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Multiple Shreddage instruments (SFZ)

Official support for: impactsoundworks.com

Moderators: zircon, BGC

User avatar
DavidN
KVRer
 
5 posts since 27 Aug, 2012

Postby DavidN; Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:44 am Multiple Shreddage instruments (SFZ)

Hello!

I'm fairly new to the world of DAWs, having come up from an old-style tracker, and I'm really enjoying the sounds that I can get out of Shreddage so far (such as this). I'm using the SFZ version through LinuxSampler and ReValver, and setup was fairly easy with the provided guide.

I've hit a stumbling block, though - how do you set multiple LinuxSampler/Shreddage instances up in a project, to process rhythm/lead guitars separately? Should I in general be aiming to put multiple LinuxSampler plugins into the project, assigning them as effects directly to the channels that hold the MIDI events, or use one plugin and route inputs into it on separate channels, then map those channels to separate outputs within LinuxSampler and route those outputs into channels that have separate ReValver instances applied? (I only half know what I'm talking about here.)

I've tried in both Cakewalk Music Creator 6 and Reaper (which is my preferred environment so far) and had the same problem each time... when attempting to set up multiple instances of LinuxSampler, I could only get sound out of one of them - and from the way the Fantasia UI reacts, it looks as if both separate instances are pointing to the same backend underneath.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!
zircon
KVRAF
 
3806 posts since 15 Mar, 2004, from Owings Mills, MD

Postby zircon; Tue Aug 28, 2012 12:03 pm

Hey David, as you said LinuxSampler seems to work best when there is only one instance. The solution is thus to load more patches into the same instance, but on separate MIDI channels. You can load a new patch by clicking the power button in the Fantasia UI and then hitting Load Instrument. Once the new instrument is loaded, click the "Options" arrow on the right. You can now specify the MIDI channel input (enabling you to send different MIDI data to this patch).

Lastly, you can click the "CR" button under "Audio Output" to specify the outputs for this patch. By default, the Shreddage SFZ multi uses outputs 0&1 for the first output pair, and 2&3 for the second pair (2&3 being the double-tracked outs). So, your next patch would use 4&5, and so on.

Does that make sense? With this method you can load multiple instruments, on different MIDI channels, with different outputs (and thus different FX/amps) all in one instance.
Zebra 2 Tetralogy - 188 Dance/Electronic Presets!

Impact Soundworks - Electric + acoustic guitar, big metals, world instruments and more!
User avatar
Baard
KVRist
 
346 posts since 27 Nov, 2009, from Norway

Postby Baard; Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:12 pm

I can confirm what Zircon says, Linuxsampler works best with one instance.

I posted a multi patch for loading both ShreddageX and Bass in the same instance in the originalShreddage SFZ thread. It also has empty preconfigured channels for loading other instruments into.

Find it here: http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 25#4985225

Maybe it can be useful? :)
User avatar
DavidN
KVRer
 
5 posts since 27 Aug, 2012

Postby DavidN; Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:54 pm

Thanks a lot to both of you! A little bit of a faff later, I have it working :)

Baard, I saw your example LSCP when I was searching around for answers to my issue, and that definitely helped point me in the direction of loading the single instance with multiple instruments and routing them around - I just wasn't sure if I was somehow meant to do this routing at the SFZ level (giving each loaded SFZ in rack 1 a list of separate inputs and outputs), when working with two copies of the same plugin.

Zircon, it's great to have someone who's worked so closely in creating the plugin available to provide support for it - your instructions finally made it all fall into place for me, particularly the detail about the CR button to specify where the output goes and the detail of the double tracking :) (I might dare to add a third guitar tonight...!) Last night I was wondering if evolving from the Amiga was worth it after all, but it's great to know that people are so willing to help out :)

---

As I never found a really newcomer-friendly step by step guide to this during my Google searches, these are the complete steps I went through with LinuxSampler and Reaper - perhaps they will help someone else in the future (and stop me if any of this looks wrong!)

Channels:
1 - MIDI for rhythm guitar
2 - MIDI for lead guitar
3 - LinuxSampler
4 - Rhythm left out
5 - Rhythm right out
6 - Lead guitar left out
7 - Lead guitar right out

MIDI events go into channels 1 and 2. Both of these channels have a send to separate MIDI channels on track 3 (track 1 sends MIDI ALL -> 1, track 2 sends MIDI ALL -> 2).

Track 3 has the LinuxSampler plugin, which needs to be set up like this:

- Start with the layout given in the Shreddage instruction sheet, with all SFZs loaded in the first rack
- Click to the second rack and load all the SFZs here as well, mirroring the layout (SFZs and volume levels) of rack 1
- The SFZs in rack 1 are set to react to events on MIDI channel 1 - open up the options for each SFZ in rack 2, and set them all to MIDI input channel 2 instead
- Click the CR button on each SFZ in rack 2 and set the outputs to audio in 0/1 -> out 4/5 for non-DT SFZs, 0/1 -> 6/7 for DT SFZs

Still on track 3, set up two sends for each instrument (bearing in mind that LinuxSampler indexes audio channels from 0 and Reaper indexes from 1!):
Send audio 1/2 (rack 1 non-DT) to 1/2 on track 4 (rhythm left)
Send audio 3/4 (rack 1 DT) to 1/2 on track 5 (rhythm right)
Send audio 5/6 (rack 2 non-DT) to 1/2 on track 6 (lead left)
Send audio 7/8 (rack 2 DT) to 1/2 on track 7 (lead right)

Tracks 4-7 are easier - they just receive their intended audio now that it's been unmuddled by LinuxSampler, and can have ReValver or another guitar processor plugin applied to them.

Finally, turn off "Master/parent send" on channel 3 to avoid hearing the clean LinuxSampler output in addition to the actual output channels.

One last detail is that for some reason I had to specifically add a hardware output to the lead guitar tracks in order to hear them (1/2 -> output 1/output 2) - I'm not sure why the rhythm guitar tracks are audible without them, but I'm going to take what I have at this point :)
onibubu
KVRer
 
6 posts since 16 Sep, 2012

Postby onibubu; Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:30 am

So you actualy need it like this?

Channel for midi events (ch1) -> midi send to linuxsampler (ch2)
Channel with LinuxSampler (ch2) -> Audio send to Channel where nothing is (CH3)

Because you see I have a smilare problem.
Shreddage X is working like a charm but if I want to load another instrument (a violing in sfz format for example) it doesn't work at all (doesn't create a new midi input/output device).

Funny thing is if i start from scratch it does...
If I load the Shreddage Script from the Tutorial it doesn't.

I find it a little "overcomplicated" to have at least 2 Channels for just one instrument.
Is there another SFZ player that is as good as linuxsampler but not that "bitchy" ?
zircon
KVRAF
 
3806 posts since 15 Mar, 2004, from Owings Mills, MD

Postby zircon; Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:36 am

If you follow the instructions in my post, you only need one MIDI channel per instrument - simple! You can even load multiple instruments on one MIDI channel, which is what you would want for Shreddage X for example.
Zebra 2 Tetralogy - 188 Dance/Electronic Presets!

Impact Soundworks - Electric + acoustic guitar, big metals, world instruments and more!

Moderators: zircon, BGC

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