :P )....you cannot go wrong either way. In my neck of the woods...the Virus is still better all around but I understand you do not feel that way! Enjoy Z3ta+ and keep making music... :D 8)
_leras
KVRist
 
304 posts since 20 Apr, 2005

Postby _leras; Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:31 pm

Zeta2 is a great little synth. Excellent value and a really rich solid sound. I also don't care how it compares to a Virus. Half the appeal of a Virus would be the well built hardware and nice keyboard etc.

I think the Dune demos sounds a little bit one dimensional in comparison to Zeta or Virus, don;t know if it's the filters or the fx... but thats how the examples come across (haven't tried the demo as I didn't think it offered anything I didn't already have.


.
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