I need something that's like Basslane except with a 36db/octave cut-off for a project. I know it's possible to recreate part of the process by applying a highpass between two MSED instances but how do I go about re-creating the width parameter?

If you change a signal into M/S, the left signal is mid, the right is side.

You change the "width" with the side signal (louder means wider, more quiet means means narrowing), but you need gain compensation on the mid channel if you cut away lowend on the sides to "mono" the signal.

Why not make an FR to both Nugen Audio (Monofilter) and/or Brainworx (bx_control). Maybe they implement steeper orders for their HP filters.

Thanks for clarifying what I failed to express coherently about the highpass targeting the S channel, represented as R after MS en-coding.

Here's what I tried a moment ago:
Duplicate stero track I'm working on.
Apply a high-pass on one stereo track, low-pass on the corresponding track(Rubberfilter used here). In this case I use 36db/octave at 300Hz.

So far I have achived defining the cutoff frequency and filter steepness.

On the lowpassed stereo track I use Voxengo MSED 'inline' mode. MSED 'side gain' control should be analogous to the 'width' control in Basslane. 'Side Mute' on MSED should be analogus to setting the 'width' parameter in Basslane to fully mono. -6dB 'side gain' in MSED is assumed to be the same as setting the Basslane 'width' half may, checking with "Plugin Analyser" will tell for sure.

It certainly sounds like I intended now. Do you think I went about it right? The only other way I could think of is something similar to a NY-style compressor except with a MS EQ but that would sound phasey I suppose?

OT now looking for a decent chainer to make the effect vitrually self-contained.

Revisited my processing chain. Only need three plugins and no track duplicate needed anymore thanks to DDMF Metaplugin. RS-Met Crossover is used for splitting the stereo track into low and high bands in the highest quality and MSED as for side chanell balance adjustment.

For pure enjoyement I'm listening to The Who - Live at Leeds, which has a very similar stereo-field as the project I'm working on. The crossover is at 300 Hz, the side chanell is reduced by only 6db, it simply keeps the hard panned instrumments from semming too detached from the mix. Sounds glorious

Actually you do not need to "mono" anything since you would get a sudden cut this way (at least to my experience). With your technique, you have a "lowend" narrow and then a sudden jump over to "wide" at the crossover frequency.

Granted, due to the crossing of the frequencies with the corresponding courves of the LP/HP, you should have a rise/fall in terms of the stereo field. But still you're using a fairly steep order with Rubberfilter and IIRC, RS-Met Crossover was not save of phasing issues.


I reverted from creating chains like that with chainer plugins and rather use bx_control. NugenAudio's tool is a bit more versatile and visual on the behalf - but you're limited to the HP order they give you (IIRC, it's 6dB/Oct for bx_control). But if it's working for you, fine. Just double check with correlation meters.


Usually if I narrow out or "cut" lowend with an M/S EQ like LP EQ from IKM, I add about 1dB of shelf for the lowend up until the crossover frequency, while I use like 24dB/Oct HP for the sides. But this is a rare issue - like I said, I mainly only use bx_control.


Glad I could help regardless.

I guess it depends on what kind of recording you are working on. What I wanted to do here was make a mix, containing bass and rhythm instrumments hard panned left and right(not by me), seem more cohesive. Indeed this should be done with care as for one thing the percieved tonality of said elements change can change drastically when brought in from the sides. Then there's the common ground shared by the ambiance of a mix as well as side panned instrumments, adjustments need to me made attentively so as not to make a mess of both. What I gain from the 36dB filter steepness is control of wider a range, into the lower-mids, which was off-limits using a wider filter due to the harm made, to me the end result makes extended listening more enjoyable.

So you mean "vintage type" recordings like the Beatles or Pink Floyd from the 60ies and 70ies. Here it was normal to have the Bass to either left/right and drums also shifted (or just "mono-ish" center).

I think in this case, especially since it was put in Vinyl, the EQ was steeper right from the start and before the signal was placed over to either side. Did you ever notice that "old" recordings have less lowend on the long run? This is a sideeffect of it on top of the RIAA EQ for the cutting the rails.


If it's working for you, it's fine. I might contact the devs of bx_control at some point - maybe Brainworx can upgrade their mono-maker matrix to offer different orders, or offer a plugin low budget plugin just for this pupose.

Else, it's the M/S LP EQ way for me.

Yeah, a lot of early stereo recordings have weird panning and it gets tiresome to my ears in the long run. It's hard to generalize, I'm not a big vinyl fan so it's down to how the CD release was prepared but at most only the very lowest frequencies get mono-ized. It's different from album to album though and the room and speaker placement also makes a difference.

I'm listening to 60s recording right now, 'Forever Changes' by Love, which basically has a big hole in the center of the stereo-field, everything is hard panned. It takes very well to the M-S highpass you mentioned although I think it's slighty better with my crossover chain with the side bass turned down about -20dB. But it's nit-picking.