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NI's got a Rick bass plugin now, wherefore art thou Trillian?

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

dr_After
KVRer
 
13 posts since 30 Mar, 2002, from Poland

Postby dr_After; Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:02 am

Agathodaimon wrote:Well i'd like to say as much as i enjoy using NI products every here and there, so far nothing really compares to Trilian


Been using Trilian for years. I tried Rickenbacker and I must say: I am amazed. So far I find Rick the best work of Mr. Scarbee ever. It is consistent, has beautiful sound. There is no background noise (some of Trilian electric basses have VERY much of bg noise. Try to reamp them - You end with useless, dirty signal). As it was also mentioned earlier - some of velocities in Trilian instruments are not consistent - which is annoying. It is not the case with Rickenbacker, which is extremely fun to play on keyboard.

And last but not least - Trillian just does not have this kind of flavour - Rickenbacker sound is one of a kind :). I'm not planning to uninstall my Trilian library - I think that, despite the flaws, it is great, but I guess that I will use Rick as my first electric bass quite often.
medium is the message
Mr.Scarbee
KVRist
 
254 posts since 15 Dec, 2003, from Denmark

Postby Mr.Scarbee; Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:33 am

mholloway wrote:
Compyfox wrote:Wait, do I get this right that we HAVE TO do a manual offset of the recording in order to get an "on beat" playback, even if the MIDI notes are quantized on beat?


Correct, you have to set a delay. There is a field for doing this in the settings for the instrument itself, but I prefer to just use the "Track Delay" input in Ableton Live itself (I imagine other DAW's have comparable things). I found that when I used the field in the instrument settings, something still seemed slightly off...whereas using ableton's track delay, everything is tight as punch.

Also note that you have to subtract 7ms from whatever the 'Scrape Mix' is set to (I read in a different thread that it's 40ms by default, but on mine it's actually 50ms). So if it's 50, I put -47ms in the ableton 'track delay' for the channel the instrument is in -- with that done, everything works perfectly.

another noted problem with the delay input field in the instrument itself is that it can't be set to more than 33ms...so in the above scenario wherein I need 47, it's not even possible...odd.

-M


Hi

Im affraid there is a misunderstanding here. The seetings in Plugin works this way:
At default there are around 40 ms from scrape start to first big peak. But the attack is starting 7 ms before peak so we limited setting to 33 ms. If you set this to max it means NO string scrape! This also means no scrape sound between up/ down strokes - and imagine this is not really realistic unless you make a bowed right hand that escapes the string :?

NOW...... using negatve PRE-Delay is something totally different: here you get all the right attack and sonic sauce! and all you need is setting track delay to to -33ms - and leave setting on bass to default.

For live playing - you have to get used to it - as someone mentioned - like a real player on a real bass.
Thomas Hansen Skarbye
Singer, Bass Player & Creative Director, SCARBEE
Websites: www.scarbee.com
MySpace: www.myspace.com/scarbee
Mr.Scarbee
KVRist
 
254 posts since 15 Dec, 2003, from Denmark

Postby Mr.Scarbee; Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:43 am

But - this is important: ITS OPTIONAL!

If you refuse to use pre-delay and would have preferred a sound without scrape - then just use the scrape setting and remove all you want. Its your choice. Its easy. You can get just what you want.

AN ANECDOTE...

After I had worked on bass for 5 months I wanted to do an A/B test between real playing and the samples. It was quite late and stupid since I was far with recordings and editing. The result was devastating! A failure....
And the reason was the attack and scrape. I realized that I had "picked" the note with pick too close to string and not like I would do when playing for real - and NOT the way a rock bassist would play. So what did I do? I started over... Dropped 5 months of hard work.

Later when doing the non palm-muted I restarted 5 times because I was not satisfied with strings, playing position, pickup height, pick angle, pick size etc.
But eventually I was satisfied - and love the sound and feel.

Some of you will be puzzled with the scrape... But you have just been used to a "cultured" sampling or a playing style where pick rarely leaves the string. And this doesnt meant its not a great bass sound - basses with little scrape can sound cool. We just wanted to give you a choice.

But dont be scared by autenticity...


PS. Thanks for all the kind words. It inspires the whole team to do more cool stuff in the future. It really does.
Thomas Hansen Skarbye
Singer, Bass Player & Creative Director, SCARBEE
Websites: www.scarbee.com
MySpace: www.myspace.com/scarbee
TheKid
KVRist
 
328 posts since 13 Aug, 2012, from Location: Location: Location: Location

Postby TheKid; Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:59 am

As a hobby producer for electronic music I can just say I don't need it. But as also being bass player in a band: wow this sounds so fantastic. Wish I had a bass sound like that.
bill45
KVRian
 
1317 posts since 14 Jun, 2006

Postby bill45; Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:20 pm

The amp sims and EFX sound real good too. Are new, or from guitar rig?
Mr.Scarbee
KVRist
 
254 posts since 15 Dec, 2003, from Denmark

Postby Mr.Scarbee; Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:06 pm

All FX are from Plugin. We had Jump amp from Guitar Rig + all the Cabinets ported to Kontakt for this project.
Thomas Hansen Skarbye
Singer, Bass Player & Creative Director, SCARBEE
Websites: www.scarbee.com
MySpace: www.myspace.com/scarbee
bill45
KVRian
 
1317 posts since 14 Jun, 2006

Postby bill45; Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:25 am

Thank You Thomas,Are the FX exclusive to the library.
These FX are so good, I'd like to buy the libtary and the FX, separatly.
Mr.Scarbee
KVRist
 
254 posts since 15 Dec, 2003, from Denmark

Postby Mr.Scarbee; Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:37 am

Then you should get Guitar Rig. The FX have been ported from there.
Thomas Hansen Skarbye
Singer, Bass Player & Creative Director, SCARBEE
Websites: www.scarbee.com
MySpace: www.myspace.com/scarbee
bill45
KVRian
 
1317 posts since 14 Jun, 2006

Postby bill45; Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:52 am

Proud owner of Guitar Rig5. I'll get the Rick library soon.
dr_After
KVRer
 
13 posts since 30 Mar, 2002, from Poland

Postby dr_After; Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:32 pm

Just made small Rickenbacker test. It sounds sweet. :)

http://soundcloud.com/redemprez/2013-01-22-rick-1-test[/code]
itsinvader
KVRer
 
19 posts since 12 Aug, 2012, from HELL

Postby itsinvader; Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:57 pm

Numanoid wrote:My favourite Rickenbacker axe wielder is Chris Squire in Yes.

He used the 4001 I think too.


f**k yeah!

this library is still very tempting, would love some Rickenbacker in my tunes specially played with a pick

I should probably just record my bass more often though, but it's just so much simpler to use a sampler
mholloway
KVRist
 
221 posts since 10 Jan, 2009, from Portland, OR, USA

Postby mholloway; Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:46 am

Mr.Scarbee wrote:NOW...... using negatve PRE-Delay is something totally different: here you get all the right attack and sonic sauce! and all you need is setting track delay to to -33ms - and leave setting on bass to default.


Great, thanks for the clarification, got it now! In Ableton it's very easy to enter the -33ms pre-delay on a track (there's an optional track delay input box beneath every channel in the mixer), but it seems perhaps folks using other DAWs don't actually know how to create the pre-delay in their host. Just a thought, maybe create a short tutorial manual for buyers showing how to set pre-delay for a track in each major DAW host? Would avoid the issue of new buyers loading up the instrument for the first time and scratching their heads about resolving sync issues.

In any case, still loving this instrument, best sampled bass ever, no contest.

-M
www.dwifh.com - old-school industrial music by DEAD WHEN I FOUND HER
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