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Ableton workflow in Cubase 7?

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

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KVRist
 
39 posts since 5 Mar, 2010

Postby KiddCabbage; Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:53 am Ableton workflow in Cubase 7?

Hey guys,

I've been using Live 8 and Cubase 5 for a little while, and I would really like to consolidate my producing into a single DAW - I'm hoping that can be Cubase 7.

But there are some things that I will *really* miss about Ableton's arrangement view if I were to do so, all on the workflow side. I'll highlight them below, and hopefully at least some of them can be addressed with some outside thought:

-Toggle-able window under the tracks to edit the current selection (not having to open each MIDI clip separately in a new overlayed window)
-Looped sections that all read from a single clip (so that I can edit a single instance of a clip, and have all repetitions thereof follow the same changes)
-VST windows showing for only selected track
-Automation parameter selection: anyone who's used Live knows how easy automation is in it compared to other DAWs, having a single automation lane over the track, displaying the most recently-touched parameter.
-Easy track freezing/flattening: taking a track, and with two clicks, turning a MIDI track into an editable audio track.
-Easily creating a sampled instrument from an audio track
-Slice beat to MIDI track
-The integrated drum racks and sampler

Off the top of my head, those are the biggest ones I can think of. It sucks, because there are SO many things that I use in Cubase when it comes to MIDI controlling and mixing that are impossible in Ableton - but Ableton is just so easy for me to get ideas down quickly.
KVRAF
 
10992 posts since 18 Oct, 2003, from Berlin, Germany
 

Postby Compyfox; Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:20 am

KiddCabbage wrote:-Toggle-able window under the tracks to edit the current selection (not having to open each MIDI clip separately in a new overlayed window)


Possible since SX3 days. It's a button on the track view in the arranger to the left. You might need to drag the track view (where the S/M/E/R/W buttons are) in order to see the button.


KiddCabbage wrote:-Looped sections that all read from a single clip (so that I can edit a single instance of a clip, and have all repetitions thereof follow the same changes)


Hold CRTL and SHIFT, or was it ALT and SHIFT? Any way, the copied event should have a "=" symbol on the event. If that is the case, then each clip is linked. Change one, everything changes.


KiddCabbage wrote:-VST windows showing for only selected track


E button that opens the Channel Strip view? But it's not nearly close as Ableton.


KiddCabbage wrote:-Automation parameter selection: anyone who's used Live knows how easy automation is in it compared to other DAWs, having a single automation lane over the track, displaying the most recently-touched parameter.


I think not as comfortable, but there's a "+" symbol on your track in the arranger. Click that, and it should show the automation. There's even a function "show all automation" in the EDIT submenu.


KiddCabbage wrote:-Easy track freezing/flattening: taking a track, and with two clicks, turning a MIDI track into an editable audio track.


Bounce in Place is not that great in Cubase, read pretty much non-existent. It's still: create loop points, export and then automatically import the audio file again (can be handled in the Export Window).


KiddCabbage wrote:-Easily creating a sampled instrument from an audio track


Currently not possible. Only with loops and the built into an "instrument" with the Cubase bundled drum machine.


KiddCabbage wrote:-Slice beat to MIDI track


Possible, take a dive in the sub-menu with the right mouse button on an Audio Event, or take a look into the menu's on top (audio menu especially).


KiddCabbage wrote:-The integrated drum racks and sampler


Cubase comes with a drum sampler, but that one is very limited. And Halion Sonic is pretty much a ROMPLER only.


KiddCabbage wrote:Off the top of my head, those are the biggest ones I can think of. It sucks, because there are SO many things that I use in Cubase when it comes to MIDI controlling and mixing that are impossible in Ableton - but Ableton is just so easy for me to get ideas down quickly.


Cubase is a bit hard to wrap your head around. But it's pretty simple regardless. I'd take another dive into the manual, try what I just said. If it's working as expected, you can jump on C7. But there is no need if C5 is more than enough for you.
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KVRAF
 
1963 posts since 27 Mar, 2010, from UK
  

Postby MFXxx; Sun Dec 23, 2012 4:52 am

Damn I am exactly the opposite. Been using Cubase since ported from Atari. Purchased Ableton Live 8 earlier this year, upgraded from a free LE with novation product.

Everytime I load Live up I look at the GUI and just think WTF and get on with things in Maschine or Cubase.

Best of luck with Cubase it is very easy once you get into it and extremely powerful editing. v7 brings a wealth of new features and the mixer is very good.

Saying that I want to get into Live as its audio routing is better than Cubase, so I am led to believe and supports VST instrument sidechain, useful with the Access Virus and vst2 sidechain plugins.
Rintrah roars & shakes his fires in the burdend air...
...nothing special just my noodles :
https://soundcloud.com/mystafx
KVRAF
 
2351 posts since 25 Aug, 2002, from here

Postby ericj23; Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:02 am

As a long time Cubase fan who owns logic those kind o scratchpad things are not great in cubase

I would recommend looking at using macros in cubase though - there are lots of things where you can take some of clicking out by making the process a macro and then assigning it a shortcut key - this is really powerful feature that most o tehr DAWs seem to miss
down boy
KVRAF
 
10992 posts since 18 Oct, 2003, from Berlin, Germany
 

Postby Compyfox; Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:03 am

The only issue I have with Cubase is the sidechaining with VST2 plugins.

But it's simple with the "2xStereo-subgroups in Quad-Group-Channel" trick. And I can definitely recommend a modular environment (VST/VSTi) as add-on.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1963 posts since 27 Mar, 2010, from UK
  

Postby MFXxx; Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:15 am

Compyfox wrote:I can definitely recommend a modular environment (VST/VSTi) as add-on.


Do you mean somthing like bidule or other?
Rintrah roars & shakes his fires in the burdend air...
...nothing special just my noodles :
https://soundcloud.com/mystafx
KVRAF
 
10992 posts since 18 Oct, 2003, from Berlin, Germany
 

Postby Compyfox; Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:23 am

Bidule, MUX, eXT, Metaplugin and how they are all called. Yes.

This definitely adds to routing capabilities for creating custom sounds, FX routing, etc while ignoring the limitation of the VSTi rack, and the 8 inserts on the channel strips.
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KVRian
 
1156 posts since 21 Jan, 2008, from The Outer Rim
 

Postby Suloo; Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:52 pm

KiddCabbage wrote:-VST windows showing for only selected track


E button that opens the Channel Strip view? But it's not nearly close as Ableton.


there is a command, i think its ALT + E or Shift + E then all vst windows of the selected track show up..they even all disappear if you hit the command again..



KiddCabbage wrote:-Automation parameter selection: anyone who's used Live knows how easy automation is in it compared to other DAWs, having a single automation lane over the track, displaying the most recently-touched parameter.


I think not as comfortable, but there's a "+" symbol on your track in the arranger. Click that, and it should show the automation. There's even a function "show all automation" in the EDIT submenu.


or right click on the track and *show used automation*

KiddCabbage wrote:-Easy track freezing/flattening: taking a track, and with two clicks, turning a MIDI track into an editable audio track.


Bounce in Place is not that great in Cubase, read pretty much non-existent. It's still: create loop points, export and then automatically import the audio file again (can be handled in the Export Window).


route your vst instrument channel into a group track, like "synths" "drums" "whatever" then create your audio track, set the input to the group you created before, solo your instrument channel, select the audio track..hit record..there you got your stuff as audio..i've always set up all that groups and several audio tracks with input set to the groups in my startup template^^


cheers 8)
KVRian
 
1487 posts since 28 Dec, 2007

Postby analoguesamples909; Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:34 pm

re Cubase bounce in place - it does do the regular freeze/flatten operations for tracks tho right? Just not bouncing individual parts on a track (logic BIP)...
KVRian
 
1487 posts since 28 Dec, 2007

Postby analoguesamples909; Sun Jan 20, 2013 5:38 pm

another Q - drag and drop in cubase - I read - is it a problem? Is there a decent mediabrowser to select audio and samples - and can you drag onto samplers etc?
KVRer
 
19 posts since 12 Aug, 2012, from HELL
 

Postby itsinvader; Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:37 am

I'm a Live 8 user and currently Beta testing Live 9

long story short, I am not impressed

I was a Logic user for around 3 years and found Live 8 workflow a lot easier to use at first, sometimes wishing I still had some of Logic 9's features but not missing all the bugs, crashes and annoying interface

I really hoped that Live 9 would address a lot of it's limitations and make it a more serious DAW for production, but it seems like Ableton really doesn't care about it's pro users, leaving all the most frequently requested features in the dark

I'm tired of having my Live max out while my CPU is barely hitting 50%, I'm tired of not having a proper freeze/bounce to audio function, proper automation, proper mixing environment, proper elastic audio quality, no groups in groups

things I would miss are the easy automation (every parameter you touch comes up on the arrange view, I'm aware that with Cubase you have to record automation unless you want to go through all the menues like in Logic), grouping (Cubase requiers you to route things to groups as opposed of having the folder appear on the mixer, could work with this though), straight warping (I'm live you can choose to warp audio to any tempo and guesses the tempo which helps a lot, Cubase can warp audio like this as well but you have to input the tempo yourself, could probably work with this too though), copy pasting while project is playing (this would always bother me in Logic since it only pastes on the track selected wherever the play head it, not sure how this works in Cubase), drum racks (give you the ability to have different samplers/instruments for each midi note and lets you add whatever effects plugins to each one, I use this to layer my drums) simpler (ridiculously simple single audio track sampler, great for drums) and effects grouping (easily map multiple parameters to the 8 macro knobs and create multiple chains of audio)

I can deal with a lot of the things I hate or would miss about Live, but the one thing that might be the deal breaker for me is the shit audio in terms of CPU usage, HALF my CPU is going to waste!

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