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Tone2 Saurus Teaser - Competition - KVR Giveaway

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

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KVRAF
 
4082 posts since 16 Feb, 2005, from Kingston, Jamaica

Postby zvenx; Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:51 am

That plug in is so awesome......has everything you could ever need and want....

rsp
User avatar
KVRAF
 
7421 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:52 am

xamido wrote:
Urs wrote:
Thing is, I only know of 3 commercially available synthesizers that have zero-delay-feedback-filters, including Saurus and Diva.

;) Urs


What's the last one? Saurus and diva are only 2. Never knew there was another one... i'm intrigued .

I just searched on Google and found that Charalatan seems to use it, at least it's described in the official description:
http://www.blaukraut.info/

Xils Lab mentions it for the multimode filter in their "Le Masque" Delay FX:
http://www.xils-lab.com/pages/LeMasqueD ... tures.html
I don't know how far this is implemented in their synths.


Ingo
Last edited by Ingonator on Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live Suite 9.1.2 / Reaper 4.61 / softsynths by Waldorf, Tone2, Xils Lab, NI, others...
Motif ES 7 / Wavestation EX / Blofeld desktop / Pulse 2
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KVRian
 
948 posts since 15 Jan, 2005, from los angeles,ca

Postby cain; Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:37 am

wow this thread just went all over the place :-o :shock: :o :drunk: in the end just dont remember what was the original topic :hihi: :hihi: :hihi:


f**k netflix i got kvr :hihi: :hihi:
KVRian
 
648 posts since 27 Oct, 2009

Postby izonin; Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:46 am

Ingonator wrote:
xamido wrote:
Urs wrote:
Thing is, I only know of 3 commercially available synthesizers that have zero-delay-feedback-filters, including Saurus and Diva.

;) Urs


What's the last one? Saurus and diva are only 2. Never knew there was another one... i'm intrigued .

I just searched on Google and found that Charalatan seems to use it, at least it's described in the official description:
http://www.blaukraut.info/

Here is an article which is hosted an the NI website:
http://www.nativeinstruments.com/filead ... xNLZDF.pdf
Maybe they used it in either Massive or Reaktor?

Xils Lab mentions it for the multimode filter in their "Le Masque" Delay FX:
http://www.xils-lab.com/pages/LeMasqueD ... tures.html
I don't know how far this is implemented in their synths.


Ingo


Vadim's zero-delay feedback filter is available for download in the Reaktor user library. I don't think it uses the same algorithm as in Diva, though.
I could be completely wrong.
KVRAF
 
7994 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds
 

Postby pdxindy; Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:43 am

chacka wrote:
himalaya wrote:The Diva example should be taken in relation to pdxindy's Saurus feedback demo. That is the comparison, not my Saurus clip in your quote!

Please, do not be offended, and perhaps try to see everything in its right context.

I'm not offended and don't want to take anything on a personal level here. I respect you and your opinion. I understand what you're saying about pdxindie's demo. I must have missed those bits of the conversation.
You were presenting two audios in your post to show that Saurus sounds "full, musical, with a woody quality" while you post a sound of Diva which has no chance to sound "full, musical, with a woody quality" when it is played several octaves higher. I wonder how these two exact sounds would compare if you would exchange only the midi of both?
You say that this was done to give all the right context? Not everybody is following the whole conversation and still listens to your examples. You don't think that this could lead to a false conclusion?


Don't worry about it... Himalaya was responding to my post which had a sound clip from Saurus that sounded "God Awful". It would have been more clear if he had included my clip when he quoted me -

http://draigathar.org/sounds/Saurus1.mp3

Himalaya posted his "worst of" Diva preset in comparison and he demonstrated my point. (which he does not want to admit) The high CPU use gives you something and in Divine mode Diva will never sound like my Saurus clip.

But since people are getting heated over this stuff and start taking it personally, I will use Synth Squad as an example. Take Cypher and do some audio rate modulations, then render it at the lowest oversampling setting and the highest. There is a difference in sound quality. There is a reason the high quality setting is there! It is necessary to maintain fidelity once you start pushing into complex territory. This Cypher example takes out the synth A vs synth B defensiveness cause it is the same synth! And the point is obvious!

Same thing with Diva. I really push it with lots of feedback, high resonance, Filter FM, Cross Modulation. I could render some of my sounds in Divine mode and Draft mode and the difference would be huge. There is a reason for the different modes!

IMO Saurus needs a high quality mode. It is too easy for the sound to fall apart once you start pushing the complex parameters (Feedback, OscFM/AM, high Resonance etc). Yes you can find some sweet spots but they would be much bigger with a high quality setting.

It is Tone2's choice to focus on low cpu, but it is false to claim the same technical sound quality. You don't get something for nothing. Just listen to Cypher doing audio rate stuff with no oversampling and high oversampling and it is night and day. Nobody's got a magic pill.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
3548 posts since 26 Apr, 2007, from Noosphere

Postby Igro; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:06 am

What is more analog, DIVA or Saurus? I think a Decay envelope shows everything:
Image

Here is the audio file(DIVA first):
http://www.box.com/s/ba0d8fa058a2dabdf47c
User avatar
KVRAF
 
4762 posts since 25 Feb, 2008, from Babylon an ting
 

Postby hakey; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:17 am

Igro wrote:I think a Decay envelope shows everything

I'm as partisan as the next person, but that's just plain daft.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
4082 posts since 16 Feb, 2005, from Kingston, Jamaica

Postby zvenx; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:21 am

I thought he was being sarcastic
rsp
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KVRAF
 
4762 posts since 25 Feb, 2008, from Babylon an ting
 

Postby hakey; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:23 am

Yeah, that was my first thought. But I don't think he is. ;)
User avatar
KVRAF
 
3548 posts since 26 Apr, 2007, from Noosphere

Postby Igro; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:28 am

hakey wrote:Yeah, that was my first thought. But I don't think he is. ;)


No, I'm not. Audibly lopped decays in tone2 synths are common. While Diva's decay is gated at much lower and inaudible level.
KVRian
 
670 posts since 27 Sep, 2010

Postby JD Gaffe; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:30 am

Why for all things am I not able to simply init a patch in the demo :( I never try out a synth via its presets..
User avatar
KVRAF
 
7421 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:39 am

Igro wrote:What is more analog, DIVA or Saurus? I think a Decay envelope shows everything:
Image

Here is the audio file(DIVA first):
http://www.box.com/s/ba0d8fa058a2dabdf47c

I just made a sample of a basic Decay with Saurus myself using a single Sawtooth and the 24dB LPF. Here is the result (ZIP includes both picture and WAV file):
https://rapidshare.com/files/3392524445 ... Test_1.zip

First my example seems to look different (closer to Diva) and second how does it show which is more analog?
Also in real analog synth there are many different kinds of analog slopes.
What you talk about is maybe "snappy" envelopes and not "analog" envelopes.


Ingo
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live Suite 9.1.2 / Reaper 4.61 / softsynths by Waldorf, Tone2, Xils Lab, NI, others...
Motif ES 7 / Wavestation EX / Blofeld desktop / Pulse 2
User avatar
KVRAF
 
3548 posts since 26 Apr, 2007, from Noosphere

Postby Igro; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:48 am

Ingonator wrote:
Igro wrote:What is more analog, DIVA or Saurus? I think a Decay envelope shows everything:
Image

Here is the audio file(DIVA first):
http://www.box.com/s/ba0d8fa058a2dabdf47c

I just made a sample of a basic Decay with Saurus myself using a single Sawtooth and the 24dB LPF. Here is the result (ZIP includes both picture and WAV file):
https://rapidshare.com/files/3264865894 ... Test_1.zip

First my example seems to look different (closer to Diva) and second how does it show which is more analog?
Also in real analog synth there are many different kinds of analog slopes.
What you talk about is maybe "snappy" envelopes and not "analog" envelopes.


Ingo


"snappy" means attack. I referred to Decay tails. Use filtered saw and you will hear(I work with headphones) how abrupt it is. Just use Attack and Decay and keep note till the decay fade away.

BTW, YOUR own sample is clearly showing how abrupt is the decay. Others can download your file and i think they will confirm it.
Last edited by Igro on Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
KVRAF
 
7031 posts since 19 Feb, 2004, from Paris
 

Postby Lotuzia; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:51 am

Ingonator wrote:
xamido wrote:
Urs wrote:
Thing is, I only know of 3 commercially available synthesizers that have zero-delay-feedback-filters, including Saurus and Diva.

;) Urs


What's the last one? Saurus and diva are only 2. Never knew there was another one... i'm intrigued .

I just searched on Google and found that Charalatan seems to use it, at least it's described in the official description:
http://www.blaukraut.info/

Xils Lab mentions it for the multimode filter in their "Le Masque" Delay FX:
http://www.xils-lab.com/pages/LeMasqueD ... tures.html
I don't know how far this is implemented in their synths.


Ingo


All Xils-Lab synths have zero-delay-feedback-filters, for three years now. Le Masque has inherited some of them. DCam has it too, for quite a long time.

There is a very simple test you can run to know if a synth has this feature or not. I'll give it to you in private if you wish so, Ingo.

Sorry for OT to Tone2. I wont answer in this thread for any other questions regarding Xils-Lab synthesizers : This thread belongs to Tone 2 and Saurus.

Congrats to them for the release.
www.lelotusbleu.fr Soundbanks for Vsti

5000+ exclusive presets for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there [Xils-Lab Team]
User avatar
KVRAF
 
7421 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:57 am

Lotuzia wrote:
Ingonator wrote:Xils Lab mentions it for the multimode filter in their "Le Masque" Delay FX:
http://www.xils-lab.com/pages/LeMasqueD ... tures.html
I don't know how far this is implemented in their synths.


All Xils-Lab synths have zero-delay-feedback-filters, for three years now. Le Masque has inherited some of them. DCam has it too, for quite a long time.

There is a very simple test you can run to know if a synth has this feature or not. I'll give it to you in private if you wish so, Ingo.

Sorry for OT to Tone2. I wont answer in this thread for any other questions regarding Xils-Lab synthesizers : This thread belongs to Tone 2 and Saurus.

Congrats to them for the release.

Hi Laurent,

thanks for the info, this is really helpful. Yes i think that you could be right about not posting to much here.


Ingo
Last edited by Ingonator on Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live Suite 9.1.2 / Reaper 4.61 / softsynths by Waldorf, Tone2, Xils Lab, NI, others...
Motif ES 7 / Wavestation EX / Blofeld desktop / Pulse 2
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